Danny's drafting pattern: Defence and Athleticism first

[Yogi]

Wouldn't mind Robert Sacre in the second round.  The kid looked like a Gortat clone in the few games I saw him play this year.

[mctyson]

I disagree.  I think Danny's pattern has been to take the best player available at our position in the draft.  Often times when you are drafting mid-to-late first round like we have been for a decade, the best player available lacks a particular something (size, shooting touch, handle, etc...) that would otherwise make him a lottery pick.  

Here are our draft selections in the Danny Ainge era (some of these players he did not draft but traded for.)  Look through this list and it does not scream out defense necessarily.  I would agree he likes the more athletic players, but again I think that is a function of trying to get the best NBA talent possible at the position you draft at.

Another thing is, as you scan this list, you realize just how good (or lucky) Danny has been at drafting.  Our biggest busts were Marcus Banks and Gerald Green, the former being an attempt to create an uptempo team with a speedy point guard, the latter being the classic "pick the best player available."    After that you have to go to the early second round picks of Giddens and Pruitt to find true busts.  . (edit: left out BBD)

Year   Round   Pick     Player

2011   1   28   JuJuan Johnson
2011   2   55   E'Twaun Moore
2010   1   19   Avery Bradley
2010   2   52   Luke Harangody
2009   2   58   Lester Hudson
2008   1   30   J.R. Giddens
2008   2   60   Semih Erden
2007   1   5   Jeff Green
2007   2   32   Gabe Pruitt
2006   1   21   Rajon Rondo
2006    2       49      Leon Powe
2005   1   18   Gerald Green
2005   2   50   Ryan Gomes
2005   2   53   Orien Greene
2004   1   15   Al Jefferson
2004   1   24   Delonte West
2004   1   25   Tony Allen
2004   2   40   Justin Reed
2003   1   13   Marcus Banks
2003   1   27   Kendrick Perkins
2003   2   56   Brandon Hunter

[Tr1boy]

Actually, I don't agree with the OP.  

I think that when Danny has looked for athleticism and defense, he's generally bombed (see Marcus Banks and J.R. Giddens, the jury is out on JaJuan Johnson).

I think where Ainge has had almost all of his success is drafting very talented, polished, smart players that have some sort of perceived "fatal flaw" that causes them to slip.  

Examples would be as follows:

-Rondo: can't shoot and attitude problems

-Tony Allen: undersized 2 with questionable attitude

-Ryan Gomes: undersized 4

-Leon Powe: undersized 4 with knee issues

-BBD: undersized 4 with weight issues

-Avery Bradley: undersized 2

-Moore (assuming he pans out): undersized 2

As you can see, in most cases, he's gone with guys who don't fit the classic height requirements of the position, but were quite talented.  

I don't know a ton about the NCAA, but I'd be looking for Ainge to make a move on someone who is either undersized for his position and will consequently slip (maybe Sullinger or even Rivers to some extent) or someone with some sort of baggage (like Royce White).  



So, if anything, to me, Danny's MO most

Never stated it was the right strategy and yeah it has burnt him a few times in Giddens and Green.

But the list you have up there are of guys who have athleticism/quickness and potential to play defense. Forget about height or being undersized.


-Rondo: Athletic , can steal before nba.

-Tony Allen: Athletic, known for defense, hard work

-Ryan Gomes: 2nd round pick, so again athletism and defense doesn't matter as much as other things.

-Leon Powe: Same as Gomes. But also ahtletic and was suppose to be big out of hs

-BBD: 2nd round again.  Great tourney

-Avery Bradley: Athletic + defense

-Moore (assuming he pans out): 2nd round. Character. Most points in his program

Again i see a pattern, the last few years of how likes to draft in the 1st and 2nd. It wouldn't be a shock if he went with a Jenkins or Nicholson in the first round, but strictly on the basis on what he has does majority of the time, it will be drafting based on Athleticism and defence.

[Celtics4ever]

Cough Big Baby......

[jr_3421]

The thing about Ainge is that he has different philosophies for the 1st and 2nd round. Generally in the 1st he goes for potential and the 2nd round he goes for productivity.

[Celtics18]

I'm partial towards Jeff Taylor.  I think he'd be perfect alongside Rondo.  He's an athletic defender who can shoot from the perimeter and finish at the rim.

I also have to admit that I like the fact that he's an American-Scandinavian.

[csfansince60s]

I'm partial towards Jeff Taylor.  I think he'd be perfect alongside Rondo.  He's an athletic defender who can shoot from the perimeter and finish at the rim.

I also have to admit that I like the fact that he's an American-Scandinavian.

I've been on the Taylor bandwagon for a while now.

