Author Topic: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks  (Read 20286 times)

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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #90 on: May 19, 2018, 05:51:06 PM »

Offline vjcsmoke

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Rosier and the Sac pick is where the Celtics offer starts. 

Irving, Horford, Hayward, Brown and Tatum are off the table. 

What other pieces does Min want?

If DA could pull that off while keeping Irving, Horford, Brown, and Tatum, he should have a statue built of him and placed inside the TD Garden.  That would be a HELL of a robbery and roster build.

To be able to field Irving, Brown, Tatum, Horford, and Towns on the floor at the same time would be ridiculous!!

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #91 on: May 19, 2018, 05:56:31 PM »

Offline footey

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I see minn trying to trade Wiggins instead of Towns. Package Wiggins and Butler for Kawhi Leonard?

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #92 on: May 19, 2018, 06:06:54 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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It'd be aweso.e to have a star in the mid to low 20s in usage.  We have too much top end talent for 1 guy to be above a 30
Its actually extremely normal for a championship team to have a player with a usage% over 30% and 3 players over 27% usage %.  Just check recent champions for proof.

GS? I cant look it up, but I imagine they play at a much faster pace.  Our pace slowed considerably this season. That could also reflect shots vs time of possession, right? GS does my have anyone pounding the ball
Pretty sure pace has anything to do with usage% so not seeing your point. Knowing your hatred of Kyrie I think this is your way of saying you don't think Kyrie having a usage % over 30% is good for this team but look at last year's GSW championship.

Curry 30.1% usage
Durant 27.8% usage
Thompson 26.1% usage

Now this year's Warriors

Curry 31% usage
Durant 30.4% usage
Thompson 23.7% usage

The Cavs during their championship year

Lebron 31.4% usage
Irving 29.5% usage
Love 23.4% usage

Its just normal to have a couple of stars with high usage(around 30 or more) and then another one or two with good usage (20-28%).

I expect Kyrie to lead this team in usage at over 30% next year and then could see 3 more players with 20-29% usage producing Kyrie being the leading scorer with 2-3(thinking 3)other guys scoring in the 15-21 point per game area.

Pace does seem to be an important factor here.  If usg is the %age of possessions 'used' by a player, and differences in pace allow some teams to have more possessions than others, then two players with the same usage% could have meaningfully different contributing stats (e.g. higher pace - more FGAs).  GS is averaging 7 more possessions per 48 this postseason.

These Celts also differ from GS in other important ways.  GS's youth grew organically, just as ours have so successfully in these playoffs.  By the time they added KD, they were a vet group knowingly making individual sacrifices to win.  The Celts are in a much different position for 2 reasons.  1. A 20 y/o and 21 y/o showing tremendous growth, potential to be the best player(s) on our championship team, and the ability to carry this group to the Finals now; we need to prioritize their growth above all else.   And 2. An even deeper core of offense e threat.  We have a legitimate 6 guys worthy of that usg in the 20s that you mentioned, and that can only be pared down to 4 (incl an AS in Hayward:still 1 more) after you relegate Rozier to the bench and our all star center to a minimal role, and while still relying on both of them to facilitate the offense at times. 

Kyrie is relevant here in that he is the biggest threat to achieving optimal team play with a focus on individual growth, sustainability, and managing egos.  Maybe Terry gets frustrated and demands a trade, but as of now, all our other guys seem to be high in character and team oriented; in fact, I'd argue that while we may have more talent than some expected, it is our defense and high character as a team that is most responsible for this great playoff run.  But Kyrie has the biggest name, a large and evidently fragile ego, and very questionable character to threaten surgery if a trade demand weren't met.  Our success requires adjustment from him, and based on his past behavior, I dont trust that hes capable of that.  Hopefully I'm wrong, though.  If he can put his ego aside, we could won several chips beginning next season.
Here is thedefinition of usage %:
An estimate of the percentage of team plays used by a player while he was on the floor.

It has nothing to due with pace, or number of shots taken per 48. It has to do with the % of plays a player helps to finish while on the floor, like by scoring or getting an assist. So your take on Golden State is irrelevant, especially regarding how they got their players.

The simple fact is the most efficient offenses aren't offenses with a bunch of everyone in the 20% usage. As can be seen in the stats I showed, most championship team have at least one andsometi es two players in the 30% or more range. Why because they have superstars and its the superstars that win championships.

