Shams: Celtics acquire Josh Richardson for Moses Brown

[liam]

With the Celtics now above the tax line and only a few million below the apron, a sign-and-trade is highly unlikely.  There’s just not the flexibility without moving a large salary.

Most likely outcome would seem to be they use the 6 million taxpayer exception and call it a day, or close too it. Rumors that Dunn could be moved again as well.

One reasonable scenario I could think of for a S&T for Lonzo would be something based around Smart. If NOLA was able to land Lowry, I could see them being potentially interested in a S&T with Lonzo based around Smart and Romeo/G Williams for around $80M/4 years. That'd be a really interesting lineup for them in Lowry, Smart, Ingram, Zion, and Hayes. They probably compete for homecourt advantage in the playoffs and potentially take a series or two barring health concerns.

For us, it'd kill two birds with one stone - figure out the Smart situation and get our long-term PG that seemingly fits well with the Jays and is on their timeline. Though, the question is whether that move is better than just keeping the space for the possibility of a Beal, Kawhi, etc. next summer.

Sure, thats possible. Smart is at 13.8 next year. If you get Lonzo at 4/80 that would start at roughly like 18.5 a year so you're adding 5 million to your books which is right around what they currently have below the apron. If they then moved on from Dunn's money they could also still use the taxpayer MLE and stay below the hard cap (it would bne VERY tight).

I guess I just have a somewhat hard time seeing them tie up their longer-term flexibility that way. But it depends on how much you like Lonzo Ball i guess. I like him, I don't know if i 4/80 like him.

Definitely. Also depends upon what the thought is about who they have a legitimate chance to get next year. Beal seems like an obvious target, but while that class is loaded, I don't see too many other big names that would potentially move and come here. Leonard? Potentially. Curry? Doubt he leaves his legacy in GS. Lavine? Possibly, but is he really a good fit next to the Jays? I don't see KD, Kyrie, or Harden leaving, and I don't really want any of them here anyways.

Beal seems like the main target given his obvious connections to Tatum. But to be honest, while Beal is undoubtedly the better player over Lonzo, I'm skeptical of the fit of all three of Brown, Beal, and Tatum together. Don't think their styles fit that well together. I think someone like Lonzo would fit much better next to the Jays and play a "Jrue-type" third wheel role behind the main two in Tatum and Brown. It'd also not waste another year and be significantly cheaper to have Lonzo, leaving more money to fill out the rest of the roster.

Is it naive to think that Tatum knows whether Beal is coming or not?

I don't think he knows.  Washington doesn't know if they are trading him yet, how would they know where they are trading him too already?
He isn't an UFA until 2023.

I thought he could opt out in 2022?

[PAOBoston]

I don't see ball coming here.  These deals were about getting expiring contracts and keeping cap flexibility for next year.  The cs have better depth, defense and scoring to compete next year.  The did not add any long term salary but are better today vs how they ended the season.  Wasn't the ideal route but it worked.  I'd be shocked at a ball deal and IMO they are setting themselves up for Beal.  If they knew they didn't have a shot at Beal they would have no issue adding long term salary on pieces that fit with the js.  I would like to see a move clearing Edward's for yam but barring another deal it seems yam is stuck overseas for 1 more year.

Sorry, but how are they better offensively? The team literally has two good offensive players. Thts pretty much it right now.

I could listen to arguments as to how Horford, Richardson, improved young guys (PP, Nessie, Romeo), an adjusted Jabari Parker + whatever free agents or further trades we make is better for our offence than Kemba, Tristan Thompson and whoever we would have picked at 16 + those improved young guys. The ability to add more with our TPE and MLE could only enhance that.

I also think Kemba might be addition by subtraction. Replacing an injury-prone shoot-first guard with a high-post passing big who can shoot will open things up for us

Horford is 35. Richardson is coming off a sub par two years. Romeo is a nobody and has shown no signs of an actual offensive game. Parker is not good either. Over the last two years, Cs lost Hayward and Kemba and have not replaced them. And now they are likely losing Fournier. God forbid if anything happen to JB or JT or this team is literally a lottery team as it is comprised right now. Thankfully plenty of time to make more moves obviously but will be very curious to see what PBS does. Thinks there’s a lot more moves coming.

[keevsnick]

With the Celtics now above the tax line and only a few million below the apron, a sign-and-trade is highly unlikely.  There’s just not the flexibility without moving a large salary.

Most likely outcome would seem to be they use the 6 million taxpayer exception and call it a day, or close too it. Rumors that Dunn could be moved again as well.