From nbadraft.net about his D:

"Has high-level potential on the defensive end, and his defense could be where his most value as a prospect lies … Is versatile on this end, and defended everything except C when at Vandy…Is very fundamentally sound and moves his feet very well … Has the size to defend SG’s and a lot of the bigger SF’s in time … Was arguably the best defending wing in the SEC last season, even though Kentucky’s Michael Kidd-Gilchrist got most of the pub …

http://nbadraft.net/players/jeffery-taylor

High motor, relentless D, great work ethic, unselfish. Born to be a Celtic.

Could you imagine a lineup of Rondo/Bradley/Taylor/Jeff Green/KG??? Running teams into the ground and then grinding them down further on the defensive end! Wow!!

[lightspeed5]

2006 quotes from ainge after drafting rondo:

Ainge said he's been watching Rondo and Telfair for a long time.

"I've watched these kids since they were young, and they just stood out in every game I've ever seen them in. Their special skills stood out." said Ainge, who noted that both guys have styles that would have lent themselves to the 1980's Celtics. "They could play in any era, at any time."
 

Ainge especially loves the intangibles that Rondo brings to the table, and is excited about his rebounding and ball hawking defense. But Rondo's calling card is his speed, and Ainge expects that it could make him a "special player" in the NBA thanks to the way the game has shifted to an emphasis on perimeter and pick-and-roll play.

[Celestine3]

thanks a lot

[clover]

Actually, I don't agree with the OP.  

I think that when Danny has looked for athleticism and defense, he's generally bombed (see Marcus Banks and J.R. Giddens, the jury is out on JaJuan Johnson).

I think where Ainge has had almost all of his success is drafting very talented, polished, smart players that have some sort of perceived "fatal flaw" that causes them to slip.  

Examples would be as follows:

-Rondo: can't shoot and attitude problems

-Tony Allen: undersized 2 with questionable attitude

-Ryan Gomes: undersized 4

-Leon Powe: undersized 4 with knee issues

-BBD: undersized 4 with weight issues

-Avery Bradley: undersized 2

-Moore (assuming he pans out): undersized 2

As you can see, in most cases, he's gone with guys who don't fit the classic height requirements of the position, but were quite talented.  

I don't know a ton about the NCAA, but I'd be looking for Ainge to make a move on someone who is either undersized for his position and will consequently slip (maybe Sullinger or even Rivers to some extent) or someone with some sort of baggage (like Royce White).  

Every player is seen to have some 'flaws'--remember how even Durant wasn't strong and athletic enough?

Also, I think you're being deceptively selective in your examples.  Arguably Danny's three most successful picks have been Rondo, Perk and Al Jeff--each of whom is adequately sized for his position.

I think they drafted Bradley as a PG, which is part of why it took Doc almost two years to see that he was a SG.  Rather, Bradley fell insomuch as he did because he was injured and he didn't do especially well in his one college season.

Yes, Danny has had some successes (and failures--hello, Gody) in picking undersized upperclassman PFs at the tail end of the draft, and so got surprising value for the pick, but he's also always ultimately traded them away.

And he does like combo guards (e.g., DWest, Bradley, Moore). 

I'd say those are the two positions he's got unexpected value for so far.   But they're also about the last two profiles of players that they need or, I'd imagine, want in this draft, particularly since it's a deep one.

[clover]

The thing about Ainge is that he has different philosophies for the 1st and 2nd round. Generally in the 1st he goes for potential and the 2nd round he goes for productivity.

Very true.

[boscel33]

I'm partial towards Jeff Taylor.  I think he'd be perfect alongside Rondo.  He's an athletic defender who can shoot from the perimeter and finish at the rim.

I also have to admit that I like the fact that he's an American-Scandinavian.

I've been on the Taylor bandwagon for a while now.

From nbadraft.net about his D:

"Has high-level potential on the defensive end, and his defense could be where his most value as a prospect lies … Is versatile on this end, and defended everything except C when at Vandy…Is very fundamentally sound and moves his feet very well … Has the size to defend SG’s and a lot of the bigger SF’s in time … Was arguably the best defending wing in the SEC last season, even though Kentucky’s Michael Kidd-Gilchrist got most of the pub …

http://nbadraft.net/players/jeffery-taylor

High motor, relentless D, great work ethic, unselfish. Born to be a Celtic.

Could you imagine a lineup of Rondo/Bradley/Taylor/Jeff Green/KG??? Running teams into the ground and then grinding them down further on the defensive end! Wow!!

I'm on the same bandwagon.  I'm dreaming of a Nicholson/Taylor draft (providing 21/22 is where the pick).  Many mocks have Nicholson, but the second pick is all over the place.

