NBA.com post-combine Top 30

[loco_91]

crappy list if Bender is at #3

look at his pathetic stats.  Can't even get mins on the court

I'm tempted to give a TP to this perfect troll post.

I hope you didn't.

[Tr1boy]

Bender is the next mirotic.  Not worthy of a top 10 pick


And yes , Sabonis would take him to school. 

[chambers]

crappy list if Bender is at #3

look at his pathetic stats.  Can't even get mins on the court

If Bender was in the USA he'd be in high school.
A 7 foot high schooler shooting 40% from three that can drive, shoot and defend.
He's four years younger than Marcus Smart man.

Exactly. This gets lost on so many people.

1) He's a pretty mediocre shooter at this point

2) He's not driving past NBA calibre athletes, and even still his driving ability is limited

3) His defensive potential is pretty high - I'll give him that

4) His rebounding isn't that great

5) His attitude is concerning for an NBA big - hard working, but seems to shy away from contact - that attitude combined with his skinny frame would get him murdered in the NBA

6) He seems to struggle finishing around the basket - from the footage I've seen he seems to miss a ton of lightly contested shots at the rim, and only makes up for it by getting 2-3 offensive rebounds and finishing it on the third attempt.  Something he only seems to be capable of doing because the guys he's significantly taller/longer then everybody he comes up against (won't be the case in the NBA)

I could easily be wrong (it's hard to know either way with international guys who have limited sample sizes and no experience against US college or pro players) but from what I am seeing Bender looks like he has the potential to become a nice defensive big man with slightly above average offensive skills.  I don't see him becoming any more then about a 12/8/2 guy in the NBA. 

I honestly see a lot of Jonas Jerebko in him - which isn't that promising considering JJ is now around 27 and still hasn't been able to leapfrog guys like Sullinger, Amir Johnson and Kelly Olynyk in the rotation over the course of a season. 

What does Bender have that Jerebko doesn't?  He's probably a slightly better ball handler, and he's a couple of inches taller...that's really about it.

Crim he's an NBA PF/C. He's certainly driving past those guys and the idea is that if opponents put someone on him that's smaller than him he'll shoot over them.
I'm not sure where you're getting the 'attitude' thing about being soft. I haven't seen any evidence of that at all. Watch these recent highlight clip- he seeks out contact, pushes off defenders etc.. not soft at all. He's also 18 years old.

If this kid could shoot 30% from three and drag his opponent out to the perimeter he'd be very hard to deal with.

As you said, his defensive potential is his highlight.
His footwork guarding switches is very, very good and he gets down very low with hands up- very mobile for an 18 year 7 footer who's still growing into his body.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IffAjKkyPBE

[chambers]

Bender is the next mirotic.  Not worthy of a top 10 pick


And yes , Sabonis would take him to school.

You are funny.
If Mirotic was 7 feet, could guard switches and defend the rim AND run the floor in transition, then he'd be a top 20 NBA player.
Sabonis is going to be lucky to be an NBA starter.

[PhoSita]

Mirotic would absolutely go in the top 10 of this draft if he were in it.

[crimson_stallion]

crappy list if Bender is at #3

look at his pathetic stats.  Can't even get mins on the court

If Bender was in the USA he'd be in high school.
A 7 foot high schooler shooting 40% from three that can drive, shoot and defend.
He's four years younger than Marcus Smart man.

Exactly. This gets lost on so many people.

1) He's a pretty mediocre shooter at this point

2) He's not driving past NBA calibre athletes, and even still his driving ability is limited

3) His defensive potential is pretty high - I'll give him that

4) His rebounding isn't that great

5) His attitude is concerning for an NBA big - hard working, but seems to shy away from contact - that attitude combined with his skinny frame would get him murdered in the NBA

6) He seems to struggle finishing around the basket - from the footage I've seen he seems to miss a ton of lightly contested shots at the rim, and only makes up for it by getting 2-3 offensive rebounds and finishing it on the third attempt.  Something he only seems to be capable of doing because the guys he's significantly taller/longer then everybody he comes up against (won't be the case in the NBA)

I could easily be wrong (it's hard to know either way with international guys who have limited sample sizes and no experience against US college or pro players) but from what I am seeing Bender looks like he has the potential to become a nice defensive big man with slightly above average offensive skills.  I don't see him becoming any more then about a 12/8/2 guy in the NBA. 

I honestly see a lot of Jonas Jerebko in him - which isn't that promising considering JJ is now around 27 and still hasn't been able to leapfrog guys like Sullinger, Amir Johnson and Kelly Olynyk in the rotation over the course of a season. 

What does Bender have that Jerebko doesn't?  He's probably a slightly better ball handler, and he's a couple of inches taller...that's really about it.

Crim he's an NBA PF/C. He's certainly driving past those guys and the idea is that if opponents put someone on him that's smaller than him he'll shoot over them.
I'm not sure where you're getting the 'attitude' thing about being soft. I haven't seen any evidence of that at all. Watch these recent highlight clip- he seeks out contact, pushes off defenders etc.. not soft at all. He's also 18 years old.

If this kid could shoot 30% from three and drag his opponent out to the perimeter he'd be very hard to deal with.

As you said, his defensive potential is his highlight.
His footwork guarding switches is very, very good and he gets down very low with hands up- very mobile for an 18 year 7 footer who's still growing into his body.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IffAjKkyPBE

Shooting 30% from three us pretty useless.  Sully and Turner have been pretty close to that mark the past few seasons and their shots get next to zero respect from the defence.  Unless he can shoot a bare minimum of 33% or so his outside shot is of no benefit.

