Poll

Are Rondo's hands the reason he can't shoot?

Yes,  and he's cursed to shoot as well as Shaq for the rest of his life.
3 (7.7%)
Yes, but he can get better if he practices more.
16 (41%)
No, he doesn't practice it because he's a slasher (There is no need to).
1 (2.6%)
No, he just needs to practice more.
19 (48.7%)

Total Members Voted: 39

Author Topic: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.  (Read 16681 times)

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Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #30 on: June 27, 2011, 10:16:02 AM »

Offline paulcowens

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Its part of the problem. But people are ignoring the fact that Rondo's jumper is definately improving. He shot 41% from midrange this year, which is a huge improvement over last year and is slightly better than league average, I believe. His form looks better too. I think its only a matter of time before teams stop sagging off him so horribly. The big problem, in my opinion, is the free throw shooting.
He needs to go find Rick Berry and pay him to turn him into an 80% free throw shooter. So what if he looked like a granny and got laughed at! If he shot 80%+ from the line, Rondo would get the last laugh.

I agree.  I think Rondo might be money from the line shooting the old Rick Barry diaper shot.  I think it would be a very natural movement for him.

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #31 on: June 27, 2011, 10:18:36 AM »

Offline paulcowens

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duncan has huge hands and he does a lot of bank shots, just have rondo do that

I agree with this too - bank shots are an excellent idea for Rondo. 

And I think Rondo should make a point of working on hook shots.  I could even see him reviving the skyhook, taking full advantage of his length.

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #32 on: June 27, 2011, 10:37:17 AM »

Offline paulcowens

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Clearly, Rondo's proportions are part of the problem for him.   You can see from the way he hits scoop shots that he has a good feel for the basket, and that it's the naturalness of the motion, in relation to his anatomy, that makes the difference.  Scoop shots seem to suit his anatomy.  That's why I'd like to see him working on shots that might similarly suit his anatomy, like hook shots and, from the line, Rick Barry diaper shots.  I could see Rondo taking taller guards into the post and nailing skyhooks over them!  Then getting the and-1, and diapering it in 80% of the time!

Also, I think Rondo plays best on the run, and he shoots best on the run too.  If the Rondo Defense leaves him alone on the perimeter, he doesn't have to always opt for a set shot.  He can attack the basket and add midrange shots on-the-run to his range of (hopefully) deadly choices, when attacking. 

There's a bit of Kobe Bryant in Rondo, it seems to me.  He's the kind of guy who, I suspect, could become impossibly good at hitting a fallaway shot off the wrong foot falling out of bounds over three defenders.   Too often we assume that good shooting is the province of set shooters with perfect form.    I don't think Rondo will ever shoot like Mark Price.

That said, learning a more classic form for set shots is important for Rondo, and he seems to be working on it.  I think that there is going to be some sort of 'critical mass' moment for him.  One year he's going to 'suddenly' be an effective shooter.  It won't really be sudden, but it will seem sudden.   I'M HOPING IT WILL BE THIS YEAR!!

I'm certain that some day, Rondo will be an effective scorer.  I THINK that he even has potential to be a deadly scorer.  And he seems to be working on it.

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #33 on: June 27, 2011, 10:44:28 AM »

Offline greenpride32

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You need to realize these are uncontested shots because nobody defends his jump shot; and it's a very poor percentage given that fact.  Other players in the league can shoot better than that from midrange with guys dangling on them, off balance, moving very quickly to evade defenders, etc.

  You're talking about, who, Kobe and PP and Ray and a half a dozen other players? People seem to think that, aside from Rondo, almost all outside shots are contested. This is far from the truth. KG's a good outside shooter and he take a fair amount of outside shots. People aren't draped all over him when he shoots, he's not off balance and he's not moving quickly to evade defenders. He's far from alone.


I'm not saying EVERY shot is contested.  But overall the degree of difficulty on Ray and Paul's shots are much more challenging than Rondo's 5 feet of space and nobody even running to put a hand in his face because they WANT him to shoot.  Ray curling around a defender to catch, square up, and shoot is not easy. 

