Hollinger: Boston Celtic Player Profiles

[Fafnir]

It might be "freakish" but I've known two people who've grown quite a lot in college. Which is more than the number of NBA basketball players I've met in my life.

[BballTim]

And Durant isn't 6'9, he's likely closer to 6'11.

I believe he measured out taller than Dwight Howard at some point a little while back. (or at least taller than Howard is listed at)

Made some jokes about it on twitter.

This is almost true.  Here are some pre-draft measurements:

Player	no shoes	w/shoes	wingspan	standing reach
Howard	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.5"	9' 3.5"
Durant	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.75"	9" 2"

Howard, of course, out weighs Durant by a significant amount.

I think this was after a year or two in the league, Durant has grown some (as has Howard)

  That would be freakish.  Its very rare for a human male to add height past age 17.  Pretty much all male height growth stops by age 19.  Men continue to naturally put on muscle mass into their mid-20s.  But they don't normally grow taller.

  I don't think it's that freakish for nba players, whose height would put them in the "freakish" category to begin with. KG's another example of players that have grown since entering the league btw.

[indeedproceed]

Durant, an elite athlete ? 

I consider strength also to be a part of athleticism, and if a light wind blows Durant will find himself somewhere across on the other side of the city, getting beat up on by 12 year old school girls. 

At least Green has SOME meat on him!

How many 6'9 guys can D up 3's and some 2's?

Lebron, Durant, Paul George, Nic Batum...and I'm outta names.

He's an elite athlete because for his size and length he can still keep up with guys enough to stay in front of them. He's also not the rail thin guy he was as a rookie. He was what, the 3rd, 4th best rebounding 3 in the league? You don't get that without a fair amount of muscle.

Green is a better athlete than all of those guys sans LeBron (obviously). Those guys are just lanky and quick. That doesn't make you athletic. Besides, I think Green can guard bigger 2's anyway.

Green has an elite combination of size, speed, strength and hops. I'd define that as athleticism.


And are you really trying to claim Durant has a fair amount of muscle? The guy is a rail, is underweight, and couldn't bench 185 at the pre-draft combine with basically an identical body.

Durant had the 4th best rebound percentage among starting SFs. He ably defended the position.

What part of that says 'average athlete'?

  Depends on how you define athlete. Bird was a much better rebounder and defender (also a sf) and he's rarely referred to as an elite athlete.

Well, that's not really apples to apples though. As Bill Simmons said, Bird came at the end of an era for the SF position. Athleticism followed and after Rodman, athletic lanky forwards gave him considerable troubles. Was George Mikan athletic?

  There were plenty of good small forwards when Bird played, Rodman didn't spend much time in the league when Bird was healthy and he didn't really give Bird considerable troubles. An aside, but I don't know why people hold Bill Simmons up as some kind of expert. You might as well say "my dad said" or "my uncle who drinks too much said".

It wasn't that there wasn't talent, it was that there wasn't a ton of the modern prototypical SF's.

And as far as Bill Simmons in this context, the man spent years researching and preparing this book, he's more of an authority than your drunk uncle or your dad.

Unless your dad is Bill Walton or something.

  There were plenty of SFs in the 80s that were as athletic as the players that came into the league after Rodman. And I didn't read Bill's book but I've seen enough of his columns on espn to stay with my comment.

You should read his book. I guarantee you change your tune.

[BballTim]

Durant, an elite athlete ? 

I consider strength also to be a part of athleticism, and if a light wind blows Durant will find himself somewhere across on the other side of the city, getting beat up on by 12 year old school girls. 

At least Green has SOME meat on him!

How many 6'9 guys can D up 3's and some 2's?

Lebron, Durant, Paul George, Nic Batum...and I'm outta names.

He's an elite athlete because for his size and length he can still keep up with guys enough to stay in front of them. He's also not the rail thin guy he was as a rookie. He was what, the 3rd, 4th best rebounding 3 in the league? You don't get that without a fair amount of muscle.

Green is a better athlete than all of those guys sans LeBron (obviously). Those guys are just lanky and quick. That doesn't make you athletic. Besides, I think Green can guard bigger 2's anyway.

Green has an elite combination of size, speed, strength and hops. I'd define that as athleticism.


And are you really trying to claim Durant has a fair amount of muscle? The guy is a rail, is underweight, and couldn't bench 185 at the pre-draft combine with basically an identical body.

Durant had the 4th best rebound percentage among starting SFs. He ably defended the position.

What part of that says 'average athlete'?

  Depends on how you define athlete. Bird was a much better rebounder and defender (also a sf) and he's rarely referred to as an elite athlete.

Well, that's not really apples to apples though. As Bill Simmons said, Bird came at the end of an era for the SF position. Athleticism followed and after Rodman, athletic lanky forwards gave him considerable troubles. Was George Mikan athletic?

  There were plenty of good small forwards when Bird played, Rodman didn't spend much time in the league when Bird was healthy and he didn't really give Bird considerable troubles. An aside, but I don't know why people hold Bill Simmons up as some kind of expert. You might as well say "my dad said" or "my uncle who drinks too much said".

It wasn't that there wasn't talent, it was that there wasn't a ton of the modern prototypical SF's.

And as far as Bill Simmons in this context, the man spent years researching and preparing this book, he's more of an authority than your drunk uncle or your dad.

Unless your dad is Bill Walton or something.

  There were plenty of SFs in the 80s that were as athletic as the players that came into the league after Rodman. And I didn't read Bill's book but I've seen enough of his columns on espn to stay with my comment.