Kyrie isn't going to hurt this offense by having a 30% usage rate because its just common for stars to have a rate that high, even more so for PG stars.

I defined for you above what usage is, as well as how it is affected by pace.  Again, an individual's % of plays out of the total number of plays by a team per 48 (which is 7+ for GS)  That's very straightforward.  Your refusal to consider this and its potential impact on the topic (I went on to discuss several other important factors that very clearly differentiate our situation from GS's) is stubbornness that detracts from the quality of convo.  Many posters here questioned how GS would work with so many stars; our situation next year will be necessarily much more complex and challenging.
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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #93 on: May 19, 2018, 06:14:51 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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It'd be aweso.e to have a star in the mid to low 20s in usage.  We have too much top end talent for 1 guy to be above a 30
Its actually extremely normal for a championship team to have a player with a usage% over 30% and 3 players over 27% usage %.  Just check recent champions for proof.

GS? I cant look it up, but I imagine they play at a much faster pace.  Our pace slowed considerably this season. That could also reflect shots vs time of possession, right? GS does my have anyone pounding the ball
Pretty sure pace has anything to do with usage% so not seeing your point. Knowing your hatred of Kyrie I think this is your way of saying you don't think Kyrie having a usage % over 30% is good for this team but look at last year's GSW championship.

Curry 30.1% usage
Durant 27.8% usage
Thompson 26.1% usage

Now this year's Warriors

Curry 31% usage
Durant 30.4% usage
Thompson 23.7% usage

The Cavs during their championship year

Lebron 31.4% usage
Irving 29.5% usage
Love 23.4% usage

Its just normal to have a couple of stars with high usage(around 30 or more) and then another one or two with good usage (20-28%).

I expect Kyrie to lead this team in usage at over 30% next year and then could see 3 more players with 20-29% usage producing Kyrie being the leading scorer with 2-3(thinking 3)other guys scoring in the 15-21 point per game area.

Pace does seem to be an important factor here.  If usg is the %age of possessions 'used' by a player, and differences in pace allow some teams to have more possessions than others, then two players with the same usage% could have meaningfully different contributing stats (e.g. higher pace - more FGAs).  GS is averaging 7 more possessions per 48 this postseason.

These Celts also differ from GS in other important ways.  GS's youth grew organically, just as ours have so successfully in these playoffs.  By the time they added KD, they were a vet group knowingly making individual sacrifices to win.  The Celts are in a much different position for 2 reasons.  1. A 20 y/o and 21 y/o showing tremendous growth, potential to be the best player(s) on our championship team, and the ability to carry this group to the Finals now; we need to prioritize their growth above all else.   And 2. An even deeper core of offense e threat.  We have a legitimate 6 guys worthy of that usg in the 20s that you mentioned, and that can only be pared down to 4 (incl an AS in Hayward:still 1 more) after you relegate Rozier to the bench and our all star center to a minimal role, and while still relying on both of them to facilitate the offense at times. 

Kyrie is relevant here in that he is the biggest threat to achieving optimal team play with a focus on individual growth, sustainability, and managing egos.  Maybe Terry gets frustrated and demands a trade, but as of now, all our other guys seem to be high in character and team oriented; in fact, I'd argue that while we may have more talent than some expected, it is our defense and high character as a team that is most responsible for this great playoff run.  But Kyrie has the biggest name, a large and evidently fragile ego, and very questionable character to threaten surgery if a trade demand weren't met.  Our success requires adjustment from him, and based on his past behavior, I dont trust that hes capable of that.  Hopefully I'm wrong, though.  If he can put his ego aside, we could won several chips beginning next season.
Here is thedefinition of usage %:
An estimate of the percentage of team plays used by a player while he was on the floor.

It has nothing to due with pace, or number of shots taken per 48. It has to do with the % of plays a player helps to finish while on the floor, like by scoring or getting an assist. So your take on Golden State is irrelevant, especially regarding how they got their players.

The simple fact is the most efficient offenses aren't offenses with a bunch of everyone in the 20% usage. As can be seen in the stats I showed, most championship team have at least one andsometi es two players in the 30% or more range. Why because they have superstars and its the superstars that win championships.