One reasonable scenario I could think of for a S&T for Lonzo would be something based around Smart. If NOLA was able to land Lowry, I could see them being potentially interested in a S&T with Lonzo based around Smart and Romeo/G Williams for around $80M/4 years. That'd be a really interesting lineup for them in Lowry, Smart, Ingram, Zion, and Hayes. They probably compete for homecourt advantage in the playoffs and potentially take a series or two barring health concerns.

For us, it'd kill two birds with one stone - figure out the Smart situation and get our long-term PG that seemingly fits well with the Jays and is on their timeline. Though, the question is whether that move is better than just keeping the space for the possibility of a Beal, Kawhi, etc. next summer.

Sure, thats possible. Smart is at 13.8 next year. If you get Lonzo at 4/80 that would start at roughly like 18.5 a year so you're adding 5 million to your books which is right around what they currently have below the apron. If they then moved on from Dunn's money they could also still use the taxpayer MLE and stay below the hard cap (it would bne VERY tight).

I guess I just have a somewhat hard time seeing them tie up their longer-term flexibility that way. But it depends on how much you like Lonzo Ball i guess. I like him, I don't know if i 4/80 like him.

Definitely. Also depends upon what the thought is about who they have a legitimate chance to get next year. Beal seems like an obvious target, but while that class is loaded, I don't see too many other big names that would potentially move and come here. Leonard? Potentially. Curry? Doubt he leaves his legacy in GS. Lavine? Possibly, but is he really a good fit next to the Jays? I don't see KD, Kyrie, or Harden leaving, and I don't really want any of them here anyways.

Beal seems like the main target given his obvious connections to Tatum. But to be honest, while Beal is undoubtedly the better player over Lonzo, I'm skeptical of the fit of all three of Brown, Beal, and Tatum together. Don't think their styles fit that well together. I think someone like Lonzo would fit much better next to the Jays and play a "Jrue-type" third wheel role behind the main two in Tatum and Brown. It'd also not waste another year and be significantly cheaper to have Lonzo, leaving more money to fill out the rest of the roster.

Sure, thats completely defensible. Maybe BOS does it thinking maybe he's a peice they can later flip, there may also be the possibility that WAS actually likes Ball as a piece of a Beal deal. After all, he'll only be 24 next year.

[blink]

With the Celtics now above the tax line and only a few million below the apron, a sign-and-trade is highly unlikely.  There’s just not the flexibility without moving a large salary.

Most likely outcome would seem to be they use the 6 million taxpayer exception and call it a day, or close too it. Rumors that Dunn could be moved again as well.

One reasonable scenario I could think of for a S&T for Lonzo would be something based around Smart. If NOLA was able to land Lowry, I could see them being potentially interested in a S&T with Lonzo based around Smart and Romeo/G Williams for around $80M/4 years. That'd be a really interesting lineup for them in Lowry, Smart, Ingram, Zion, and Hayes. They probably compete for homecourt advantage in the playoffs and potentially take a series or two barring health concerns.

For us, it'd kill two birds with one stone - figure out the Smart situation and get our long-term PG that seemingly fits well with the Jays and is on their timeline. Though, the question is whether that move is better than just keeping the space for the possibility of a Beal, Kawhi, etc. next summer.

Sure, thats possible. Smart is at 13.8 next year. If you get Lonzo at 4/80 that would start at roughly like 18.5 a year so you're adding 5 million to your books which is right around what they currently have below the apron. If they then moved on from Dunn's money they could also still use the taxpayer MLE and stay below the hard cap (it would bne VERY tight).

I guess I just have a somewhat hard time seeing them tie up their longer-term flexibility that way. But it depends on how much you like Lonzo Ball i guess. I like him, I don't know if i 4/80 like him.

Definitely. Also depends upon what the thought is about who they have a legitimate chance to get next year. Beal seems like an obvious target, but while that class is loaded, I don't see too many other big names that would potentially move and come here. Leonard? Potentially. Curry? Doubt he leaves his legacy in GS. Lavine? Possibly, but is he really a good fit next to the Jays? I don't see KD, Kyrie, or Harden leaving, and I don't really want any of them here anyways.

Beal seems like the main target given his obvious connections to Tatum. But to be honest, while Beal is undoubtedly the better player over Lonzo, I'm skeptical of the fit of all three of Brown, Beal, and Tatum together. Don't think their styles fit that well together. I think someone like Lonzo would fit much better next to the Jays and play a "Jrue-type" third wheel role behind the main two in Tatum and Brown. It'd also not waste another year and be significantly cheaper to have Lonzo, leaving more money to fill out the rest of the roster.

