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Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: rondohondo on January 20, 2013, 10:26:28 PM

Title: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: rondohondo on January 20, 2013, 10:26:28 PM
On the post game show he just said this has to change or some people have to go

Wow he was p---ed and then ended the interview ...
Title: Re: Doc: We have to find the right combo or some people have to go
Post by: lon3lytoaster on January 20, 2013, 10:29:34 PM
Posturing? Or is he really going to put pressure on DA to make moves?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: PhoSita on January 20, 2013, 10:32:25 PM
Even Doc is craving some cathartic roster turnover right now.

But I've yet to see a realistic trade rumor or proposal that drastically changes the makeup of this team.
Title: Re: Doc: We have to find the right combo or some people have to go
Post by: JoT on January 20, 2013, 10:33:41 PM
FINALLY!!!!!
Something needs to be done as soon as possible or else some people need to go... pronto.
I didn't watch the video but looking at comments from others who have, Doc is mad.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: albas89 on January 20, 2013, 10:34:13 PM
I think the guys he was calling out are Pierce, Terry and Bass... what do u guys think?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: ManUp on January 20, 2013, 10:34:30 PM
Is that a word for word quote?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: PhoSita on January 20, 2013, 10:35:28 PM
I think the guys he was calling out are Pierce, Terry and Bass... what do u guys think?

Everybody other than Bradley, Sullinger, and perhaps Lee.  In my opinion.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: rondohondo on January 20, 2013, 10:35:39 PM
Is that a word for word quote?

yes word for word , Doc said it madder though  ;)
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: albas89 on January 20, 2013, 10:36:25 PM
Is that a word for word quote?
Yes. He looked extremely p***ed as well...
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: csfansince60s on January 20, 2013, 10:38:13 PM
Look in the mirror Doc............
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: albas89 on January 20, 2013, 10:40:15 PM
I think the guys he was calling out are Pierce, Terry and Bass... what do u guys think?

Everybody other than Bradley, Sullinger, and perhaps Lee.  In my opinion.
When a team's 3 youngest players are the only ones who actually give a s**t about getting blown out by the frickin Pistons, then you know something's really really wrong...
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Eja117 on January 20, 2013, 10:41:17 PM
I think the guys he was calling out are Pierce, Terry and Bass... what do u guys think?
possibly Danny
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: albas89 on January 20, 2013, 10:42:33 PM
Look in the mirror Doc............
I accept that Doc has lost some games this year with his poor coaching... but tonight's not one of them!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticinorlando on January 20, 2013, 10:43:17 PM
Posted after the west coast dibacle that doc doesn't like this team. Tonight reinforced my thoughts. This deep into the season and zero is changing. The winning streak was fools gold...doc said as much tonight
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: cltc5 on January 20, 2013, 10:44:16 PM
Look in the mirror Doc............

He did.  He began by saying he's not getting the job done with the guys, and eluded to himself making some changes, but alos talked about players doing there part.  He was not happy.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticinorlando on January 20, 2013, 10:45:05 PM
Posted after the west coast dibacle that doc doesn't like this team. Tonight reinforced my thoughts. This deep into the season and zero is changing. The winning streak was fools gold...doc said as much tonight

Jason terry has been a flat out bust so far. Bass has been a bust. Lee is up and down. Green not sure yet.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Kane3387 on January 20, 2013, 10:48:19 PM
Quote
"[The start of game] was awful, we are playing awful. Im clearly not doing my job with this team. And Im serious, Im not trying to take a bullet for the team. And I told them that. I said, We got to find something where every night, all 12 guys play the same way. We did it for three games in a stretch. I told them that games 4 and 5 in that [six-game] winning streak were garbage; We just won the game. I gotta figure that out. I told the guys that, I gotta figure it out. Because I dont think the guys are honest with each other. I just dont think we have committed to being a good basketball team.

"I think this team wants everything easy. They want the easy way out. They want to win easy. And I told them the only way youre going to win easy is your going to have to play hard. The harder you play, the easier the games become. Were taking the wrong approach. I gotta either find the right combination, the right guys, or were going to get some guys out of here. Its the bottom line. Because this group right now, they are not playing right. Its in them to play right. But right now they haven't been -- either because Im not getting to them, or they are not getting to each other. But at the end of the day, either we gotta do that, or we gotta make changes."

Via Doc
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: csfansince60s on January 20, 2013, 10:49:19 PM
Look in the mirror Doc............
I accept that Doc has lost some games this year with his poor coaching... but tonight's not one of them!

Doc wasn't just talking about tonight...and neither was I.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 20, 2013, 10:50:05 PM
On the post game show he just said this has to change or some people have to go

Wow he was p---ed and then ended the interview ...

Good for Doc...!!!! Put RONDO and worthless Jet on the hot seat... 

I'd love to see ROndo in a SUPERSONICS jersey. and JET too.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: cltc5 on January 20, 2013, 10:51:41 PM
Quote
"[The start of game] was awful, we are playing awful. Im clearly not doing my job with this team. And Im serious, Im not trying to take a bullet for the team. And I told them that. I said, We got to find something where every night, all 12 guys play the same way. We did it for three games in a stretch. I told them that games 4 and 5 in that [six-game] winning streak were garbage; We just won the game. I gotta figure that out. I told the guys that, I gotta figure it out. Because I dont think the guys are honest with each other. I just dont think we have committed to being a good basketball team.

"I think this team wants everything easy. They want the easy way out. They want to win easy. And I told them the only way youre going to win easy is your going to have to play hard. The harder you play, the easier the games become. Were taking the wrong approach. I gotta either find the right combination, the right guys, or were going to get some guys out of here. Its the bottom line. Because this group right now, they are not playing right. Its in them to play right. But right now they haven't been -- either because Im not getting to them, or they are not getting to each other. But at the end of the day, either we gotta do that, or we gotta make changes."

Via Doc

this
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticSooner on January 20, 2013, 10:53:43 PM
Posted after the west coast dibacle that doc doesn't like this team. Tonight reinforced my thoughts. This deep into the season and zero is changing. The winning streak was fools gold...doc said as much tonight

I don't think it was fools gold. We saw how the C's need to play. They need to be aggressive on both sides of the ball. Too many times this team goes back to the bad lazy basketball. For whatever reason (most probably due to age) they settle for bad shots and refuse to play solid defense.

You lead by example and the leaders of this team aren't doing that. It's been that way for years and hasn't changed so I don't see changing now.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticinorlando on January 20, 2013, 10:55:30 PM
This is what was reported with kg and pp. they have been unhappy with the way the new guys handle games...losing...etc. somebody needs to be traded...start with a Jason and ends in a terry
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticinorlando on January 20, 2013, 10:58:02 PM
Posted after the west coast dibacle that doc doesn't like this team. Tonight reinforced my thoughts. This deep into the season and zero is changing. The winning streak was fools gold...doc said as much tonight

I don't think it was fools gold. We saw how the C's need to play. They need to be aggressive on both sides of the ball. Too many times this team goes back to the bad lazy basketball. For whatever reason (most probably due to age) they settle for bad shots and refuse to play solid d&efense.

You lead by example and the leaders of this team aren't doing that. It's been that way for years and hasn't changed so I don't see changing now.



Fools gold meaning they had figured out how to change the bad habits..
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Juneauz on January 20, 2013, 10:59:42 PM
This is what was reported with kg and pp. they have been unhappy with the way the new guys handle games...losing...etc. somebody needs to be traded...start with a Jason and ends in a terry

I'm unhappy with the way PP handles games! He has no right calling other people out, he's playing horrendous basketball
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: indeedproceed on January 20, 2013, 10:59:45 PM
Doc's right, the biggest hole, the only hole this team has on paper is a rim-defending, rebounding 5. This team just isn't getting it done consistently, and on paper it should be.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticSooner on January 20, 2013, 11:01:00 PM
Posted after the west coast dibacle that doc doesn't like this team. Tonight reinforced my thoughts. This deep into the season and zero is changing. The winning streak was fools gold...doc said as much tonight

I don't think it was fools gold. We saw how the C's need to play. They need to be aggressive on both sides of the ball. Too many times this team goes back to the bad lazy basketball. For whatever reason (most probably due to age) they settle for bad shots and refuse to play solid d&efense.

You lead by example and the leaders of this team aren't doing that. It's been that way for years and hasn't changed so I don't see changing now.



Fools gold meaning they had figured out how to change the bad habits..

