Author Topic: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?  (Read 21260 times)

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Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #120 on: June 02, 2017, 03:47:24 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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from a league where Colton Iverson is his stiffest competition?  Wasted pick. 
plainly false

The idea that he would have top 10 potential in this draft is definitely a drug-induced hallucination.  If he was worth the 5th pick in this draft that would be someone like Malik Monk/Josh Jackson/Dearron Fox/ J Smith/or Jayson Tatum...
top 10 =/= pick #5. Stupid comment #2.

It's laughable to think Zizic (who would have slipped to the second round last year if not for the Celtics) is in that class.
Zizic was projected to go in the first round (actually was considered a steal at 23).
YES they reached for Zizic ... YES they could have traded those first round picks for more value,
according to mock drafts and post-draft analysts, the bolded is completely untrue

There is also 0 evidence that they could have traded pick 23 for more value

You seem to have taken some of what I said personally, I encourage you to take some deep breaths to relax before posting, or possibly investigate medical interventions.

It's tough to argue the rationale side of this situation with irrational posters... People on this board are arguing that Zizic has value as a top 10 pick in THIS draft which is beyond absurd.  Not only is it nearly impossible for a Euroleague player to get drafted in the Top 10 of ANY draft, there has never been a euroleague player drafted in the top 10 who didn't have an outside shot or next level passing ability.

But somehow a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds a game playing against the dregs of the professional leagues is going to be the first player ever to break through that ceiling? 

Seriously, get real.

Here's links to 4 articles that did a redraft of the 2016 NBA draft, some just do the top 10 some redraft the whole first round.  You won't find Zizic in the top 10 of any of them... or even in the first round... because NOBODY thinks he's actually gained value. 

http://www.thesportster.com/basketball/re-drafting-the-first-round-of-the-2016-nba-draft/
http://www.foxsports.com/nba/gallery/nba-draft-no-1-pick-first-redraft-redo-worst-class-ever-brandon-ingram-ben-simmons-2016-033017
http://thesportsquotient.com/nba/2017/1/6/2016-nba-re-draft-what-should-have-happened
https://theringer.com/reevaluating-the-2016-nba-draft-class-46df7c76e2b2
Nothing personal about it. Your post was riddled with inaccuracies so I pointed them out. Simple as that.

I don't think Zizic goes top 10 in this draft, but that doesn't make your fallacious argument any better.

Ford and Pelton listed Zizic in their top 10 rookies mid season and Keith Smart and Kevin OConnor reported that multiple scouts have Zizic as a backend of the top 10 pick in this draft.

Zizic went from a Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.ty league to the best league outside the NBA and performed very well under a former NBA coach putting up better numbers than Nurkic or Jokic at a similar age. There is reason for optimism here.
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Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #121 on: June 02, 2017, 03:58:26 PM »

Offline oldtype

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I can understand why people would be skeptical re: Zizic's potential if they know absolutely nothing about the EuroLeague.  The Euroleague is a collection of only the best teams from each professional league from Europe, it is without a question the second-strongest league in the world.  If Zizic was putting up these very same numbers on Kentucky, wouldn't you be reasonably excited about him? Well, your average EuroLeague opponent is miles stronger than you average SEC opponent.

Now obviously take this with a grain of salt, but based on projection models Zizic's numbers this year in Euroleague translate to roughly 10.7 points and 14.2 rebounds per 36 minutes on 57% shooting in the NBA. There are limits to his upside given that he is a non-uber-athletic center that doesn't shoot, but he is a legitimately exciting prospect.  I don't know about top 10, but he'd certainly be in the Zach Collins tier if he were being drafted this year.


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Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #122 on: June 02, 2017, 04:44:21 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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from a league where Colton Iverson is his stiffest competition?  Wasted pick. 
plainly false

The idea that he would have top 10 potential in this draft is definitely a drug-induced hallucination.  If he was worth the 5th pick in this draft that would be someone like Malik Monk/Josh Jackson/Dearron Fox/ J Smith/or Jayson Tatum...
top 10 =/= pick #5. Stupid comment #2.