Kyrie isn't going to hurt this offense by having a 30% usage rate because its just common for stars to have a rate that high, even more so for PG stars.

Both the Spurs (5 championships) and the Celtics Big 3 era featured 3-4 core players with usage rates in the 20s. Between the two they contended for something like 15+ years without anyone ever touching 30%.

So yeah, it's a superstar league, but I'm not buying a general rule about high usage and championships.

I didn't propose a general rule.  I provided context as to how our situation will be especially challenging in context of similar teams in recent history.  I added specific reasons as to why I think it will be more challenging based on specific circumstances involving 1 player, all of which are face valid -- ego-driven, defensive weakness that is our strength, character issues.   I regret putting as much thought into these posts when they're immediately dismissed based on the fact that I made the post, personal opinion, or back-slapping among buddies.
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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #94 on: May 19, 2018, 06:19:06 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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It'd be aweso.e to have a star in the mid to low 20s in usage.  We have too much top end talent for 1 guy to be above a 30
Its actually extremely normal for a championship team to have a player with a usage% over 30% and 3 players over 27% usage %.  Just check recent champions for proof.

GS? I cant look it up, but I imagine they play at a much faster pace.  Our pace slowed considerably this season. That could also reflect shots vs time of possession, right? GS does my have anyone pounding the ball
Pretty sure pace has anything to do with usage% so not seeing your point. Knowing your hatred of Kyrie I think this is your way of saying you don't think Kyrie having a usage % over 30% is good for this team but look at last year's GSW championship.

Curry 30.1% usage
Durant 27.8% usage
Thompson 26.1% usage

Now this year's Warriors

Curry 31% usage
Durant 30.4% usage
Thompson 23.7% usage

The Cavs during their championship year

Lebron 31.4% usage
Irving 29.5% usage
Love 23.4% usage

Its just normal to have a couple of stars with high usage(around 30 or more) and then another one or two with good usage (20-28%).

I expect Kyrie to lead this team in usage at over 30% next year and then could see 3 more players with 20-29% usage producing Kyrie being the leading scorer with 2-3(thinking 3)other guys scoring in the 15-21 point per game area.

Pace does seem to be an important factor here.  If usg is the %age of possessions 'used' by a player, and differences in pace allow some teams to have more possessions than others, then two players with the same usage% could have meaningfully different contributing stats (e.g. higher pace - more FGAs).  GS is averaging 7 more possessions per 48 this postseason.

These Celts also differ from GS in other important ways.  GS's youth grew organically, just as ours have so successfully in these playoffs.  By the time they added KD, they were a vet group knowingly making individual sacrifices to win.  The Celts are in a much different position for 2 reasons.  1. A 20 y/o and 21 y/o showing tremendous growth, potential to be the best player(s) on our championship team, and the ability to carry this group to the Finals now; we need to prioritize their growth above all else.   And 2. An even deeper core of offense e threat.  We have a legitimate 6 guys worthy of that usg in the 20s that you mentioned, and that can only be pared down to 4 (incl an AS in Hayward:still 1 more) after you relegate Rozier to the bench and our all star center to a minimal role, and while still relying on both of them to facilitate the offense at times. 

Kyrie is relevant here in that he is the biggest threat to achieving optimal team play with a focus on individual growth, sustainability, and managing egos.  Maybe Terry gets frustrated and demands a trade, but as of now, all our other guys seem to be high in character and team oriented; in fact, I'd argue that while we may have more talent than some expected, it is our defense and high character as a team that is most responsible for this great playoff run.  But Kyrie has the biggest name, a large and evidently fragile ego, and very questionable character to threaten surgery if a trade demand weren't met.  Our success requires adjustment from him, and based on his past behavior, I dont trust that hes capable of that.  Hopefully I'm wrong, though.  If he can put his ego aside, we could won several chips beginning next season.
Here is thedefinition of usage %:
An estimate of the percentage of team plays used by a player while he was on the floor.

It has nothing to due with pace, or number of shots taken per 48. It has to do with the % of plays a player helps to finish while on the floor, like by scoring or getting an assist. So your take on Golden State is irrelevant, especially regarding how they got their players.

The simple fact is the most efficient offenses aren't offenses with a bunch of everyone in the 20% usage. As can be seen in the stats I showed, most championship team have at least one andsometi es two players in the 30% or more range. Why because they have superstars and its the superstars that win championships.