You should read his book. I guarantee you change your tune.

  I'd have to somehow have my memory wiped of everything I've read from him as well.

[mmmmm]

And Durant isn't 6'9, he's likely closer to 6'11.

I believe he measured out taller than Dwight Howard at some point a little while back. (or at least taller than Howard is listed at)

Made some jokes about it on twitter.

This is almost true.  Here are some pre-draft measurements:

Player	no shoes	w/shoes	wingspan	standing reach
Howard	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.5"	9' 3.5"
Durant	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.75"	9" 2"

Howard, of course, out weighs Durant by a significant amount.

I think this was after a year or two in the league, Durant has grown some (as has Howard)

  That would be freakish.  Its very rare for a human male to add height past age 17.  Pretty much all male height growth stops by age 19.  Men continue to naturally put on muscle mass into their mid-20s.  But they don't normally grow taller.

  I don't think it's that freakish for nba players, whose height would put them in the "freakish" category to begin with. KG's another example of players that have grown since entering the league btw.

It would be interesting to know if that were true.  I don't know of any data or studies that would confirm (that NBA players tend to keep growing taller past age 19 at abnormal rates).

KG was measured at pre-draft at 6' 11" without shoes (with implies ~7' with).   Do you know of an actual measurement since then that shows he's taller than that?

NBA 'official' player listings for height and weight are notoriously unreliable, unfortunately, but they list him at 6' 11", 253lb. 

[BballTim]

And Durant isn't 6'9, he's likely closer to 6'11.

I believe he measured out taller than Dwight Howard at some point a little while back. (or at least taller than Howard is listed at)

Made some jokes about it on twitter.

This is almost true.  Here are some pre-draft measurements:

Player	no shoes	w/shoes	wingspan	standing reach
Howard	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.5"	9' 3.5"
Durant	6' 9"	6' 10.25"	7' 4.75"	9" 2"

Howard, of course, out weighs Durant by a significant amount.

I think this was after a year or two in the league, Durant has grown some (as has Howard)

  That would be freakish.  Its very rare for a human male to add height past age 17.  Pretty much all male height growth stops by age 19.  Men continue to naturally put on muscle mass into their mid-20s.  But they don't normally grow taller.

  I don't think it's that freakish for nba players, whose height would put them in the "freakish" category to begin with. KG's another example of players that have grown since entering the league btw.

It would be interesting to know if that were true.  I don't know of any data or studies that would confirm (that NBA players tend to keep growing taller past age 19 at abnormal rates).

KG was measured at pre-draft at 6' 11" without shoes (with implies ~7' with).   Do you know of an actual measurement since then that shows he's taller than that?

NBA 'official' player listings for height and weight are notoriously unreliable, unfortunately, but they list him at 6' 11", 253lb.

  I've been hearing that he's listed at 6'11 because he doesn't want the stigma of being a 7-footer (playing center) for years.

[td450]

Check out the photo of KG and J O'Neal on the lead article of this blog. He's clearly taller.

[relja]

No way that people stop growing when they turn 19.. We grow till our early-mid twenties, like 23-24

[mmmmm]

Check out the photo of KG and J O'Neal on the lead article of this blog. He's clearly taller.

Umm... there is this little thing called 'camera perspective'.  It makes your statement a pretty unreliable conclusion.

KG is on the near side (closer to the camera).  The cameraman is almost 100% certain to be shorter than both KG and JO. Would you disagree?   Thus, the camera is looking upward at both.

Pick two objects or people of similar height next to each other and set yourself up to look at them the same way - or use your camera in your phone.  I.E. look up at both from the side of one.  The nearer object will look 'taller' from the camera's perspective.

[mmmmm]

No way that people stop growing when they turn 19.. We grow till our early-mid twenties, like 23-24

There are lots and lots of studies on this.   Men do continue growing into their mid-20s, but that is mainly muscle-mass growth.   Generally, men experience almost no growth in height after age 19 and pretty much zero change in height after age 20.

Certainly there are going to be deviations from this.  People with gigantism, for example.   And it is possible that basketball players may contain a disproportionate share of people who continue to grow a little longer than 'normal' - though I am aware of no studies confirming that.

[SHAQATTACK]

No way that people stop growing when they turn 19.. We grow till our early-mid twenties, like 23-24

Wow ...   KG still growing ?...

[crimson_stallion]

How many 6'9 guys can D up 3's and some 2's?

Lebron, Durant, Paul George, Nic Batum...and I'm outta names.

He's an elite athlete because for his size and length he can still keep up with guys enough to stay in front of them. He's also not the rail thin guy he was as a rookie. He was what, the 3rd, 4th best rebounding 3 in the league? You don't get that without a fair amount of muscle.

Firstly, Durant is about as muscular as this guy:



Secondly, Marcus Camby led the NBA in rebounds per 48 minute last season.  He's not particularly srong for his position nor is he (at 39 years old) especially athletic.

Thirdly Lebron, Paul and Batum are all known for being good perimeter defenders - Durant is not.

Green is known for being a solid defender at the SF position, and I don't think he'd have any problem staying in front of some guards out there (such as Joe Johnson, Ray Allen, JJ Redick or even Courtney Lee) on defense.   

Plus, this guy looks pretty athletic to me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6_46Hn7LIM&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvORhP5mVIk&list=LPcTNWkW0kFzM&index=5&feature=plcp