Robert Sarver suspended one year, fined $10 million

[celticsclay]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

[/b]

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

I think your inadvertently making my exact point here.

That may be, but if that's the case your point isn't reflected in what you've written. I'm trying to communicate to you that, per your example, the person who kills someone and the person who bombs the orphanage are both terrible - arguing over who is worse is mostly counterproductive.

Well you have changed it from worst to best, but even doing that you are still making my point. If someone was saying, who is the greatest player of all time, and I said “it doesn’t matter, they are in all in the hall of fame!” It would be pretty silly cause bird was clearly at a different level than pierce. To me Sterling has done a tremendous amount of damage to society far outside the scope of owning a basketball team. I think it is important to be aware of things being a slumlord, doing racist rental practices unfair evictions and really just being horrible to poor minority groups that are very vulnerable. If people want to just say “hey two crappy guys” it’s not how I view it.

I’ll also add it hasnt even been just “hey they are both crappy” at least one person said Sarver was actually worse and wasn’t that racist for having a black gm which is just flat out ridiculous.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Until i see more specific details, I personally couldn't care less at the moment. I just hate political correctness in all its fashions. Though I agree with that there should be a code of conduct in the workplace, none of what I have read makes me lose any sleep over from a moral context. But in the framing of the workplace, whatever code of conduct there is should rule.

At most I've seen a boss that was a jackass and obnoxious to some, if that, nothing new here. So either I'm missing particular details, or there's not much here for me to care about. As for punishment, don't care one way or another, $10m is a drop in the bucket for him... not sure how a 1 year suspension affects him financially though.

Now with Sterling we had ample evidence like the audio and other off court occurrences that made him a complete piece of crap of a human being.

[Moranis]

Until i see more specific details, I personally couldn't care less at the moment. I just hate political correctness in all its fashions. Though I agree with that there should be a code of conduct in the workplace, none of what I have read makes me lose any sleep over from a moral context. But in the framing of the workplace, whatever code of conduct there is should rule.

At most I've seen a boss that was a jackass and obnoxious to some, if that, nothing new here. So either I'm missing particular details, or there's not much here for me to care about. As for punishment, don't care one way or another, $10m is a drop in the bucket for him... not sure how a 1 year suspension affects him financially though.

Now with Sterling we had ample evidence like the audio and other off court occurrences that made him a complete piece of crap of a human being.

Zach Lowe did a pretty good job of summing it up.

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

[BudweiserCeltic]

Until i see more specific details, I personally couldn't care less at the moment. I just hate political correctness in all its fashions. Though I agree with that there should be a code of conduct in the workplace, none of what I have read makes me lose any sleep over from a moral context. But in the framing of the workplace, whatever code of conduct there is should rule.

At most I've seen a boss that was a jackass and obnoxious to some, if that, nothing new here. So either I'm missing particular details, or there's not much here for me to care about. As for punishment, don't care one way or another, $10m is a drop in the bucket for him... not sure how a 1 year suspension affects him financially though.

Now with Sterling we had ample evidence like the audio and other off court occurrences that made him a complete piece of crap of a human being.

Zach Lowe did a pretty good job of summing it up.

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

I saw that before posting... again, nothing to get outraged about as far as I'm concerned for what I care about.

[Moranis]

Until i see more specific details, I personally couldn't care less at the moment. I just hate political correctness in all its fashions. Though I agree with that there should be a code of conduct in the workplace, none of what I have read makes me lose any sleep over from a moral context. But in the framing of the workplace, whatever code of conduct there is should rule.

At most I've seen a boss that was a jackass and obnoxious to some, if that, nothing new here. So either I'm missing particular details, or there's not much here for me to care about. As for punishment, don't care one way or another, $10m is a drop in the bucket for him... not sure how a 1 year suspension affects him financially though.

Now with Sterling we had ample evidence like the audio and other off court occurrences that made him a complete piece of crap of a human being.

Zach Lowe did a pretty good job of summing it up.

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

I saw that before posting... again, nothing to get outraged about as far as I'm concerned for what I care about.

so dropping your pants and underpants for no reason is normal behavior in your workplace?

[Roy H.]

Here's the report:

https://www.wlrk.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Phoenix-Suns-Report.pdf

[BudweiserCeltic]

Until i see more specific details, I personally couldn't care less at the moment. I just hate political correctness in all its fashions. Though I agree with that there should be a code of conduct in the workplace, none of what I have read makes me lose any sleep over from a moral context. But in the framing of the workplace, whatever code of conduct there is should rule.

At most I've seen a boss that was a jackass and obnoxious to some, if that, nothing new here. So either I'm missing particular details, or there's not much here for me to care about. As for punishment, don't care one way or another, $10m is a drop in the bucket for him... not sure how a 1 year suspension affects him financially though.