Is it naive to think that Tatum knows whether Beal is coming or not?

I don't think he knows.  Washington doesn't know if they are trading him yet, how would they know where they are trading him too already?
He isn't an UFA until 2023.

I thought he could opt out in 2022?

he can?  sorry I had no idea.  If that is the case, strike everything I wrote lol...

[liam]

With the Celtics now above the tax line and only a few million below the apron, a sign-and-trade is highly unlikely.  There’s just not the flexibility without moving a large salary.

Most likely outcome would seem to be they use the 6 million taxpayer exception and call it a day, or close too it. Rumors that Dunn could be moved again as well.

One reasonable scenario I could think of for a S&T for Lonzo would be something based around Smart. If NOLA was able to land Lowry, I could see them being potentially interested in a S&T with Lonzo based around Smart and Romeo/G Williams for around $80M/4 years. That'd be a really interesting lineup for them in Lowry, Smart, Ingram, Zion, and Hayes. They probably compete for homecourt advantage in the playoffs and potentially take a series or two barring health concerns.

For us, it'd kill two birds with one stone - figure out the Smart situation and get our long-term PG that seemingly fits well with the Jays and is on their timeline. Though, the question is whether that move is better than just keeping the space for the possibility of a Beal, Kawhi, etc. next summer.

Sure, thats possible. Smart is at 13.8 next year. If you get Lonzo at 4/80 that would start at roughly like 18.5 a year so you're adding 5 million to your books which is right around what they currently have below the apron. If they then moved on from Dunn's money they could also still use the taxpayer MLE and stay below the hard cap (it would bne VERY tight).

I guess I just have a somewhat hard time seeing them tie up their longer-term flexibility that way. But it depends on how much you like Lonzo Ball i guess. I like him, I don't know if i 4/80 like him.

Definitely. Also depends upon what the thought is about who they have a legitimate chance to get next year. Beal seems like an obvious target, but while that class is loaded, I don't see too many other big names that would potentially move and come here. Leonard? Potentially. Curry? Doubt he leaves his legacy in GS. Lavine? Possibly, but is he really a good fit next to the Jays? I don't see KD, Kyrie, or Harden leaving, and I don't really want any of them here anyways.

Beal seems like the main target given his obvious connections to Tatum. But to be honest, while Beal is undoubtedly the better player over Lonzo, I'm skeptical of the fit of all three of Brown, Beal, and Tatum together. Don't think their styles fit that well together. I think someone like Lonzo would fit much better next to the Jays and play a "Jrue-type" third wheel role behind the main two in Tatum and Brown. It'd also not waste another year and be significantly cheaper to have Lonzo, leaving more money to fill out the rest of the roster.

Is it naive to think that Tatum knows whether Beal is coming or not?

I don't think he knows.  Washington doesn't know if they are trading him yet, how would they know where they are trading him too already?
He isn't an UFA until 2023.

I thought he could opt out in 2022?

he can?  sorry I had no idea.  If that is the case, strike everything I wrote lol...

 

[action781]

Outside of Jaylen & Tatum, is the rest of the roster the worst offensive group in the league?

Depends if Al has a good year shooting the 3 ball.  Smart and Josh Richardson are not a good recipe to space the floor for the J's though.

Are we also only looking at the #3-15 players on every roster? Because if not, you could make the same claim for several teams in the league if you're comparing their 3-15 against every other teams' 1-15.

If you're comparing our 3-15 against everyone else's 3-15, then we're not the worst in the league, no. Chicago, Dallas, Detroit, Houston, NYK, OKC, Washington are worse. Probably others too.

[Jiri Welsch]

LaVine is the guy to go for if you can’t get Durant next off-season

[jpotter33]

With the Celtics now above the tax line and only a few million below the apron, a sign-and-trade is highly unlikely.  There’s just not the flexibility without moving a large salary.

Most likely outcome would seem to be they use the 6 million taxpayer exception and call it a day, or close too it. Rumors that Dunn could be moved again as well.

One reasonable scenario I could think of for a S&T for Lonzo would be something based around Smart. If NOLA was able to land Lowry, I could see them being potentially interested in a S&T with Lonzo based around Smart and Romeo/G Williams for around $80M/4 years. That'd be a really interesting lineup for them in Lowry, Smart, Ingram, Zion, and Hayes. They probably compete for homecourt advantage in the playoffs and potentially take a series or two barring health concerns.

For us, it'd kill two birds with one stone - figure out the Smart situation and get our long-term PG that seemingly fits well with the Jays and is on their timeline. Though, the question is whether that move is better than just keeping the space for the possibility of a Beal, Kawhi, etc. next summer.

