Something's Gotta Give

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

[Sophomore]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

As a longtime Smart defender/optimist, I gotta say those numbers stink and they’re not redeemed by the other stuff he does. This can’t go on.

[86MaxwellSmart]

How long before we can package Smart and Richardson?

Asking for ME

[Roy H.]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

As a longtime Smart defender/optimist, I gotta say those numbers stink and they’re not redeemed by the other stuff he does. This can’t go on.

Definitely disappointing so far.  I was hoping that his role as starting point guard would lead to better decision making.

[Birdman]

How long before we can package Smart and Richardson?

Asking for ME

Haha I posted a trade idea earlier..never liked Smart as a starter

[BudweiserCeltic]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

As a longtime Smart defender/optimist, I gotta say those numbers stink and they’re not redeemed by the other stuff he does. This can’t go on.

Definitely disappointing so far.  I was hoping that his role as starting point guard would lead to better decision making.

Same, and if only we had a defense to show for it, but our team's defense has been awful.

[Vermont Green]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

As a longtime Smart defender/optimist, I gotta say those numbers stink and they’re not redeemed by the other stuff he does. This can’t go on.

Definitely disappointing so far.  I was hoping that his role as starting point guard would lead to better decision making.

Same, and if only we had a defense to show for it, but our team's defense has been awful.

Boy, this is beat up Marcus day.  I am not saying that those core scoring stats are not bad but the plus/minus number for Marcus are outrageously good.  Some one explain that:

Celtics PGs:
Smart       +17
Schroder   -2
Pritchard  -31

When Marcus is the PG (no Pritchard or Schroder on the court) the team is +8.  When anyone else is the PG, the team is -32.  Sample size will level both the good and the bad but you can't ignore that some how, even with that atrocious shooting, the team is better with Smart on the court and the team is better when he is the PG.  Imagine what the numbers will be when he hits a few more 3s (and he will).  Smart is one of those players where you just can't apply the traditional stats.

[Celtics2021]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

Those statistics are definitely offensive.

As a longtime Smart defender/optimist, I gotta say those numbers stink and they’re not redeemed by the other stuff he does. This can’t go on.

Definitely disappointing so far.  I was hoping that his role as starting point guard would lead to better decision making.

Same, and if only we had a defense to show for it, but our team's defense has been awful.

Boy, this is beat up Marcus day.  I am not saying that those core scoring stats are not bad but the plus/minus number for Marcus are outrageously good.  Some one explain that:

Celtics PGs:
Smart       +17
Schroder   -2
Pritchard  -31

When Marcus is the PG (no Pritchard or Schroder on the court) the team is +8.  When anyone else is the PG, the team is -32.  Sample size will level both the good and the bad but you can't ignore that some how, even with that atrocious shooting, the team is better with Smart on the court and the team is better when he is the PG.  Imagine what the numbers will be when he hits a few more 3s (and he will).  Smart is one of those players where you just can't apply the traditional stats.

Seriously.  Smart was hounding Beal almost every possession, such that one of the best scorers in the NBA went 7-25 with 5 turnovers last night, and was the only guy on the team with a positive +/-, but dangit, he missed shots so we might as well dump him.

[Vermont Green]

The Celtics plus/minus numbers are really crazy so far this season.  Overall, the team is -24 in total points.  We have 5 players with Positive plus/minus; Brown +23, Smart +17, Horford +9, RWill +7, Tatum +3,  and Schroder -2 who isn't too bad.  Those are all really good when you consider the team is overall -24.  Parker is -1 but hasn't played enough to really matter.  Bruno Fernando I don't think has played yet.

Then the bad. GWill -16, Richardson -27, Pritchard -31.  These guys are all playing pretty regular minutes and aren't that far off of the team average of -24, but it is still losing 3-6 points per game.  Our young studs, Langford -37, Nesmith -35.  These are really bad especially when you consider it is in relatively limited minutes.

Than the really bad.  Somehow, Kanter -15 and JHern -15 managed these in only 5 min. and 8 min.  Together in 4 minutes, the team was -12.

I can't distill what is going on here.  We have top 5 (Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, RWill) +1 (Schroder) who are doing very well.  Then we fall off of a cliff.  I don't think GWill is that good, nor Kanter and JHern, but Richardson, Pritchard, Langford, and Nesmith are horrible so far and should be much better.  That appears to be the problem.  Langford is 6-11  FG% overall and 4-6 from 3 but has given up about 18 pts per game in the two games he played.  How in the world does that happen?

[liam]

The Celtics plus/minus numbers are really crazy so far this season.  Overall, the team is -24 in total points.  We have 5 players with Positive plus/minus; Brown +23, Smart +17, Horford +9, RWill +7, Tatum +3,  and Schroder -2 who isn't too bad.  Those are all really good when you consider the team is overall -24.  Parker is -1 but hasn't played enough to really matter.  Bruno Fernando I don't think has played yet.

Then the bad. GWill -16, Richardson -27, Pritchard -31.  These guys are all playing pretty regular minutes and aren't that far off of the team average of -24, but it is still losing 3-5 points per game.  Our young studs, Langford -37, Nesmith -35.  These are really bad especially when you consider it is in relatively limited minutes.