[clover]

I'm partial towards Jeff Taylor.  I think he'd be perfect alongside Rondo.  He's an athletic defender who can shoot from the perimeter and finish at the rim.

I also have to admit that I like the fact that he's an American-Scandinavian.

I've been on the Taylor bandwagon for a while now.

From nbadraft.net about his D:

"Has high-level potential on the defensive end, and his defense could be where his most value as a prospect lies … Is versatile on this end, and defended everything except C when at Vandy…Is very fundamentally sound and moves his feet very well … Has the size to defend SG’s and a lot of the bigger SF’s in time … Was arguably the best defending wing in the SEC last season, even though Kentucky’s Michael Kidd-Gilchrist got most of the pub …

http://nbadraft.net/players/jeffery-taylor

High motor, relentless D, great work ethic, unselfish. Born to be a Celtic.

Could you imagine a lineup of Rondo/Bradley/Taylor/Jeff Green/KG??? Running teams into the ground and then grinding them down further on the defensive end! Wow!!

I'll admit, after Pierce I'm spoiled and I want shot creation and ball handling in an attempted next-generation 3.  Also, Taylor is already 23, whereas some of the other top 3's--e.g., Miller, Harkless, and Fournier--are still teenagers who are already competitive in skills.

[csfansince60s]

I'm partial towards Jeff Taylor.  I think he'd be perfect alongside Rondo.  He's an athletic defender who can shoot from the perimeter and finish at the rim.

I also have to admit that I like the fact that he's an American-Scandinavian.

I've been on the Taylor bandwagon for a while now.

From nbadraft.net about his D:

"Has high-level potential on the defensive end, and his defense could be where his most value as a prospect lies … Is versatile on this end, and defended everything except C when at Vandy…Is very fundamentally sound and moves his feet very well … Has the size to defend SG’s and a lot of the bigger SF’s in time … Was arguably the best defending wing in the SEC last season, even though Kentucky’s Michael Kidd-Gilchrist got most of the pub …

http://nbadraft.net/players/jeffery-taylor

High motor, relentless D, great work ethic, unselfish. Born to be a Celtic.

Could you imagine a lineup of Rondo/Bradley/Taylor/Jeff Green/KG??? Running teams into the ground and then grinding them down further on the defensive end! Wow!!

I'll admit, after Pierce I'm spoiled and I want shot creation and ball handling in an attempted next-generation 3.  Also, Taylor is already 23, whereas some of the other top 3's--e.g., Miller, Harkless, and Fournier--are still teenagers who are already competitive in skills.

While I agree that his "upside"  may not be as great as Miller, Harkless, Fournier, Royce White and others, he has improved his game every year at Vandy, is a tireless worker, an unselfish teammate and as explosive athletically as any of the above mentioned, and there may be room for improvement still, even though, as you point out, he will be 23 on draft night.

This from DraftExpress:

Playing with a traditional point guard will allow him to play more to his strengths and his role will likely consist of spotting up around the perimeter, finishing in transition and off of cuts to the basket, and occasionally taking his man off of the dribble. His steady improvement at Vanderbilt has been impressive, however, and by all accounts his work ethic and intangibles are outstanding, so it is not out of the question that he will continue to add elements to his game throughout his career.

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com#ixzz1y46yBgG4
http://www.draftexpress.com

In addition , he is NBA ready now, especially on D.This too from DraftExpress:

Though he will be 23 years old on draft night, Taylor is one of the few players in this draft who should be ready to contribute immediately. At 6'7 with a solid 226-pound frame, a respectable perimeter jump shot, and lockdown defensive potential; Taylor has solidified his standing as a first round draft pick this season who could rise up draft boards in June if he strings together a solid NCAA Tournament run and strong individual workouts.

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com#ixzz1y47OmKjb
http://www.draftexpress.com

If we bring KG back and are retooling/making one more run, this is a kid who can be part of the rotation quickly.

I do hear your concern about "upside", though sometimes it's overrated.

[vjcsmoke]

The more I hear about Jeffrey Taylor, the more I like.  Especially his potential to be a lockdown defender and versatility to guard 3/4's at the next level.  His jumper and athleticism are also big pluses.  I'm not worried that he's 23, that just means he is more mature and Doc rarely plays rookies anyways.  But the more ready you are on D, generally the more minutes you will earn.

Also have an interest in Festus Ezeli.  We might have to buy a late round 1st round pick or move up in the 2nd to get him though.  A high compete Nigerian with legit 5 length, strength, and athleticism.  No offensive game, but Perk didn't have that eiter.  Notable for playing head to head with #1 overall projected Anthony and containing him in their 2nd matchup.