Author Topic: Coronavirus Concerns  (Read 235846 times)

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Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5130 on: August 02, 2020, 09:10:47 AM »

Offline TheReaLPuba

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RIP Herman Cain.

Dude was a Presidential candidate and a close supporter of Donald Trump.

Mr. Cain supposedly beat a form of cancer as well. Sad to see him lose this battle.
When I first heard he contracted Covid, I was wondering how he'd fare in battling the disease.  now we know he wasn't successful.

first thought that ran through my head when I heard this news was I wonder if this is the first domino that gets Republicans to take the steps needed to combat Covid seriously.  Once the rich and powerful start contracting this and suffering the health effects (and possibly some deaths) I wonder if they'll pivot from going against medical guidelines to full fledged support (or close to it).

RIP Mr Cain. Wasn't a fan as a political figure, particularly of his more harebrained ideas but he seemed a nice enough guy, not that I knew him personally  :angel:

Re: your post, I hope they do. Particularly since Cain was a clear Covid skeptic who in June told the public not to believe media scare stories about Covid and refused to wear masks or believe the science. His death, after beating cancer, is a tragedy and I hope that the Republicans still holding out with mask wearing and taking the pandemic seriously, learn from it. Lives are more important than trying to look good to your constituents by not wearing a mask and not socially distancing.

That said, Louie Gohmert, Texas Republican, is saying that wearing a mask is probably what caused his Covid infection:

Quote
ďI canít help but think if I hadnít been wearing a mask so much in the last 10 days or so, I really wonder if I would have gotten it,Ē Gohmert said. ďMoving the mask around, getting it sitting just right, I am bound to have put some virus on the mask that I sucked in. That is most likely what happened.Ē

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/2020/07/31/louie-gohmert-spins-a-dangerous-tale-about-his-positive-covid-19-test/

What a knobhead seriously. These types of people are dangerous because they use their political platform to spread misinformation. If he was an idiot that's bad enough, if he's doing it to pander to his constituents instead of educating them then it's even worse. I have very little sympathy for these people catching it. That said, let's hope it doesn't take more of them dying for others to get the message.

More and more skeptics will either wise up or fall to this virus.
Both inappropriate and a conspicuous attempt at avoiding the swearing filter. Don't do it again.

I think you probably misunderstood him.
He literally wrote out a swear word with a # in between the b and the i, which I deleted. This is a kid-friendly forum

Oh that. I was unaware that wasn't allowed.

Sorry! My bad.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5131 on: August 02, 2020, 09:28:02 AM »

Offline Vermont Green

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I just saw Adm. Brett Giroir who is head of the  Public Health Service Commissioned Corps.(or something like that), he is an MD and Pediatrician, and currently serves as Trump's testing Czar.  He had comments about hydroxychloroquine where he was very definitive.  Giroir is very much in the Trump camp so there is no way these are "make Trump look bad" comments.

He said there have been 5 randomized tests of hydroxychloroquine that all showed there is no benefit.  He said there might be some cases where a physician may choose to prescribe it as a treatment for Covid but he didn't know what those would might be.  He said that we need to move on from it and promote other treatments.

To hear this from him, to me, closes the book on the discussion.  He is very much a Trump loyalist so there is no way you can accuse him of saying it for political reasons.  In fact, he is saying it in the face of many political reasons not to say it.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2020, 10:27:11 AM by Vermont Green »

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5132 on: August 02, 2020, 12:36:30 PM »

Offline Fan from VT

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Good summary of the current situation.

Very NSFW (Language)


Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5133 on: August 02, 2020, 04:38:47 PM »

Online gouki88

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RIP Herman Cain.

Dude was a Presidential candidate and a close supporter of Donald Trump.

Mr. Cain supposedly beat a form of cancer as well. Sad to see him lose this battle.
When I first heard he contracted Covid, I was wondering how he'd fare in battling the disease.  now we know he wasn't successful.

first thought that ran through my head when I heard this news was I wonder if this is the first domino that gets Republicans to take the steps needed to combat Covid seriously.  Once the rich and powerful start contracting this and suffering the health effects (and possibly some deaths) I wonder if they'll pivot from going against medical guidelines to full fledged support (or close to it).

RIP Mr Cain. Wasn't a fan as a political figure, particularly of his more harebrained ideas but he seemed a nice enough guy, not that I knew him personally  :angel:

Re: your post, I hope they do. Particularly since Cain was a clear Covid skeptic who in June told the public not to believe media scare stories about Covid and refused to wear masks or believe the science. His death, after beating cancer, is a tragedy and I hope that the Republicans still holding out with mask wearing and taking the pandemic seriously, learn from it. Lives are more important than trying to look good to your constituents by not wearing a mask and not socially distancing.

