Author Topic: Where does our off-season rank?  (Read 1047 times)

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Where does our off-season rank?
« on: August 11, 2022, 09:02:36 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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In terms of improving a title contender, I'd put us at the top.  David Aldridge mostly agrees, ranking us third:

https://theathletic.com/3480581/2022/08/11/nba-best-offseason-moves-3/

Quote
3. Boston Celtics
2021-22 record: 51-31; lost in NBA Finals

Added: G Malcolm Brogdon (acquired from Indiana); F Danilo Gallinari (two years, $13.2M); G JD Davison (second round, 53rd pick); F Mfiondu Kabengele (two-way)

Lost: C Daniel Theis (traded to Indiana); F Aaron Nesmith (traded to Indiana); G Nik Stauskas (traded to Indiana); F Malik Fitts (traded to Indiana); F Juwan Morgan (traded to Indiana); 2023 first-round pick (traded to Indiana)

Retained: C Luke Kornet (two years, $4.5M); F Sam Hauser (three years, $5.6M)

Extended: None

Returning from Injury: None

The Skinny: Getting better minutes on the ball than the Celtics got in the finals from Marcus Smart was key, and acquiring Brogdon should shore that up. This isn’t a criticism of Smart, who is as vital to Boston as Jayson Tatum or Jaylen Brown; it’s just a recognition of his limitations as a playmaker. He’s a scorer with the ball. Brogdon can score but is much more impactful as a team’s quarterback. The two of them could actually be terrific together in smaller-ball lineups with Brown at the three. (That is, uh, if Brown isn’t moved for Kevin Durant — which, by the way, would be a no-brainer move for Boston. How is this even controversial?) And Brogdon will only enhance Boston’s best-in-the-league defense. Gallinari still showed some offensive pop with the Hawks, and Lord knows Boston could use more consistent scoring in reserve.

He's got two teams ahead of us, though:  Atlanta and Philly.

As a reminder:

Quote from: Atlanta Hawks
Added: G Dejounte Murray (acquired from San Antonio); F Maurice Harkless (acquired from Sacramento); G Justin Holiday (acquired from Sacramento); C Frank Kaminsky (one year, $2.4M); G Aaron Holiday (one year, $1.9M); F A.J. Griffin (first round, 16th pick); G Tyrese Martin (draft rights acquired from Golden State); 2024 first-round pick (acquired from Sacramento)

Lost: F Danilo Gallinari (traded to San Antonio); G Kevin Huerter (traded to Sacramento); C Jock Landale (traded to Phoenix after being acquired from San Antonio); G Delon Wright (signed with Washington); F Kevin Knox (signed with Detroit); F/C Gorgui Dieng (signed with San Antonio); G Sharife Cooper (waived); G Ryan Rollins (draft rights traded to Golden State); 2023 first-round pick (traded to San Antonio via Charlotte); 2025, 2027 first-round picks (traded to San Antonio); 2026 first-round pick (swap rights traded to San Antonio)

Quote from: Philadelphia 76ers
Added: F P.J. Tucker (three years, $33.3M); G Danuel House Jr. (two years, $8.4M); F De’Anthony Melton (acquired from Memphis); G Trevelin Queen (two years, $3.5M); F Michael Foster Jr. (Exhibit 10)

Lost: G Danny Green (traded to Memphis); C DeAndre Jordan (signed with Denver); F David Roddy (draft rights traded to Memphis)

Agree?
« Last Edit: August 11, 2022, 09:26:53 AM by Roy H. »


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Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2022, 09:12:42 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I'd say the Clippers and Nuggets definitely improved the most as title contenders but that is merely because their injured players are presumed to be back. 

Accounting for actual off season moves, I'd put Boston ahead of Philly, though behind Atlanta.  I'd also put Minnesota ahead of Boston.  The future price of Gobert was huge, but the immediate this season impact should be greater for them than Brogdon or Gallinari are for the C's.  So I'd have Boston at 3, but with Atlanta and Minnesota ahead of them.  I think a guy like Brunson going to NY also could have a greater impact on the Knicks than Boston's moves, but I don't consider the Knicks anywhere near the same level of team so I wouldn't have them high up on the list.    Also, to be clear, I don't think Atlanta or Minnesota are better than Boston, just that their moves would have a greater impact on winning.
I was finally wrong. Boston not only didn't win in 5, but didn't win at all.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2022, 09:25:15 AM »

Online Vermont Green

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Atlanta got some decent players in and one really good player (Murray) but they had a lot go out.  As compared to Boston, we got Brogdon and Gallinari in but didn't lose much.  That is a lot of turnover for ATL to deal with.  On net, I give Boston the edge, based on what we didn't give up.

And all Philly really added was PJ Tucker.  A nice add but I don't think he changes their trajectory all that much.  Of these 3, I have them clearly third.

