Half baked trade idea

[td450]

Simmons is damaged goods, but even in that state, he plugs in some really important stuff to a team.

In the end, can you pay a guy $37M or $40M if he can't play at the end of games? That's tough, but he would make us a defensive monster, he'd speed us up in transition, he'd add a ton of passing skill, and he'd rebound. We'd still have Langford and Nesmith. We'd still have Robert Williams, Al, and Moses Brown up front. We would be OK with a bigger guard that could just spot 3's and play defense. We might even be able to start Nesmith, because Simmons and Al are that good at passing.

My main concern is he can't play at the end of games. But we would be a very tough team to beat, especially if Nesmith and Langford evolved. It would probably be worth the risk, even if Simmons can't fix anything. And if he could just become a competent foul shooter, whoah!

[Sophomore]

“ In the end, can you pay a guy $37M or $40M if he can't play at the end of games?”

This is it. And it’s four more years. So when Tatum is deciding what to do when he becomes an unrestricted free agent, you are going to be tethered to this guy. If Simmons shrinks in the playoffs - doesn’t show something he hasn’t shown so far - I bet the grass is going to look greener somewhere else.

[RPGenerate]

The defences of Simmons are hilarious.

Very much so. You can't have watched this last series against the Hawks and want him anywhere close to the Celtics. You just can't.

[tonydelk]

Not a fully fledged concept but just a forum gauge,

76ers: Tristin Thompson, Marcus Smart, Payton Prichard, 2 future 1st round picks (protected)

Celtics: Ben Simmons

I'm sure Boston fans say no and 76ers fans say no but it intrigues me given how much of a distressed asset Simmons has become. I believe most of his regression is mental and he has been playing out of position since his sophomore year. Perhaps with a fresh start he would be willing to switch shooting hands and push himself to prove everyone wrong (e.g Nash to Phoenix).

Horford
Tatum
Brown
Nesmith
Simmons

Even though this line up has Ben Simmons at point guard, if the ball isn't his in his hands he operates as a false centre in the post with the rest of the starting five as shooters around him.

Simmons is an enigma.  Unreal Defense.  Unreal Vision.  Horrible Shooter outside of 5 ft.  The game today is about spacing and shooting.  You can't have more then 1 player on the court that can't shoot.  Simmons is a good player.  He's not a max player because 50% of the game he is horrible at.  He's not even a scorer.  A scorer finds ways to get the ball in the basket.  Simmons could score a lot more then he does but has the Jeff Green mentality.  Until he decides he's the best player on the court and no one can stop in driving to the hoop he will never be a star.  Gianns isn't a good shooter.  He is an amazing scorer though and thus why he's one the of best players in the game.  He has the mentality to be a beast and feels no one can stop him.

[johnnygreen]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them? Just because a player is tall, that can also dribble and pass, doesn’t mean he should be compared to Magic, an all-time great. Simmons is just different, and it should be embraced by the team that has him, who is more of a highbred power forward. He shouldn’t be used as a traditional PG at the top of the key, as why would you take a 6’11” guy away from the rim that can’t shoot from the outside. He should be in a ball motion type of offense, where he can get layups on back cuts or alley oops. The other option would be to have him set up the offense when getting the ball on the block. I would absolutely be interested in trading for Simmons.

I doubt this would work, but one quick idea:

Boston: Ben Simmons
Philly: CJ McCollum
Portland: Marcus Smart, Tristan Thompson, Aaron Nesmith.

[jambr380]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them? Just because a player is tall, that can also dribble and pass, doesn’t mean he should be compared to Magic, an all-time great. Simmons is just different, and it should be embraced by the team that has him, who is more of a highbred power forward. He shouldn’t be used as a traditional PG at the top of the key, as why would you take a 6’11” guy away from the rim that can’t shoot from the outside. He should be in a ball motion type of offense, where he can get layups on back cuts or alley oops. The other option would be to have him set up the offense when getting the ball on the block. I would absolutely be interested in trading for Simmons.