Yea the bad habits were there even during some of those wins. Houston and Charlotte games primarily.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Kane3387 on January 20, 2013, 11:01:41 PM
Bass is obviously a guy. Even though he played solid tonight I'm sure green is one too. Lee also. I'd be surprised if jet was a guy not being serious. He says guys don't want to play hard. Outside of kg and Bradley that could be anyone.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 20, 2013, 11:10:41 PM
Idk if Bass was one of the guys joking around after the losses but i also dont know if he is taking this to serious. I feel like Terry and maybe Green were the guys doing the joking. Terry seems to try to hard about being the Rha Rha guy and thinking everything is going to be alright. I really hope things start turing around. But no the less someone needs to be moved.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: PhoSita on January 20, 2013, 11:11:35 PM
Doc's right, the biggest hole, the only hole this team has on paper is a rim-defending, rebounding 5. This team just isn't getting it done consistently, and on paper it should be.

I agree, although I think that the other hole the team has is a young horse to carry the load on offense on a consistent basis. 

Pierce is having a good season and is one of the top scorers in the league, but the consistency isn't there -- which is definitely understandable at his age.

Going into this season, I think the hope was that Rondo would step up and carry some of that burden to make it easier, scoring more like 15-16 points a night instead of 12-13, and perhaps more importantly, giving the team consistent double digit scoring on efficient shooting the vast majority of the time.  Unfortunately, that just hasn't really happened.  To be fair, I think that's probably just not his game.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: frosty33 on January 20, 2013, 11:14:22 PM
"I think this team wants everything easy. They want the easy way out. They want to win easy. And I told them the only way youre going to win easy is you're going to have to play hard. The harder you play, the easier the games become. Were taking the wrong approach. I've got to either find the right combination, the right guys, or were going to get some guys out of here. Its the bottom line. Because this group right now, they are not playing right. Its in them to play right. But right now they haven't been -- either because Im not getting to them, or they are not getting to each other. But at the end of the day, either we've got to do that, or we've got to make changes."  - Doc
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Kane3387 on January 20, 2013, 11:15:42 PM
Doc's right, the biggest hole, the only hole this team has on paper is a rim-defending, rebounding 5. This team just isn't getting it done consistently, and on paper it should be.

I agree, although I think that the other hole the team has is a young horse to carry the load on offense on a consistent basis. 

Pierce is having a good season and is one of the top scorers in the league, but the consistency isn't there -- which is definitely understandable at his age.

Going into this season, I think the hope was that Rondo would step up and carry some of that burden to make it easier, scoring more like 15-16 points a night instead of 12-13, and perhaps more importantly, giving the team consistent double digit scoring on efficient shooting the vast majority of the time.  Unfortunately, that just hasn't really happened.  To be fair, I think that's probably just not his game.

That was the hope. After the Miami series it should have been.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 20, 2013, 11:16:04 PM
Expecting some rumors tomorrow!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Chief on January 20, 2013, 11:22:34 PM
Expecting some rumors tomorrow!
I hope! :)
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: jambr380 on January 20, 2013, 11:24:10 PM
It seemed like Danny's goal this summer was to sign as many quality players as possible so we did have trade chips. Unfortunately, most of those players aren't panning out and their contracts are too long, so they actually have negative trade value [see Bass, Terry, and maybe Green]. Signing Terry at the time seemed like a great move, but in hindsight, it seems a little unbelievable we didn't give that same contract to a guy like Mayo.

I really don't know what is going to happen with Terry. He was pretty psyched to come here, but he just isn't the same player he used to be. Sending him off so quickly sends a bad message to other veterans thinking of Boston as a destination, but he and Bass are the obvious choices to trade away.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: PhoSita on January 20, 2013, 11:29:45 PM
Expecting some rumors tomorrow!
I hope! :)

Second year in a row that we're pining away on trade rumor season. 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 20, 2013, 11:31:23 PM
I love me some rumors. I will be upset if it has to do with Rondo,KG,Pierce,Or sully. I really like Sully and what he is doing anyone else that could net us something big please by all means do it! I love AB but if we could get a legit big in a deal involving him I would have to say do it.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Atzar on January 20, 2013, 11:31:33 PM
I think trying to determine who does and doesn't take losing "the right way" is little more than biased speculation.  "Terry is playing poorly and I don't like it, therefore he must be a problem in the locker room." 

Honestly, everybody on this team has the reputation of being a great team player, to a fault in some cases.  So if there's truly a rift in the locker room that goes deeper than frustration due to losing more than the team should, then I'll be surprised regardless of who ends up being at fault.  Personally, I think any divide is just a byproduct of losing.

Time is running out on this team's opportunity to prove that it can get it done.  The trade deadline is coming up.  Either they flip the switch and start playing games the right way, or some people will be wearing new uniforms a month from now.  Everybody on this team has shown flashes of being the player we thought we were getting, but they haven't gelled for an extended stretch of games yet.   They have a month left to do it.  Let's just wait and see what happens.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 20, 2013, 11:37:12 PM
I think trying to determine who does and doesn't take losing "the right way" is little more than biased speculation.  "Terry is playing poorly and I don't like it, therefore he must be a problem in the locker room." 

Honestly, everybody on this team has the reputation of being a great team player, to a fault in some cases.  So if there's truly a rift in the locker room that goes deeper than frustration due to losing more than the team should, then I'll be surprised regardless of who ends up being at fault.  Personally, I think any divide is just a byproduct of losing.

Time is running out on this team's opportunity to prove that it can get it done.  The trade deadline is coming up.  Either they flip the switch and start playing games the right way, or some people will be wearing new uniforms a month from now.  Everybody on this team has shown flashes of being the player we thought we were getting, but they haven't gelled for an extended stretch of games yet.   They have a month left to do it.  Let's just wait and see what happens.


No i think Terry gets a bad rap cause In a number of losses this season fans see him laughing it up on the bench. Me as a fan if I don't wanna see you giggiling over something like that. AND to add to it he is playing bad. Yes if he was coming off the bench doing his thing and playing well a lot of people would give him a pass but he isn't. He came in talking a huge game and has not backed it up what so ever. Listen I want JET to do really well here cause I love him as a player always have, but when your down 15 and laughing on the bench.. I am just not to big on that.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Atzar on January 20, 2013, 11:51:22 PM
No i think Terry gets a bad rap cause In a number of losses this season fans see him laughing it up on the bench. Me as a fan if I don't wanna see you giggiling over something like that. AND to add to it he is playing bad. Yes if he was coming off the bench doing his thing and playing well a lot of people would give him a pass but he isn't. He came in talking a huge game and has not backed it up what so ever. Listen I want JET to do really well here cause I love him as a player always have, but when your down 15 and laughing on the bench.. I am just not to big on that.

Would you prefer that he go into the locker room and kick the crap out of a trash can?  Does it really matter?  At the end of the day, they still lost.  I don't really care how he takes it.  There's no such thing as losing the right way.

I think the idea of a "clubhouse cancer" is greatly overblown.  You never hear about this stuff on good teams.  The problem is losing when they're good enough to win, not the fact that Terry isn't sulking visibly enough.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: indeedproceed on January 20, 2013, 11:52:33 PM
I think trying to determine who does and doesn't take losing "the right way" is little more than biased speculation.  "Terry is playing poorly and I don't like it, therefore he must be a problem in the locker room." 

Honestly, everybody on this team has the reputation of being a great team player, to a fault in some cases.  So if there's truly a rift in the locker room that goes deeper than frustration due to losing more than the team should, then I'll be surprised regardless of who ends up being at fault.  Personally, I think any divide is just a byproduct of losing.

Time is running out on this team's opportunity to prove that it can get it done.  The trade deadline is coming up.  Either they flip the switch and start playing games the right way, or some people will be wearing new uniforms a month from now.  Everybody on this team has shown flashes of being the player we thought we were getting, but they haven't gelled for an extended stretch of games yet.   They have a month left to do it.  Let's just wait and see what happens.


No i think Terry gets a bad rap cause In a number of losses this season fans see him laughing it up on the bench. Me as a fan if I don't wanna see you giggiling over something like that. AND to add to it he is playing bad. Yes if he was coming off the bench doing his thing and playing well a lot of people would give him a pass but he isn't. He came in talking a huge game and has not backed it up what so ever. Listen I want JET to do really well here cause I love him as a player always have, but when your down 15 and laughing on the bench.. I am just not to big on that.

I hate to see that, but it's pretty common. You don't see Rondo or KG doig that, but if pierce was doing it, it wouldn't shock me. JET may not be 'playing the right way' or he may not be part of the problem at all. Getting caught laughing on the bench during the loss isn't really an indicator either way though.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 20, 2013, 11:58:14 PM
No i think Terry gets a bad rap cause In a number of losses this season fans see him laughing it up on the bench. Me as a fan if I don't wanna see you giggiling over something like that. AND to add to it he is playing bad. Yes if he was coming off the bench doing his thing and playing well a lot of people would give him a pass but he isn't. He came in talking a huge game and has not backed it up what so ever. Listen I want JET to do really well here cause I love him as a player always have, but when your down 15 and laughing on the bench.. I am just not to big on that.

