Author Topic: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins  (Read 23600 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #60 on: February 15, 2010, 03:29:12 PM »

Offline PosImpos

  • NCE
  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12383
  • Tommy Points: 903
  • Rondo = Good
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.
Never forget the Champs of '08, or the gutsy warriors of '10.

"I know you all wanna win, but you gotta do it TOGETHER!"
- Doc Rivers

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #61 on: February 15, 2010, 03:30:20 PM »

Offline rondohondo

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10756
  • Tommy Points: 1196
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.

even if Morrow and Biedrins are with him? I love Morrow he can score 30 on any given night especially with Rondo getting him the ball

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #62 on: February 15, 2010, 03:33:57 PM »

Offline Drucci

  • Global Moderator
  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7223
  • Tommy Points: 439
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.

even if Morrow and Biedrins are with him? I love Morrow he can score 30 on any given night especially with Rondo getting him the ball

Oh hell yea!!!!!! if we can get Morrow in this trade do it! the kid is the next Ray Allen ( at least shooting wise)

You must never have heard of chemistry, fits, sharing of the ball, terrible contracts and salary cap, don't you?


That is way too much talent coming back not to do it, We have shooting off the bench with Morrow. We have to lightning quick guards who can get to the basket at will.

Morrow shooting

08-09 = 48% FG's , 47% 3pt , 87% FT
09-10 = 49% fgs  , 45 % 3pt , 90 % FT


This would be a steal of a trade

If a bigger guard is taking advantage of Ellis, we still have Daniels 

So you're ready to take on two huge contracts for two overrated and not fitting-at-all-in-our-system players (Ellis and Biedrins) just to take Morrow, a really good shooter? That's a lot to take (and to lose - Perk and Ray) just to acquire a bonified roleplayer... again, this is not fantasy basketball, and Morrow's shooting doesn't make up for his poor defense and doesn't make up for the fact that the guy can just shoot - very well, ok, but still, he is a better version of Eddie House and that's it.

You're basically saying that we should do this trade in a heartbeat, losing two key players from our starting five, but hey, that's worth it since we get a bigger and better shooter than Eddie House, a one trick poney player off our bench. Yeah. ::)

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #63 on: February 15, 2010, 03:37:29 PM »

Offline rondohondo

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10756
  • Tommy Points: 1196
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.

even if Morrow and Biedrins are with him? I love Morrow he can score 30 on any given night especially with Rondo getting him the ball

Oh hell yea!!!!!! if we can get Morrow in this trade do it! the kid is the next Ray Allen ( at least shooting wise)

You must never have heard of chemistry, fits, sharing of the ball, terrible contracts and salary cap, don't you?


That is way too much talent coming back not to do it, We have shooting off the bench with Morrow. We have to lightning quick guards who can get to the basket at will.

Morrow shooting

08-09 = 48% FG's , 47% 3pt , 87% FT
09-10 = 49% fgs  , 45 % 3pt , 90 % FT


This would be a steal of a trade

If a bigger guard is taking advantage of Ellis, we still have Daniels 

So you're ready to take on two huge contracts for two overrated and not fitting-at-all-in-our-system players (Ellis and Biedrins) just to take Morrow, a really good shooter? That's a lot to take (and to lose - Perk and Ray) just to acquire a bonified roleplayer... again, this is not fantasy basketball, and Morrow's shooting doesn't make up for his poor defense and doesn't make up for the fact that the guy can just shoot - very well, ok, but still, he is a better version of Eddie House and that's it.

You're basically saying that we should do this trade in a heartbeat, losing two key players from our starting five, but hey, that's worth it since we get a bigger and better shooter than Eddie House, a one trick poney player off our bench. Yeah. ::)

well last time I checked this was a message board and I am allowed to have an opinion . Just because YOU say they won't fit doesn't mean its true. I have much more faith in Danny's decision making, no offense. I just think we would be adding so much young talent.

We have to resign perk after next year anyways and he will make the same as Biedrins, yes Perk is better , but not that much

and Ellis + Morrow are better than a 35 yr old SG.

Morrow is better than a role player , he is only in his 2nd year

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #64 on: February 15, 2010, 03:42:01 PM »

Offline MF Doom

  • Brad Stevens
  • Posts: 212
  • Tommy Points: 29
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.

though i am somewhat against this trade too, what makes you think he is a loser with a me-first attitude? He plays for Don Nelson, who wants him to shoot jumpers on almost every posession. He cant be blamed for the system hes in. I dont know the guy but i dont know why you are making personal attacks on him.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #65 on: February 15, 2010, 03:53:30 PM »

Offline buzz

  • Kristaps Porzingis
  • Posts: 187
  • Tommy Points: 29
Hey guys... Celts fan here in CA, know more about the Ws than I ever should.