Than the really bad.  Somehow, Kanter -15 and JHern -15 managed these in only 5 min. and 8 min.  Together in 4 minutes, the team was -12.

I can't distill what is going on here.  We have top 5 (Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, RWill) +1 (Schroder) who are doing very well.  Then we fall off of a cliff.  I don't think GWill is that good, nor Kanter and JHern, but Richardson, Pritchard, Langford, and Nesmith are horrible so far.  That appears to be the problem.  Langford is 6-11  FG% overall and 4-6 from 3 but has given up about 18 pts per game in the two games he played.  How in the world does that happen?

The plus minus stat is more about who you are on the court with than what you are personally allowing. The whole sample size is also much too small at this point to mean much. It's a team sport and it's not baseball where you can gather so much info from the stats.  Watching basketball is the ultimate eye test.

[Mahk E Mahk]

The Celtics plus/minus numbers are really crazy so far this season.  Overall, the team is -24 in total points.  We have 5 players with Positive plus/minus; Brown +23, Smart +17, Horford +9, RWill +7, Tatum +3,  and Schroder -2 who isn't too bad.  Those are all really good when you consider the team is overall -24.  Parker is -1 but hasn't played enough to really matter.  Bruno Fernando I don't think has played yet.

Then the bad. GWill -16, Richardson -27, Pritchard -31.  These guys are all playing pretty regular minutes and aren't that far off of the team average of -24, but it is still losing 3-5 points per game.  Our young studs, Langford -37, Nesmith -35.  These are really bad especially when you consider it is in relatively limited minutes.

Than the really bad.  Somehow, Kanter -15 and JHern -15 managed these in only 5 min. and 8 min.  Together in 4 minutes, the team was -12.

I can't distill what is going on here.  We have top 5 (Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, RWill) +1 (Schroder) who are doing very well.  Then we fall off of a cliff.  I don't think GWill is that good, nor Kanter and JHern, but Richardson, Pritchard, Langford, and Nesmith are horrible so far.  That appears to be the problem.  Langford is 6-11  FG% overall and 4-6 from 3 but has given up about 18 pts per game in the two games he played.  How in the world does that happen?

The plus minus stat is more about who you are on the court with than what you are personally allowing. The whole sample size is also much too small at this point to mean much. It's a team sport and it's not baseball where you can gather so much info from the stats.  Watching basketball is the ultimate eye test.

liam hit the nail on the head. sample size is far too small to derive anything meaningful. also, ime’s rotations have really impacted several young guys’ +/- stats, particularly the awful small ball lineups the first few games.

[Ed Monix]

[Celtics4ever]

Offensive statistics for Marcus Smart over five games:

2pt FGs: 4/13 (30.8 percent)
3pt FGs: 8/34 (23.5 percent)
19.6 percent turnover rate (career-high)

And Marcus had the guts to say this

Frustration was bubbling over in the Celtics locker room Monday after they blew a 19-point late third-quarter lead, got outscored 39-11 by the Bulls in the fourth quarter, and came from ahead to lose at home 128-114.

Marcus Smart was frustrated. The Celtics’ starting point guard plays a lot off the ball a lot while Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum have the ball in their hands as the shot creators. However, after this ugly loss and a fourth quarter where the “Jays” were 1-of-10 shooting, Smart said the young stars need to give up the ball more and get teammates involved.


Frustration was bubbling over in the Celtics locker room Monday after they blew a 19-point late third-quarter lead, got outscored 39-11 by the Bulls in the fourth quarter, and came from ahead to lose at home 128-114.

Marcus Smart was frustrated. The Celtics’ starting point guard plays a lot off the ball a lot while Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum have the ball in their hands as the shot creators. However, after this ugly loss and a fourth quarter where the “Jays” were 1-of-10 shooting, Smart said the young stars need to give up the ball more and get teammates involved.

“Every team knows we’re trying to go to Jayson and Jaylen. Every team is programmed and studied to stop Jayson and Jaylen. I think everybody’s scouting report is to make those guys pass the ball. They don’t want to pass the ball…

“That’s something that they’re going to learn. They’re still learning. We’re proud of the progress they’re making, but they’re going to have to make another step and find ways to create for themselves and others on this team to open up the court for them later down in the game… It’s something we’ve been asking them to do and they’re learning.”

[Surferdad]

I came to CS today to say something to Wyc Grousebeck.  This seems as good a thread as any.

Dear Wyc,

I didn't watch the Bulls game.  I knew they would lose and I had other things on my mind (family issue).  Frankly, I'm not sure I'll watch any games from now on.  I see no reason to be optimistic.  Call me a "bad fan", "frontrunner", etc., but the reality is that the Celtics are disappointing and are losing fans.

Signed,
Celtics fanatic since 1981

[Ed Monix]

Jayson Tatum has played 37 clutch minutes, the most in the NBA so far. Here are his stats in those minutes:

7-25 FG
1-9 3P
3 AST
4 TOV

Source: StatMuse

—————————

There is definitely a mentality issue here for Tatum, especially considering he’s just come off a fantastic performance for Team USA.