That said, Louie Gohmert, Texas Republican, is saying that wearing a mask is probably what caused his Covid infection:

Quote
ďI canít help but think if I hadnít been wearing a mask so much in the last 10 days or so, I really wonder if I would have gotten it,Ē Gohmert said. ďMoving the mask around, getting it sitting just right, I am bound to have put some virus on the mask that I sucked in. That is most likely what happened.Ē

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/2020/07/31/louie-gohmert-spins-a-dangerous-tale-about-his-positive-covid-19-test/

What a knobhead seriously. These types of people are dangerous because they use their political platform to spread misinformation. If he was an idiot that's bad enough, if he's doing it to pander to his constituents instead of educating them then it's even worse. I have very little sympathy for these people catching it. That said, let's hope it doesn't take more of them dying for others to get the message.

More and more skeptics will either wise up or fall to this virus.
Both inappropriate and a conspicuous attempt at avoiding the swearing filter. Don't do it again.

I think you probably misunderstood him.
He literally wrote out a swear word with a # in between the b and the i, which I deleted. This is a kid-friendly forum

Oh that. I was unaware that wasn't allowed.

Sorry! My bad.
No sweat :)

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5134 on: August 02, 2020, 06:24:23 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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https://www.newsweek.com/key-defeating-covid-19-already-exists-we-need-start-using-it-opinion-1519535

I honestly have no idea what to make of this stuff.

seems this might be what Trump,was saying ?   Why he was taking it as a precaution ?   

This is cobfusing for the non medical bloke

Zinc !!! ....go lick a wash tub  ;D

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5135 on: August 02, 2020, 06:50:32 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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https://www.newsweek.com/key-defeating-covid-19-already-exists-we-need-start-using-it-opinion-1519535

I honestly have no idea what to make of this stuff.

seems this might be what Trump,was saying ?   Why he was taking it as a precaution ?   

This is cobfusing for the non medical bloke

Zinc !!! ....go lick a wash tub  ;D

Yes, the above referenced article (which when you break it down seems to be a bit of self-promotion on the part of Risch) is confusing, but other, real studies are starting to clarify things.

First off - let's clarify that chloroquine is not necessarily dangerous if applied correctly for it's (many) prescribed uses.  The scares about causing all kinds of heart problems seem to be matters of dosages at very high levels.

That said - it's simply not an effective treatment for COVID-19.

Latest studies have found that while it can be used to inhibit propagation of the virus in some tissues (lab tests have shown it effective on kidney cells in Monkeys) it is specifically NOT helpful in preventing propagation in lung tissue cells.  And the latter is the primary means of propagation of the virus in humans.

https://scitechdaily.com/malaria-drug-chloroquine-does-not-inhibit-covid-19-infection-in-human-lung-cells/

This is why the more rigid studies are finding it to have no real benefit.

There are some other treatments that are showing real promise (including some common, inexpensive steroid treatments).   Folks need to focus on them.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt?  Incompetent?  Which is worse?  Does it matter?  It sucks.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5136 on: August 03, 2020, 12:04:04 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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So, Dr. Birx issues cautions that schools should not reopen until outbreaks are under control:

https://www.businessinsider.com/reopening-schools-covid-19-cases-caution-birx-2020-8

Quote
In an interview on CNN's "State of the Union," host Dana Bash asked Birx about a recommendation from the Centers for Disease Control Director Robert Redfield, which said schools in areas with a 5% positivity rate or higher need to use distance learning.

"I certainly would endorse what Dr. Redfield is saying," Birx said. "In the areas where we have this widespread case increase, we need to stop the cases, and then we can talk about safely reopening."

And .... Trump promptly criticizes her:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/03/politics/trump-birx-coronavirus-task-force/index.html

Quote
"So Crazy Nancy Pelosi said horrible things about Dr. Deborah Birx, going after her because she was too positive on the very good job we are doing on combatting the China Virus, including Vaccines & Therapeutics. In order to counter Nancy, Deborah took the bait & hit us. Pathetic!" Trump wrote.

NBA Officiating - Corrupt?  Incompetent?  Which is worse?  Does it matter?  It sucks.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5137 on: August 03, 2020, 03:06:45 PM »

Offline NKY fan

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Sweden 7 days moving averages for reported cases and deaths are fast approaching 0.
It looks like they are achieving herd immunity. Courageous and strong people 💪

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5138 on: August 03, 2020, 05:07:30 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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Sweden 7 days moving averages for reported cases and deaths are fast approaching 0.
It looks like they are achieving herd immunity. Courageous and strong people 💪

Nope.

