Poll

After this season if it came down to it, would you choose to keep CBS or Irving?

Brad Stevens
21 (84%)
Kyrie Irving
4 (16%)

Total Members Voted: 25

Author Topic: If can only choose one to keep after this season - Stevens or Irving (poll)  (Read 3463 times)

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Offline SparzWizard

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Irving and it's not even close (for me).

Stevens is good for his college-level schemes and how he can work with underachieving teams. But when it comes to talent, he doesn't seem to have a clue on how to manage it.

After Game #74, he still insists on starting Morris over Brown. Still preach about spreading minutes to everyone evenly despite them being hot on the court. Should tell you everything you need to know about him.

Offline KGs Knee

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Doc is that guy.



Your opinion of Doc is way higher than mine.  He's a good coach, but I don't think he's on that level.

There's a [dang] good reason why LeBron name dropped Doc (through media rumors).  He's the one guy other than Pop 99.9% of NBA players respect.

Online blink

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As much as I like Kyrie, and as frustrated as I have been with some of Brad's lack of action to fix things during the games, I went with Brad.  It was close to me, and I think both can co-exist on a contending team.  But if one has to go, I would stick with the guy who has been a great coach with us for many years.

Something just seems off with Kyrie sometimes as far as being a leader, and getting his team to come together around him.  It isn't the stats, he has been an awesome stat guy.  It is more an intangible thing.

Off topic a bit I know, but if Kyrie decided NOT to come back but we still traded for Davis , I wonder if a lineup next year of Gordon, Jaylen, Smart, Al and Davis would ever work.  That would give us better length / size that might improve our terrible rebounding, as well as have multiple great passers on the floor as well.  When the ball is in Gordon and Smart's hands good things tend to happen.  I wonder if Smart and Gordon could share point guard / point forward ball handling?

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
If he wasn't statistically the second best clutch scorer in the whole league this argument would hold up a bit more.

Not seeing it perhaps you can help me. according to this he is 20th.  I think I used starter guards.

https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-scoring/?sort=GP&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G&StarterBench=Starters

Also on our team

https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-scoring/?sort=GP&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&TeamID=1610612738&GameSegment=Second%20Half&Period=4&PointDiff=1&AheadBehind=Behind%20or%20Tied

This says Tatum. 

Stats are one thing use your eyes, he has not taken many games since the all star break.  He loves blaming others for these losses when he shares equal blame.

I foresee, a rebuild, and I doubt he stays.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 09:24:10 PM by Celtics4ever »

Offline gpap

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All I know is I liked Doc a lot more than I like Brad.

And it seems players respect him more.

Yeah, I mean, Isaiah Thomas, Evan Turner, Jae Crowder, Avery Bradley, Amir Johnson, etc.


So many players who clearly didn't respect Brad and didn't play hard for him.

I think what KG's Knee is getting at (and I agree with him) is having the respect of accomplished veteran players who've been in the league for a while like Paul, KG, Ray, Shaq, Sheed, Posey and PJ Brown.

No offense but the players you mentioned don't measure up with the veterans we had on the 2007-2011 teams.

Offline gpap

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All I know is I liked Doc a lot more than I like Brad.

And it seems players respect him more.

Yeah, I mean, Isaiah Thomas, Evan Turner, Jae Crowder, Avery Bradley, Amir Johnson, etc.


So many players who clearly didn't respect Brad and didn't play hard for him.

They were playing to prove themselves.  Every single one of them was a player who felt they were being undervalued.

Rondo clearly didn't respect him.

Brad just doesn't have that kind of cache.  Stars dismiss him.

Don't forget though Rondo was kind of a....well, you get the point.

Offline PhoSita

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All I know is I liked Doc a lot more than I like Brad.

And it seems players respect him more.

Yeah, I mean, Isaiah Thomas, Evan Turner, Jae Crowder, Avery Bradley, Amir Johnson, etc.