Plenty of guards and small forwards in the league use dribble drive fake, or dribble drive hesitation to create shots for themselves.  Again much more difficult than a spot up set shot with all the time in the world.   Have you ever played a competitive game of basketball?

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2011, 10:49:34 AM »

Offline heitingas

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How big are Dirk's hands?  Mehmet Okur's?  Raef's?  Rasheed's?The kid has big hands, but so do lots of good shooters (presumably).

Rasheed has really small hands..

look at the left hand


right hand


again


« Last Edit: June 27, 2011, 10:59:52 AM by heitingas »

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #35 on: June 27, 2011, 11:00:32 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Uh given that Rasheed is 6' 11" and overall a big dude its hard to tell how big his hands are from a few photos at different angles.

KG and MJ both have big mitts, both can/could shoot free throws just fine.

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #36 on: June 27, 2011, 11:08:33 AM »

Offline Spilling Green Dye

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IMO Rondo's jumpshot has almost nothing to do with his hands, and everything to do with both Mechanics & Rhythm. 

I doubt his mechanics are going to improve much more, but when he shoots a shot while maintaining balance he seems to make it more often.  It's always bugged me that he sometimes takes jumpers fading away or off-balance when no-one is guarding him. 

And 40% jump shooting isn't that bad, but I do expect him to improve upon that.  Heck, there were other players on the team who shot a lot more often yet made less... perhaps we should be talking about their mechanics. 

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2011, 11:58:37 AM »

Offline Chris

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IMO Rondo's jumpshot has almost nothing to do with his hands, and everything to do with both Mechanics & Rhythm. 

I doubt his mechanics are going to improve much more, but when he shoots a shot while maintaining balance he seems to make it more often.  It's always bugged me that he sometimes takes jumpers fading away or off-balance when no-one is guarding him. 

And 40% jump shooting isn't that bad, but I do expect him to improve upon that.  Heck, there were other players on the team who shot a lot more often yet made less... perhaps we should be talking about their mechanics. 

Exactly.  While his hands might stop him from being Ray Allen, what is stopping him from being a solid shooter is his mechanics mostly with his lower body, and his footwork.

You can really see a difference when he does step into the shot properly, and when he forces it. 

This is going to be a work in progress as the only way to fix this is repetition, but it is certainly not just because his hands are too big. 

Re: Rondo can't shoot because his hand is too big.
« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2011, 12:09:29 PM »

Offline saltlover

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I think some of it's mental, but sort of in a different way.

Rondo's primary job is to get everyone else shots.  He does it very well.  Amazingly well.  But that's his first mindset when he catches the ball -- pass it or dribble with it.  So when he catches it 15 feet from the hoop an is wide open, he's not in position to shoot.  He's in position to look for a pass, and in the mindset to look for a pass.  He isn't squared up to the basket, and hasn't had his eyes locked on it ready to go.

Contrast that to Ray.  When Ray gets the ball, his first inclination is to shoot.  If he doesn't have a good shot, he might pass it up, and a small fraction of times when he catches it he's already looking to pass it again immediately.  But by and large, he's ready to shoot, and that helps.

In practice (I imagine, as I don't watch all of his practices,) Rondo is passed the ball from an assistant, and he shoots.  In games, he's passed the ball from a teammate, looks around at a couple players to see who's open, maybe dribbles a couple of times, and then shoots.  It's a completely different experience.  What he should do when practicing his jump shot is to catch the ball, look away from the hoop for a half second, and then take the shot.  Shooting is all about muscle memory, and that's why Ray is so good at it.  But Rondo can't try to develop Ray's muscle memory, since his in-game experience is different.  He needs to practice the repetitions that he experiences in games.

Lastly, I doubt he'll ever be a great shooter.  If every basketball player could become a great shooter, they would be.  But he can become an effective shooter, and considering how great the rest of his game is, that's all he needs.