Random thoughts:

1. Chris Cohan is in serious financial trouble, and as reported, may be looking to shed salaries to facilitate a sale.

2. Biedrins is by no means better than Perkins. That's not even a subjective take. To say otherwise is simply factually incorrect. Get it out of your minds right now. Biedrins pads rebounding stats playing as the only big man on an uptempo team. He can't score 20 and he can't stop his man from scoring 20. Perkins is significantly better on both ends of the floor. Biedrins has no offensive game at all. Good guy, though... good attitude and leadership potential. Nice hands, can finish, especially on the pick and roll.

3. Monta is a glorified role player. Don't buy the stats. He is a 1-on-1 guy with no clue about team basketball. His team wants to dump him and make room for Curry, who is a total stud.

4. I still like the move. We aren't winning jack this year, and need to think about the future. Monta and Biedrins are both better fits for Rondo's uptempo skills.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #66 on: February 15, 2010, 03:54:59 PM »

Offline TradeProposalDude

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 536
  • Tommy Points: 56
The only question is whether the Celtics would be willing to commit to all that long term salary. This ownership has a track record of highly contemplating deals like this and then backing off.

This trade obviously makes the Celtics a better team provided that Ellis and Biedrins are free of injury.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #67 on: February 15, 2010, 03:59:07 PM »

Offline Cman

  • K.C. Jones
  • *************
  • Posts: 13068
  • Tommy Points: 120
Ugh... it seems that this trade has been discussed (per MatthyDHume on Tweeter, retweeted by Celticsblog) :

Quote
Latest Juice on Golden St./Boston - Ellis, Biedrins, Morrow to Celts for Ray, Perkins, Williams and Giddens. Picks Have Been Discussed (TBC)

Terrible, terrible trade. Monta Ellis is a terrible fit for us and we would be stuck with him for years, Biedrins is not worth taking on his contract. The only good acquisition would be Morrow but if we give up Ray and Perk for him and get Ellis and Biedrins in the deal too, it's just an awful trade.

I hope this is just rumors and basic discussions, Danny would be crazy to make such a deal, unless he is entitled to build a fantasy team instead of a championship team.

Including Morrow makes it very interesting (but likely would require a draft pick from Boston).  

But the deal really hinges on Monta Ellis.  If Danny believes that all Monta needs is a change of scenery, then this could be a huge steal.  That is, if Monta arrives in Boston, suddenly learns to play defense from KG, and accepts his role as a cog in the machine that is the Celtics, not his role as "the man", then this could be great for Boston.  Especially since Monta is underpaid for his level of talent.  

I'm not sold that Monta will do all the above, but I am probably willing to take the gamble.  

I love the love for Perkins, and I do think he is better than Biedrins, but not by a large enough margin to nix such a deal...
Celtics fan for life.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #68 on: February 15, 2010, 04:02:09 PM »

Offline Drucci

  • Global Moderator
  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7223
  • Tommy Points: 439
Monta Ellis is a loser with a me-first attitude and no interest in defense.

No thanks.

even if Morrow and Biedrins are with him? I love Morrow he can score 30 on any given night especially with Rondo getting him the ball

Oh hell yea!!!!!! if we can get Morrow in this trade do it! the kid is the next Ray Allen ( at least shooting wise)

You must never have heard of chemistry, fits, sharing of the ball, terrible contracts and salary cap, don't you?


That is way too much talent coming back not to do it, We have shooting off the bench with Morrow. We have to lightning quick guards who can get to the basket at will.

Morrow shooting

08-09 = 48% FG's , 47% 3pt , 87% FT
09-10 = 49% fgs  , 45 % 3pt , 90 % FT


This would be a steal of a trade

If a bigger guard is taking advantage of Ellis, we still have Daniels 

So you're ready to take on two huge contracts for two overrated and not fitting-at-all-in-our-system players (Ellis and Biedrins) just to take Morrow, a really good shooter? That's a lot to take (and to lose - Perk and Ray) just to acquire a bonified roleplayer... again, this is not fantasy basketball, and Morrow's shooting doesn't make up for his poor defense and doesn't make up for the fact that the guy can just shoot - very well, ok, but still, he is a better version of Eddie House and that's it.

You're basically saying that we should do this trade in a heartbeat, losing two key players from our starting five, but hey, that's worth it since we get a bigger and better shooter than Eddie House, a one trick poney player off our bench. Yeah. ::)

well last time I checked this was a message board and I am allowed to have an opinion . Just because YOU say they won't fit doesn't mean its true. I have much more faith in Danny's decision making, no offense. I just think we would be adding so much young talent.

We have to resign perk after next year anyways and he will make the same as Biedrins, yes Perk is better , but not that much

and Ellis + Morrow are better than a 35 yr old SG.

Morrow is better than a role player , he is only in his 2nd year

I'm not saying you shouldn't have your own opinion, I wouldn't say or think something so stupid but I disagree with you. Although young talent is generally better than a 35 year old guard, there are a ton of factors to consider into making such a deal. Swapping old legs for young legs is not a recipe for success.

It's still obvious to me that Ellis would be a terrible fit. And giving Perk away (our only Howard, Shaq, etc, stopper) for the soft Biedrins doesn't make us better, so it's not all about young talent vs old legs...