Now with Sterling we had ample evidence like the audio and other off court occurrences that made him a complete piece of crap of a human being.

Zach Lowe did a pretty good job of summing it up.

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

I saw that before posting... again, nothing to get outraged about as far as I'm concerned for what I care about.

so dropping your pants and underpants for no reason is normal behavior in your workplace?

Again, I have to see the details of what actually occurred. And i couldn't care less about the workplace. As I said, from what we have so far provided, that I 've seen at least, he seems like at most a jackass and obnoxious boss to some.

I'm not gonna lose sleep over someone dropping their pants in a physical examination, more so without the context to accompany it. Inappropriate, sure most probably... but meh.

[Roy H.]

It's interesting that the inappropriate physical conduct was directed exclusively toward males.  The NBA seems to have accepted that the four occasions where this happened were a "boys will be boys" situation of crude humor. 

Maybe it's not gender discrimination, but having another man's naked penis shoved in my face at work sure sounds like a hostile work environment to me.  Why aren't these dudes suing?  The NBA seems to have established liability.

[Kernewek]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

[/b]

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

I think your inadvertently making my exact point here.

That may be, but if that's the case your point isn't reflected in what you've written. I'm trying to communicate to you that, per your example, the person who kills someone and the person who bombs the orphanage are both terrible - arguing over who is worse is mostly counterproductive.

Well you have changed it from worst to best, but even doing that you are still making my point. If someone was saying, who is the greatest player of all time, and I said “it doesn’t matter, they are in all in the hall of fame!” It would be pretty silly cause bird was clearly at a different level than pierce. To me Sterling has done a tremendous amount of damage to society far outside the scope of owning a basketball team. I think it is important to be aware of things being a slumlord, doing racist rental practices unfair evictions and really just being horrible to poor minority groups that are very vulnerable. If people want to just say “hey two crappy guys” it’s not how I view it.

I’ll also add it hasnt even been just “hey they are both crappy” at least one person said Sarver was actually worse and wasn’t that racist for having a black gm which is just flat out ridiculous.

Sure - I think what Nick and I are saying is that there's a threshold of badness, where one appears to be a bad person who's presence within the NBA damages the product, and Sarver and Sterling have both crossed it. 

You are right: Donald Sterling was a piece of garbage and it was an open secret for a long time. No one's disputing that (not even Moranis) and the reasons why he wasn't booted from the league ownership despite being a trash human being for 100% of his tenure have mostly been covered in the thread.

What I am saying is that bringing it up just how bad he was in comparison to Sarver seems silly to me because the reasons why Sarver's kept his ownership and Sterling lost his are 1) fairly obvious and 2) have little to do with comparative badness.

Or, to continue the analogy: it's not about discussing who is better/worse, we're evaluating if they're both in the hall of fame [of crappy owners].

[celticsclay]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

[/b]

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

I think your inadvertently making my exact point here.

That may be, but if that's the case your point isn't reflected in what you've written. I'm trying to communicate to you that, per your example, the person who kills someone and the person who bombs the orphanage are both terrible - arguing over who is worse is mostly counterproductive.

Well you have changed it from worst to best, but even doing that you are still making my point. If someone was saying, who is the greatest player of all time, and I said “it doesn’t matter, they are in all in the hall of fame!” It would be pretty silly cause bird was clearly at a different level than pierce. To me Sterling has done a tremendous amount of damage to society far outside the scope of owning a basketball team. I think it is important to be aware of things being a slumlord, doing racist rental practices unfair evictions and really just being horrible to poor minority groups that are very vulnerable. If people want to just say “hey two crappy guys” it’s not how I view it.

I’ll also add it hasnt even been just “hey they are both crappy” at least one person said Sarver was actually worse and wasn’t that racist for having a black gm which is just flat out ridiculous.

Sure - I think what Nick and I are saying is that there's a threshold of badness, where one appears to be a bad person who's presence within the NBA damages the product, and Sarver and Sterling have both crossed it. 

You are right: Donald Sterling was a piece of garbage and it was an open secret for a long time. No one's disputing that (not even Moranis) and the reasons why he wasn't booted from the league ownership despite being a trash human being for 100% of his tenure have mostly been covered in the thread.

What I am saying is that bringing it up just how bad he was in comparison to Sarver seems silly to me because the reasons why Sarver's kept his ownership and Sterling lost his are 1) fairly obvious and 2) have little to do with comparative badness.

Or, to continue the analogy: it's not about discussing who is better/worse, we're evaluating if they're both in the hall of fame [of crappy owners].