So many players who clearly didn't respect Brad and didn't play hard for him.

I think what KG's Knee is getting at (and I agree with him) is having the respect of accomplished veteran players who've been in the league for a while like Paul, KG, Ray, Shaq, Sheed, Posey and PJ Brown.

No offense but the players you mentioned don't measure up with the veterans we had on the 2007-2011 teams.

Al Horford and Gordon Hayward totally signed in Boston because they don't respect brad right?

Or do they not count?

How about amir Johnson, Aron baynes, Gerald Wallace, Jonas jerebko ... All established vets before coming to the Celts.

It seems like the one category we're really talking about is top tier superstars, and I'm not sure we have proof that any coach is guaranteed to get those guys to buy in if they don't feel like it.
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Offline PhoSita

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Coaches are much easier to replace than players.


Bad to mediocre coaches, sure.

Above average to very good coaches?

I'm not so sure about that.


Every year there are above average to excellent coaches available in the summer time.

They are easy to replace.


And yet we've also seen plenty of teams that endlessly cycle through coaches every couple of years.
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Offline CelticSooner

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If CBS can’t manage a rotation and/or egos that means he has a ceiling like any other coach in the league. He’s been exposed some this season there is no way to sugarcoat it.

Online jambr380

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With so much complaining about Stevens lately, I'm a bit surprised at the poll results. But I often am. Like how people would rather trade Jaylen than Smart in an AD deal or that like 90 something percent of people would still have signed Hayward to a max contract if they knew what was going to happen.

Anyway, I also think people are stuck on the idea that if we keep Kyrie, then we are forced to keep him forever. Frankly, I am not the biggest Kyrie fan in the world. I mean, he is really good and I am glad he is on our team, but if things didn't work out over the next year or two, I wouldn't hesitate to trade him for another superstar or young player who is slotted to be one.

I certainly don't want to lose Stevens either, but I just worry about losing our best player and best asset for nothing.

Online gouki88

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Quote
If he wasn't statistically the second best clutch scorer in the whole league this argument would hold up a bit more.

Not seeing it perhaps you can help me. according to this he is 20th.  I think I used starter guards.

https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-scoring/?sort=GP&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G&StarterBench=Starters

Also on our team

https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-scoring/?sort=GP&dir=-1&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&TeamID=1610612738&GameSegment=Second%20Half&Period=4&PointDiff=1&AheadBehind=Behind%20or%20Tied

This says Tatum. 

Stats are one thing use your eyes, he has not taken many games since the all star break.  He loves blaming others for these losses when he shares equal blame.

I foresee, a rebuild, and I doubt he stays.
Clutch scoring is a pretty weird category, considering https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-traditional/?sort=PTS&dir=-1 has actual points per end of game clutch time.

Kyrie is 3rd in that. https://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-traditional/?sort=PTS&dir=-1&CF=GP*G*20&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season

This is probably the best way to look at it. Kyrie shoots 50% from the field, 35% from 3 and 88% from the line, while turning it over 0.2 times and having a massive +/- of 2.0. He also plays a lot less in the clutch than others.

Recently I agree, he hasn't been as good in the clutch. But the same can be said of almost all our players at all times.

Offline Ogaju

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lol I dont even have to look at names anymore to kinda know who is posting in support of Kyrie.

Online gouki88

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lol I dont even have to look at names anymore to kinda know who is posting in support of Kyrie.
Consistency is a new concept around here, you're right

Offline Boston Garden Leprechaun

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Irving and it's not even close (for me).

Stevens is good for his college-level schemes and how he can work with underachieving teams. But when it comes to talent, he doesn't seem to have a clue on how to manage it.

After Game #74, he still insists on starting Morris over Brown. Still preach about spreading minutes to everyone evenly despite them being hot on the court. Should tell you everything you need to know about him.

BINGO
LET'S GO CELTICS!

Offline gpap

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Kyrie....and it's not even close.

 

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