It's laughable to think Zizic (who would have slipped to the second round last year if not for the Celtics) is in that class.
Zizic was projected to go in the first round (actually was considered a steal at 23).
YES they reached for Zizic ... YES they could have traded those first round picks for more value,
according to mock drafts and post-draft analysts, the bolded is completely untrue

There is also 0 evidence that they could have traded pick 23 for more value

You seem to have taken some of what I said personally, I encourage you to take some deep breaths to relax before posting, or possibly investigate medical interventions.

It's tough to argue the rationale side of this situation with irrational posters... People on this board are arguing that Zizic has value as a top 10 pick in THIS draft which is beyond absurd.  Not only is it nearly impossible for a Euroleague player to get drafted in the Top 10 of ANY draft, there has never been a euroleague player drafted in the top 10 who didn't have an outside shot or next level passing ability.

But somehow a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds a game playing against the dregs of the professional leagues is going to be the first player ever to break through that ceiling? 

Seriously, get real.

Here's links to 4 articles that did a redraft of the 2016 NBA draft, some just do the top 10 some redraft the whole first round.  You won't find Zizic in the top 10 of any of them... or even in the first round... because NOBODY thinks he's actually gained value. 

http://www.thesportster.com/basketball/re-drafting-the-first-round-of-the-2016-nba-draft/
http://www.foxsports.com/nba/gallery/nba-draft-no-1-pick-first-redraft-redo-worst-class-ever-brandon-ingram-ben-simmons-2016-033017
http://thesportsquotient.com/nba/2017/1/6/2016-nba-re-draft-what-should-have-happened
https://theringer.com/reevaluating-the-2016-nba-draft-class-46df7c76e2b2
the general optimism on zizic that many posters hold is not without merit or other support.

http://hardwoodhoudini.com/2017/04/04/brown-zizic-and-yabusele-rank-in-top-7-of-espns-2016-draft-prospects-list/

"According to basketball writer Keith Smith, Zizic would've been a top-10 pick in this year's draft had he declared a year later."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2702309-nba-draft-lottery-2017-predictions-updated-standings-for-no-1-pick

https://sports.yahoo.com/m/4e678770-b8f2-3052-8a84-8fdbe708241a/o'connor%3A-zizic-would-go.html

and please note that i did not even need demeaning or disrespectful language to add strength to my argument.
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Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #123 on: June 02, 2017, 05:12:14 PM »

Offline 86MaxwellSmart

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Larry Bird was Greater than you think.

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #124 on: June 02, 2017, 05:15:28 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Don't see David Lee. Jeff Foster, perhaps.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #125 on: June 02, 2017, 05:38:20 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Don't see David Lee. Jeff Foster, perhaps.

Yeah, David Lee can shoot.

People will probably kill you for the Foster comp but he was a decent player who started on some good Indiana teams. You could do worse with the #23 pick.

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #126 on: June 02, 2017, 06:14:06 PM »

Offline liam

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Don't see David Lee. Jeff Foster, perhaps.

Yeah, David Lee can shoot.

People will probably kill you for the Foster comp but he was a decent player who started on some good Indiana teams. You could do worse with the #23 pick.

Zicic looks bigger and longer than Foster.( who was a good energy big.)

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #127 on: June 02, 2017, 06:27:50 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Don't see David Lee. Jeff Foster, perhaps.

Yeah, David Lee can shoot.

People will probably kill you for the Foster comp but he was a decent player who started on some good Indiana teams. You could do worse with the #23 pick.

Zicic looks bigger and longer than Foster.( who was a good energy big.)

Could be, and Zizic is young, he could end up significantly stronger than he is now.


Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #128 on: June 02, 2017, 07:48:01 PM »

Offline loco_91

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Zizic looks like he's going to be an NBA player, but I don't see starter upside. He neither shoots 3's, protects the rim, or switches screens. That's a tough combination in today's NBA. His post game won't translate at all because the #1 thing that post-up bigs need to be able to do these days is to find cutters + shooters, but Zizic is a below-average passer. The easy dunks he gets off drop-offs and transition will be much harder to find vs disciplined NBA defenses.

A 6'10 Tyler Zeller with elite rebounding for his size would be a useful player, but not a starter on a top-10 team. If he could develop 3 point range, it would be a different story.

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #129 on: June 02, 2017, 08:56:46 PM »

Offline IDreamCeltics

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from a league where Colton Iverson is his stiffest competition?  Wasted pick. 
plainly false

The idea that he would have top 10 potential in this draft is definitely a drug-induced hallucination.  If he was worth the 5th pick in this draft that would be someone like Malik Monk/Josh Jackson/Dearron Fox/ J Smith/or Jayson Tatum...
top 10 =/= pick #5. Stupid comment #2.

It's laughable to think Zizic (who would have slipped to the second round last year if not for the Celtics) is in that class.
Zizic was projected to go in the first round (actually was considered a steal at 23).
YES they reached for Zizic ... YES they could have traded those first round picks for more value,
according to mock drafts and post-draft analysts, the bolded is completely untrue

There is also 0 evidence that they could have traded pick 23 for more value

You seem to have taken some of what I said personally, I encourage you to take some deep breaths to relax before posting, or possibly investigate medical interventions.

It's tough to argue the rationale side of this situation with irrational posters... People on this board are arguing that Zizic has value as a top 10 pick in THIS draft which is beyond absurd.  Not only is it nearly impossible for a Euroleague player to get drafted in the Top 10 of ANY draft, there has never been a euroleague player drafted in the top 10 who didn't have an outside shot or next level passing ability.

But somehow a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds a game playing against the dregs of the professional leagues is going to be the first player ever to break through that ceiling? 

Seriously, get real.

Here's links to 4 articles that did a redraft of the 2016 NBA draft, some just do the top 10 some redraft the whole first round.  You won't find Zizic in the top 10 of any of them... or even in the first round... because NOBODY thinks he's actually gained value. 

http://www.thesportster.com/basketball/re-drafting-the-first-round-of-the-2016-nba-draft/
http://www.foxsports.com/nba/gallery/nba-draft-no-1-pick-first-redraft-redo-worst-class-ever-brandon-ingram-ben-simmons-2016-033017
http://thesportsquotient.com/nba/2017/1/6/2016-nba-re-draft-what-should-have-happened
https://theringer.com/reevaluating-the-2016-nba-draft-class-46df7c76e2b2
the general optimism on zizic that many posters hold is not without merit or other support.

http://hardwoodhoudini.com/2017/04/04/brown-zizic-and-yabusele-rank-in-top-7-of-espns-2016-draft-prospects-list/

"According to basketball writer Keith Smith, Zizic would've been a top-10 pick in this year's draft had he declared a year later."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2702309-nba-draft-lottery-2017-predictions-updated-standings-for-no-1-pick

https://sports.yahoo.com/m/4e678770-b8f2-3052-8a84-8fdbe708241a/o'connor%3A-zizic-would-go.html

and please note that i did not even need demeaning or disrespectful language to add strength to my argument.

To be fair you didn't actually say anything that added strength to your argument.

My problem is that you've cited an article from right after the 2016 draft where Chad Ford Lists the seven best prospects without anyone having played a minute...  His second rated player is Skal Labissiere for God's sake.  Did you even actually read it? 

And then articles where Kevin O'Connor (a Celtics fan and blogger) and Keith Smith (a guy no one has ever heard of) both claim Ante Zizic would be a top ten pick if he was in this years draft.  Mind you, the writer's of the actual articles aren't saying they agree with this, they're just stating that these guys have made this claim.