Kyrie isn't going to hurt this offense by having a 30% usage rate because its just common for stars to have a rate that high, even more so for PG stars.

I defined for you above what usage is, as well as how it is affected by pace.  Again, an individual's % of plays out of the total number of plays by a team per 48 (which is 7+ for GS)  That's very straightforward.  Your refusal to consider this and its potential impact on the topic (I went on to discuss several other important factors that very clearly differentiate our situation from GS's, by making it more challenging) is stubbornness that detracts from the quality of convo.

I get your point regarding pace. Obviously the more possessions a team has the more shot attempts are going to be available for all players. A player with a 20% usage rate will have a greater number of possession that end with a qualifying event (shot attempt, assist, turnover) the greater number of possessions they are involved in.

And in that vein, if your point is that by GSW having a higher pace they are more easily able to satisfy the desires of Durant, Curry, and Thompson in getting up what they deem a rightful number of shot attempts, I guess you're right.

But I do not agree with your assertion that any of Boston's players are so selfish that this will be an issue. These are all higher character players (including Kyrie) who have been chosen by Ainge at least in part for this very reason.

And while we're on the topic of being stubborn, it's kind of funny to here those words come from you, when you may be the single most stubborn individual here, at least when it comes to all things Kyrie.   It's not a big deal, I just found it ironic.

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #95 on: May 19, 2018, 06:27:48 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Your definition of usage is wrong. I quoted the definition straight from basketballreference.com. I did a search. Not one site defined it any differently. Pace and per 48 minutes simply has nothing to do with that number. If you are involved in 30 out of 100 plays your usage is 30%. If you are involved in 15 plays out of 50 your usage is 30%. Pace and number of plays have zero to do with the number. If you can't understand that we have nothing else to discuss.

Regarding championship teams and players with 30% usage the following champions all had at least one player at 30% and sometimes two.

2017 GSW
2016 CLE
2015 GSE
2013 MIA
2012 MIA
2011 DAL didn't but Dirk's was over 28%
2010 LAL
2009 LAL
2006 MIA
All the Chicago championships
All the Lakers championships
All the Rockets championships

That's a vast majority of championship teams. Simple fact is having a 30% usage player doesn't mean your offense is worse, like tars claimed Boston would, and most championship teams have at least one player that has that usage rate.

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #96 on: May 19, 2018, 06:29:50 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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Back to the thread topic. I posted these earlier -- thoughts?

The Cs could offer a "rebuild" package around Rozier, Yabusele, the Kings pick, Memphis pick, etc., but again, I think they'd (Wolves) rather have a proven talent.

The only way I could see something happening would be to rope in a third team, sending the Kings pick and Yabusele to them for a proven two-way starter. That brings me to my trade ideas. Not sure any of these trades are legit, but with the number of stars that are unhappy, it may be a bit easier to orchestrate a trade to get them in a deal like this.

Celtics get KAT
Pistons get Teague, Yabusele and the Kings pick
Wolves get Rozier, Drummond, and Memphis Pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Wall, Yabusele
Wizards get Rozier, Teague, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Lillard, Memphis pick, Clippers pick
Blazers get Rozier, Teague, Yabusele, Kings pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Aldridge, Leonard
Spurs get Teague, Rozier, Yabusele, Dieng, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #97 on: May 19, 2018, 06:35:11 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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back-slapping among buddies.

This isn't really a fair statement at all.

I can assure you that while Nick and I are friends, we most certainly are not doing any back-slapping here. We've had plenty of disagrements on a wide range of topics over the years (especially when it comes to politics). Nick has also never been reticent to take his moderator duties seriously when he's felt necessary in regards to anyone here, even his friends (I've been reprimanded a few times by him recently - even though I disagreed on the necessity of it).

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #98 on: May 19, 2018, 06:40:10 PM »

Offline byennie

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I didn't propose a general rule.  I provided context as to how our situation will be especially challenging in context of similar teams in recent history.  I added specific reasons as to why I think it will be more challenging based on specific circumstances involving 1 player, all of which are face valid -- ego-driven, defensive weakness that is our strength, character issues.   I regret putting as much thought into these posts when they're immediately dismissed based on the fact that I made the post, personal opinion, or back-slapping among buddies.

