High school team forfeits game due to shattering backboard in pregame warm-ups.

[PaulPierce34G]

http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=922635

"This was a "teaching" moment that comes up for high school coaches from time to time.

You know, one of those, "We just got a bad break, and that's life, we have to deal with it."

On March 5 in Cut Bank, Mont., Isaiah Martin, a 5-foot-11 senior guard for Harlem's boys basketball team, dunked during warmups for a high school tournament game with Shelby.

There was a shower of glass as the backboard shattered.

Harlem had to forfeit the game.

According to the Montana High School Association, dunking is not allowed in pregame warmups in tournament play. If a backboard is damaged by a pregame dunk, the offending school must forfeit. The rule was put in 10 years ago.

Harlem, which had finished second in its district, forfeited the Northern Divisional game to Shelby. Harlem was dumped into the loser's bracket and won on Friday night, but on a quick turnaround Saturday morning it lost in overtime and was eliminated.

"We had that talk about life being tough and you roll with the punches and how you pick yourself up," Harlem coach Harlan Mount said. "It took a lot out of the team."

Almost a week later, you could hear the dismay in the 48-year-old Mount's voice, as if the talk and the lesson did not soothe his team's disappointment. The Wildcats had made a 168-mile trip only to be left face-down with an improbable forfeit, which goes down in the books as a 2-0 defeat.

"I was stunned," Mount said. "At first, the tournament official came to our locker room and said it would probably be a technical for breaking the backboard. Then he came back and asked me to step outside with him. It was in the rule book, in black and white.

"I thought it was harsh."

The Harlem fans made the 168-mile trip, paid for their tickets, took their seats, but did not get their money back when their team forfeited.

Mount understands a rule was broken and there are consequences, but he has other questions. There was a thunderous dunk, he said, in the game before Harlem took the floor, a dunk he heard in his team's locker room.

Did anyone inspect the backboard?

"Isaiah is a buck-fifty, maybe 160 pounds," Mount said. "Hard to believe a kid at that weight shattered a backboard. Was it already defective?"

If a backboard is broken with a dunk in a game, Mount said there is a technical called, but it is not a forfeit. He wonders why there is a difference.

Mount said he told his team no dunking in pregame warmups, but when he got to the tournament there were other teams dunking in pregame. He told his kids it was OK.

Brian Kavanagh, the coach at Cut Bank, said after Harlem forfeited that players on other teams approached the rim gingerly in pregame warmups and there were no more pregame dunks. A lesson had been learned the hard way.

Harlem finished the season 13-10. It was a good record in a rebuilding year, but the Wildcats expected better in the postseason. After all, they were the only team to beat the top seed in the division all season.

Mount is Director of the Native American Career and Technical Education Program at the Fort Belknap College. It is a tribal college, which is near the Native American reservations in north Montana - almost on the Canadian border. He is training students for real life and jobs.

His team's forfeit was just some more real-life, on-the-job training."

[yall hate]

that sucks for the other players...but at the same time, the rules say dont dunk.

I bet in the future the coach makes sure he tells the kids not to dunk during warmups.

[Steve Weinman]

In how much of the country is dunking in warm-ups for a high school game okay?

I know it was always made clear to us (not that it had any relevance to me as the 6-foot guy with no leaping ability) to stay off the rim before the game.

Anyone else weigh in one way or the other?

-sw

[CelticsWhat35]

It was always no dunking when I was in high school, and those who did, never hung on the rim.  I don't care if it was a faulty backboard, as the coach alleged might have been the case.  If you're 150 lbs. and you're shattering glass, you were hanging on the rim, and to do that during warmups is just plain stupid.

[makaveli]

I don't know wath to say about that rule, I played a game about a year ago and durring warmups, somebody broke the backboard and the game was simply rescheduled and I still felt stupid and disappointed, I can't imagine how Harlem Boys felt like.

[Redz]

I think the rules were initially installed back when dunks were considered somewhat evil and nothing more than showboating (they were outlawed during games in the NCAA's for a while there).  One can argue that dunking in warmups is pretty much showboating, whereas in a game they are a viable way of scoring 2 points (not that they are not quite often showboating too). 

I know when I was in high school (80's) it was pretty clear that you would get a T if you dunked in warmups.  I'd never heard of a forfeit rule, but in our league there weren't more than a handful of guys who could do a dunk of any value anyhow. 

I can also see where it might make sense on a budgetary level.  If a broken backboard happens during a game it's somewhat justifiable, if it happens during warmups it's simply not necessary (and a big fat waste of money to replace a backboard).