None of which actually justifies the claims that some delusional posters have made that Zizic is ACTUALLY worth a top 10 pick in this draft. 

I will repeat that no Euro has EVER IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA been drafted in the top ten picks as a non-defensive/non-shooting, rebounding big.  This idea the a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds per game is suddenly going to break into the lottery is simply non-sense.  Guys like Zizic go anywhere from the 20th pick to the second round EVERY SINGLE YEAR.

If anything Zizic has LOST value since being drafted since he: is now older, hasn't developed an outside shot, and didn't dominate in Europe.

 

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #130 on: June 02, 2017, 09:17:46 PM »

Offline liam

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from a league where Colton Iverson is his stiffest competition?  Wasted pick. 
plainly false

The idea that he would have top 10 potential in this draft is definitely a drug-induced hallucination.  If he was worth the 5th pick in this draft that would be someone like Malik Monk/Josh Jackson/Dearron Fox/ J Smith/or Jayson Tatum...
top 10 =/= pick #5. Stupid comment #2.

It's laughable to think Zizic (who would have slipped to the second round last year if not for the Celtics) is in that class.
Zizic was projected to go in the first round (actually was considered a steal at 23).
YES they reached for Zizic ... YES they could have traded those first round picks for more value,
according to mock drafts and post-draft analysts, the bolded is completely untrue

There is also 0 evidence that they could have traded pick 23 for more value

You seem to have taken some of what I said personally, I encourage you to take some deep breaths to relax before posting, or possibly investigate medical interventions.

It's tough to argue the rationale side of this situation with irrational posters... People on this board are arguing that Zizic has value as a top 10 pick in THIS draft which is beyond absurd.  Not only is it nearly impossible for a Euroleague player to get drafted in the Top 10 of ANY draft, there has never been a euroleague player drafted in the top 10 who didn't have an outside shot or next level passing ability.

But somehow a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds a game playing against the dregs of the professional leagues is going to be the first player ever to break through that ceiling? 

Seriously, get real.

Here's links to 4 articles that did a redraft of the 2016 NBA draft, some just do the top 10 some redraft the whole first round.  You won't find Zizic in the top 10 of any of them... or even in the first round... because NOBODY thinks he's actually gained value. 

http://www.thesportster.com/basketball/re-drafting-the-first-round-of-the-2016-nba-draft/
http://www.foxsports.com/nba/gallery/nba-draft-no-1-pick-first-redraft-redo-worst-class-ever-brandon-ingram-ben-simmons-2016-033017
http://thesportsquotient.com/nba/2017/1/6/2016-nba-re-draft-what-should-have-happened
https://theringer.com/reevaluating-the-2016-nba-draft-class-46df7c76e2b2
the general optimism on zizic that many posters hold is not without merit or other support.

http://hardwoodhoudini.com/2017/04/04/brown-zizic-and-yabusele-rank-in-top-7-of-espns-2016-draft-prospects-list/

"According to basketball writer Keith Smith, Zizic would've been a top-10 pick in this year's draft had he declared a year later."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2702309-nba-draft-lottery-2017-predictions-updated-standings-for-no-1-pick

https://sports.yahoo.com/m/4e678770-b8f2-3052-8a84-8fdbe708241a/o'connor%3A-zizic-would-go.html

and please note that i did not even need demeaning or disrespectful language to add strength to my argument.

To be fair you didn't actually say anything that added strength to your argument.

My problem is that you've cited an article from right after the 2016 draft where Chad Ford Lists the seven best prospects without anyone having played a minute...  His second rated player is Skal Labissiere for God's sake.  Did you even actually read it? 

And then articles where Kevin O'Connor (a Celtics fan and blogger) and Keith Smith (a guy no one has ever heard of) both claim Ante Zizic would be a top ten pick if he was in this years draft.  Mind you, the writer's of the actual articles aren't saying they agree with this, they're just stating that these guys have made this claim.