Would you prefer that he go into the locker room and kick the crap out of a trash can?  Does it really matter?  At the end of the day, they still lost.  I don't really care how he takes it.  There's no such thing as losing the right way.

I think the idea of a "clubhouse cancer" is greatly overblown.  You never hear about this stuff on good teams.  The problem is losing when they're good enough to win, not the fact that Terry isn't sulking visibly enough.



I'm not saying Terry is a cancer in the locker room. I am saying that I hate seeing players taking a loss so lightly. Pierce as well. Even though I can let it go with him cause he is actually doing his job. Listen Terry is great and not saying he needs to be a hard you know what and be in everyone's face but for his first year and Boston and talked so highly about how were going to take everyone down but then is laughing as we get beat by the pistons by double digits.. Just doesn't sit well with people.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: tenn_smoothie on January 20, 2013, 11:58:43 PM
Even Doc is craving some cathartic roster turnover right now.

But I've yet to see a realistic trade rumor or proposal that drastically changes the makeup of this team.

Jeff Green + Terry for Gortat + ? would make a difference
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Ogaju on January 21, 2013, 12:05:56 AM
Finally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Someone is getting mad..maybe now the forum will stop saying we need to wait or that the season is too yong to ask for signs of life from this team.

It is clear now that KG and AB are our MVPs, we should build around those two with Rondo and Sully, save Pierce for old time sake, then ship anyone else out that can get us what we need.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Atzar on January 21, 2013, 12:16:20 AM
No i think Terry gets a bad rap cause In a number of losses this season fans see him laughing it up on the bench. Me as a fan if I don't wanna see you giggiling over something like that. AND to add to it he is playing bad. Yes if he was coming off the bench doing his thing and playing well a lot of people would give him a pass but he isn't. He came in talking a huge game and has not backed it up what so ever. Listen I want JET to do really well here cause I love him as a player always have, but when your down 15 and laughing on the bench.. I am just not to big on that.

Would you prefer that he go into the locker room and kick the crap out of a trash can?  Does it really matter?  At the end of the day, they still lost.  I don't really care how he takes it.  There's no such thing as losing the right way.

I think the idea of a "clubhouse cancer" is greatly overblown.  You never hear about this stuff on good teams.  The problem is losing when they're good enough to win, not the fact that Terry isn't sulking visibly enough.

I'm not saying Terry is a cancer in the locker room. I am saying that I hate seeing players taking a loss so lightly. Pierce as well. Even though I can let it go with him cause he is actually doing his job. Listen Terry is great and not saying he needs to be a hard you know what and be in everyone's face but for his first year and Boston and talked so highly about how were going to take everyone down but then is laughing as we get beat by the pistons by double digits.. Just doesn't sit well with people.

I'm not trying to defend Terry here.  He's in the middle of an awful slump and he hasn't been the difference-maker we signed him to be.  But my issue with him is his play, not his attitude.  Different people have different personalities.  I don't care how he acts, I just care that he produces.

Also, if you're coming down on Terry, then I don't see why Pierce gets a pass.  Over this three-game skid, Pierce is averaging 11.7 points on 15-43 shooting, including 1-11 from deep and 4-7 from the line.  He's rebounding, but he's been awful in every other phase of the game lately.

Even Doc is craving some cathartic roster turnover right now.

But I've yet to see a realistic trade rumor or proposal that drastically changes the makeup of this team.

Jeff Green + Terry for Gortat + ? would make a difference

Leaves us with no backup SF, unless you honestly believe Beasley can do it (I don't).  We need somebody to help Pierce handle guys like LeBron, Melo and Durant.  Lee isn't big enough. 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: OsirusCeltics on January 21, 2013, 12:17:13 AM
Look in the mirror Doc............

Said EXACTLY what I was thinking

TP
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Atzar on January 21, 2013, 12:22:14 AM
Look in the mirror Doc............

Said EXACTLY what I was thinking

TP

If you actually listen to the interview, Doc was as hard on himself as he was on the team.  He was very clear about the fact that he's not getting it done with this group as a coach.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: ScottHow on January 21, 2013, 12:42:04 AM
As of right now...

I very frustrated with this team and I'm ready to ship out almost everyone. I'm ready and been ready to blow this thing up. I don't want to watch a shell of a championship team struggle to be .500.

Right now I'm ready to go to full suck mode, trade everyone except Bradley and Sullinger, get as much value as you can, start losing with a purpose, and hopefully we hit on a top draft pick who actually wants to play hard with Sully and AB.

Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 21, 2013, 12:57:22 AM
I don't want KG or Pierce going anywhere they've done to much for this team city everything to be shipped out. If we can move Rondo for some weak spots than do it. If we can move AB Bass and Sully for something to help do it. Whatever it does to help us WIN NOW. Ainge knows we can win games in a 7 games series but we are missing something. I hope he finds it. I love Rondo AB and the guys but if Rondo could bring us multiple pieces that we need than do it. If AB and some other guys bring us someone like Josh Smith than do it but something needs to happen so in order for (if new guys do come in) to mesh.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: vinnie on January 21, 2013, 01:19:05 AM
We are now 15-20 games past the number of games a lot of people said this team needed to gel. It just isn't happening folks and a trade(S) is required. I am hoping Danny can get something half way decent back for the likes of Bass, Terry and Green along with draft picks. Time to start the reloading, Danny.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: tenn_smoothie on January 21, 2013, 01:29:24 AM
why does everyone seem to think that Sullinger plays hard all the time ? i rewound the DVR a few times on a play the Bulls scored a layup on the other night. Sullinger's man (Noah) breaks across and then down the lane, receives a pass and drops in a layup.

Sully wasn't even close to seeing the ball and his man and was standing flat-footed without a hint of a basic defensive stance (all fundamentals a good high school player knows to do). he should have easily beaten Noah to the spot and denied the pass. either lazy or clueless about basic defensive fundamentals or both.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: ImShakHeIsShaq on January 21, 2013, 01:44:13 AM
You guys are letting Doc fool you... he's doing nothing more than trying to light a fire. He said the same things about his coaching when he said the team was soft! It didn't work last time, what makes him/us think it will this time? Seems like a lot of wind blowing to me.


What makes us think they have it? Because Paper says we are good enough?

Has anyone considered that maybe, just maybe, they aren't good enough together... that they haven't meshed b/c they aren't the right fit for each other? It takes a lot to put together a good team filled with players who work well as a unit. You can assemble all the good players you want to but it doesn't mean they will have on court chemistry no matter how much they like each other off the court. Look at Mia, they have 3 of some of the best players at their positions, THE PLAYERS chose to come together (collusion)... they liked each other off the court, they were friends. They all gave all the effort you could want from them but they still weren't enough their first year, they had to lose (and be helped -.-) before they figured out/fixed themselves and they still barely got passed us. The only players on our team that are use to losing and are probably accustomed to it is Lee, Collins, and Barbosa (kinda, even though the Pacers were solid last season)... all of the other players we have won and knows what it takes to win (Sully is a rookie so he doesn't count)... to me, it doesn't seem like they aren't trying, they just don't seem to ever click all at once. It's weird really... one day PP and KG will light it up and RR and Green will disappear and vice-verse, then bench will light it up and the starters will stink it up or again, vice-verse.


I don't know what needs to be done but I know that Doc can't keep talking about it publicly because that hasn't worked and it could make it worse.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticslove on January 21, 2013, 01:46:51 AM
why does everyone seem to think that Sullinger plays hard all the time ? i rewound the DVR a few times on a play the Bulls scored a layup on the other night. Sullinger's man (Noah) breaks across and then down the lane, receives a pass and drops in a layup.

Sully wasn't even close to seeing the ball and his man and was standing flat-footed without a hint of a basic defensive stance (all fundamentals a good high school player knows to do). he should have easily beaten Noah to the spot and denied the pass. either lazy or clueless about basic defensive fundamentals or both.
You're judging sully's hard work with that one play? Then you haven't seen him play hard then. He plays hard and only limited and stop by bad foul calls.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 21, 2013, 02:07:06 AM
I don't want KG or Pierce going anywhere they've done to much for this team city everything to be shipped out. If we can move Rondo for some weak spots than do it. If we can move AB Bass and Sully for something to help do it. Whatever it does to help us WIN NOW. Ainge knows we can win games in a 7 games series but we are missing something. I hope he finds it. I love Rondo AB and the guys but if Rondo could bring us multiple pieces that we need than do it. If AB and some other guys bring us someone like Josh Smith than do it but something needs to happen so in order for (if new guys do come in) to mesh.