Look at Tony Allen's injury incurred while dunking after the whistle a couple of years ago.  No one has a problem with a guy getting hurt during game action, but when you do it dunking when during play stoppage it just looks stupid.

While fun I'm sure, dunking during warmups does little to actually "warm you up".  Layups, weaves etc...should do the trick.

If the rules say it's a forfeit...tough noogies.

[Hoyo de Monterrey]

In how much of the country is dunking in warm-ups for a high school game okay?

I know it was always made clear to us (not that it had any relevance to me as the 6-foot guy with no leaping ability) to stay off the rim before the game.

Anyone else weigh in one way or the other?

-sw

dunking in warmups in NH high school is an automatic technical foul, which makes sense. It's a stupid thing to do in warmups anyway, it doesn't prove anything. It's fine in games though

[Steve Weinman]

In how much of the country is dunking in warm-ups for a high school game okay?

I know it was always made clear to us (not that it had any relevance to me as the 6-foot guy with no leaping ability) to stay off the rim before the game.

Anyone else weigh in one way or the other?

-sw

dunking in warmups in NH high school is an automatic technical foul, which makes sense. It's a stupid thing to do in warmups anyway, it doesn't prove anything. It's fine in games though

Yep, that was the case for us in New York as well.  Two shots and the ball going the other way to start.  And a rule I have no problem with.

Thanks for the knowledge, Hoyo.

It was always no dunking when I was in high school, and those who did, never hung on the rim.  I don't care if it was a faulty backboard, as the coach alleged might have been the case.  If you're 150 lbs. and you're shattering glass, you were hanging on the rim, and to do that during warmups is just plain stupid.

Yep, completely agreed, CW35.

-sw

[Eja117]

It's a little harsh and you wish the kids knew ahead of time, but I'm fine with it for several reasons.

One is that it should hopefully reduce pre game showboating

Two is that it's not your board. It's someone else's and they aren't cool with you destroying it and shouldn't have to pay for your carelessness

It does reduce injury possibilities as well

I definitely feel the questions about the board quality are justified though

I actually feel more sorry for the other team. If I went to a playoff game and was told I couldn't play cause the other team did some stupid thing in warm ups I'd be pretty annoyed.

I'd try to invite the other team to scrimmage practice for a little while

[Amonkey]

I don't think the reason that this rule is in place has anything to do with showboating.  It's very simple.  Basketball boards costs money and a school, with the tight budget that it has already, does not want to pay for broken board.  It's the same reason why schools have to make sure they receive their football gear after the football season, why there was always a limited number of balls in my school, and why they charged $5 to go to a HHS basketball game.  There's just not that much money around in our education system these days and they'll do anything to shed those expenses.  It's an unfortunate incident, but I can't blame the school.

[yall hate]

I definitely feel the questions about the board quality are justified though

It may be justified, but it is irrelevant.

if he had dunked during the game, and the same 'broken' back board shattered, the game would still be on (with a technical). 

whether the board was broken or not doesnt effect the fact that the action was still against the rules before hand.

[Amonkey]

I definitely feel the questions about the board quality are justified though

It may be justified, but it is irrelevant.

if he had dunked during the game, and the same 'broken' back board shattered, the game would still be on (with a technical). 

whether the board was broken or not doesnt effect the fact that the action was still against the rules before hand.

And again, to go with school budget.  I am pretty sure the school is not going to choose a NBA standard high quality backboard for high school games.  Why would they choose an expensive board if the board is only gonna get about 1% of the action an NBA boards gets.

[Roy Hobbs]

According to the Montana High School Association, dunking is not allowed in pregame warmups in tournament play. If a backboard is damaged by a pregame dunk, the offending school must forfeit. The rule was put in 10 years ago.

That pretty much closes the book.  There's a clear rule, so yes, the team must automatically forfeit the game.

[Eja117]

I definitely feel the questions about the board quality are justified though

It may be justified, but it is irrelevant.

if he had dunked during the game, and the same 'broken' back board shattered, the game would still be on (with a technical). 

whether the board was broken or not doesnt effect the fact that the action was still against the rules before hand.

And again, to go with school budget.  I am pretty sure the school is not going to choose a NBA standard high quality backboard for high school games.  Why would they choose an expensive board if the board is only gonna get about 1% of the action an NBA boards gets.

Well because for one thing there are some kids that are pretty big these days. The bigger kids are definitely bigger than the smaller pros.

Second when you lower safety standards for kids without at least altering rules to reflect that you are inviting a law suit sooner or later.

Despite various precautions and permission slips people can't sign away their rights and people have a reasonable expectation that if their 160lb kids dunks he won't be badly hurt