Author Topic: Old Three Vs. New Three....  (Read 4161 times)

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Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #15 on: January 13, 2010, 05:16:17 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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Has it ever occurred to anyone that Ray might just leave for free agency after the season?  Maybe he decides he wants to play for max money in New York or something once the big free agents are off the market and NY has a ton of money to blow.   Is that impossible?

Who's going to give a 34 year old jump shooter max money? I don't even think I'd give Ray 8 mill let alone multiple years on his next contract. The impact of age and the reality of players going downhill after a certain point seems to be understated around here.

Are you going to be surprised if the following plays out?...

Bron, Wade, Joe Johnson and Bosh all re-sign...

New York's fans freak out.

The Knicks (or any other team who has banked their future on free agency) figure they ought to get SOMETHING for their money and offer Ray a lucrative 2 or 3 year deal that is far more than 7-8 mil a year...

Is it really unthinkable?

The same reason people on this board are adamantly against trading Ray for younger pieces is the same reason why a team might overpay to bring in Ray Allen. 

Or what about this scenario... what if the Knicks are in position to sign Bron, but Bron is saying, "Man... if i go to New York I have no supporting cast!"...   Say Wade, Bosh, etc all are unavailable... doesn't New York overpay to put a shooter like Ray next to Bron for immediate success?

Didn't Spike Lee direct "He Got Game"?

Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2010, 07:09:55 PM »

Offline jdpapa3

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Donnie Walsh should get fired on the spot if he signs Ray Allen for 2-3 years for more than 8-9 mil. They would've DEFINITELY done that with Rondo, and that is why it is good that Danny locked him up.

Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2010, 08:23:36 AM »

Offline BballTim

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Has it ever occurred to anyone that Ray might just leave for free agency after the season?  Maybe he decides he wants to play for max money in New York or something once the big free agents are off the market and NY has a ton of money to blow.   Is that impossible?

Who's going to give a 34 year old jump shooter max money? I don't even think I'd give Ray 8 mill let alone multiple years on his next contract. The impact of age and the reality of players going downhill after a certain point seems to be understated around here.

Are you going to be surprised if the following plays out?...

Bron, Wade, Joe Johnson and Bosh all re-sign...

New York's fans freak out.

The Knicks (or any other team who has banked their future on free agency) figure they ought to get SOMETHING for their money and offer Ray a lucrative 2 or 3 year deal that is far more than 7-8 mil a year...

Is it really unthinkable?


  Funny, I was laughed at before Rondo signed his extension when I claimed some team that didn't get James or Bosh or Wade would sign Rondo to a big contract.

  If it did happen, and you're Ray Allen, do you sign the 2-3 year deal with the Celts or go fro the big bucks in NY or NJ? It's an interesting question.

Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2010, 08:54:37 AM »

Offline wiley

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If KG isn't healthy, or if he's iffy, I say we sign Camby and go for a title with Camby, Perk, Sheed Baby, Paul, Ray and Rondo.

Start TA if you want to set a defensive tone. 

Let Kevin be gravy if he can get healthy, and if he gets really healthy you could trade Glen or Sheed....or figure something out...yeah, if KG gets really healthy trade a big for an athletic 3-4 combo player....

That's my hopefully not likely "if" scenario.......

You know, when we didn't rebuild near the end of the Bird, Parish, McHale era, we got burned  by their failing health and subsequent untradeability, uselessness, etc....But we had no players then who were the caliber of Rondo, and no decent center.....we had Reggie Lewis, who carried us, but really just Reggie.  A Rondo Perk combo is easier to rebuild around than just one awesome small forward.  my point is that we're already partially rebuilt this time around, due to the Rondo draft snag working out marvelously, along with Perk's development.  So, since we're already partially rebuilt, let's keep riding our current big 3 into the sunset.....



Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2010, 09:10:33 AM »

Offline wiley

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If KG isn't healthy, or if he's iffy, I say we sign Camby and go for a title with Camby, Perk, Sheed Baby, Paul, Ray and Rondo.

Start TA if you want to set a defensive tone. 

Let Kevin be gravy if he can get healthy, and if he gets really healthy you could trade Glen or Sheed....or figure something out...yeah, if KG gets really healthy trade a big for an athletic 3-4 combo player....

That's my hopefully not likely "if" scenario.......

You know, when we didn't rebuild near the end of the Bird, Parish, McHale era, we got burned  by their failing health and subsequent untradeability, uselessness, etc....But we had no players then who were the caliber of Rondo, and no decent center.....we had Reggie Lewis, who carried us, but really just Reggie.  A Rondo Perk combo is easier to rebuild around than just one awesome small forward.  my point is that we're already partially rebuilt this time around, due to the Rondo draft snag working out marvelously, along with Perk's development.  So, since we're already partially rebuilt, let's keep riding our current big 3 into the sunset.....




And one more thing.....I'd like to resign Powe after the Cavs don't pick up his option so that he and Kevin (two great Celts) can play checkers....should their knees be wobbly.

Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2010, 12:17:12 PM »

Offline ScoobyDoo

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Well, I didn't say that if we don't resign Ray, all our rebuilding problems are magically solved. What I did say is that I feel like we are in a very, very, very good position to rebuild far more easily this time around than we were in the 80's.
1. Ainge is clever, one of the best GM's I've seen. Not without flaws but he is excellent and will be the first GM since Auerback to build two championship teams. I'd put money on that. 