The last thing the C's should want is to move their young All-Star for multiple lesser players.
Title: Re: Doc: We have to find the right combo or some people have to go
Post by: clover on January 21, 2013, 02:07:59 AM
Posturing? Or is he really going to put pressure on DA to make moves?

Somehow I don't think Doc has to pressure Danny to make moves.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Who on January 21, 2013, 03:12:46 AM
I feel like that was directed at Brandon Bass.

Doc has a lot of loyalty to Garnett, Pierce and Rondo. I think he loves Bradley. Green and Lee were very good today so I think they escape Doc's current foul mood. Sully is a guy Doc likes.

Maybe Jason Terry too. But mainly, I feel like Doc's ire here is directed at Bass.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: nostar on January 21, 2013, 03:23:49 AM
Our best 2 assets are Rondo and Pierce because of his semi-expiring contract. Then Bradley. Then Sully.

I don't want to blow it up because I like watching the Celtics contend year after year. This off-season Danny signed 5 players 27 and under because he's trying to keep the team competitive while building for the future. I'm happy I have a GM who is thinking about winning now and for the next decade rather than someone like Hollinger fire-sale-ing the good players on my playoff-bound team.

I get the sense that if a big trade happens it will happen around Paul Pierce. Gay or P.Gasol probably. I'd much rather have a smaller trade around Bass or even Lee but moving the captain for a big guy make a little bit of sense, especially if Pierce is gonna play like he's injured the rest of the season.

I doubt the rebuild starts with trading Rondo. Unless an ridiculous offer comes in for him (and it's possible I guess) then I think the rebuild starts with Pierce and ends with 5-6 guys who are 30 and older.

Live Clover said:

The last thing the C's should want is to move their young All-Star for multiple lesser players.

Personally I'm hoping for a smaller trade. I'm not lighting my hair on fire over a few losses before the All-Star break. I'm not upset about being .500 in the regular season. I do think we need a capable PF/C to play behind KG, preferably in the post. We need to get our guys rested and healthy. 8th seed is sitting pretty as long as we're healthy. Go C's!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticsleyte on January 21, 2013, 05:06:41 AM
I think Doc might need to go after this season is over.  Doc is a decent coach but defers too much to the veterans even when they are far past their prime and as a result we are often without enough athleticism on the floor. 

If we can get any decent offer for JET it would be great to let the younger guys handle the backcourt duties.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: drax on January 21, 2013, 05:28:35 AM
http://www.csnne.com/celticsvideo?PID=uvXM2-wq1Sry8YdmyTSAzb9d5bYrjzE0dV1pxd

Not a happy Rondo right here. He has to evaluate his own game and look what he can do, but the laid back guys he refers to should really get their head straight.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: triboy16f on January 21, 2013, 07:31:44 AM
Pierce and Rondo more specifically.

Sully, Green, Lee have been doing their jobs since our winning streak started more or less.

Pierce scores 10 dinky points in 36 minutes is unacceptable. Even though Rondo had 15 assist, 9 turnovers are unacceptable. Its like he only had 6 assist



Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CoachBo on January 21, 2013, 07:45:17 AM
Great thread.

"The players I love are getting the job done. The players I hate aren't."

Five minutes of my life I'll never get back.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: bfrombleacher on January 21, 2013, 07:48:57 AM
How about there's still a month until the deadline?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 21, 2013, 07:53:47 AM
http://www.csnne.com/celticsvideo?PID=uvXM2-wq1Sry8YdmyTSAzb9d5bYrjzE0dV1pxd

Not a happy Rondo right here. He has to evaluate his own game and look what he can do, but the laid back guys he refers to should really get their head straight.

Who was it, Washburn, who reported on this locker-room complaint a couple of weeks ago--and many were quick to jump on him for it?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: jambr380 on January 21, 2013, 09:03:03 AM
Pierce and Rondo more specifically.

Sully, Green, Lee have been doing their jobs since our winning streak started more or less.

Pierce scores 10 dinky points in 36 minutes is unacceptable. Even though Rondo had 15 assist, 9 turnovers are unacceptable. Its like he only had 6 assist

Actually, there is not much of correlation between assists and turnovers, except that they created a stat to show the proportion between them [meaning an assist doesn't cancel out a turnover - you can still score without a Rondo assist, but you can't score at all if he Rondo turns it over]. Basically 36 assists and 9 turnovers is similar to 8 assists and 2 turnovers...9 turnovers is always unacceptable!

But I am not ready to give up Rondo unless we get a package like Cousins and Evans, which probably isn't happening.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: WeMadeIt17 on January 21, 2013, 09:36:36 AM
Thing is i don't think we can fart around for another month. If we continue to hover around .500 and then think we are just gonna make a move for Smith or someone and it'll work isn't a good idea. IDK I feel if we're gonna make a deal make it within 2 weeks. Attempt to grab someone who could push us over the top. I mean the Lakers grabbed Pau Gasol in the middle of the season and looked what he did for them that year. They lost to us but getting someone at the right time can make a difference.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Moranis on January 21, 2013, 09:46:12 AM
Even Doc is craving some cathartic roster turnover right now.

But I've yet to see a realistic trade rumor or proposal that drastically changes the makeup of this team.
Bass, Green, and Terry (or Lee) for Gasol and Ebanks.  Seems like a pretty realistic trade for both teams, and would drastically change the makeup of the team.  Obviously, Gasol needs to be checked out medically to do this, but if he is say 85% or better come playoffs, his low post ability would significantly upgrade Boston's post-season chances.  Far more than a bunch of bench players.  The Lakers clearly need to add some depth and shake things up (and Bass is actually a good fit next to Howard as evident by their time together) so I could see them doing it as well.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticsleyte on January 21, 2013, 09:55:09 AM
I actually would prefer Doc would focus on coaching and leave the GM work to Ainge.  He should focus on his own job. Sometimes it seems like with his love for veteran players that he does not really like to coach.  Unless Doc means that guys can go to the bench (which should be the bottom line) he should not make it more difficult for Ainge to find trading partners by trashing his players.

Ainge is going to have to determine whether Melo will be able to contribute during the stretch run. If he knows he could contribute he has to not give Doc another veteran option to block his chance.  Personally, I think he could be a decent upgrade over what Ryan Hollins gave us last year.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Evantime34 on January 21, 2013, 10:06:04 AM
To me you float out the names of guys like Bass, Terry and Lee as well as a first and see if some combination will get you a big.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 21, 2013, 10:09:22 AM
I actually would prefer Doc would focus on coaching and leave the GM work to Ainge.  He should focus on his own job. Sometimes it seems like with his love for veteran players that he does not really like to coach.  Unless Doc means that guys can go to the bench (which should be the bottom line) he should not make it more difficult for Ainge to find trading partners by trashing his players.

Ainge is going to have to determine whether Melo will be able to contribute during the stretch run. If he knows he could contribute he has to not give Doc another veteran option to block his chance.  Personally, I think he could be a decent upgrade over what Ryan Hollins gave us last year.

I think we're beyond concerning ourselves with a stretch run for this year.  I suspect Doc's beyond threatening changes in the rotation and doing so privately.  There's not much further he can go with these guys.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CFAN38 on January 21, 2013, 10:19:26 AM
I would love to see trades made and the roster adjusted so that Doc has a solid 8 man rotation. A rotation that includes the whole bench only seems to work for very young high energy teams not with vets.

Best case

Rondo
Avery
Pierce
Sully
KG
bench
6'4+ SG who can get 10-12 pts game
Green
6'9+ 4/5 who can block shots

enough of this playing everyone, there obviously is a thing called being to deep.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 21, 2013, 10:25:04 AM
Can people stop blaming the new guys for everything?  Yes, Terry has sucked but Doc has also done an awful job in using him AND has continued to play him even while he sucks.  Green needs to be a lot better at rebounding but other than that, he's rounding into exactly the sort of player Boston needs.  Lee has also come back from his horrible start.

The problems on this team are pretty clearly...

1.  Rondo is just too bleepin' inconsistent.  He doesn't come to play some nights and his pick-n-roll defense is frequently atrocious.

2.  Bass has stunk.  He gets maybe 1% of a break because of how Doc passed him over in favor of Sully to start the season, but he's got to be a professional about that.

3.  Doc's stubbornness has been a good thing at times, but he's clearly done a terrible job of adjusting to the team's personnel ever since the Perk trade.  Look no further than the fact that halfway through the season, Boston is STILL trying to run Jason Terry off baseline screens like he was Ray Allen Jr.

