Author Topic: Civil Rights Abuses  (Read 4799 times)

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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #30 on: October 02, 2019, 08:55:10 PM »

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Call me cynical but I can't imagine under the same exact scenario that if it was a black male cop walking into the wrong apartment & shooting a white woman, that the sentence would've been the same.

Hard to say, but Muhammad Noor (sp?) in Minnesota got 12.5 years.  Similar circumstances in that there was a murder conviction for negligently killing a civilian. There, it was a black cop (also an African immigrant, I think) with an attractive blonde victim.  The facts obviously weren’t the exact same, but the sentences were quite close.
Wasn't Noor responding to a call though? You can feel remorse for a cop on duty making a mistake while responding to a call. Someone going into the wrong apartment and shooting a guy while they were sitting is rough.
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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #31 on: October 02, 2019, 08:58:06 PM »

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If it was 10 years no parole then it might be fair. Well fair if it's true that prison is a nightmare for ex cops. If she isn't protected or isolated she will have it rougher than most if prison is as they say.
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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #32 on: October 03, 2019, 09:37:19 AM »

Offline keevsnick

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https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/03/us/botham-jean-amber-guyger-trial-wrap/index.html

So its parole after five years, which does seem light. But I thought I'd post it here because some very interesting? nice? heartbreaking? stuff happened after the sentence was handed down.

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #33 on: October 03, 2019, 09:51:48 AM »

Offline Fan from VT

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Call me cynical but I can't imagine under the same exact scenario that if it was a black male cop walking into the wrong apartment & shooting a white woman, that the sentence would've been the same.

Hard to say, but Muhammad Noor (sp?) in Minnesota got 12.5 years.  Similar circumstances in that there was a murder conviction for negligently killing a civilian. There, it was a black cop (also an African immigrant, I think) with an attractive blonde victim.  The facts obviously weren’t the exact same, but the sentences were quite close.
Wasn't Noor responding to a call though? You can feel remorse for a cop on duty making a mistake while responding to a call. Someone going into the wrong apartment and shooting a guy while they were sitting is rough.

I think these are pretty apples and oranges situations.

In one, the cop was on duty, responding to a call, saw a chaotic scene unfolding, and reacted and killed someone.

The other, a cop was off duty, walked into someone else's apartment, and reacted by shooting someone eating dessert.


The first person got 12.5 years. Second got 10.

Both are tragic. Neither should be a cop again. But the first one is MUCH more analogous to Tamir Rice type situations where cops are overzealous in their demands and act far too quickly with lethal force, but aren't even indicted. That cop was only fired because he was previously determined to be too unstable to be a cop, but didn't disclose that on his new job application. The reasoning and defense for Noor is the same as all other cop shootings. "Reasonable" fear.

Quote
Noor's attorney, Peter Wold, told the court that "there is no dispute that Noor reacted based on fear in the split seconds he reacted and shot Ms. Ruszczyk that night."
But Hennepin County prosecutors argued that Noor overreacted and failed to assess the situation properly before firing.


The point isn't that Noor is awesome and that Guyer should be locked up forever. The point is that cops shoot too many people and jump to lethal means far too soon, and that the race of the shooter and victim matters far too much in terms of legal sympathy and sentencing.

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #34 on: October 03, 2019, 10:08:14 AM »

Online Roy H.

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Call me cynical but I can't imagine under the same exact scenario that if it was a black male cop walking into the wrong apartment & shooting a white woman, that the sentence would've been the same.

Hard to say, but Muhammad Noor (sp?) in Minnesota got 12.5 years.  Similar circumstances in that there was a murder conviction for negligently killing a civilian. There, it was a black cop (also an African immigrant, I think) with an attractive blonde victim.  The facts obviously weren’t the exact same, but the sentences were quite close.
Wasn't Noor responding to a call though? You can feel remorse for a cop on duty making a mistake while responding to a call. Someone going into the wrong apartment and shooting a guy while they were sitting is rough.

I think these are pretty apples and oranges situations.

In one, the cop was on duty, responding to a call, saw a chaotic scene unfolding, and reacted and killed someone.

The other, a cop was off duty, walked into someone else's apartment, and reacted by shooting someone eating dessert.


The first person got 12.5 years. Second got 10.

Both are tragic. Neither should be a cop again. But the first one is MUCH more analogous to Tamir Rice type situations where cops are overzealous in their demands and act far too quickly with lethal force, but aren't even indicted. That cop was only fired because he was previously determined to be too unstable to be a cop, but didn't disclose that on his new job application. The reasoning and defense for Noor is the same as all other cop shootings. "Reasonable" fear.

Quote
Noor's attorney, Peter Wold, told the court that "there is no dispute that Noor reacted based on fear in the split seconds he reacted and shot Ms. Ruszczyk that night."
But Hennepin County prosecutors argued that Noor overreacted and failed to assess the situation properly before firing.


