Mo Williams to Charlotte

[saltlover]

Charlotte also gets Troy Daniels, while giving up Gary Neal and a 2019 2nd rounder (previously acquired from Miami).

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/02/10/hornets-trade-gary-neal-and-second-rounder-to-timberwolves-for-mo-williams-and-troy-daniels/?ocid=Yahoo&partner=ya5nbcs

Not that Mo Williams is anything special, but given Charlotte's needs with the Walker injury, and given that Williams is cheap and on an expiring, this should be a pretty good gauge for where the market is on our vets.  And the answer is: not very high.

[Future Celtics Owner]

a tanking team always screws up the market. Same thing happened last year.

[P stoff]

Minny looking to unload some folks.  I really think Thad Young could be good for us...in NBA for 7 years or something but still only 26. I see his stat lines and he seems to pass pretty well and can score. Pretty athletic too. 

I dont think the price would be high... might be a piece that allows us to move KO for a better draft spot or to sweten a package for a center. I think his contract is where the problem is, but if we cant get superstars, we could add some good mid level guys (Hawks strategy) to our young and improving mix while losing Bass, thornton, Prince, etc.

[Depalma2002]

Minny looking to unload some folks.  I really think Thad Young could be good for us...in NBA for 7 years or something but still only 26. I see his stat lines and he seems to pass pretty well and can score. Pretty athletic too. 

I dont think the price would be high... might be a piece that allows us to move KO for a better draft spot or to sweten a package for a center. I think his contract is where the problem is, but if we cant get superstars, we could add some good mid level guys (Hawks strategy) to our young and improving mix while losing Bass, thornton, Prince, etc.

You'd have to be pretty sure you are not just getting a few month rental. He has an ETO that he can exercise after this year

I'd give them Prince and our 2nd rounder but considering they bypassed the opportunity to take Miami's 1st from Cleveland and sent it to Philly instead for him makes it unlikely that that will get it done. Maybe I'd add the Washington protected 2nd or the Cleveland future second. That way, if he walks, they may be able to recoup their investment in a sign and trade.

[PickNRoll]

Minny looking to unload some folks.  I really think Thad Young could be good for us...in NBA for 7 years or something but still only 26. I see his stat lines and he seems to pass pretty well and can score. Pretty athletic too. 

I dont think the price would be high... might be a piece that allows us to move KO for a better draft spot or to sweten a package for a center. I think his contract is where the problem is, but if we cant get superstars, we could add some good mid level guys (Hawks strategy) to our young and improving mix while losing Bass, thornton, Prince, etc.

Even if the acquisition price is low, AND he stays put, you're looking at a 9.7M salary hit for a sort of middling talent.  For 10M I want a Monta Ellis or Paul Millsap level FA.  I don't think Thad Young pulls minutes on a contender.

[Irish Stew]

Minny looking to unload some folks.  I really think Thad Young could be good for us...in NBA for 7 years or something but still only 26. I see his stat lines and he seems to pass pretty well and can score. Pretty athletic too. 

I dont think the price would be high... might be a piece that allows us to move KO for a better draft spot or to sweten a package for a center. I think his contract is where the problem is, but if we cant get superstars, we could add some good mid level guys (Hawks strategy) to our young and improving mix while losing Bass, thornton, Prince, etc.

Even if the acquisition price is low, AND he stays put, you're looking at a 9.7M salary hit for a sort of middling talent.  For 10M I want a Monta Ellis or Paul Millsap level FA.  I don't think Thad Young pulls minutes on a contender 

This is exactly right. When you are rebuilding you don't need these middle of the road overpriced players like Jeff Green and Avery Bradley. We are trying to clean out our roster to get cap space. The only trade that I would consider (Minnesota would never do this) is: Marcus Thornton for Thad Young and a future unprotected 1st round Wolves pick. The pick is compensation for the possibility that Young would opt to stay.

[byennie]

While I agree in principle about middle-of-the-road players, the looming salary cap increase is a major factor here.

Say you are paying Thaddeus Young and Avery Bradley $18M under a $59M cap (last year). That's over 30% of your cap room.

Now suppose you are paying them $18M in 2017-2018 and the cap is $85M (many estimates are over $80M by 2016 when the new TV deal kicks in). That's 21% for the two of them in their prime years.

I'm not necessarily saying I want Thad Young, but "reasonable" long term deals for starter-caliber players are an interesting assets right now as compared to previous years.

[saltlover]

While I agree in principle about middle-of-the-road players, the looming salary cap increase is a major factor here.

Say you are paying Thaddeus Young and Avery Bradley $18M under a $59M cap (last year). That's over 30% of your cap room.

Now suppose you are paying them $18M in 2017-2018 and the cap is $85M (many estimates are over $80M by 2016 when the new TV deal kicks in). That's 21% for the two of them in their prime years.

I'm not necessarily saying I want Thad Young, but "reasonable" long term deals for starter-caliber players are an interesting assets right now as compared to previous years.

The thing is, you acquire players like Thaddeus Young after you've missed on your primary target.  Players like Young will always be available -- Taj Gibson comes to mind very quickly, as does Kevin Martin.  But the key is to add them after you've got your star, or know for sure you're missing out, and not before.  Ainge has multiple max room availabke next summer -- best to save it for top players than to spend it before they get a chance to tell you no.  Then get the stopgap players.  I'm sure that's plan B or C next summer, just like it was last summer.

[P stoff]

I know its the right thing to sign your best players first... but the "we can sign that guy anytime" philosophy hasnt panned out for us...nor is the "adding the superstar" an automatic.

If i was confident we could add a great player i would totally agree with you. But if we cant, then a lineup of :

Smart, Bradley, Thad, Sully, Zeller
Turner, Young, Crowder, Bass, KO 

...is not bad to start with (before other trades and drafting even begins).

[saltlover]

I know its the right thing to sign your best players first... but the "we can sign that guy anytime" philosophy hasnt panned out for us...nor is the "adding the superstar" an automatic.

If i was confident we could add a great player i would totally agree with you. But if we cant, then a lineup of :

Smart, Bradley, Thad, Sully, Zeller
Turner, Young, Crowder, Bass, KO 

...is not bad to start with (before other trades and drafting even begins).

What do you mean the "we can sign that guy any time philosophy" hasn't worked out?  When have we tried it?  Also, I was referring partly to trades (like Taj Gibson), since Young was brought up as someone to trade for now, and not sign next summer.  My point is you don't trade for Young/Gibson etc. now, because we need flexibility currently.  They're who you get when you need that extra piece.

[PickNRoll]

I don't see Thad Young as a starting caliber player.  I'd much rather have Taj Gibson, but even Gibson at his current price gives me pause.  I'm happy to wait around for a real impact player and just accumulate assets in the meantime.