That's fine, but I disagree that it's problematic, specifically because:

* SAS and previous BOS teams are two very relevant comps that thrived
* CLE is a completely different situation
* There really is no "normal" to go by here at all, i.e. I don't put too much stock into one team (GS)
* The majority of our roster appears to be made up of strong-minded, team-oriented guys behind a great organization

My response has zero to do with you personally, and I have no "buddies" in this thread. I'm not on here enough to have a clue what your posting history is like or gang up on anyone.

Please don't dismiss my posts as "personal opinion" and "back-slapping" and suppose that yours are so much more thoughtful, thanks.

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #99 on: May 19, 2018, 06:48:00 PM »

Offline Monkhouse

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Back to the thread topic. I posted these earlier -- thoughts?

The Cs could offer a "rebuild" package around Rozier, Yabusele, the Kings pick, Memphis pick, etc., but again, I think they'd (Wolves) rather have a proven talent.

The only way I could see something happening would be to rope in a third team, sending the Kings pick and Yabusele to them for a proven two-way starter. That brings me to my trade ideas. Not sure any of these trades are legit, but with the number of stars that are unhappy, it may be a bit easier to orchestrate a trade to get them in a deal like this.

Celtics get KAT
Pistons get Teague, Yabusele and the Kings pick
Wolves get Rozier, Drummond, and Memphis Pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Wall, Yabusele
Wizards get Rozier, Teague, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Lillard, Memphis pick, Clippers pick
Blazers get Rozier, Teague, Yabusele, Kings pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Aldridge, Leonard
Spurs get Teague, Rozier, Yabusele, Dieng, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

The Spurs could possibly give up Aldridge, but it wouldn't make any sense to trade Aldridge for Towns unless MIN totally gets Kawhi. I just don't see the Spurs giving up both. Rozier is an excellent player, and once he's able to be given the keys to the offense. Murray, and Rozier will be a deadly but slightly undersized back court, that can use their speed and length to disrupt players.

This is the only trade that makes sense.

Wizards/Blazers aren't trading their best star point guards... If anything Beal or McCollum are on their way out basically, if they were trade fodder.

Pistons makes sense, but why would MIN want an inferior center that is a great player, but do the Pistons really want to rebuild right now?
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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #100 on: May 19, 2018, 06:52:47 PM »

Offline Monkhouse

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Thibs is a great defensive minded coach, but he does not know how to get his players to buy into his system and his offense. Look at Wiggins. He is just out of control. I see him getting traded first, and as some previous poster mentioned... KAT is a young and upcoming star. He has the tools and potential to be a top 3 center by next year. He can shoot, he can rebound, and he can pass. I would've said before he got drafted, I followed his career and Ballislife highlights, and from what I've seen and gathered. He plays sort of like a more finesse version of Kevin Love, minus the ability to be more efficient, and a little taller.

Under Stevens, I could see him averaging 20/11/4-5 APG, and those are out of world numbers to put next to Horford, who as others have mentioned have that Dominican connection. I actually believe KAT would be better off suited as the 4, and you can allow Horford and KAT to switch on defense. They both have the body type to be flexible, and I really don't think Thibs knows how to coach KAT. He seems lost and disinterested in offense most of the time, and looks asleep on defense. Something Stevens would absurdly refuse to accept.
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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #101 on: May 19, 2018, 06:53:31 PM »

Offline JHTruth

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Meh don't see the need to trade for him. Wait to see if he improves his D then go after him in FA. We will still be a very attractive destination

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #102 on: May 19, 2018, 06:53:48 PM »

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Back to the thread topic. I posted these earlier -- thoughts?

The Cs could offer a "rebuild" package around Rozier, Yabusele, the Kings pick, Memphis pick, etc., but again, I think they'd (Wolves) rather have a proven talent.

The only way I could see something happening would be to rope in a third team, sending the Kings pick and Yabusele to them for a proven two-way starter. That brings me to my trade ideas. Not sure any of these trades are legit, but with the number of stars that are unhappy, it may be a bit easier to orchestrate a trade to get them in a deal like this.