Well I’ll give you a Tommy point for a good discussion. I disagree strongly with both your points that it is obvious and has little to do with comparative badness. If Sterling didn’t have the recording on top of all the previous things including the Baylor lawsuit, the 3 million dollar fine and discriminatory housing charges, the sexual assault accusations the asking staff to hire him prostitutes (I’ve included all of these links in this thread already) he maybe would have had a chance of just getting a two year ban and max fine. So I do definitely think comparative badness plays a role in this. As crappy as it is to say this you look at what Cuban did and some of the stuff it has been rumored other owners have done (heck even look at some the things the late jerry buss did with women) and they are a lot closer to Sarver than Sarver is to Sterling. It doesn’t really seem like you are gonna change my mind or I will change yours so we can just agree to disagree.

[Moranis]

Here's the report:

https://www.wlrk.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Phoenix-Suns-Report.pdf

some really gross conduct and it was all basically in the actual workplace.  That is why I think what he did is worse than what Sterling did at least from the league's perspective.  It is pretty known on here that I don't think the leagues should be regulating off field/court issues because it has nothing to do with the product on the field.  While an owner can't play, the same reasoning holds for me i.e. does the conduct arise from employment with the NBA or is it something outside the realm of the NBA.  Sterling obviously had plenty of NBA related stuff, but the vast majority of the really bad conduct he had was unrelated to the NBA.  Even the tape was unrelated to the job as that was a private conversation with his girlfriend and not an employee.  Sarver's conduct was all almost exclusively within his work for the team.  To me that makes it worse from a league perspective, because it directly relates to his NBA "employment". 

And I find the notion that it would take the NBA players to threaten a boycott to remove Sarver to be a horrible precedent to take.  Sarver's conduct would get him fired from any business except apparently the NBA.  In fact, the bank that he founded fired him when they did their own investigation into his conduct, much of which has been discussed here.  So a private entity he founded fired him, while the NBA lets him off with a slap on the wrist. 

It is despicable.  It redraws prior precedent and does so in a horrible manner.  You can be as sexist as you want in the NBA without issue, just don't be a racist in your private business unrelated to the NBA.  That is really bad.

[SHAQATTACK]

Put him in the stockade and flog him . 

[celticsclay]

Here's the report:

https://www.wlrk.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Phoenix-Suns-Report.pdf

some really gross conduct and it was all basically in the actual workplace.  That is why I think what he did is worse than what Sterling did at least from the league's perspective.  It is pretty known on here that I don't think the leagues should be regulating off field/court issues because it has nothing to do with the product on the field.  While an owner can't play, the same reasoning holds for me i.e. does the conduct arise from employment with the NBA or is it something outside the realm of the NBA.  Sterling obviously had plenty of NBA related stuff, but the vast majority of the really bad conduct he had was unrelated to the NBA.  Even the tape was unrelated to the job as that was a private conversation with his girlfriend and not an employee.  Sarver's conduct was all almost exclusively within his work for the team.  To me that makes it worse from a league perspective, because it directly relates to his NBA "employment". 

And I find the notion that it would take the NBA players to threaten a boycott to remove Sarver to be a horrible precedent to take.  Sarver's conduct would get him fired from any business except apparently the NBA.  In fact, the bank that he founded fired him when they did their own investigation into his conduct, much of which has been discussed here.  So a private entity he founded fired him, while the NBA lets him off with a slap on the wrist. 

It is despicable.  It redraws prior precedent and does so in a horrible manner.  You can be as sexist as you want in the NBA without issue, just don't be a racist in your private business unrelated to the NBA.  That is really bad.

You realize a part of the report was him using the n word repeatedly and sexually harassing men, including pulling his pants down in front of a man that was examining. Between this and your minimizing the Watson stuff at least try to keep your faux outrage based on what happened lol, a small shred of consistency would also be nice.

[celticsclay]

It's interesting that the inappropriate physical conduct was directed exclusively toward males.  The NBA seems to have accepted that the four occasions where this happened were a "boys will be boys" situation of crude humor. 

Maybe it's not gender discrimination, but having another man's naked penis shoved in my face at work sure sounds like a hostile work environment to me.  Why aren't these dudes suing?  The NBA seems to have established liability.

We’re any of these guys his friends? That’s the only real sense I can make of that.

[Celtics2021]

It's interesting that the inappropriate physical conduct was directed exclusively toward males.  The NBA seems to have accepted that the four occasions where this happened were a "boys will be boys" situation of crude humor. 

Maybe it's not gender discrimination, but having another man's naked penis shoved in my face at work sure sounds like a hostile work environment to me.  Why aren't these dudes suing?  The NBA seems to have established liability.

We’re any of these guys his friends? That’s the only real sense I can make of that.

If you're a billionaire, most everyone pretends to be your friend.