I doubt this would work, but one quick idea:

Boston: Ben Simmons
Philly: CJ McCollum
Portland: Marcus Smart, Tristan Thompson, Aaron Nesmith.

I still like him as a ball-handler, but maybe not full-time. I'd really like to see him with a playmaking/shooting Big like Jokic. Funny enough, Horford fits the bill, as well - just not when he was a PF alongside Embiid.

I can't believe people wouldn't give up Smart/TT/young guy/picks for Simmons, though. Before the series, we were talking about whether or not we would need to give up Brown for him. His skillset should be embraced, but channeled in a certain direction. Our offense and defense would benefit a great deal with someone like Simmons on our team...and, frankly, I like that he is signed long-term.

[Sophomore]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them? Just because a player is tall, that can also dribble and pass, doesn’t mean he should be compared to Magic, an all-time great. Simmons is just different, and it should be embraced by the team that has him, who is more of a highbred power forward. He shouldn’t be used as a traditional PG at the top of the key, as why would you take a 6’11” guy away from the rim that can’t shoot from the outside. He should be in a ball motion type of offense, where he can get layups on back cuts or alley oops. The other option would be to have him set up the offense when getting the ball on the block. I would absolutely be interested in trading for Simmons.

I doubt this would work, but one quick idea:

Boston: Ben Simmons
Philly: CJ McCollum
Portland: Marcus Smart, Tristan Thompson, Aaron Nesmith.

I still like him as a ball-handler, but maybe not full-time. I'd really like to see him with a playmaking/shooting Big like Jokic. Funny enough, Horford fits the bill, as well - just not when he was a PF alongside Embiid.

I can't believe people wouldn't give up Smart/TT/young guy/picks for Simmons, though. Before the series, we were talking about whether or not we would need to give up Brown for him. His skillset should be embraced, but channeled in a certain direction. Our offense and defense would benefit a great deal with someone like Simmons on our team...and, frankly, I like that he is signed long-term.

Not sure who “we” is here. I, for one, would not for a heartbeat have considered sending Philly Jaylen Brown for Simmons.

[Celtics2021]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them? Just because a player is tall, that can also dribble and pass, doesn’t mean he should be compared to Magic, an all-time great. Simmons is just different, and it should be embraced by the team that has him, who is more of a highbred power forward. He shouldn’t be used as a traditional PG at the top of the key, as why would you take a 6’11” guy away from the rim that can’t shoot from the outside. He should be in a ball motion type of offense, where he can get layups on back cuts or alley oops. The other option would be to have him set up the offense when getting the ball on the block. I would absolutely be interested in trading for Simmons.

I doubt this would work, but one quick idea:

Boston: Ben Simmons
Philly: CJ McCollum
Portland: Marcus Smart, Tristan Thompson, Aaron Nesmith.

I still like him as a ball-handler, but maybe not full-time. I'd really like to see him with a playmaking/shooting Big like Jokic. Funny enough, Horford fits the bill, as well - just not when he was a PF alongside Embiid.

I can't believe people wouldn't give up Smart/TT/young guy/picks for Simmons, though. Before the series, we were talking about whether or not we would need to give up Brown for him. His skillset should be embraced, but channeled in a certain direction. Our offense and defense would benefit a great deal with someone like Simmons on our team...and, frankly, I like that he is signed long-term.

If Simmons made what Smart makes, sure.  But he makes more than double that, which is something that can’t be ignored.  He’s simply not worth his salary at this point, and there’s four more years of it.   Maybe you can figure out how to use him better, but he’s been the exact same player going back to college.  The lack of growth is really concerning, and I’d question how receptive he’d be to coaching that told him to do something remotely out of his comfort zone.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

The warriors will get him and he will help them win a championship.

Any smart organization knows the impact Simmons has, especially with his defense. Make jokes all you want, but he will win a championship before embiid.