4.  Pierce is still rebounding well but he can't score like he used to and I think he's getting a bit of Kobe-itis on defense when it comes to making the effort on every rotation.

5.  KG is old.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 21, 2013, 10:27:19 AM
I would love to see trades made and the roster adjusted so that Doc has a solid 8 man rotation.

You can't play an 8 man rotation when two of the 8, and the two the offense is largely built around, are Pierce and KG.  Neither of them can carry a team the way they did in the past.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CFAN38 on January 21, 2013, 10:38:57 AM
Quote
You can't play an 8 man rotation when two of the 8, and the two the offense is largely built around, are Pierce and KG.  Neither of them can carry a team the way they did in the past.

Mike

There are 96 minutes at the 1+2. Rondo gets 36. Leaving 30 for AB and 30 for a guard off the bench.

There are 48 min at SF Pierce takes 30 leaves 18 for Green.

There are 96 minutes at 4+5. KG gets 30, Sully gets 30, bench 4/5 gets 30, and Green gets 6min.

With a good enough bench SG and bench big this works. example Jamal Crawford and Zaza Pachulia
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 21, 2013, 10:40:49 AM
I would love to see trades made and the roster adjusted so that Doc has a solid 8 man rotation.

You can't play an 8 man rotation when two of the 8, and the two the offense is largely built around, are Pierce and KG.  Neither of them can carry a team the way they did in the past.

Mike

Sadly too true!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 21, 2013, 10:43:54 AM
Rondo  doesn't have the scoring skills to carry a team night in and night out like KG and Pierce could when they were young.   A flash of offense stardom here and there is the weakness of Rondo.  He depends on having OTHERS do the actual scoring off his ball handling /passing skills.

Jet and Bass just have to play better.  Jet surely can , h is so aweful lately , he can only get bettter.  Bass has effort , but his skill level has maxed out and he is overwhelmed by most starters.  Bass should be on the bench .

The C's are just plain staved for a talented BIG on the front line. Either KG plays 40 minutes or we lose , and he's too old ...puts us up the creek without a paddle.

I look for Danny to get despert and bring in FAB  to see if he can help "ANY" at all before the season goes down the drain.

Like others mentioned it may already be too late for a run this year.
 



Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: TripleOT on January 21, 2013, 10:50:31 AM
It's clear to me that Bass and Green have both been infected with a common NBA malady - paid-itis.  Paid-itis sets in with many players immediately after signing a long term contract.  It's most common in players with laid back personas or players who like to eat a lot. 

Some of the symptoms:

1) Wild inconsistency from game to game
2) Box score lines that look like this:
1-5,0-1,1-2,0,0,0,0,0,2,2,-14,3
3)Lots of smiling, even  in defeat.  The smiling translates to: I'm getting paid for three more years regardless.
4) Lots of standing around. Wing players tend to stand in the corner, bigs tend to stand in the paint and stare helplessly at the rim.

I don't thing Terry or Lee have been infected.  Terry is just showing his age, and both have been uncomfortable trying to find suitable roles.

I do think there are too many of what Rondo calls "laid back personalities" and I like to refer to as "****" on this team. Ship Bass and Green out of town for a big man who can play 22 decent minutes a night, and the Cs would be a lot better off. 

I'd rather have an undersized Lee take the backup SG minutes and Barbosa playing the remaining minutes behind Rondo than watch Green sleepwalk his way through half his minutes. 

Or just take a scrap heap wing out of the D-league who is hungry and will compete all of the time. I've seen enough of Jeff Green to know that he's never going to be a guy who maximized his prodigious talents.

No Green and Bass, a tough backup big, hard charging Barbosa playing more, Bradley staying healthy, and Doc forcing Rondo to play defense more often and this team will be a lot better.   
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 21, 2013, 11:03:31 AM
It's clear to me that Bass and Green have both been infected with a common NBA malady - paid-itis. 

That may be true for Bass, but I don't think that applies to Green at all.  Green has been a bad rebounder but his defense has been pretty good and so has his offense, given that Doc basically never runs a play for him.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: celticsleyte on January 21, 2013, 11:07:32 AM
I actually would prefer Doc would focus on coaching and leave the GM work to Ainge.  He should focus on his own job. Sometimes it seems like with his love for veteran players that he does not really like to coach.  Unless Doc means that guys can go to the bench (which should be the bottom line) he should not make it more difficult for Ainge to find trading partners by trashing his players.

Ainge is going to have to determine whether Melo will be able to contribute during the stretch run. If he knows he could contribute he has to not give Doc another veteran option to block his chance.  Personally, I think he could be a decent upgrade over what Ryan Hollins gave us last year.

I think we're beyond concerning ourselves with a stretch run for this year.  I suspect Doc's beyond threatening changes in the rotation and doing so privately.  There's not much further he can go with these guys.

I think he would be one of the harder coaches to be a role player under.  He seems to be big on limiting the roles of the guys he wants to do most of the dirty work. Most of these guys are on multiple year contracts now so maybe they are starting to tune Doc out.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on January 21, 2013, 11:34:10 AM
I just have one request to Doc.

PLay Jeff Green on the top of the key, give him an ISO once in a while. He's athletic enough to beat his defender off the dribble.

As for the right combo, I really believe we need a Center and move KG back to PF. Collins isnt cutting it (ya don't say).
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Galeto on January 21, 2013, 11:37:13 AM
Quote
It's clear to me that Bass and Green have both been infected with a common NBA malady - paid-itis.

Really?  Green's always played like this, inconsistently, averagely.  Unless he was infected with paid-itis from the beginning of his career, he has not yet come down with that common NBA malady that ravages the sack of worthless bums that populate the NBA.  How do these lazy bums even make the NBA in the first place, ya'know?  Must have been their helicopter parents.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Who on January 21, 2013, 11:51:24 AM
As for the right combo, I really believe we need a Center and move KG back to PF. Collins isnt cutting it (ya don't say).
Gosh, the team is slow enough already.

There are not many centers talented enough for me to put KG back to the PF position. I would much rather pursue a power forward and keep Garnett at the five if at all possible.

Team speed is a major issue for this team. 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: mctyson on January 21, 2013, 01:49:06 PM
Let me first say that I did not watch the Detroit game so I cannot say who Doc is most upset with, though I can tell he is disgusted with the way this team plays in the 1st quarter of games.  And I am too.

Having said that:  I think we are making a too much of this.  Sometimes a coach just has to lay into his players, and that's basically what Doc did (at the same time criticizing himself, ever the players' coach).

It wasn't that long ago that Doc said he liked his team and thought they were getting better.  He wanted to see consistency...day-in, day-out.  Obviously that did not happen in the New Orleans or Detroit games.  The Chicago game was a tough fought game they should have won.

I don't take anything away from this talk about people not taking losing seriously enough.  Who cares about attitudes after losses?  What matters is the attitude on the court, the level of play.

I also don't take anything away from Doc's threats that "guys have to go."  Doc is not the GM.  Danny is.  Danny will definitely trade the whole freaking roster if this team doesn't act and play like a contender.  We don't need Doc handing out threats to make this a reality.

I am glad Doc is p---ed, but if it doesn't make the team play better than all he has done is shown they don't respond to him anymore.  That is what I am most worried about.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Bankshot on January 21, 2013, 02:03:55 PM
Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"

Does that include Doc?  He is, after all, the one that can't find the right combination.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticG1 on January 21, 2013, 02:09:46 PM
As for the right combo, I really believe we need a Center and move KG back to PF. Collins isnt cutting it (ya don't say).
Gosh, the team is slow enough already.

There are not many centers talented enough for me to put KG back to the PF position. I would much rather pursue a power forward and keep Garnett at the five if at all possible.

Team speed is a major issue for this team.

I don't think our team speed really has to do with our personell but just the style and pace we are playing with. No matter who we do or don't get that is a fundamental change that needs to happen
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on January 21, 2013, 02:14:11 PM
As for the right combo, I really believe we need a Center and move KG back to PF. Collins isnt cutting it (ya don't say).
Gosh, the team is slow enough already.

There are not many centers talented enough for me to put KG back to the PF position. I would much rather pursue a power forward and keep Garnett at the five if at all possible.

Team speed is a major issue for this team.

Green, Bradley, Lee and Rondo are fast enough.

We need someone to protect the rim when KG is not on the floor, or someone who can take the pounding so KG can be the help defender.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Kane3387 on January 21, 2013, 02:24:26 PM
As for the right combo, I really believe we need a Center and move KG back to PF. Collins isnt cutting it (ya don't say).
Gosh, the team is slow enough already.

There are not many centers talented enough for me to put KG back to the PF position. I would much rather pursue a power forward and keep Garnett at the five if at all possible.

Team speed is a major issue for this team.