Celtics get KAT
Pistons get Teague, Yabusele and the Kings pick
Wolves get Rozier, Drummond, and Memphis Pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Wall, Yabusele
Wizards get Rozier, Teague, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Lillard, Memphis pick, Clippers pick
Blazers get Rozier, Teague, Yabusele, Kings pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Aldridge, Leonard
Spurs get Teague, Rozier, Yabusele, Dieng, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Yeah, I also originally thought a 3-team trade would have to occur for this to happen.

I was trying to see if there could be one involving Memphis, Minnesota and Boston, or Orlando, Minnesota and Boston (with #4 or #6 picks, respectively, going to Minnesota in package)

But these are some solid ideas. TP and Good work!

I like the Detroit one and think that could happen. San Antonio as well if they truly do trade Kawhi (they get a Kings ransom, MIN gets a superstar, and we get Towns). I doubt SAS gives up BOTH Aldridge and Kawhi though. They keep Aldridge instead of giving him up for Dieng essentially.

I don't think Portland and Washington are as likely since I predict they stubbornly hold on to Lilliard/Wall and instead deal Beal or McCollum.
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Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #103 on: May 19, 2018, 07:23:29 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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Back to the thread topic. I posted these earlier -- thoughts?

The Cs could offer a "rebuild" package around Rozier, Yabusele, the Kings pick, Memphis pick, etc., but again, I think they'd (Wolves) rather have a proven talent.

The only way I could see something happening would be to rope in a third team, sending the Kings pick and Yabusele to them for a proven two-way starter. That brings me to my trade ideas. Not sure any of these trades are legit, but with the number of stars that are unhappy, it may be a bit easier to orchestrate a trade to get them in a deal like this.

Celtics get KAT
Pistons get Teague, Yabusele and the Kings pick
Wolves get Rozier, Drummond, and Memphis Pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Wall, Yabusele
Wizards get Rozier, Teague, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Lillard, Memphis pick, Clippers pick
Blazers get Rozier, Teague, Yabusele, Kings pick

Celtics get KAT
Wolves get Aldridge, Leonard
Spurs get Teague, Rozier, Yabusele, Dieng, Kings pick, Memphis pick, Clippers pick

The Spurs could possibly give up Aldridge, but it wouldn't make any sense to trade Aldridge for Towns unless MIN totally gets Kawhi. I just don't see the Spurs giving up both. Rozier is an excellent player, and once he's able to be given the keys to the offense. Murray, and Rozier will be a deadly but slightly undersized back court, that can use their speed and length to disrupt players.

This is the only trade that makes sense.

Wizards/Blazers aren't trading their best star point guards... If anything Beal or McCollum are on their way out basically, if they were trade fodder.

Pistons makes sense, but why would MIN want an inferior center that is a great player, but do the Pistons really want to rebuild right now?

Thanks for the input.

I agree that the Detroit trade might be questionable. Drummond is an elite defensive anchor (numbers don't lie) with a budding offensive skill set. Next to Butler and behind Wiggins they would be a really good defense. If they think Rozier has higher upside than Teague, then Rozier gets them younger with more explosive potential. He is also a much better defender than Teague, which is needed in the West. Minny would probably need/want one more solid rotation piece to get it done.

I think both Wall and Lillard are gonna force their way out of Washington and Portland soon enough -- I included those trades with that assumption. The competition for Lillard would probably be Philly (with Fultz/Saric/picks), but I think both teams get good value back in this deal for guys that are second tier point guards in the NBA. You could argue that the Wizards would be a better team and have picks to fill out the roster with more depth or trade for a big. The Blazers are not better with this trade, but they need to push the reset/rebuild button soon anyway. This trade gives them the ability to do so quickly.

For the Spurs, it's about a rebuild more than anything. They get picks and young talent and get off of Aldridges big contract. Rozier-Murray-Yab-Bertans-??? is not a bad young core, and they get some valuable picks next year to retool quickly. In the end, they probably want more to make this work, and that's where the trade breaks down.

Re: Whoa, Karl-Anthony Towns "Frustrated", Possibly To Be In Trade Talks
« Reply #104 on: May 19, 2018, 08:08:34 PM »

Online Phantom255x

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I see minn trying to trade Wiggins instead of Towns. Package Wiggins and Butler for Kawhi Leonard?

Trade Wiggins for Kevin Love! Problems solved...  :P :laugh:
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