None of which actually justifies the claims that some delusional posters have made that Zizic is ACTUALLY worth a top 10 pick in this draft. 

I will repeat that no Euro has EVER IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA been drafted in the top ten picks as a non-defensive/non-shooting, rebounding big.  This idea the a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds per game is suddenly going to break into the lottery is simply non-sense.  Guys like Zizic go anywhere from the 20th pick to the second round EVERY SINGLE YEAR.

If anything Zizic has LOST value since being drafted since he: is now older, hasn't developed an outside shot, and didn't dominate in Europe.

Doesn't Zizic shoot like 70% from the line? Isn't that the biggest stat that predicts future NBA shooting? Just because he hasn't taken that many outside shots doesn't mean he can't make at least a midrange shot.  Zizic is only 20 and plays very hard when he's on the court. His floor is at least a backup hustle center. He's a top ten pick if someone is willing to pick him in the top ten. Lots of guys get picked in the lotto despite lots of things. The Kings have two picks in the top ten and they took Georgios Papagiannis 13 and I'm not sure if he'll even play in the NBA...

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #131 on: June 02, 2017, 09:28:57 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Offensive rebounding takes a certain mindset not necessarily vertical ability,it takes the willingness to absorb a pounding and awareness of angles.
Zizic is only 20 and offensive rebounding one of his strengths in a mans league.
The Eastern Europeans do put out some tough ,hungry big men.
David Blatt has used Zizic as an example of a tough young kid at 16 that kept getting up after being knocked down by the best older experienced big man star.
.Blatt knew he was special then.

Makes sense.  Historically, there have always been a lot of hungry people in Eastern Europe (sarcasm) ;D.

I could see him being a Gortat at the very best, but I have tempered expectations.  2nd round stashes tend to not amount to much, so obviously his floor would be bench-warmer.

If he can reach that Gortat potential though, it would be yuuuuge for the Celtics
Luckily he isn't a second round stash.

Heh, I completely forgot that he was drafted in the 20's of round 1.  Still, my point remains; guys drafted outside of the lottery are pretty prone to hardly ever showing up.  I don't think it is unfair to say that his floor is to be a complete nonfactor
So what do you think about the multiple reports suggesting he'd be ~10 if he had entered the draft this year?

In this draft? :o No way.  That sounds like propaganda to me.

Kieth smith and Kevin O'Connor have said it.


Also he was seen as a bit of a steal at #23 last year and has certainly upped his stock substantially this year

No idea who Kieth Smith is, and while I do enjoy his draft guide even if I don't always agree with his assessments, isn't Kevin really just a glorified blogger?  I'm not knocking him or anything, as it's great to see what he's accomplished, but last time I checked he wasn't a scout.

You can google their resumes for yourself.

And if you can find more credible reporters putting Zizic later in this first round I'd love to see it

So they're both bloggers.  Woo ::).  If you can find more credible reporters putting Zizic at 10 or so I'd love to see it ;).  He just doesn't do anything for me :-\, but I'm missing something, as usual :-\.

Way to stomp at the hardwork people go through just because they are "bloggers"

Excuse me, but I did nothing of the sort.  What I said was, "while I do enjoy his draft guide even if I don't always agree with his assessments, isn't Kevin really just a glorified blogger?  I'm not knocking him or anything, as it's great to see what he's accomplished, but last time I checked he wasn't a scout."  All I was trying to say was that Kevin isn't on the level of a professional scout, even though I do enjoy his work and think it's awesome to see what he's been able to accomplish, but then again you've always found some way to pick a fight with me although I have no idea why since I've never done anything to you at all, but whatever ::).

Offensive rebounding takes a certain mindset not necessarily vertical ability,it takes the willingness to absorb a pounding and awareness of angles.
Zizic is only 20 and offensive rebounding one of his strengths in a mans league.
The Eastern Europeans do put out some tough ,hungry big men.
David Blatt has used Zizic as an example of a tough young kid at 16 that kept getting up after being knocked down by the best older experienced big man star.
.Blatt knew he was special then.