The point isn't that Noor is awesome and that Guyer should be locked up forever. The point is that cops shoot too many people and jump to lethal means far too soon, and that the race of the shooter and victim matters far too much in terms of legal sympathy and sentencing.

I think they’re analogous for that reason: accidental shootings caused by fearful, trigger-happy cops. They received similar sentences because they negligently / recklessly killed somebody.

And for whatever it is worth, the jury is the one who made the decision on sentencing in the Texas shooting. If I recall correctly, the jury had six blacks and four Latinos on it.  I doubt they went easy on the officer due to sympathy for her race, or contempt for the victim’s.

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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #35 on: October 06, 2019, 08:00:08 AM »

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A key witness in the Guyger case, a black man that lived down the hall from the victim and placed Guyger coming out of the apartment after the shooting was killed yesterday.

No word on if this was retaliation for testifying in the case but it appears this witness had no enemies and the situation does not appear to be a robbery gone wrong.

« Last Edit: October 06, 2019, 08:49:05 AM by nickagneta »

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #36 on: October 06, 2019, 09:04:01 AM »

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A key witness in the Guyger case, a black man that lived down the hall from the victim and placed Guyger coming out of the apartment after the shooting was killed yesterday.

No word on if this was retaliation for testifying in the case but it appears this witness had no enemies and the situation does not appear to be a robbery gone wrong.

This is pretty disturbing. We still don’t know if this is a horrible coincidence or something much worse. The city better get on this and find the killer *fast*.

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #37 on: October 08, 2019, 08:15:20 PM »

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A key witness in the Guyger case, a black man that lived down the hall from the victim and placed Guyger coming out of the apartment after the shooting was killed yesterday.

No word on if this was retaliation for testifying in the case but it appears this witness had no enemies and the situation does not appear to be a robbery gone wrong.

This is pretty disturbing. We still don’t know if this is a horrible coincidence or something much worse. The city better get on this and find the killer *fast*.

Looks like a coincidence. Drug deal gone bad.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/police-3-wanted-killing-witness-182119882.html
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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2019, 08:35:49 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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A key witness in the Guyger case, a black man that lived down the hall from the victim and placed Guyger coming out of the apartment after the shooting was killed yesterday.

No word on if this was retaliation for testifying in the case but it appears this witness had no enemies and the situation does not appear to be a robbery gone wrong.

This is pretty disturbing. We still don’t know if this is a horrible coincidence or something much worse. The city better get on this and find the killer *fast*.

Looks like a coincidence. Drug deal gone bad.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/police-3-wanted-killing-witness-182119882.html
The fact that this guy was a major pot dealer explains why he was so nervous about going to court and being a witness. That's not cool for people involved in the world of drug trafficking.

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2019, 10:55:39 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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So yet another white, Texas police officer shot and killed yet another African American while that person was doing nothing wrong in their own house.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/10/12/us/fort-worth-police-shooting/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2019, 11:10:44 AM »

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So yet another white, Texas police officer shot and killed yet another African American while that person was doing nothing wrong in their own house.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/10/12/us/fort-worth-police-shooting/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Hopefully he is charged, too. Not every person at a potential crime scene is a target.
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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #41 on: October 13, 2019, 11:19:39 AM »

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So yet another white, Texas police officer shot and killed yet another African American while that person was doing nothing wrong in their own house.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/10/12/us/fort-worth-police-shooting/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Hopefully he is charged, too. Not every person at a potential crime scene is a target.
My family has 5 law enforcement officers and a couple of active arms forces personnel. They are all given training on a regular basis on the use of deadly force and how NOT to over react in certain situations and how discharging your weapon is a last resort.

What the heck happens in Texas? Do they not get this training?

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #42 on: October 13, 2019, 12:42:50 PM »

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So yet another white, Texas police officer shot and killed yet another African American while that person was doing nothing wrong in their own house.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/10/12/us/fort-worth-police-shooting/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Hopefully he is charged, too. Not every person at a potential crime scene is a target.
My family has 5 law enforcement officers and a couple of active arms forces personnel. They are all given training on a regular basis on the use of deadly force and how NOT to over react in certain situations and how discharging your weapon is a last resort.

What the heck happens in Texas? Do they not get this training?

In this case, it looks like a rookie officer. 11 months on duty, he gets sent to a welfare check, and rather than announce his entry he blows somebody away within seconds of contact. For the crime of leaving a door open while playing video games with her nephew.

Sounds like this guy wasn’t meant to be a cop. And yes, Texas’ trigger happy culture may play in.
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Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #43 on: October 14, 2019, 09:36:22 PM »

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So after the Fort Worth police officer resigned from his job(just before he would have been fired), he was arrested for muder. Rightfully so, IMO.

Re: Civil Rights Abuses
« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2019, 09:37:29 PM »

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So after the Fort Worth police officer resigned from his job(just before he would have been fired), he was arrested for muder. Rightfully so, IMO.