I am very happy with what Boston was able to do.  I agree though that Denver may improve the most based on getting injured players back.  But if the question is which team improved the most just based on moves, I give it to Boston.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2022, 09:26:00 AM »

Online Celtics2021

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I’d put us ahead of Atlanta.  They paid a steep cost for Murray and got back much less for Huerter (the first from Sacramento is initially lottery-protected and caps out at top-10 protected, so coming from SAC it is far from a given to convey).  Atlanta is also still in the tax, where they don’t want to end up, so they’re likely to make a cost-cutting move in the future.

I’d also put us ahead of Philly, although I get the argument that they added three rotation players at the cost of only a 1st, whereas we added two rotation players at the cost of a 1st and one rotation player.  I think Brogdon is better than Tucker and Gallo better than Melton, while the extra player added in House and lost in Theis is too marginal to make up.

I also don’t think getting guys back from injuries counts as an off-season move, especially since we haven’t seen them on the court to know how recovered they are.  So no points from me on that.


Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2022, 10:23:06 AM »

Online Csfan1984

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I can see Hawks being number one they added the biggest name player that "fits". A 2nd option level guy that still defends.

Boston is two. As Brogdon could start if the C's wanted. Gallo at the 4 or as a stretch five is a great bench option. Still hoping C's add a more.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2022, 10:23:53 AM »

Online Vermont Green

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I'd say the Clippers and Nuggets definitely improved the most as title contenders but that is merely because their injured players are presumed to be back. 

Accounting for actual off season moves, I'd put Boston ahead of Philly, though behind Atlanta.  I'd also put Minnesota ahead of Boston.  The future price of Gobert was huge, but the immediate this season impact should be greater for them than Brogdon or Gallinari are for the C's.  So I'd have Boston at 3, but with Atlanta and Minnesota ahead of them.  I think a guy like Brunson going to NY also could have a greater impact on the Knicks than Boston's moves, but I don't consider the Knicks anywhere near the same level of team so I wouldn't have them high up on the list.    Also, to be clear, I don't think Atlanta or Minnesota are better than Boston, just that their moves would have a greater impact on winning.

I am not that high on Brunson.  I don't think he will be quite the disappointment that Fournier was for example, but I don't think Brunson is a better addition than Brogdon.  And we are talking about the Knicks here, these kind of deals never seem to work out for them.

Fair point on Gobert.  He should make a legitimate impact on the Wolves who are already a team flirting with being actually good.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2022, 12:27:00 PM »

Offline Who

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Atlanta had a terrible summer. Dejounte Murray does not fit their team at all. They've messed up everything.

Philly had an okay summer. The D-Melton pickup is really good. Not as big on PJ Tucker who is old and slow. They needed a genuine wing player; someone with footspeed. Not a slow footed undersized forward. Still, something is better than nothing. So a good summer but nothing special.

Boston had a special summer. Brogdon is a huge pickup. He is a near All-Star caliber player. He is the 3rd option BOS needed to put behind the two Jays. He finishes the team. He completes the team. He makes BOS the team to beat in the East. It was a phenomenal offseason.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2022, 12:27:04 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I’m curious how Leonard, Porter and Murray look. It’s been a long time since they played much basketball.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2022, 02:37:08 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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I'd say arguably #1. 


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Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2022, 04:31:23 AM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

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Money talks: We’re the Vegas favorites to win the title. A great off-season turning Theis/Nesmith into Brogdon/Gallinari. In Brad We Trust.

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2022, 06:54:06 AM »

Online SHAQATTACK

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Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2022, 07:26:50 AM »

Offline CelticsWhat35

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If it’s about “title contenders”, why are the Hawks even on the list?  They were barely above .500 last year.  Yes, they got an all-star without having to give up a whole lot, but what has Murray ever done in the league to impact winning?  Him and Young together might be exciting to watch, but I don’t see that team at all as a title contender

Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2022, 07:44:25 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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If it’s about “title contenders”, why are the Hawks even on the list?  They were barely above .500 last year.  Yes, they got an all-star without having to give up a whole lot, but what has Murray ever done in the league to impact winning?  Him and Young together might be exciting to watch, but I don’t see that team at all as a title contender

Aldridge looked at all teams; I haven't really analyzed all of the lottery teams that arguably improved 10 or 15 games, so I couched my rankings in terms of contenders.  Others will use playoff teams, etc.


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Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2022, 02:31:31 PM »

Offline ozgod

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I don't know about where exactly we rank but I think we've had a solid offseason. Our biggest need after the season was a stronger bench, particularly a ball handling combo guard/wing that could also defend 1-4 (or 1-5 depending) and a big. We filled the first need with probably the best player available and while we didn't get a big name traditional big to back up Al and Timelord Gallo allows us to play one-big lineups defensively. I can't complain about our offseason at all.
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Re: Where does our off-season rank?
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2022, 05:36:39 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Comfortably #1. Atlanta added a big name (a player who I am generally a huge fan of), but the fit just makes no sense to me. None whatsoever.

Philly added some role players, but all significantly worse than Brogdon.