Green, Bradley, Lee and Rondo are fast enough.

We need someone to protect the rim when KG is not on the floor, or someone who can take the pounding so KG can be the help defender.

Barbosa can move a little bit and so can Bass. This should be the most athletic team we have had in this era.

It's just not translating into consistent wins.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Who on January 21, 2013, 02:36:12 PM
I think the C's effectiveness on the defensive end of the floor is based around quickness and mobility. Largely led through the exceptional athleticism of Bradley + Rondo in the backcourt and the quickness/mobility of Garnett anchoring the defense. Putting more defensive quickness around those guys will create very good results.

I don't think a slow or mediocre quickness center with KG sliding back to PF will be as impactful an addition defensively as many people hope it will. And offensively, unless that center is reasonably skilled, I think it threatens to take a lot more off table than is added defensively.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: tenn_smoothie on January 21, 2013, 03:55:48 PM
why does everyone seem to think that Sullinger plays hard all the time ? i rewound the DVR a few times on a play the Bulls scored a layup on the other night. Sullinger's man (Noah) breaks across and then down the lane, receives a pass and drops in a layup.

Sully wasn't even close to seeing the ball and his man and was standing flat-footed without a hint of a basic defensive stance (all fundamentals a good high school player knows to do). he should have easily beaten Noah to the spot and denied the pass. either lazy or clueless about basic defensive fundamentals or both.
You're judging sully's hard work with that one play? Then you haven't seen him play hard then. He plays hard and only limited and stop by bad foul calls.

of course i'm not summing up Sullinger's ability/effort based on one play - i see him (and Green too for that matter) constantly looking around befuddled after their man cuts without the ball, then receives a pass for an easy layup.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Moranis on January 21, 2013, 04:35:53 PM
why does everyone seem to think that Sullinger plays hard all the time ? i rewound the DVR a few times on a play the Bulls scored a layup on the other night. Sullinger's man (Noah) breaks across and then down the lane, receives a pass and drops in a layup.

Sully wasn't even close to seeing the ball and his man and was standing flat-footed without a hint of a basic defensive stance (all fundamentals a good high school player knows to do). he should have easily beaten Noah to the spot and denied the pass. either lazy or clueless about basic defensive fundamentals or both.
You're judging sully's hard work with that one play? Then you haven't seen him play hard then. He plays hard and only limited and stop by bad foul calls.

of course i'm not summing up Sullinger's ability/effort based on one play - i see him (and Green too for that matter) constantly looking around befuddled after their man cuts without the ball, then receives a pass for an easy layup.
looking around befuddled doesn't mean you aren't trying hard.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: j804 on January 21, 2013, 04:37:37 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: j804 on January 21, 2013, 04:38:30 PM
why does everyone seem to think that Sullinger plays hard all the time ? i rewound the DVR a few times on a play the Bulls scored a layup on the other night. Sullinger's man (Noah) breaks across and then down the lane, receives a pass and drops in a layup.

Sully wasn't even close to seeing the ball and his man and was standing flat-footed without a hint of a basic defensive stance (all fundamentals a good high school player knows to do). he should have easily beaten Noah to the spot and denied the pass. either lazy or clueless about basic defensive fundamentals or both.
You're judging sully's hard work with that one play? Then you haven't seen him play hard then. He plays hard and only limited and stop by bad foul calls.

of course i'm not summing up Sullinger's ability/effort based on one play - i see him (and Green too for that matter) constantly looking around befuddled after their man cuts without the ball, then receives a pass for an easy layup.
you aren't paying attention even stars can have mental breakdowns the kid is a rookie afterall but he is busting his butt out there
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 21, 2013, 05:09:25 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Roy H. on January 21, 2013, 05:18:49 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 21, 2013, 05:56:56 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.

No thanks. ;D
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: 2short on January 21, 2013, 06:41:25 PM
While some have called out green, rondo, pierce and even garnett.  Two guys have been glaringly poor this season.  Bass who has played better as of late and terry who to me is being outplayed by barbosa.  Package them for gortat?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Evantime34 on January 21, 2013, 08:25:43 PM
So obviously after reading this everyone is focused on the people have to go portion.

I want to take a look at the first part, finding the right combination. What are some lineups that haven't been featured that could help us out.
1. I think you see a lot of small lineups, especially ones that feature 3 of the four of Rondo, Lee, Bradley and Terry.
2. In these small lineups you will see them go super small and sometimes have Pierce or Green at the four.
3. More plays run for Green and Sullinger
4. Less time for Terry, more time for Lee.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: csfansince60s on January 21, 2013, 08:42:03 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.

No thanks. ;D

I'll pass too..give me the guy with the Leprechaun tat on his arm as opposed to the Judas with his 30 pieces of silver....Oh, make that 15 pieces of silver...our Judas screwed us at a discount.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Edgar on January 21, 2013, 11:07:25 PM
I can think in a combo of thibs and a towel for Doc Rivers
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 21, 2013, 11:12:22 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.

  While I don't think +/- is a great stat, I still take pleasure in pointing out that the Heat are *still* getting outscored with Ray on the floor for the season.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Boris Badenov on January 21, 2013, 11:14:23 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.

  While I don't think +/- is a great stat, I still take pleasure in pointing out that the Heat are *still* getting outscored with Ray on the floor for the season.

He is the target of some fairly negative sentiment on the Heat boards. I'm enjoying that.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: ben on January 21, 2013, 11:27:58 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Kane3387 on January 21, 2013, 11:34:29 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!

Lol Terry isn't even third string?!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: wdleehi on January 21, 2013, 11:35:32 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: csfansince60s on January 21, 2013, 11:38:09 PM
This message was clearly aimed at Bass and The Jet.

I agree .  Jet is WORTHLESS.... no wonder Dallas didn't want him.  We got the shaft.

Maybe we can trade him for Ray.

  While I don't think +/- is a great stat, I still take pleasure in pointing out that the Heat are *still* getting outscored with Ray on the floor for the season.

He is the target of some fairly negative sentiment on the Heat boards. I'm enjoying that.

Boris, Me too. ;D

Things like: "can't play D", "turns ball over when trying to do too much"...stuff we know all about.

Many are hating on him overvthere.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 21, 2013, 11:39:02 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: wdleehi on January 21, 2013, 11:41:17 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.


Player/coach? 

Russel did it. 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: indeedproceed on January 21, 2013, 11:44:52 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.

Wow, you're so wrong I doubt you could find the right angle in a square. The proper depth chart should read:

PG SULLY/Bradley
SG SULLY/Bradley
SF SULLY
PF SULLLLY
C SULLLLLLLINGERRRR!!!!!/Melo
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 21, 2013, 11:49:50 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.

Wow, you're so wrong I doubt you could find the right angle in a square. The proper depth chart should read:

PG SULLY/Bradley
SG SULLY/Bradley
SF SULLY
PF SULLLLY
C SULLLLLLLINGERRRR!!!!!/Melo

  You're apparently new to coaching. You have Sully, all by himself, playing all 5 positions at the same time. I, on the other hand, have 5 lineups, each featuring Green in a different spot.

  I'm fairly certain at least 3 of those 5 lineups could beat Sully playing 1v5, although they might lose the battle of the boards.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: syfy9 on January 21, 2013, 11:53:23 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.


Player/coach? 

Russel did it.

Don't forget general manager.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: wdleehi on January 21, 2013, 11:53:58 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.


Player/coach? 

Russel did it.

Don't forget general manager.


Didn't work so well for Jordan.


Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Change on January 21, 2013, 11:55:27 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!

How about

Rondo/Avery
Green/Lee
Pierce/Green
Sully/Bass
KG/Collins
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: indeedproceed on January 21, 2013, 11:59:07 PM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.

Wow, you're so wrong I doubt you could find the right angle in a square. The proper depth chart should read:

PG SULLY/Bradley
SG SULLY/Bradley
SF SULLY
PF SULLLLY
C SULLLLLLLINGERRRR!!!!!/Melo

  You're apparently new to coaching. You have Sully, all by himself, playing all 5 positions at the same time. I, on the other hand, have 5 lineups, each featuring Green in a different spot.

  I'm fairly certain at least 3 of those 5 lineups could beat Sully playing 1v5, although they might lose the battle of the boards.

Oh Tim, sweet Tim, your navet is adorable. Jared Sullinger can play as many positions simultaneously as he wants. It's a little thing called heart.

Sullinger is everywhere. On the crest of a rainbow on a spring morning, Sully is there. In the mellow copper tones of a fall sunset, Sullly is there. In a perfect s'more, in that first rush of exhilaration and joy while a young boy first flies down a snow covered hill on a bright orange plastic saucer, Sully is there.

