Could we nab Jordan AND Love this offseason? Cap ?

[crimson_stallion]

To the people that are saying Sullinger is basically Love, that is crazy talk.  Sully had his best season this year and finished with a 4.0 Win Share (up from last years 3.9).  Love's Win Share was an 8.7 as a third option (down from his 14.3 last year).

Please explain to me what (aside from three point shooting) Love does significantly better than Sully.

Especially this season.

I'll be waiting.

Truth is, Love is just Sully with a three point shot and far inferior defensive. 

[Greenteam2158]

To the people that are saying Sullinger is basically Love, that is crazy talk.  Sully had his best season this year and finished with a 4.0 Win Share (up from last years 3.9).  Love's Win Share was an 8.7 as a third option (down from his 14.3 last year).

Please explain to me what (aside from three point shooting) Love does significantly better than Sully.

Especially this season.

I'll be waiting.

Truth is, Love is just Sully with a three point shot and far inferior defensive.

How about being in shape, staying healthy and All around consistent play

[jpotter33]

To the people that are saying Sullinger is basically Love, that is crazy talk.  Sully had his best season this year and finished with a 4.0 Win Share (up from last years 3.9).  Love's Win Share was an 8.7 as a third option (down from his 14.3 last year).

Please explain to me what (aside from three point shooting) Love does significantly better than Sully.

Especially this season.

I'll be waiting.

Truth is, Love is just Sully with a three point shot and far inferior defensive.

How about being in shape, staying healthy and All around consistent play

Yeah, talk to me when Sully averages 26 pts, 12.5 rebs, and 4.4 asts shooting 46% from the floor and 37% from the 3 for a season.

[mahonedog88]

Until the Celtics prove me wrong and actually sign a big name free agent, I'm going to continually answer "no" to any question about signing a free agent.

When was the last time this team signed a legit big name free agent?  Jason Terry?  Rasheed Wallace?...Seriously, those might be the biggest.  It just doesn't happen in Boston, which is unfortunate.  Players just don't like signing here when given the option to do so.

I mean, it's not impossible...but if we do, we're only gonna have room for 1 and that's because we'll have to VASTLY overpay

[Greenteam2158]

Until the Celtics prove me wrong and actually sign a big name free agent, I'm going to continually answer "no" to any question about signing a free agent.

When was the last time this team signed a legit big name free agent?  Jason Terry?  Rasheed Wallace?...Seriously, those might be the biggest.  It just doesn't happen in Boston, which is unfortunate.  Players just don't like signing here when given the option to do so.

I mean, it's not impossible...but if we do, we're only gonna have room for 1 and that's because we'll have to VASTLY overpay

When have they ever had the cap space to outright sign a max player? Garnett and Allen might as well have been signings because there's no way they come here without wanting to be here

[kraidstar]

i just had a very interesting thought while reading this thread...

i'll bet that extra cap space will be burning a hole in a lot of GM's pockets... there will be some large contracts given out in the next couple offseasons.

if we can't get the players we want, maybe danny should just sign guys to short deals in the interim. if we don't get greedy and overpay mediocre guys to long-term deals, we could feasibly benefit a couple years after other teams kill their new caps with that big wave of signings.

and that would be right around when our younger guys really start hitting their stride. our win total should be higher, and we'll have cap space to boot. could be a great time for danny to strike.

just a thought.

as for love and jordan, i don't want love unless we get an elite defensive center first. even then, he worries me. in a couple years sully could conceivably be a better player, though his conditioning and health are certainly an ongoing concern.

i think there's little chance deandre leaves the clips. he's in a good situation there and i think they'll pay him. ballmer would be committing a two billion dollar franchise suicide by giving away their defensive anchor. and a max contract, though it would push the clips way over the cap for a year, would ultimately not be that bad after the cap hikes to come. maybe ballmer has to pay some luxury tax in the short term, but ultimately if he can bring a title home it will solidify his fanbase, and solidify the value of his franchise.
the only way i see the clips letting jordan go is if they're sure they can get somebody better in free agency with their upcoming cap space. but IMO that would be a huge risk to take. the spurs and mavs are getting old. the grizz will also be old soon. the clips should be a top-3 team in the west for the forseeable future.