I also do not see him driving past NBA Power Forwards - he's NOWHER NEAR as athletic as people are hyping.  He's pretty mobile for a 7 footer, but people talk about him as if he has the quickness and ball handling of a small forward - he doesn't.  He'll struggle to get past a lot of NBA Power Forwards IMHO. 

I also think he's going to struggle badly when trying to shoot over even smaller NBA big men, since he seems pretty darn incapable of finishing against both length and strength.  He really can't play much center either since even modest sized NBA bigs will push him around like he's a leaf in a tornado.

There is skinny - then there is Bender.  HE's on a whole other level of skinny.  The only lottery projected guy I see who's skinnier then Bender is Ingram, and Ingram is both longer and a LOT more skilled and athletic then Bender.

Compared to Bender Labissiere looks to be just as good a perimeter defender, a better post defender, a comparable shooter, similar in size and even more athletic.  Why Bender projects top 3 and Skal struggles to project top 10 is beyond me.  Skal looks raw as hell, and he still looks more NBA ready then Bender.  At least he seems to have a solid frame that looks like it can add bulk - bender has a petite frame and I'm not sure if he even has the potential to add much weight. 

I just think Bender is ridiculously overhyped right now.  He'll probably be a productive NBA player, but I don't see anything that indicates he is any better than a top 8-10 prospect.  I predict that 5 years from now Bender will be looked at as a guy who should have gone 12-20.  He may well prove me wrong, but I just don't see it.

Everybody is so caught up on his age, but he's around the same age as Noah Vonleh was when he was drafted. and Vonleh had a LOT more talent (IJHO).  Vonleh was an excellent ball handle for a big, he was an elite rebounder, an excellent shot blocker, a good outside shooter (a better one then Bender, probably) and had superior length and vertical leap along with an NBA body from the get go. He was known as a hard working, high motor guy as well.  About the only thing Bender has over Vonleh is passing ability. 

Yet Vonleh has been a massive bust thus far.  I was actually one of the people really hyped for Vonleh - if Vonleh went #9 and still turned out a big disappointment, then I don't see how Bender can project at #3 and live up to it.

[crimson_stallion]

I still can't believe after all the recent evidence to the contrary, scouts still deduct points for players in the draft if they are 3 or 4 year college players like Buddy Hield.

Not that I am comparing Buddy directly to Wade but they were both 'old' come the draft and are essentially the same height and length. Lillard, CJ McCollum, Hood ect. all these guy are dropping in the draft even though each player is proving the scouts wrong time and time again.

It also completely ignores the fact that having the push for rookies in their teens seems to have only really started in the last 10-15 years   

IIRC in the late 80's and early 90's (the Shaq / MJ / Hakeem / Robinson era) it was actually highly desirable to go for guys who had been at college a couple of years younger, as they came into the NBA more mature, more refined, and ready to produce.

People criticise Hield and Dunn because they are oldish (22) for rookies, but ignore the fact that those two guys are quite possible the two most NBA ready players in this draft.  They both look like guys who could come in to the NBA today and play productive minutes the moment they step on the court.

On the other hand look at a guy like Ingram - he's 4 years younger then Dunn, but it may well take 2-3 years of development before he's actually read to produce at the level Dunn is at right now.

I think Simmons is one of the big exceptions because he's only 19, and yet I think he already has the body, IQ and skills to be an effective/productive NBA starter. 

The other two exceptions I see are Poeltl (20) and Ellenson (19) who I think both look pretty NBA ready despite their youth.   

The other young guys (Ingram, Bender, Brown, Murray, Skal, Luwawu) all look to me like they are probably at least a full years or two away from being able to make a net-positive contribution to a team either because they are too raw (Skal, Luwawu, Bender), too physically limited (Bender, Ingram) or have major holes in their game (Brown, Murray)

Of the latter group Brown and Murray are probably the most ready, but Brown has offensive limitations (think: Justice Winslow) and there are question marks with Murray's defence and court feel (think: D'Angelo Russell) that probably limit them to being one dimensional players in their rookie years.

The older guys like Dunn, Hield and Valentine are (I think) probably more likely to make an impact from day one.   

 

[chilidawg]

While I agree with you that the older players are undervalued, I think you're underestimating the ability of some of the Freshmen to come in and produce.  Ingram, Murray, Simmons and Ellenson all produced at a high level in the NCAA, levels similar to that of guys like Dunn and Valentine.  Hield was on a different level from everyone else imho.  If those guys can produce as Freshmen, I think there's a good chance they'll at least be productive players off the bench in their first years.  Plus I think there is obviously more room for growth with the young guys.

Ingram in particular, I think he's stronger than he's given credit for, at least he played that way at Duke.  I think he'll be a contributor right off.

[spikelovetheCelts]

Bender is the next mirotic.  Not worthy of a top 10 pick


And yes , Sabonis would take him to school.

You are funny.
If Mirotic was 7 feet, could guard switches and defend the rim AND run the floor in transition, then he'd be a top 20 NBA player.
Sabonis is going to be lucky to be an NBA starter.

Sabonis has the heart of a Lion. He will Start in the NBA. He keeps getting better and he puts In the work on and off the court.

[Snakehead]

can't get that name, Cheick Diallo, out of my head. know nothing about the player. never seen what he looks like. Don't know his story. Just one of those things ... feels like that kid is going to be a player. Give me some Cheick Diallo.

LOL same for me.  Whenever I see it.  I think he was a bounty hunter in the background of the Mos Isley scene in A New Hope.

Mirotic would absolutely go in the top 10 of this draft if he were in it.

For sure.  I don't love him either.