He can play wherever, whenever, and however he darn well pleases.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 22, 2013, 12:12:14 AM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.

Wow, you're so wrong I doubt you could find the right angle in a square. The proper depth chart should read:

PG SULLY/Bradley
SG SULLY/Bradley
SF SULLY
PF SULLLLY
C SULLLLLLLINGERRRR!!!!!/Melo

  You're apparently new to coaching. You have Sully, all by himself, playing all 5 positions at the same time. I, on the other hand, have 5 lineups, each featuring Green in a different spot.

  I'm fairly certain at least 3 of those 5 lineups could beat Sully playing 1v5, although they might lose the battle of the boards.

Oh Tim, sweet Tim, your navet is adorable. Jared Sullinger can play as many positions simultaneously as he wants. It's a little thing called heart.

Sullinger is everywhere. On the crest of a rainbow on a spring morning, Sully is there. In the mellow copper tones of a fall sunset, Sullly is there. In a perfect s'more, in that first rush of exhilaration and joy while a young boy first flies down a snow covered hill on a bright orange plastic saucer, Sully is there.

He can play wherever, whenever, and however he darn well pleases.

  Sounds like he's firmly cemented his position as the second best point guard in the league. No worries, though, I'm sure he'll improve before the season ends.

Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Mazingerz on January 22, 2013, 01:18:58 AM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.

Wow, you're so wrong I doubt you could find the right angle in a square. The proper depth chart should read:

PG SULLY/Bradley
SG SULLY/Bradley
SF SULLY
PF SULLLLY
C SULLLLLLLINGERRRR!!!!!/Melo

  You're apparently new to coaching. You have Sully, all by himself, playing all 5 positions at the same time. I, on the other hand, have 5 lineups, each featuring Green in a different spot.

  I'm fairly certain at least 3 of those 5 lineups could beat Sully playing 1v5, although they might lose the battle of the boards.

Oh Tim, sweet Tim, your navet is adorable. Jared Sullinger can play as many positions simultaneously as he wants. It's a little thing called heart.

Sullinger is everywhere. On the crest of a rainbow on a spring morning, Sully is there. In the mellow copper tones of a fall sunset, Sullly is there. In a perfect s'more, in that first rush of exhilaration and joy while a young boy first flies down a snow covered hill on a bright orange plastic saucer, Sully is there.

He can play wherever, whenever, and however he darn well pleases.

  Sounds like he's firmly cemented his position as the second best point guard in the league. No worries, though, I'm sure he'll improve before the season ends.

Sully also is the defensive coordinator and video coordinator when he is done playing.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: jyyzzoel on January 22, 2013, 02:36:34 AM
i think everyone is looking at this the wrong way.  it should really be, "who can we say doc is happy with?"

he's happy with sullinger as he said recently that "he's going no where. the kids a warrior" or something like that, KG, rondo, and paul. he's happy with wilcox, who has done nothing but be a champ when he's healthy. 

putting the whole thing into context, it's really about the newish guys. doc can't be that mad at jason collins - we all knew what we were getting there. he cant be that mad at barbosa, who came here waaaayy cheap and has done nothing but get buckets when he plays.

doc's gone on the record about jeff greens lack of performance, comparing it to getting a tie for christmas.  a few games a go he went with sully over bass in the final minutes against chicago, which clearly showed that bass is on the way out.

i dont think doc can be mad at avery since everyone knows he has heart, and just came back. he aint mad at fab because hes in the d-league.

i remember that doc said at the beginning of the year doc said something along the lines of "the only people who know what celtics ball is are terry, KG, paul, and rondo.

i think clearly, the least we can say, is he's not happy with:

BASS
GREEN
LEE

thats close to 19 and a half million dollars in salary. what can we get realistically with that?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: bdsulliv on January 22, 2013, 03:10:12 AM
Bring back Delonte. He brought it every night and shoots a great percentage compared to Lee/Terry. I don't care if he's crazy in the locker room. Sounds like that's exactly what they need - heart & a little bit of edge. When they traded Perk (and to a lesser extent, traded or lost Tony Allen/Nate Robinson/Eddie House) they lost the garbage pail energy guys and brought in guys that are talented on paper but lack the motor. Never in a million years would Delonte, Tony Allen, etc., give up in a game the way we see this team do repeatedly.

The other problem with the team as is, is that they should have built this team around Rondo and gone into fast break mode. In addition to giving Tommy what he's always wanted, it would maximize Jeff Green, AB's and Rondo's ability. Sully is perfect for that system, so is KG as a trailing big man that can hit the pull up jumper and protect the paint on turnovers. They should put Pierce on the 5 minute KG minute plan, and when the fourth quarter turns into a grind it out, slugfest, he will still have legs. You can see that his shot is really flat lately. Either he is hurt or old, and in both cases less minutes are a good thing.

Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 22, 2013, 08:48:53 AM
i think everyone is looking at this the wrong way.  it should really be, "who can we say doc is happy with?"

he's happy with sullinger as he said recently that "he's going no where. the kids a warrior" or something like that, KG, rondo, and paul. he's happy with wilcox, who has done nothing but be a champ when he's healthy. 

putting the whole thing into context, it's really about the newish guys. doc can't be that mad at jason collins - we all knew what we were getting there. he cant be that mad at barbosa, who came here waaaayy cheap and has done nothing but get buckets when he plays.

doc's gone on the record about jeff greens lack of performance, comparing it to getting a tie for christmas.  a few games a go he went with sully over bass in the final minutes against chicago, which clearly showed that bass is on the way out.

i dont think doc can be mad at avery since everyone knows he has heart, and just came back. he aint mad at fab because hes in the d-league.

i remember that doc said at the beginning of the year doc said something along the lines of "the only people who know what celtics ball is are terry, KG, paul, and rondo.

i think clearly, the least we can say, is he's not happy with:

BASS
GREEN
LEE

thats close to 19 and a half million dollars in salary. what can we get realistically with that?

Maybe he isnt happy with Lee in the locker room? But I would see no reason as to why he wouldnt be happy with Lee. He is almost as good of an on ball defender as Bradley...Almost... And he has better offense. When he has been on the floor he has played well, hard, with effort, and fairly consistent.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Casperian on January 22, 2013, 10:01:15 AM
I cant believe people are still talking about lateral moves.

There is nothing we could get for a package of Bass + Green that would make us contenders.

Too bad we didnt blow it up last year, huh?
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 22, 2013, 10:08:03 AM
i think everyone is looking at this the wrong way.  it should really be, "who can we say doc is happy with?"

he's happy with sullinger as he said recently that "he's going no where. the kids a warrior" or something like that, KG, rondo, and paul. he's happy with wilcox, who has done nothing but be a champ when he's healthy. 

putting the whole thing into context, it's really about the newish guys. doc can't be that mad at jason collins - we all knew what we were getting there. he cant be that mad at barbosa, who came here waaaayy cheap and has done nothing but get buckets when he plays.

doc's gone on the record about jeff greens lack of performance, comparing it to getting a tie for christmas.  a few games a go he went with sully over bass in the final minutes against chicago, which clearly showed that bass is on the way out.

i dont think doc can be mad at avery since everyone knows he has heart, and just came back. he aint mad at fab because hes in the d-league.

i remember that doc said at the beginning of the year doc said something along the lines of "the only people who know what celtics ball is are terry, KG, paul, and rondo.

i think clearly, the least we can say, is he's not happy with:

BASS
GREEN
LEE

thats close to 19 and a half million dollars in salary. what can we get realistically with that?

Doc compared Green's play to getting a tie for Christmas?  Ha ha--I missed that one!
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 22, 2013, 10:13:27 AM

i remember that doc said at the beginning of the year doc said something along the lines of "the only people who know what celtics ball is are terry, KG, paul, and rondo.

i think clearly, the least we can say, is he's not happy with:

BASS
GREEN
LEE


Well, Terry has largely sucked, Rondo has had more than a few "bad Rondo" nights, Pierce has had plenty of terrible offensive nights and KG, while he's still trying, clearly can't do what he used to do.  If those are the guy's Doc has faith in, I'm not surprised the rest of the team isn't happy to get with the program.

Bass has been awful, there's no denying that.  People need to stop blaming Green and Lee, however.  Both have improved a great deal since the start of the year and even then, I don't think you could blame them for the team's struggles.

Doc needs to stop worrying about what "celtics ball" is supposed to be and start dealing with the team as it is.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 22, 2013, 10:25:39 AM
Doc I thought you would never ask.  Here is the right combo!!!

1.Rondo/Bradley/Lee
2.Pierce/Bradley/Green
3.Green/Pierce/Barbosa
4.Sullinger/Willcox/Bass/Green
5.Garnett/Collins/Wilcox/Bass


Your Welcome!!!