Makes sense.  Historically, there have always been a lot of hungry people in Eastern Europe (sarcasm) ;D.

I could see him being a Gortat at the very best, but I have tempered expectations.  2nd round stashes tend to not amount to much, so obviously his floor would be bench-warmer.

If he can reach that Gortat potential though, it would be yuuuuge for the Celtics
Luckily he isn't a second round stash.

Heh, I completely forgot that he was drafted in the 20's of round 1.  Still, my point remains; guys drafted outside of the lottery are pretty prone to hardly ever showing up.  I don't think it is unfair to say that his floor is to be a complete nonfactor
So what do you think about the multiple reports suggesting he'd be ~10 if he had entered the draft this year?

In this draft? :o No way.  That sounds like propaganda to me.

Kieth smith and Kevin O'Connor have said it.


Also he was seen as a bit of a steal at #23 last year and has certainly upped his stock substantially this year

No idea who Kieth Smith is, and while I do enjoy his draft guide even if I don't always agree with his assessments, isn't Kevin really just a glorified blogger?  I'm not knocking him or anything, as it's great to see what he's accomplished, but last time I checked he wasn't a scout.

You can google their resumes for yourself.

And if you can find more credible reporters putting Zizic later in this first round I'd love to see it

So they're both bloggers.  Woo ::).  If you can find more credible reporters putting Zizic at 10 or so I'd love to see it ;).  He just doesn't do anything for me :-\, but I'm missing something, as usual :-\.

That's okay. He's still smarting from his prediction that Jaylen Brown was a lousy pick. So when Zizic proves him wrong, he'll clam up about him just like he did about Jaylen.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :-X :-X :-X

Actually I'm not.  I've readily admitted that I was wrong (and have no problem doing so, for the record) to this point regarding Kris Dunn over Brown and Demetrius Jackson and have even made fun of myself for it.  You should try it sometime ;).

Admittedly, I don't know much of anything about international basketball as I don't watch it, and if Zizic turns out to be a good player, all the better :).

I'm still not there on Brown yet, though, btw.  So are we okay, now?  I'm terribly sorry if I've bothered you or something, as that was certainly never my intent :-\.

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #132 on: June 02, 2017, 09:55:25 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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from a league where Colton Iverson is his stiffest competition?  Wasted pick. 
plainly false

The idea that he would have top 10 potential in this draft is definitely a drug-induced hallucination.  If he was worth the 5th pick in this draft that would be someone like Malik Monk/Josh Jackson/Dearron Fox/ J Smith/or Jayson Tatum...
top 10 =/= pick #5. Stupid comment #2.

It's laughable to think Zizic (who would have slipped to the second round last year if not for the Celtics) is in that class.
Zizic was projected to go in the first round (actually was considered a steal at 23).
YES they reached for Zizic ... YES they could have traded those first round picks for more value,
according to mock drafts and post-draft analysts, the bolded is completely untrue

There is also 0 evidence that they could have traded pick 23 for more value

You seem to have taken some of what I said personally, I encourage you to take some deep breaths to relax before posting, or possibly investigate medical interventions.

It's tough to argue the rationale side of this situation with irrational posters... People on this board are arguing that Zizic has value as a top 10 pick in THIS draft which is beyond absurd.  Not only is it nearly impossible for a Euroleague player to get drafted in the Top 10 of ANY draft, there has never been a euroleague player drafted in the top 10 who didn't have an outside shot or next level passing ability.

But somehow a 20 year old center who averaged 6 rebounds a game playing against the dregs of the professional leagues is going to be the first player ever to break through that ceiling? 

Seriously, get real.

