Robert Sarver suspended one year, fined $10 million

[celticsclay]

When the Donald Sterling stuff was happening, Mark Cuban said he didn't think the NBA would force Sterling to sell because it would cause a slippery slope.

And what do you know, it wasn't long before the Mavericks had their own problems come to light, with "a longstanding culture of organizational mistreatment of women" that found “numerous instances of sexual harassment and other improper workplace conduct within the Mavericks organization over a period spanning more than twenty years”.  Mark Cuban paid $10m for that one.  This is probably closer to the Sarver situation than the Sterling situation.

And I also think this goes back to why Sarver wasn't forced to sell.  None of the other owners want that slippery slope of forcing to sell over a bad workplace.  And like Roy said, no smoking gun and all.

so we are clear being racist is really bad, but being sexist is ok?  why the double standard?

https://www.kpcc.org/show/take-two/2014-04-29/why-isnt-donald-sterlings-history-of-sexism-getting-more-attention

“ A 2012 report by ESPN’s Peter Keating, Amanda Younger, and Alyssa Roenick, detailed just how little Sterling thinks of women. A 1996 lawsuit against Sterling by a female former employee alleges that he “touched her in ways that made her uncomfortable and asked her to visit friends of his for sex.”

“ In a 2003 lawsuit against a woman named Alexandra Castro, Sterling testified that he regularly paid Castro for sex and that, “When you pay a woman for sex, you are not together with her…You're paying her for a few moments to use her body for sex." There are also allegations that he's asked female employees to find him masseuses that are willing to give him sexual favors.”

The story details how he'd been sued multiple times by women for sexual harassment, including one former employee who testified in 1996 that she'd been ordered by Sterling to find massage therapists willing to service him sexually. "I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it," Sterling said.

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-donald-sterling-sued-new-lawsuit-sexual-racist-20140602-story.html

Might be time to put down the shovel on this and stop digging Mo. let’s not get into defending hitler just to be contrarian. And just to be clear, Sarver is absolutely a terrible person that deserves every punishment he got and then some, but repeatedly doubling down on this Ill fated argument that he was worse than Sterling is extremely cringe and a bit embarrassing.

[bdm860]

When the Donald Sterling stuff was happening, Mark Cuban said he didn't think the NBA would force Sterling to sell because it would cause a slippery slope.

And what do you know, it wasn't long before the Mavericks had their own problems come to light, with "a longstanding culture of organizational mistreatment of women" that found “numerous instances of sexual harassment and other improper workplace conduct within the Mavericks organization over a period spanning more than twenty years”.  Mark Cuban paid $10m for that one.  This is probably closer to the Sarver situation than the Sterling situation.

And I also think this goes back to why Sarver wasn't forced to sell.  None of the other owners want that slippery slope of forcing to sell over a bad workplace.  And like Roy said, no smoking gun and all.

so we are clear being racist is really bad, but being sexist is ok?  why the double standard?

https://www.kpcc.org/show/take-two/2014-04-29/why-isnt-donald-sterlings-history-of-sexism-getting-more-attention

“ A 2012 report by ESPN’s Peter Keating, Amanda Younger, and Alyssa Roenick, detailed just how little Sterling thinks of women. A 1996 lawsuit against Sterling by a female former employee alleges that he “touched her in ways that made her uncomfortable and asked her to visit friends of his for sex.”

“ In a 2003 lawsuit against a woman named Alexandra Castro, Sterling testified that he regularly paid Castro for sex and that, “When you pay a woman for sex, you are not together with her…You're paying her for a few moments to use her body for sex." There are also allegations that he's asked female employees to find him masseuses that are willing to give him sexual favors.”

The story details how he'd been sued multiple times by women for sexual harassment, including one former employee who testified in 1996 that she'd been ordered by Sterling to find massage therapists willing to service him sexually. "I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it," Sterling said.

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-donald-sterling-sued-new-lawsuit-sexual-racist-20140602-story.html

Might be time to put down the shovel on this and stop digging Mo. let’s not get into defending hitler just to be contrarian. And just to be clear, Sarver is absolutely a terrible person that deserves every punishment he got and then some, but repeatedly doubling down on this Ill fated argument that he was worse than Sterling is extremely cringe and a bit embarrassing.

I think Moranis is asking a fair question, backed up by the authors of the article you provided, "Why isn't Donald Sterling's history of sexism getting more attention?"  Why did the racism get all the attention and not the sexism?  Is one really better/worse than the other?  By the NBA standards, one seems forgivable and one seems unforgivable, should that really be the case?

[nickagneta]

While I think the punishment for Sarver should have been equal to that of Sterling, I am glad it was addressed, unlike the NFL who have hidden what the found on Daniel Snyder, threw Jon Gruden under the bus and have allowed Snyder to go virtually unpunished.