[crimson_stallion]

To the people that are saying Sullinger is basically Love, that is crazy talk.  Sully had his best season this year and finished with a 4.0 Win Share (up from last years 3.9).  Love's Win Share was an 8.7 as a third option (down from his 14.3 last year).

Please explain to me what (aside from three point shooting) Love does significantly better than Sully.

Especially this season.

I'll be waiting.

Truth is, Love is just Sully with a three point shot and far inferior defensive.

How about being in shape, staying healthy and All around consistent play

Yeah, talk to me when Sully averages 26 pts, 12.5 rebs, and 4.4 asts shooting 46% from the floor and 37% from the 3 for a season.

I'm talking about skills and abilities.

Kevin Love is NOT in shape - he's barely any more mobile then Sully is.  He might be in better shape then Sully, but he's still no glorious athlete.

Staying healthy?  Over the past four seasons Love has missed 103 out of a possible 328 games - that's over 31 of his games missed over four seasons.  Sully has missed 69 out of a possible 246 games over his three seasons, which is about 28% of his games.  Yeah...Sully has actually stayed healthier then Love has.

All round consistent play?  Puhleaseeeeee!  Have you watched Kevin Love this season?  His numbers / production have been all over the shop.  Let me help you - here are Love's last 20 games of the regular season:

21/6/3
12/8/3
22/10/1
14/8/1
13/10/4
21/14/2
8/5/2
10/11/4
11/13/1
9/3/2
22/10/4
18/7/1
10/10/1
11/4/2
16/11/0
19/6/4
7/4/0
19/3/0

The pattern isn't all that different throughout the year. Sure he may be a little more consistent than Sully, but certainly not $20M/year more consistent.

Oh, and those to seasons when Kevin Love averaged 26 points per game, he also took close to 20 FGA per game and while playing 39 and 36 minutes per game (respectively).   He put up those numbers because he was jacking up shots on a bad team.

Sully on the other hand, has never averaged more than 12 Field Goal Attempts per game for a season, or more than 27 minutes per game. 

Sully averaged 26 points on 19 FGA, which is an average of 1.37 points per FGA.  Drop his attempts down to 12 a game (to match Sully) and you can expect him to average about 16.5 PPG, which is not (by any means) a massive jump over what Sully averaged the last two years.  Just to prove my points, guess what?  Love's FGA dropped to 12.7 this year, and his scoring average has dropped to 16.4 PPG.  Funny, huh?

So again yes, Love is a more effective scorer than Sully (much of that is due to the extra couple of three's per game) but is a difference of three points extra (given the same FGA) really worth $20M more?

So again, ASIDE from the three point shot (which gives him those extra 3 points per 12 FGA) what skill/ability does Love has that Sully doesn't?

I would hazard a guess that Love will EASILY give up 3 points per game more just from his horrendous defense. 

In fact Kelly Olynyk has averaged 1.24 points per FGA this year, which is equivalent to 15 points on 12 FGA, or 23.5 points on 19 FGA.   So if the three point shot is so important to you, then what does Love offer that Olynyk doesn't?  It's sure as hell not defense, length or athleticism (Olynyk's primary criticisms)!

[byennie]

Scoring 26 points on 18.5 FGA is superb, and puts Love just behind LeBron and Harden, and ahead of Curry as one of the most efficient top scorers in the league in terms of points per shot.

How you are somehow lumping this in with Sully (13 points on 12 FGA) and calling it "jacking up shots" is beyond me. An extra 3 points every night is a HUGE difference, and that's assuming a lower usage player maintains all his percentages when he's the focal point of the offense.

His rebound rates (19-24%) also blow away Sully (15-17%). Olynyk was at 12% this year.

Sully is on his rookie contract, but he won't be in a couple of years.

I actually like both Sully and KO, but you're really reaching here...