They've had less than 8 cases per 1000 population.  That's less than 1%.   Even in the most extreme estimates of 'undetected' propagation, there is no way they are near the exposure thresholds needed for 'herd immunity'.

Smaller nations have the advantage of being able to more tightly control travel and apply propagation mitigations (social distancing, masks, etc.) in a more consistent manner (because fewer subgroups being stupid).   New Zealand, notably, has reduced their cases to almost nothing for a while now.   

But that is not immunity.  That's just mitigating the spread.
NBA Officiating - Corrupt?  Incompetent?  Which is worse?  Does it matter?  It sucks.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5139 on: August 03, 2020, 05:09:37 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Sweden 7 days moving averages for reported cases and deaths are fast approaching 0.
It looks like they are achieving herd immunity. Courageous and strong people 💪


In staying open and going in a different direction than most countries, Sweden incurred more than 5700 deaths which is more reported deaths (by far) than any similarly populated country with the exception of Belgium.

If Sweden is essentially done with Covid while the rest of the world has many months or a couple of years to go, then it sounds really good for Sweden.   But is that really the case or are you making an assumption about "herd immunity"?  I couldn't find any source that supports this.

Isn't there general uncertainty in the medical community about immunity?

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5140 on: August 03, 2020, 05:17:30 PM »

Offline NKY fan

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Sweden 7 days moving averages for reported cases and deaths are fast approaching 0.
It looks like they are achieving herd immunity. Courageous and strong people 💪


In staying open and going in a different direction than most countries, Sweden incurred more than 5700 deaths which is more reported deaths (by far) than any similarly populated country with the exception of Belgium.

If Sweden is essentially done with Covid while the rest of the world has many months or a couple of years to go, then it sounds really good for Sweden.   But is that really the case or are you making an assumption about "herd immunity"?  I couldn't find any source that supports this.

Isn't there general uncertainty in the medical community about immunity?
Well I think there are different shades of immunity. As long as itís (Covid-19) effect is mitigated thatís herd immunity.
 I donít think you can completely destroy the virus just like you canít eradicate the common cold. As long as people arenít dying and they live normal without wearing masks that was the end game right?
Iím hearing people in Sweden (and Scandinavia) donít wear masks and never cared about wearing them.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5141 on: August 03, 2020, 06:09:29 PM »

Online gouki88

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Sweden 7 days moving averages for reported cases and deaths are fast approaching 0.
It looks like they are achieving herd immunity. Courageous and strong people 💪


In staying open and going in a different direction than most countries, Sweden incurred more than 5700 deaths which is more reported deaths (by far) than any similarly populated country with the exception of Belgium.

If Sweden is essentially done with Covid while the rest of the world has many months or a couple of years to go, then it sounds really good for Sweden.   But is that really the case or are you making an assumption about "herd immunity"?  I couldn't find any source that supports this.

Isn't there general uncertainty in the medical community about immunity?
Well I think there are different shades of immunity. As long as itís (Covid-19) effect is mitigated thatís herd immunity.
 I donít think you can completely destroy the virus just like you canít eradicate the common cold. As long as people arenít dying and they live normal without wearing masks that was the end game right?
Iím hearing people in Sweden (and Scandinavia) donít wear masks and never cared about wearing them.
Sweden has top-12 marks in case fatality % and top-8 in deaths per 100k population. I donít know that this is some big win like youíre painting it out to be.

Around 5x as many deaths than similarly sized Portugal, with only 1.6x as many cases. Around 12.4x more deaths than similarly sized Azerbaijan, with only 2.5x more cases (fatality % difference of about 5.4%). Could go on and on with how much Sweden has outstripped itís similarly sized counterparts in fatality rates and deaths per capita. Not some gleaming example of success

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5142 on: August 03, 2020, 06:25:23 PM »

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 I admired Swedish courage and strength as I had described it in my post but feel free to twist my words.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5143 on: August 03, 2020, 07:17:48 PM »

Online gouki88

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I admired Swedish courage and strength as I had described it in my post but feel free to twist my words.
I donít think thereís anything courageous about abandoning vulnerable citizens to a virus.

Re: Coronavirus Concerns
« Reply #5144 on: August 03, 2020, 07:28:11 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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I admired Swedish courage and strength as I had described it in my post but feel free to twist my words.

I think I hear you,  the courage if that's what it is, would be to have forged ahead with a national decision to do what other countries were not willing to do.   

I know this isn't what you are saying, but I wouldn't want it to be misconstrued to imply that Americans who don't wear masks are somehow more courageous than those who do.