sign turner

[rollie mass]

be the first to call don't let him just walk
another year with brad and you can trade him later
the celts will not use all the salary cap

[greece66]

nice thread as always rollie.

My concern with ET is not so much the salary but roster spots. We finished the season with 14 players.
For the sake of the argument, let's assume three players will come through the draft,one trhough  FA, and Marcus Thornton might deserve a chance even as a 15th man. This is a very low estimate given we have  eight picks and enough cap space to offer two max contracts.

If you ask me, ET is probably the odd man out; he is likely to ask for a pay rise, he is 27 yo, so I do not expect him getting much better. And finally, although I love his ball handling and he did improve his weaknesses last season (turnovers and D), his 3p% is 24.1. It is not hard to find a cheap replacement through the draft, or get Dudley who is a much better 3p shooter (39.9%).

If we had more roster spots, I'd say keep take them both, but as things are, I'd go with either a young prospect taking his mins or a veteran help improve our offence. ET takes more rebs and gives more assists than Dudley (although he also makes more TOs) but with Smart and IT we already have two ball handlers; he is good to have but far from indispensable.

http://bkref.com/tiny/eM2Aw


 

[rollie mass]

of course you have a valid concern but evans really is the only other guy who can create
-you are right also about dudley from 3 but evan has double his assists and is durable
hate to let him walk for nothing,brad resurected his career
sign him to one year with option the cap goes up again
without turner who can create
crowder straight line ,marcus still learning,rozier can't close reliably,
jerebko never and kelly inconsistent
avery off dribble not often
all we have is isaiah-

[jambr380]

I think it depends on what we do in the draft. Dunn or Buddy can come right in and take most of ET's minutes. We also may make a trade where AB, Crowder, or Smart go and we get a more ball-dominant player like Butler.

I really like ET - his mid-range game is top-notch, he's versatile, he gets lots of rebounds, is a great passer, and is a much improved defender. I am just concerned about his future with the Cs since we have so many picks and his three-point shooting isn't conducive to Brad's system. However, if we make some consolidation trades and ET is willing to take a hometown discount, then I am more than happy to bring him back. He is great for the locker room and might have the best sense of humor in the league.

[Chief]

He played his best basketball trying to earn a big contract. And his best was sort of average. Don't be fooled!  He's just not that good.

[__ramonezy__]

He played his best basketball trying to earn a big contract. And his best was sort of average. Don't be fooled!  He's just not that good.

He isn't that good, but his versatility on offense and defense hid a lot of our team's problems last season. We don't have another offensive player that can consistently get their own shot, we don't have a secure, secondary ball handler once IT sits. All in all, he is a competent two-way player on a team of one-way specialists

[Chief]

Last season is correct. But we can now upgrade that spot because it's the off season.

If we want to be mediocre forever sign mediocre players.
This team isn't beating Toronto, Atlanta, or Cleveland unless we seriously upgrade the talent.

[greece66]

of course you have a valid concern but evans really is the only other guy who can create
-you are right also about dudley from 3 but evan has double his assists and is durable
hate to let him walk for nothing,brad resurected his career
sign him to one year with option the cap goes up again
without turner who can create
crowder straight line ,marcus still learning,rozier can't close reliably,
jerebko never and kelly inconsistent
avery off dribble not often
all we have is isaiah-

Thanks for the answer Rollie.

Let me put it this way:

Scenario A:

we free roster posts by trading many for one and/or trading our picks.

in which case, we have plenty of roster posts and it all depends on the negotiations between DA and ET.

Scenario B

The interesting one for me because it allows for meaningful debate. Not saying this is what will happen, but it is IMO a meaningful way to debate the value of the players.

Suppose:
-we draft more players than we have roster spots.
-DA wants to add a couple of FAs too.
-we can draft/get through FA players playing at any position (ie make your decision on who is the best player, not on what position he plays)

So, you have to let go five of the following six: Amir (non guaranteed), Sully (RFA), Jerebko (non guaranteed), ET (FA), Zeller (RFA), Young (will have to be waived).

In this situation, I would most probably keep Amir for a number of reasons: non guaranteed contract, so no negotiation needed, only one year commitment (minimal risk,) solid veteran player, does all the small things you want from a big (screens, hustle, good defensive presence).

I can see a case being made for Zeller or Sully in case you want to take a risky and cheaper contract; and even for Young, in case you want to give him one last chance to prove himself.

But it's hard to see how in case we run out of roster spots we make a move to re-sign ET. Sure, we will miss his playmaking, but Stevens seems to want to delegate some of the ballhandling responsibility to Smart- he will need time to develop this skill; we also need to add at least one wing who can make threes, how will he coexist with ET?

But most importantly what ET brings to the table is not hard to find- sure the combination of his size, ballhandling and mid-range shooting is a very rare combo- I do not want to be unfair on that. But I can easily see how other players taking his minutes, ET's contribution will be absorbed by the team - you cannot say the same for Amir. Nor does ET have any upside left at 27.

So, although I like him, my best guess is that he will be gone.

[chiken Green]

ET was great for last years team - but when Bradly got hurt and Crowder was limping you saw what he brought to the table.. IT wasn't enough to help us out of round 1..

ET will be paid well somewhere else and I am happy about that.. As for The Celtics - we need someone to take his minutes and bring Something to the table.. Rozier or Hunter in the 2nd year or possibly the #3 could perform his duties and if they do it will upgrade the team..