[Kernewek]

And I also think this goes back to why Sarver wasn't forced to sell.  None of the other owners want that slippery slope of forcing to sell over a bad workplace.  And like Roy said, no smoking gun and all.

This is a really good point - but I do think that it’s an interesting study in contrast in some ways because Sarver (and Sterling) is/were cheapskates, whereas Cuban clearly was happy to spend to keep the Mavs competitive, which grants him more goodwill.

[celticsclay]

When the Donald Sterling stuff was happening, Mark Cuban said he didn't think the NBA would force Sterling to sell because it would cause a slippery slope.

And what do you know, it wasn't long before the Mavericks had their own problems come to light, with "a longstanding culture of organizational mistreatment of women" that found “numerous instances of sexual harassment and other improper workplace conduct within the Mavericks organization over a period spanning more than twenty years”.  Mark Cuban paid $10m for that one.  This is probably closer to the Sarver situation than the Sterling situation.

And I also think this goes back to why Sarver wasn't forced to sell.  None of the other owners want that slippery slope of forcing to sell over a bad workplace.  And like Roy said, no smoking gun and all.

so we are clear being racist is really bad, but being sexist is ok?  why the double standard?

https://www.kpcc.org/show/take-two/2014-04-29/why-isnt-donald-sterlings-history-of-sexism-getting-more-attention

“ A 2012 report by ESPN’s Peter Keating, Amanda Younger, and Alyssa Roenick, detailed just how little Sterling thinks of women. A 1996 lawsuit against Sterling by a female former employee alleges that he “touched her in ways that made her uncomfortable and asked her to visit friends of his for sex.”

“ In a 2003 lawsuit against a woman named Alexandra Castro, Sterling testified that he regularly paid Castro for sex and that, “When you pay a woman for sex, you are not together with her…You're paying her for a few moments to use her body for sex." There are also allegations that he's asked female employees to find him masseuses that are willing to give him sexual favors.”

The story details how he'd been sued multiple times by women for sexual harassment, including one former employee who testified in 1996 that she'd been ordered by Sterling to find massage therapists willing to service him sexually. "I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it," Sterling said.

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-donald-sterling-sued-new-lawsuit-sexual-racist-20140602-story.html

Might be time to put down the shovel on this and stop digging Mo. let’s not get into defending hitler just to be contrarian. And just to be clear, Sarver is absolutely a terrible person that deserves every punishment he got and then some, but repeatedly doubling down on this Ill fated argument that he was worse than Sterling is extremely cringe and a bit embarrassing.

I think Moranis is asking a fair question, backed up by the authors of the article you provided, "Why isn't Donald Sterling's history of sexism getting more attention?"  Why did the racism get all the attention and not the sexism?  Is one really better/worse than the other?  By the NBA standards, one seems forgivable and one seems unforgivable, should that really be the case?

Bdm, Im not so sure this is where you want to hitch your wagon. Moranis posted in a way implying Sterling wasn’t also extremely sexist, where in reality his accusation or paying for sex, lawsuits for sexual harassment, asking his staff to find him massage therapists that will let him stick it in holes is all very bad and arguably worse than anything Sarver did. Sterling was both sexist and racist as is Sarver so the nba valuing one over the other is completely irrelevant in this context. An interesting conversation could be had in general over what the nba cares about more, but when Sterling was equal or worse at both it has nothing to do with this.

He also made the argument that he wasn’t sure if Sterling was really racist because he stood by his black gm (a black gm who sued him for being racist lol). As I said Sarver is absolutely a crappy person and a jerk that did bad things. I would have supported a bigger punishment for him. But saying he is worse than Sterling (which was said as an opinion in black and white terms) for the sake of arguing is a bit embarrassing and approaching hitler was better than … style arguments.

I’m willing to give Moranis the benefit of the doubt on his posts that he was not fully aware of all the allegations against Sterling going back to before Danny manning. But now that I have shared them all this I’m gonna cringe at anyone that wants to get into the business of saying Sarver is worse or did worse things than Sterling. I really think that is a bad camp to be in.

It’s also extremely clear that the nba and its players clearly feel Sterling was worse. So yeah.. hopefully this puts to bed that nonsense for the sake of disagreeing.

[Moranis]

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

https://twitter.com/Schultz_Report/status/1569806625782784000?t=SyLHOGJVUZ4GVYFDkAfYiw&s=19

https://twitter.com/YahooSports/status/1569815899187859458?t=LI_HfIFf4o0liFGsUnMwVA&s=19

https://twitter.com/AnnaHorford/status/1569733439800152067?t=HebruXEU_hpkftP58BWAeg&s=19

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569783670205972480?t=fwEVqyZtKMMeFkDK4xLTiA&s=19

Plenty more. I think I'm comfortable with all those people.  Sarver should have been banned for life.  It is disgusting he wasn't. I mean they basically found he committed felonies, but it's ok because he was joking and didn't mean it.  Despicable.