Sure, thats possible. Smart is at 13.8 next year. If you get Lonzo at 4/80 that would start at roughly like 18.5 a year so you're adding 5 million to your books which is right around what they currently have below the apron. If they then moved on from Dunn's money they could also still use the taxpayer MLE and stay below the hard cap (it would bne VERY tight).

I guess I just have a somewhat hard time seeing them tie up their longer-term flexibility that way. But it depends on how much you like Lonzo Ball i guess. I like him, I don't know if i 4/80 like him.

Definitely. Also depends upon what the thought is about who they have a legitimate chance to get next year. Beal seems like an obvious target, but while that class is loaded, I don't see too many other big names that would potentially move and come here. Leonard? Potentially. Curry? Doubt he leaves his legacy in GS. Lavine? Possibly, but is he really a good fit next to the Jays? I don't see KD, Kyrie, or Harden leaving, and I don't really want any of them here anyways.

Beal seems like the main target given his obvious connections to Tatum. But to be honest, while Beal is undoubtedly the better player over Lonzo, I'm skeptical of the fit of all three of Brown, Beal, and Tatum together. Don't think their styles fit that well together. I think someone like Lonzo would fit much better next to the Jays and play a "Jrue-type" third wheel role behind the main two in Tatum and Brown. It'd also not waste another year and be significantly cheaper to have Lonzo, leaving more money to fill out the rest of the roster.

Sure, thats completely defensible. Maybe BOS does it thinking maybe he's a peice they can later flip, there may also be the possibility that WAS actually likes Ball as a piece of a Beal deal. After all, he'll only be 24 next year.

Good point. Could even be a midyear acquisition, which would actually theoretically allow us to keep some of our other guys that we'd have to cut to get him in free agency.

Free agency sign and trade -

NOLA: Smart/GWill (a little under $17M)
Boston: Lonzo ($20M)

Mid-season trade -

Washington: Lonzo/Richardson ($31.6M), lots of draft compensation
Boston: Beal ($33.7M)

That's a few million under the tax apron I believe ($137.8M - dependent upon other moves), but I think it's doable and would leave us with a great group with some vet minimum money to spare:

PG: Dunn, Pritchard
SG: Beal, Nesmith
SF: Brown, Romeo
PF: Tatum, Parker
C: Timelord, Horford, Brown

Pick up some vet minimum contracts to flesh out the roster and that's a hell a contender that would give the Brooklyns and Milwaukees a fit.

[radiohead]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-boston-celtics-trade-for-dallas-mavericks-wing-josh-richardson-use-hayward-tpe/ar-AAMLvAh

Brad is doing some housecleaning.

Edit: The above article is gone and has been replaced with this:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/report-boston-celtics-trade-for-dallas-mavericks-wing-josh-richardson-use-hayward-tpe/ar-AAMLvAh

[kraidstar]

I don't see ball coming here.  These deals were about getting expiring contracts and keeping cap flexibility for next year.  The cs have better depth, defense and scoring to compete next year.  The did not add any long term salary but are better today vs how they ended the season.  Wasn't the ideal route but it worked.  I'd be shocked at a ball deal and IMO they are setting themselves up for Beal.  If they knew they didn't have a shot at Beal they would have no issue adding long term salary on pieces that fit with the js.  I would like to see a move clearing Edward's for yam but barring another deal it seems yam is stuck overseas for 1 more year.

Agree 100%. Really feels like Brad knows something is going down, probably with Beal. The frantic way he is clearing cap space is pretty crazy.

So he punts on this year a little bit to land a solid star and truly contend as the Jays enter their prime.

[ozgod]

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/celtics-acquiring-josh-richardson-from-mavericks-after-wing-opts-into-final-year-of-his-deal-per-report/

The trade is a brilliant bit of salary cap maneuvering by the Celtics. Boston had roughly $11 million left on the trade exception it generated when it dealt Gordon Hayward to Charlotte last offseason. Richardson's $11.6 million salary for next season would not have fit into that exception. However, as the league year has not yet flipped, Boston can trade for him at his $10.8 million 2020-21 salary and therefore fit him into the exception. According to ESPN's Bobby Marks, that is how the Celtics are completing this trade.

The Celtics made another trade earlier Friday to clear room underneath the tax line for this one. They swapped Tristan Thompson for Kris Dunn, and in acquiring Richardson, they've essentially jumped back up to the tax line while replacing free agent Evan Fournier. That might seem insignificant now, but it has enormous ramifications for next offseason. Richardson's contract is expiring. Fournier will surely command a multi-year deal this offseason. Now Boston has a number of veterans on expiring deals, and with Richardson seemingly filling Fournier's spot in the rotation, they are in position to create a significant amount of cap space.