It looks to me that by considering such trades Danny is thinking that the Celtics should start rebuilding now and I hate this idea. And I don't think you rebuild on Monta Ellis, especially when you already have Rondo.

Maybe you're right and Danny Ainge would be right to consider that a change for scenery would do wonders for Ellis (like Cman suggested and a la Stephen Jackson in Charlotte) but even if that was to happen (which would be a miracle by the way so don't count too hard on it), Monta would still be an undersized guard who can't shoot from three thus can't space the floor. This would be a big problem, regardless of his attitude, because Monta's height will always limit him and create matchups problems for us on the defensive end.

A Martin + Nocioni for Ray deal would be much, much better for us both in short term and long term, and would keep us in the race for the championship this season and beyond... while the Monta Ellis deal would get us in the highlights factory and that's it...

Fortunately this is just a rumor and I hope this deal will stay a rumor forever.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #69 on: February 15, 2010, 04:03:31 PM »

Offline buzz

  • Kristaps Porzingis
  • Posts: 187
  • Tommy Points: 29
To me, this trade is just compiling future trade assets.

We would be getting young talent for an expiring deal. How talented is debatable, but how else can we do it?

None of this addresses our real problem, which is the fact that KG is washed up (did you see him try to chase down that fast break pass in the Hornets game like a total gimp? I wanted to cry).

Anyhow... so long as either Perkins or Sheed goes back in return, we don't get murdered in the lux tax next season. But losing Perk a tough pill to swallow.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #70 on: February 15, 2010, 04:04:07 PM »

Online celticinorlando

  • Larry Bird
  • *****************************
  • Posts: 29095
  • Tommy Points: 701
  • MASTER OF PANIC
Ugh... it seems that this trade has been discussed (per MatthyDHume on Tweeter, retweeted by Celticsblog) :

Quote
Latest Juice on Golden St./Boston - Ellis, Biedrins, Morrow to Celts for Ray, Perkins, Williams and Giddens. Picks Have Been Discussed (TBC)

Terrible, terrible trade. Monta Ellis is a terrible fit for us and we would be stuck with him for years, Biedrins is not worth taking on his contract. The only good acquisition would be Morrow but if we give up Ray and Perk for him and get Ellis and Biedrins in the deal too, it's just an awful trade.

I hope this is just rumors and basic discussions, Danny would be crazy to make such a deal, unless he is entitled to build a fantasy team instead of a championship team.

i like this deal.

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #71 on: February 15, 2010, 04:06:20 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

  • In The Rafters
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 42583
  • Tommy Points: 2756
  • You ain't the boss of the freakin' bedclothes.
ahhhhh I cannot wait for the trade deadline to pass. I'm debating just playing NBA 2k10 and just watching games and letting the chips fall where they will.


EDIT: Actually I will probably just do that anyways.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #72 on: February 15, 2010, 04:08:08 PM »

Offline rondohondo

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10756
  • Tommy Points: 1196
To me, this trade is just compiling future trade assets.

We would be getting young talent for an expiring deal. How talented is debatable, but how else can we do it?

None of this addresses our real problem, which is the fact that KG is washed up (did you see him try to chase down that fast break pass in the Hornets game like a total gimp? I wanted to cry).

Anyhow... so long as either Perkins or Sheed goes back in return, we don't get murdered in the lux tax next season. But losing Perk a tough pill to swallow.

I agree Perk is tough to lose, but all that young talent back is to much to pass in my opinion. I think it is a pretty fair trade for both sides, we are not going to win the championship with a Gimpy KG anyways, he looks like he is close to done if not already. I hope I am wrong , but Kg has played so many mins and years .


Plus like I mentioned before Perk has to be resigned after next season. Ray Allen(36), KG(35) and PP(34) will all be a year older. If we can get a deal like this I think you have to do it.

Lets not forget ,Rasheed Wallace has played Dwight Howard very good over the years and has enough beef to match up with an Old shaq

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #73 on: February 15, 2010, 04:08:27 PM »

Online celticinorlando

  • Larry Bird
  • *****************************
  • Posts: 29095
  • Tommy Points: 701
  • MASTER OF PANIC
ahhhhh I cannot wait for the trade deadline to pass. I'm debating just playing NBA 2k10 and just watching games and letting the chips fall where they will.


EDIT: Actually I will probably just do that anyways.

i have already talked myself into the fact that i dont think boston will make a deal. makes all this nonsense easier to deal with

Re: Are you serious?Rumor: Perk/Allen for Ellis/Biedrins
« Reply #74 on: February 15, 2010, 04:09:09 PM »

Offline rondohondo

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10756
  • Tommy Points: 1196
ahhhhh I cannot wait for the trade deadline to pass. I'm debating just playing NBA 2k10 and just watching games and letting the chips fall where they will.


EDIT: Actually I will probably just do that anyways.

i have already talked myself into the fact that i dont think boston will make a deal.

we know you say that every other post  ;)