How is Green not playing PG and C as well?

  He's our 1st sf, our 3rd sg and 4th pf. That leaves room for 2nd pg and 5th center on the list above. All Jeff Green, all the time.


Player/coach? 

Russel did it.

Don't forget general manager.

Hey, with Green's contract he might as well step in as co-owner.  Then he can fire Danny for having given him such a contract.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticG1 on January 22, 2013, 10:27:45 AM
I cant believe people are still talking about lateral moves.

There is nothing we could get for a package of Bass + Green that would make us contenders.

Too bad we didnt blow it up last year, huh?

No I wouldn't take back last year. Couple bounces here ir there and we're in the finals. It was an exciting fun ride.

Im still not convinced that this team is done either. They've proved us wrong too many times. They showed that they are a good team last year. We added more talent to our team and didn't lose much. You just can't convince me that this team is worse than last years or that much worse.

Plus they will always be more built for playoffs with KG and Pierce being older and Rondo playing all worldy in the playoffs.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 22, 2013, 10:40:43 AM
I cant believe people are still talking about lateral moves.

There is nothing we could get for a package of Bass + Green that would make us contenders.

  I don't think that's necessarily true. A "better than Collins" backup center could make quite a difference in the playoffs. We don't necessarily need someone who's a better player than Bass or Green, maybe just a similar quality player with a different skill set or playing a different position.

 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CapnDunks on January 22, 2013, 11:09:33 AM
Is Terry really not playing hard enough?

I think he's being misused on offense, doesn't know where he fits and has been slumping horribly. But I don't know that I see him not playing hard enough.

I've been surprised how much d he's playing for a guy who has a reputation as a lackluster defender. I also think he's underperforming worse than anyone. But I haven't really seen the lack of effort people are talking about.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticG1 on January 22, 2013, 11:15:43 AM
Is Terry really not playing hard enough?

I think he's being misused on offense, doesn't know where he fits and has been slumping horribly. But I don't know that I see him not playing hard enough.

I've been surprised how much d he's playing for a guy who has a reputation as a lackluster defender. I also think he's underperforming worse than anyone. But I haven't really seen the lack of effort people are talking about.

Well he claimed at the beginning of the season that he was the leader of second unit etc.

He's had plenty if time there and for a lifetime 6th man "leader" I don't think he's really assumed the role.

That's just my view. I thought he would lead the second unit be more aggressive andthe vocal. Green and Lee have been starters in the past and are youngish Sully is a rook, I wad hoping Terry would help being it together.

He's been playing better defense as of late but in general you barely notice when he's in the game
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 22, 2013, 11:26:30 AM

Well he claimed at the beginning of the season that he was the leader of second unit etc.

Boston has been having bad bench play ever since Banner 17 and even then, the team didn't really have a bench like the Clippers do this year or the Bulls had the past couple of seasons. PJ Brown, Baby, Cassel, Leon and Posey never really played much together as a productive unit.  Doc basically just plugged some of them in with the starters.

You can't give Terry or anyone a pass on poor play, but I think there's something systemically wrong in addition to all that.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: Celtics18 on January 22, 2013, 11:37:28 AM
I cant believe people are still talking about lateral moves.

There is nothing we could get for a package of Bass + Green that would make us contenders.

  I don't think that's necessarily true. A "better than Collins" backup center could make quite a difference in the playoffs. We don't necessarily need someone who's a better player than Bass or Green, maybe just a similar quality player with a different skill set or playing a different position.

 

I think that we already have two "better than Collins" backup centers on the roster.  Right now one of them is recovering from a thumb injury and the other one is getting up to speed in the D-League. 
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: BballTim on January 22, 2013, 12:26:14 PM
I cant believe people are still talking about lateral moves.

There is nothing we could get for a package of Bass + Green that would make us contenders.

  I don't think that's necessarily true. A "better than Collins" backup center could make quite a difference in the playoffs. We don't necessarily need someone who's a better player than Bass or Green, maybe just a similar quality player with a different skill set or playing a different position.

 

I think that we already have two "better than Collins" backup centers on the roster.  Right now one of them is recovering from a thumb injury and the other one is getting up to speed in the D-League.

  I don't think that Melo is ready yet, and I'm talking about a somewhat grittier defender/rebounder than Wilcox (although his return should be helpful).
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: CelticG1 on January 22, 2013, 12:44:01 PM

Well he claimed at the beginning of the season that he was the leader of second unit etc.

Boston has been having bad bench play ever since Banner 17 and even then, the team didn't really have a bench like the Clippers do this year or the Bulls had the past couple of seasons. PJ Brown, Baby, Cassel, Leon and Posey never really played much together as a productive unit.  Doc basically just plugged some of them in with the starters.

You can't give Terry or anyone a pass on poor play, but I think there's something systemically wrong in addition to all that.

Mike
I don't really get how your response has to do with what you quoted me on.

I think our benches have been hot and cold over the years some being a lot better than others. Im not gonna compare 2 completely different teams with 2 completely different cap situations especially one team that's been in the lottery since the 20's.

As far as my assessment of Terry claiming the alpha dog of the second unit he could at least show.it a little. At least Sheed would go out there guns blazing, talk a bunch of crap, and try and hurt people when he fouled. Terry is playing scared which I didn't expect. I didn't know him too well but this certainly wasn't the perception I got
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: clover on January 22, 2013, 01:02:42 PM
Is Terry really not playing hard enough?

I think he's being misused on offense, doesn't know where he fits and has been slumping horribly. But I don't know that I see him not playing hard enough.

I've been surprised how much d he's playing for a guy who has a reputation as a lackluster defender. I also think he's underperforming worse than anyone. But I haven't really seen the lack of effort people are talking about.

Well he claimed at the beginning of the season that he was the leader of second unit etc.

He's had plenty if time there and for a lifetime 6th man "leader" I don't think he's really assumed the role.

That's just my view. I thought he would lead the second unit be more aggressive andthe vocal. Green and Lee have been starters in the past and are youngish Sully is a rook, I wad hoping Terry would help being it together.

He's been playing better defense as of late but in general you barely notice when he's in the game

I actually thought JET's self-proclaimed leadership of the bench was a little obnoxious.  Green and Lee are in their primes and it just seemed a bit presumptuous to me, coming in new to the team and all.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 22, 2013, 01:02:54 PM
Jet just hasn't been the impact player player we'd all hoped.

I belive Dooling would have been a much -much better bench leader than JET and probally would have shot as good as JEt has been doing lately.
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 22, 2013, 01:10:26 PM

Well he claimed at the beginning of the season that he was the leader of second unit etc.

Boston has been having bad bench play ever since Banner 17 and even then, the team didn't really have a bench like the Clippers do this year or the Bulls had the past couple of seasons. PJ Brown, Baby, Cassel, Leon and Posey never really played much together as a productive unit.  Doc basically just plugged some of them in with the starters.

You can't give Terry or anyone a pass on poor play, but I think there's something systemically wrong in addition to all that.

Mike
I don't really get how your response has to do with what you quoted me on.

I think our benches have been hot and cold over the years some being a lot better than others. Im not gonna compare 2 completely different teams with 2 completely different cap situations especially one team that's been in the lottery since the 20's.

As far as my assessment of Terry claiming the alpha dog of the second unit he could at least show.it a little. At least Sheed would go out there guns blazing, talk a bunch of crap, and try and hurt people when he fouled. Terry is playing scared which I didn't expect. I didn't know him too well but this certainly wasn't the perception I got

It has to do with the struggles we've seen consistently from the bench over the past few years, with different players and line ups.  You say you want Terry to be the alpha dog, but what is Doc telling him to do?  Whenever he's on the court with KG, Pierce and Rondo, he's clearly been instructed to do nothing but fill the same role Ray did in the past.  And for at least the last several games, when Terry's been in with the rest of the bench, it's been Lee bringing the ball up court and initiating any offense.

You're putting all the blame on Terry but maybe he's just struggling to fit the very limited role Doc has assigned to him?  Have you seen how Nate Robinson is playing for Thibs in Chicago?  He's getting a lot more use out of him than Doc ever did.

Mike
Title: Re: Doc: "We have to find the right combo or some people have to go"
Post by: MBunge on January 22, 2013, 01:26:19 PM
Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about.

Terry is averaging 4.5 fewer shots a game with Boston than his career average.  But, he's only averaging .3 fewer three-point attempts.  If both total shots and 3 pointers were down, that might just mean Terry isn't being aggressive.  But for 3 point shots to be essential the same yet total shot attempts down so much, that tells me that Terry is being asked to play a much different offensive role than he has in the past.

Mike