He’s a perfect fit next to the js and horford. Got to get him if someone the Cs could put together a package that would entice the sizers.

[RPGenerate]

The warriors will get him and he will help them win a championship.

Any smart organization knows the impact Simmons has, especially with his defense. Make jokes all you want, but he will win a championship before embiid.

He’s a perfect fit next to the js and horford. Got to get him if someone the Cs could put together a package that would entice the sizers.

Winning a championship??? How about he start with actually being able to play 4th quarters of playoff games.

[Ilikesports17]

The warriors will get him and he will help them win a championship.

Any smart organization knows the impact Simmons has, especially with his defense. Make jokes all you want, but he will win a championship before embiid.

He’s a perfect fit next to the js and horford. Got to get him if someone the Cs could put together a package that would entice the sizers.

He’s afraid to shoot the basketball. He’s a great on ball defender and good in transition. But he makes Marcus smart look like Steph curry in the half court right now.

He has absolutely crippling mental issues. If those can be solved then he’s a very good player, but 5 years in the league and not an ounce of improvement on the offensive side. Does he care enough to fix this?

[PAOBoston]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them?

I was thinking about this in the AM. It’s either really really really bad luck or there’s something organizationally there with this. Both those guys were super hyped. Both literally forgot how to shoot to the point of being absolute zeros on offense. I know the internet is piling on Simmons but the guy is mental toast right now. For his career, he needs a reset somewhere that is not Philly. I think he’s a good player, albeit overpaid at this point for what he brings. I do think there is something more to be unlocked with him that Philly has utterly failed to bring out.

[johnnygreen]

How can one team draft two consecutive consensus number 1 picks (Simmons 2016, Fultz 2017), and both become head cases that can’t shoot, once Philly gets their hands on them?

I was thinking about this in the AM. It’s either really really really bad luck or there’s something organizationally there with this. Both those guys were super hyped. Both literally forgot how to shoot to the point of being absolute zeros on offense. I know the internet is piling on Simmons but the guy is mental toast right now. For his career, he needs a reset somewhere that is not Philly. I think he’s a good player, albeit overpaid at this point for what he brings. I do think there is something more to be unlocked with him that Philly has utterly failed to bring out.

Since he's been in Orlando, Fultz has looked like a completely different player from his Philly days. Simmons desperately needs a change in scenery too.

[Who]

Smart is every bit a great defensive force in the backcourt as Simmons.

I do not concur with your assertion that Smart is as impactful as Simmons on defense, and I expect Smart to continue to degrade as a top defender as he ages, while Simmons remains a 1st team all defense level player.

This post is mostly a side note / discussion on Smart rather than about Simmons. That is why I cut out the rest of the two previous comments for just the Smart bit I was interested in.

I am worried about this too. I feel like Stevens should be looking for an opportunity to sell high on Smart before that decline starts to set in.

Big difference between being 6-3 and 6-10 and an equally big difference in quickness relative to size (Simmons has elite quickness for a big guy, Smart does not for a 6-3 guard). Ben Simmons will be able to maintain high level defense for a much long time. I also agree Simmons is much better now as well as likely to age much better defensively.

I am not sure Smart will be able to do so. Already we are seeing cracks appear in his D especially last season.

The guy I compare Smart too most is Ron Artest because their body types remind me so much of one another. Artest managed to maintain elite on the ball one-on-one man D for a long time but his team D fell off earlier and he struggled to chase quicker wings off the ball and through screens as he aged (moving all that extra weight / muscle around).

Watching Smart at times last season reminded me of that - those years where Artest started to drop off as a defender. It made me nervous.

It also made me more open to moving Smart in a trade (in general, not necessarily for Simmons).

[Rondo9]

Smart was also struggling with a major injury last season which obviously affected his quickness. I don't think a condensed and injury riddled season should be used to condemn him as being on the decline especially when he's 27. Also the ENTIRE defense for the Celtics was bad, not just Marcus Smart.