Yep, there's a decent number of FAs hitting the market in 2022:

[GreenlyGreeny]

Maybe there’s a bigger move coming, but to me these moves make sense in that our bench was hot garbage. Nobody does anything special with a garbage bench.

Here’s to hoping we somehow end up with a Big 3 AND a decent bench by this time next year. That’s the ticket to a championship, of course. Skeptical it can be done, though…

[GreenlyGreeny]

Outside of Jaylen & Tatum, is the rest of the roster the worst offensive group in the league?

Depends if Al has a good year shooting the 3 ball.  Smart and Josh Richardson are not a good recipe to space the floor for the J's though.

Are we also only looking at the #3-15 players on every roster? Because if not, you could make the same claim for several teams in the league if you're comparing their 3-15 against every other teams' 1-15.

If you're comparing our 3-15 against everyone else's 3-15, then we're not the worst in the league, no. Chicago, Dallas, Detroit, Houston, NYK, OKC, Washington are worse. Probably others too.

Our 6-15 last year was easily the worst in the league, especially after moving Theis.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

We are just going to throw waves of really good defenders at opposing team's best guards/forwards. Start the game with Smart on them. Rotate Josh Richardson on them. Scrap minutes given to Kris Dunn. All three of which are expirings looking to prove themselves for their next contract.

That doesn't even start the conversation about Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum, who are two of the best two-way wings in the league. Then you have a great team defender in Al Horford and one of the most disruptive defensive bigs in the league in Robert Williams.

Oh, and Langford and Nesmith will be given the opportunity to prove they can be disruptive on defense as well.

Teams are going to hate playing the Celtics. I love that.

I do wish we had one more tough-nosed forward, like a big forward version of Josh Richardson who is disruptive on the ball and plays with an edge. It'd be nice to save Tatum and Brown from some of the inside banging too.

I don't think Young, Anderson, or Barnes fits that bill. All three are bit more finesse and soft.

I wish we could get 2017s version of PJ Tucker. What FA out there could be had for a one-year contract? JaMychael Green? Markieff Morris? Solomon Hill? How about resigning Semi Ojeleye?

I'm probably a bigger believer in Grant Williams than most on here, but I do feel like we need depth/competition at that spot with a veteran.

[RJ87]

I don't see ball coming here.  These deals were about getting expiring contracts and keeping cap flexibility for next year.  The cs have better depth, defense and scoring to compete next year.  The did not add any long term salary but are better today vs how they ended the season.  Wasn't the ideal route but it worked.  I'd be shocked at a ball deal and IMO they are setting themselves up for Beal.  If they knew they didn't have a shot at Beal they would have no issue adding long term salary on pieces that fit with the js.  I would like to see a move clearing Edward's for yam but barring another deal it seems yam is stuck overseas for 1 more year.

Sorry, but how are they better offensively? The team literally has two good offensive players. Thts pretty much it right now.

I could listen to arguments as to how Horford, Richardson, improved young guys (PP, Nessie, Romeo), an adjusted Jabari Parker + whatever free agents or further trades we make is better for our offence than Kemba, Tristan Thompson and whoever we would have picked at 16 + those improved young guys. The ability to add more with our TPE and MLE could only enhance that.

I also think Kemba might be addition by subtraction. Replacing an injury-prone shoot-first guard with a high-post passing big who can shoot will open things up for us

Horford is 35. Richardson is coming off a sub par two years. Romeo is a nobody and has shown no signs of an actual offensive game. Parker is not good either. Over the last two years, Cs lost Hayward and Kemba and have not replaced them. And now they are likely losing Fournier. God forbid if anything happen to JB or JT or this team is literally a lottery team as it is comprised right now. Thankfully plenty of time to make more moves obviously but will be very curious to see what PBS does. Thinks there’s a lot more moves coming.

I agree. On paper, we'll be better defensively but it won't matter that we can hold a team to 90 points if we can't score 91.

I just don't see where we're getting consistent scoring outside of the Jays with this roster. We know Horford isn't a big scorer. Richardson has been declining for awhile, and you have to wonder if his last season in Miami was a fluke. Do we want Marcus feeling like he has to score? That rarely works in anyone's favor. Best case scenario is that Nesmith makes a jump, but that's not fair to put those expectations on him this early in his career. Can we get a decent MLE guy? We're going to have to.