Here's links to 4 articles that did a redraft of the 2016 NBA draft, some just do the top 10 some redraft the whole first round.  You won't find Zizic in the top 10 of any of them... or even in the first round... because NOBODY thinks he's actually gained value. 

http://www.thesportster.com/basketball/re-drafting-the-first-round-of-the-2016-nba-draft/
http://www.foxsports.com/nba/gallery/nba-draft-no-1-pick-first-redraft-redo-worst-class-ever-brandon-ingram-ben-simmons-2016-033017
http://thesportsquotient.com/nba/2017/1/6/2016-nba-re-draft-what-should-have-happened
https://theringer.com/reevaluating-the-2016-nba-draft-class-46df7c76e2b2
the general optimism on zizic that many posters hold is not without merit or other support.

http://hardwoodhoudini.com/2017/04/04/brown-zizic-and-yabusele-rank-in-top-7-of-espns-2016-draft-prospects-list/

"According to basketball writer Keith Smith, Zizic would've been a top-10 pick in this year's draft had he declared a year later."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2702309-nba-draft-lottery-2017-predictions-updated-standings-for-no-1-pick

https://sports.yahoo.com/m/4e678770-b8f2-3052-8a84-8fdbe708241a/o'connor%3A-zizic-would-go.html

and please note that i did not even need demeaning or disrespectful language to add strength to my argument.

To be fair you didn't actually say anything that added strength to your argument.

My problem is that you've cited an article from right after the 2016 draft where Chad Ford Lists the seven best prospects without anyone having played a minute...  His second rated player is Skal Labissiere for God's sake.  Did you even actually read it?

That article is from April 2017, near the end of the season. Did you even actually...aw never mind.

And Ford and Pelton trump any of the "experts" you cite.

I mean, "The Sportster"? That article is by some dude who's listed only as "Griffin," no last name, and who looks about 12.

"The Sports Quotient"? really?? That article is written by the esteemed Austin Ryback. Never heard of him? Well that would make sense since his qualifications are listed as "Syracuse '18." The dude is 20 years old and still in college.

As for O'Connor - you cite him yourself. He wrote that Ringer article you link to and has Zizic 12th in his redraft. You're dismissing him in one breath and citing him as an expert in the other. (Did you even actually...aw never mind.)

Then we are left with Andrew Lynch, who appears to be a senior writer with Fox. Nonetheless I've never heard of him, as opposed to Pelton and Ford. Or O'Connor, who writes for one of the top sports sites we have.



And then articles where Kevin O'Connor (a Celtics fan and blogger) and Keith Smith (a guy no one has ever heard of) both claim Ante Zizic would be a top ten pick if he was in this years draft.  Mind you, the writer's of the actual articles aren't saying they agree with this, they're just stating that these guys have made this claim.

Smith doesn't quote "guys." He quotes SCOUTS. Actual NBA scouts. It doesn't matter if Keith Smith is a blogger, or worked for the Celtics, or washes dishes at Denny's. These aren't his opinions. The opinions cited are those of experts. An expert, by the way, is someone who is paid to evaluate things and does it for a living...not some random dude who still hasn't handed in his senior essay on the cultural significance of Quentin Tarantino's early works.

You're bringing a toothpick to a knife fight. Give it up.

« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 10:03:20 PM by Boris Badenov »

Re: What is Zicic's floor and ceiling?
« Reply #133 on: June 02, 2017, 11:23:11 PM »

Offline Boston Garden Leprechaun

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Watching some clips of Zizic, he looks like a younger, bigger, right handed David Lee to me.

I would be happy with that.
Don't see David Lee. Jeff Foster, perhaps.

Yeah, David Lee can shoot.

People will probably kill you for the Foster comp but he was a decent player who started on some good Indiana teams. You could do worse with the #23 pick.

Zicic looks bigger and longer than Foster.( who was a good energy big.)

Could be, and Zizic is young, he could end up significantly stronger than he is now.



only 20!
LET'S GO CELTICS!