Yikes... Ray frustrated with Doc?

[winsomme]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

[wdleehi]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

[nickagneta]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

It was definitely a mistake to take the ball out of his hands for most of the fourth quarter. But when it got down to about 2:30 left in the game, I have no problem with wanting to bang the ball inside to try to pick up fouls, offensive rebounds, and reduce long rebounds for fastbreak ops.

Rivers mistake to me was taking Ray out at all in the fourth and not giving him the ball virtually every time down the floor until late in the game.

Just my humble opinion.

[wdleehi]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

It was definitely a mistake to take the ball out of his hands for most of the fourth quarter. But when it got down to about 2:30 left in the game, I have no problem with wanting to bang the ball inside to try to pick up fouls, offensive rebounds, and reduce long rebounds for fastbreak ops.

Rivers mistake to me was taking Ray out at all in the fourth and not giving him the ball virtually every time down the floor until late in the game.

Just my humble opinion.

The two man game should have been Ray and KG, Pierce and KG last night. 

[winsomme]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

and if Ray had missed forced shots because he was getting doubled in the 4th, then everybody would be leading the "why didn't we go to Pierce and KG in the 4th?" brigade...

[Jon]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

and if Ray had missed forced shots because he was getting doubled in the 4th, then everybody would be leading the "why didn't we go to Pierce and KG in the 4th?" brigade...

I agree.  In hindsight, I would've gone with Ray more, and I was disappointed that Doc didn't even during the game.  However, part of what makes each of our Big Three so dangerous is that (on most nights) all three are a huge threat to blow up.  If we stuck with Ray too long, it might have stolen from that.  Moreover, as already noted, had we stuck with Ray and still lost, people would be bashing Doc for not going to Paul and KG. 

It's a tough situation. 

[winsomme]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

and if Ray had missed forced shots because he was getting doubled in the 4th, then everybody would be leading the "why didn't we go to Pierce and KG in the 4th?" brigade...

I agree.  In hindsight, I would've gone with Ray more, and I was disappointed that Doc didn't even during the game.  However, part of what makes each of our Big Three so dangerous is that (on most nights) all three are a huge threat to blow up.  If we stuck with Ray too long, it might have stolen from that.  Moreover, as already noted, had we stuck with Ray and still lost, people would be bashing Doc for not going to Paul and KG. 

It's a tough situation. 

Pierce also got hammered on two key drives late in the game and simply got the old "not tonight" treatment from the refs...

IMO LA  has looked closer at the CLE series and is now going to grab and clutch Paul just like the Cavs did (and ATL for the matter) and hope that the refs swallow the whistle....at least for the next couple of games in LA anyway...

these next two games are going to be up hill battles....

[wdleehi]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

and if Ray had missed forced shots because he was getting doubled in the 4th, then everybody would be leading the "why didn't we go to Pierce and KG in the 4th?" brigade...

If Ray forced shots? 

If Ray was doubled, he would have passed. 

But the only defense of the move is what could have gone wrong with going with the hot star. 

[winsomme]

Celtics regular offense wasn't working last night.  (the defense was and kept it close)


The one time the Celtics offense clicked was in the third when they went to KG down low.  House on the floor kept it hard to double.



The best set up was KG in the low post, Ray with the ball at the three in position to feed KG, and Perk set up outside to set a pick for Ray.


When Perk's man dropped to double KG before he got the ball, Ray off the pick created a wide open three. 

When Perk's man was out to defend the pick and roll, KG had single coverage. 


When one of the other two defender came accross, House, Pierce (or Posey) was open. 

That should have been the offensive strategy at the end of the game.  Inside/outside with KG and Allen.



Ray definitely frustrated last night.  He was hot.  It was his game to win.  The ball an opportunities didn't go to him

Good points. 

I really think that the C's took what the defense gave them most of the night.  At the end of the game, they might have overthought it a little, but I also think the Lakers defense picked up significantly. 

I need to watch the game again, but at the end of the game when Ray did get the ball, he seemed to be swarmed, and didn't get the open looks he had earlier.  But I need to watch more closely to see if it was because of different play calls, or the defense adjusting.

he WAS getting swarmed.....they began trapping him on every cut he was making just like in CLE....

and the idea that running our offense through Pierce and KG at the end of a game being a huge coaching mistake is preposterous.

Right.

Why should we ask why they didn't use a part of their offense that was actually successful that night.


What I said isn't something I made up.  It is what I observed them doing in the 3rd quarter.  You know, the only quarter they outscored the Lakers in. 


Taking the ball out of the hands of the one star that was playing well on offense is a mistake. 

We are not talking about going away from a hot Perk or Rondo. 

We are talking about Ray Allen.

and if Ray had missed forced shots because he was getting doubled in the 4th, then everybody would be leading the "why didn't we go to Pierce and KG in the 4th?" brigade...

If Ray forced shots? 

If Ray was doubled, he would have passed. 

But the only defense of the move is what could have gone wrong with going with the hot star. 

how do you know what he would have done?

he was getting doubled and the shots he did take showed that...