2. We have two critical pieces in Perk and Rondo (Rondo arguably could develope into a franchise player )

3. Some nice role players and potentials in Baby, TA, Giddens and Walker. Yes, I do think  Giddens may end up suprising us. He is starting to improve; much less frantic, a bit more settled and efficient. Very important development. Now that he's over the shell shock of being in the NBA...let' see if he can play. I think he can.

4. We have three consecutive, expiring maximum contracts beginning this year. I fail to understand how this fact cannot be seen as creating cap flexiblity.

A) We can either resign them for one year terms (I'd give Pierce a two year deal), trade them or simply put good young role players behind them to carry more of the load each year.

If Pierce gets a two year extension, he'll be 35 when that ends. Barring a majore injury he'll be very productive still in 30-32 minutes a night.

B) I might give Ray a one year max deal or a 2-3 year deal at medium money.

C) KG, he'll be fine. He'll probably retire at the end of his string at 35 unless he is 100% healthy and can still tear it up at 35. If that's the case, you don't watn him going anywhere.

Meanwhile, a developed and healthy Bill Walker behind pierce or someone else as a good solid back up, a Raja Bell behind Ray, a growing Baby behind KG....

We'll be just fine for the next 2-3 years as these guys play out the string and will be competing for a ring each of those years. What's wrong with that?

Meanwhile, Perk and Rondo are 27/28 and 25/26. Baby? 27, Walker, what, 24?

As Red would say, "people don't realise we're a move or two away from being right there again...!

Then, when Pierce, Ray and KG are all off the books in three years time..
lots of cap...
maybe a down year or two...
Draft couple nice complimentary players
Use our cap space to sign the Durant or Wade type...
Perk and Rondo around 28 and 29...
Away we go...

The only way Ainge could create a seemless transition is to somehow get one of the big free agents here this summer or next without losing KG, Pierce, Rondo or Perk.

He does that? We're looking at the next 5-10 years of competing for the ring.

Put that guy ( Wade, LeBron or Durant, etc,) between Perk and Rondo...you have no problem enticing other people to come here.

I realise this aspect is an ultra long shot, most likely impossible. But, never say never.

I think we're in great shape now and moving forward, it just depends on a little luck, maybe, maybe 1-2 down years depending on how lucky we get. And we can retire these three and still stay at the top.

I really think that all of these guys, KG, Pierce and Ray, might in fact end up taking less money to stay put and build their legacies here in Boston. If that means taking a bit less money and letting someone else do the heavy lifting while they still a a big part of tryign to raise banners...? Isn't that paradise at the end of a great career?

Call me a glass half full guy but I think that is somethign I could sell. I think Ainge can too.

or is paradise making $15 mil ( when you've already made $100's of millions) by playing in some NBA rat hole, playign out the string? For the Allen Iverson's, perhpas that is paradise. For these guys? I don't think so.

           

Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2010, 02:07:07 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Paul Pierce is only 32 but honestly he is playing like he is 35. Absolutely has lost a step or three

The guy is picking his spots and playing like a savvy vet but that will only get you so far.

Two years ago i thought he was never to be the super star we knew he was once. Till he had an amazing game vs lebron and the cavs and pretty much carried us on our back to get us over the cavs. Glimpse of his super star capabilities was witnessed

But now.. I mean so we don't have kg or wallace , so what? We have two in theory super stars in pierce and ray allen who get paid top tier cash to win us games but they are not(most teams have only one of these so called stars). Deng took pierce to lunch as has many other sf in the league thus far this year. The guy is not playing what reflects of his paycheque, is not in great shape and lastly has lost the "fire" .

If he wants 15 million plus playing this mediocre he needs a reality check and wake up from the glory days.

He needs to first get in better shape and lose 7 to 10 pounds. He really needs to try

Ray Allen also needs to step it up. The guy is in his last year before one last contract can be obtained. He is playing bystander basketball sometimes vs his old spectacular self at some others. He needs to play better and be more aggressive.


For me i will be always grateful for the big three to help us win it all two years ago. But they are still getting paid enourmous money to help us win. Even if one of the two go down there really isn't much excuses to lose to teams like the clippers and chicago tonight. Pierce and allen should be scoring 30 each if thats what it takes for us to win.


Re: Old Three Vs. New Three....
« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2010, 04:47:31 AM »

Offline BballTim

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Paul Pierce is only 32 but honestly he is playing like he is 35. Absolutely has lost a step or three

The guy is picking his spots and playing like a savvy vet but that will only get you so far.

Two years ago i thought he was never to be the super star we knew he was once. Till he had an amazing game vs lebron and the cavs and pretty much carried us on our back to get us over the cavs. Glimpse of his super star capabilities was witnessed

But now.. I mean so we don't have kg or wallace , so what? We have two in theory super stars in pierce and ray allen who get paid top tier cash to win us games but they are not(most teams have only one of these so called stars). Deng took pierce to lunch as has many other sf in the league thus far this year. The guy is not playing what reflects of his paycheque, is not in great shape and lastly has lost the "fire" .

If he wants 15 million plus playing this mediocre he needs a reality check and wake up from the glory days.

He needs to first get in better shape and lose 7 to 10 pounds. He really needs to try


  Where were these posts before his knee problem when he was playing great? I must have missed them somehow...