https://twitter.com/MarcJSpears/status/1569743542968516609?t=5mZXSybTeS477oiJsGtQXQ&s=19

[celticsclay]

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569804274284249088?t=64psNti9npzkDA0hRKWQYA&s=19

https://twitter.com/Schultz_Report/status/1569806625782784000?t=SyLHOGJVUZ4GVYFDkAfYiw&s=19

https://twitter.com/YahooSports/status/1569815899187859458?t=LI_HfIFf4o0liFGsUnMwVA&s=19

https://twitter.com/AnnaHorford/status/1569733439800152067?t=HebruXEU_hpkftP58BWAeg&s=19

https://twitter.com/malika_andrews/status/1569783670205972480?t=fwEVqyZtKMMeFkDK4xLTiA&s=19

Plenty more. I think I'm comfortable with all those people.  Sarver should have been banned for life.  It is disgusting he wasn't. I mean they basically found he committed felonies, but it's ok because he was joking and didn't mean it.  Despicable.

https://twitter.com/MarcJSpears/status/1569743542968516609?t=5mZXSybTeS477oiJsGtQXQ&s=19

Mo are you familiar with the term “moving the goal posts?” You literally said he was worse than Sterling and now are saying he deserves the same penalty. Your faux outrage is also a bit humorous for a guy that was literally just defending deshawn Watson a month ago and talking about the sexual assault being non forceful (his conduct not “despicable” cause he plays in Cleveland? Yikes! Worse, some of these tweets aren’t even related to what we are talking about. Anna Horford calls him 100% racist? What does that have to do with the Sterling comparison. You can’t just make noise with links as a way of moving on from insane arguments. You said Sarver is worse than Sterling. Explain it will without the noise and explain that viewpoint because it is highly controversial (and just flat out wrong)


If you want to just disagree with the forum all the time your arguments are not going to be consistent. And that is why you keep twisting yourself in knots. I’ve always been curious what opinions are actually yours but it’s clearly not Watson isn’t that bad Sarver is worst person in world.

[celticsclay]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

[nickagneta]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

[Kernewek]

Agreed with Nick - after a certain point it becomes counterproductive to argue for Sarver, effectively, by pointing out that Sterling was a creep of the highest order (which he was).

[Celtics2021]

Something else that’s important to note about the Sarver situation compared to Sterling: Sarver was given the maximum penalty allowed by the league that doesn’t require a vote of ownership.  Sterling was ousted because there was a smoking gun that angered players to the point of threatening not to play, and public opinion made his continued ownership untenable.  (I believe the vote to oust him never actually happened — it was scheduled but he relented before the vote occurred).

The Sarver story isn’t fully written yet — the question is whether this report spurs a public outcry enough to move Sarver’s fellow owners to pursue the same action as they did against Sterling.  My guess is it won’t — the NBA did Sarver a favor by releasing the report during the off-season right as the NFL kicked off — but if it does, that’s when you’ll start to see momentum towards removing him.

[celticsclay]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

[Kernewek]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

[celticsclay]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

I think you are inadvertently making my exact point here.

[Kernewek]

Sharing this because some of this seems to be forgotten with the passage of time. I really encourage the people equating Sarver and Sterling to read this.

https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-sterling-racist-history-2014-4?amp

Sarver is absolutely a low life and I wouldn’t care if he was forced to sell, but literally committing crimes by refusing to rent properties to blacks or Mexicans, saying they smell, wrongfully evicting them and actively trying to get Koreans In the buildings. All federal crimes. In addition he was having clippers employees hire him prostitutes, having women come into the clippers lockeroom to admire the black bodies of Sam cassel , Elton brand and Corey Magrette. To say nothing of there being an actual recording of what Sterling did. This is stuff very clearly ten times as bad from both a volume of crime or magnitude to what Sarver did. There is a petition to ban Sarver people can sign, but let’s know our history here.

I think they are both scum and since both owned franchises and fostered a working environment where they thought it okay to be either racist, sexist, homophobic or xenophobic, neither deserve to own an NBA franchise.

That they are on different exponential levels of scuminess matters not to me. All that matters to me is that they passed a certain level of scuminess to own a team.

Like I said a few times I would be fine if Sarver couldn’t own the team. However Sterling should be in jail for breaking federal laws and making extremely vulnerable people homeless through wrongful evictions, racist affordable housing practices and being a general slum lord. I guess if a person has the viewpoint of a one guy killed one person and a second person bombed an orphanage that killed 50 they are both terrible. That’s just not how I view things.

[/b]

Do you disagree with the following sentence:

Larry Bird and Paul Pierce were both great basketball players, even though Larry Bird was a better basketball player than Paul Pierce.

I think your inadvertently making my exact point here.

That may be, but if that's the case your point isn't reflected in what you've written. I'm trying to communicate to you that, per your example, the person who kills someone and the person who bombs the orphanage are both terrible - arguing over who is worse is mostly counterproductive.