ET's Role is the easiest to upgrade..

[CelticPride2016]

Seven roster spots could be opened up by simply moving on:

1) Sully
2) Jerebko
3) Turner
4) Amir
5) John Holland
6) Tyler Zeller
7) James Young (waive him as suggested by Greece)

That means we are not as boxed in by the roster as it seems. Two new rookies could easily fit in. I don't know what the benefit is to all the second round picks. Sure, draft and stash. We did that with Colton Iverson. Maybe that will work next time or perhaps invite Colton to training camp and give him a real chance for once. He or a similar player could possibly replace both Sully and Zeller.

In my opinion, we have to resign Turner and Amir unless their skills are replaced. We are going for titles now. There will be no cinderella finish if there is no Amir, Turner and fireworks.

I was the biggest detractor of Evan Turner. I would add to the mob pile calling him Evan Turnover. It was too perfect a nickname.

That was then. This is now. I can't believe how much people are underrating Evan Turner's game. I believe he is a rotation player on a championship team. He is a versatile toolbox of a player. And Brad Stevens has won these guys over. Turner is no diva.

Sully is a whole other topic, as is Zeller to a lesser extent. The former is eating himself out of the league and Zeller seems a bit too content also with his NBA development.

I can also see the argument against resigning Amir because he does appear brittle as Rollie points out. But we need Amir just like we need Turner. You can't let guys go without replacing them with players who can do some or most of the same things.

Jerebko is another player we should resign if we have no one else like him and there isn't a roster crunch.

We messed up letting Gigi Datome go. He filled the tall sg role, until Danny decided to roll the dice with unproven players such as Hunter and Young. Don't make the same mistake with Evan Turner for what he brings to the table?

I think Jordan Crawford and Marcus Thornton were not worth keeping. Perhaps in a way, Turner seemed to be the same kind of pro, some kind of bridge player to what the team will actually end up being. Evan Turner matured and fine-tuned his game. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

[chiken Green]

Seven roster spots could be opened up by simply moving on:

1) Sully
2) Jerebko
3) Turner
4) Amir
5) John Holland
6) Tyler Zeller
7) James Young (waive him as suggested by Greece)

That means we are not as boxed in by the roster as it seems. Two new rookies could easily fit in. I don't know what the benefit is to all the second round picks. Sure, draft and stash. We did that with Colton Iverson. Maybe that will work next time or perhaps invite Colton to training camp and give him a real chance for once. He or a similar player could possibly replace both Sully and Zeller.

In my opinion, we have to resign Turner and Amir unless their skills are replaced. We are going for titles now. There will be no cinderella finish if there is no Amir, Turner and fireworks.

I was the biggest detractor of Evan Turner. I would add to the mob pile calling him Evan Turnover. It was too perfect a nickname.

That was then. This is now. I can't believe how much people are underrating Evan Turner's game. I believe he is a rotation player on a championship team. He is a versatile toolbox of a player. And Brad Stevens has won these guys over. Turner is no diva.

Sully is a whole other topic, as is Zeller to a lesser extent. The former is eating himself out of the league and Zeller seems a bit too content also with his NBA development.

I can also see the argument against resigning Amir because he does appear brittle as Rollie points out. But we need Amir just like we need Turner. You can't let guys go without replacing them with players who can do some or most of the same things.

Jerebko is another player we should resign if we have no one else like him and there isn't a roster crunch.

We messed up letting Gigi Datome go. He filled the tall sg role, until Danny decided to roll the dice with unproven players such as Hunter and Young. Don't make the same mistake with Evan Turner for what he brings to the table?

I think Jordan Crawford and Marcus Thornton were not worth keeping. Perhaps in a way, Turner seemed to be the same kind of pro, some kind of bridge player to what the team will actually end up being. Evan Turner matured and fine-tuned his game. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

Gigi Datome? whew..
My friend no disrespect but This team is not chasing a title.. You Add ET to a Cav's, Spurs, Clippers or Even a OKC team with Durant.. and you can say okay They are chasing a Title.. We are light years away from those teams right now.
Our Team, the youngest Team in the playoffs last year are not in a position a Titles run.. We are trying to develop talent to help win a playoff Series..  GIGI, Butler and ET = another 1st round Exit..
I'm not saying he is bad because he is not, Just saying If We cant get better than him for that role then we are stuck..  IF he is there Mainly for Ball-handling then we need to pray that both RJ and especially Rozier can take that next step and Handle the rock.. (and Find their shots consistently)

What happens with Amir is neither here nor there when comparing his role to ET's.

 

[Future Celtics Owner]

of course you have a valid concern but evans really is the only other guy who can create
-you are right also about dudley from 3 but evan has double his assists and is durable
hate to let him walk for nothing,brad resurected his career
sign him to one year with option the cap goes up again
without turner who can create
crowder straight line ,marcus still learning,rozier can't close reliably,
jerebko never and kelly inconsistent
avery off dribble not often
all we have is isaiah-

I think the team we put out on the floor resurrected his career. Besides IT he is the only guy who can create offense on his own. It saddens me that this is what the Celtic's have debased themselves to:
Using players(Bass,JJ,Gigi,ET,Sully) that have no future with us to further/resurect their careers and then leave...o and let's not forget the inflated wins they added to our record....costing us wayyyy more than they gave
I do have to figure a way to get over that.

[86MaxwellSmart]

Someone will probably give him a 3 year $28 Million contract....not us.