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Around the League => Transaction Ideas and Rumors => Topic started by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 08:44:29 PM

Title: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 08:44:29 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: CelticsQuestFor18 on August 22, 2017, 08:54:27 PM
Well said, I hate this trade too.

First off, there's the huge risk of whether Irving will re-sign here in 2 years, and then there's the risk of that Nets Pick landing #1 or #2 and the Cavs getting Porter/Bagley (which may also entice Lebron to stay in CLE longer). UGH.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 08:56:22 PM
Well said, I hate this trade too.

First off, there's the huge risk of whether Irving will re-sign here in 2 years, and then there's the risk of that Nets Pick landing #1 or #2 and the Cavs getting Porter/Bagley (which may also entice Lebron to stay in CLE longer). UGH.

Yep, that Nets Pick is the absolute deal breaker for me. Hate it.

Oh, and here's your first TP!  ;)
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Tr1boy on August 22, 2017, 08:58:19 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?

Don;t listen to Massarotti...he knows very little about basketball or nhl

he should stick to baseball and football
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 09:00:40 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?

Don;t listen to Massarotti...he knows very little about basketball or nhl

he should stick to baseball and football

Oh don't worry I don't follow him much either.

But I just thought that Tweet/Quote related so much to the situation here and how I feel about this trade.  ;D
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: dmopower on August 22, 2017, 09:03:00 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 09:04:40 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)

Love this post or the trade?  ???
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Surferdad on August 22, 2017, 09:06:26 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)
Yup, I do too.  Kyrie is better than IT.  Picks are a crap shoot.  Crowder doesn't matter.  Zizic isn't even NBA level talent.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Celtics978Fan on August 22, 2017, 09:09:28 PM
Yes this trade does look like we're giving up a lot. But we also have to look long-term to a degree.  We're getting an All-Star back and return Kyrie Irving who's 4 years younger. Not saying he doesn't have some injury history as well as Isaiah Thomas does now with a hip injury. But if you ask around the league there was never a question of Kyrie Irving being a max player. But if you ask the same question about Isaiah Thomas you would have questions. I agree the Brooklyn pick is hard to lose, but I do see the Brooklyn Nets maybe being better than we think. We also have to look at the chance we still have a top 2 - 5 pick with the Lakers pick.  Plus having our own 1st round pick this year as well.  Which means it could work out we still get a better pick then the one we're giving up.  Also in 2019 we could have both the Grizzlies and Clippers first round draft picks.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: biggs on August 22, 2017, 09:09:33 PM
OP- I'm with you. We just made our roadblock to the finals deeper and more complete, while handing the team that has had the most fake luck of any team ever a chance at the next LeBron. This trade reaks of ownership. Can't believe Danny pushed for this one.

Yay fire...works?

I'll react like I reacted when Wyc took the stage at the Jaylen draft party..

Boooooooooooooooooooooo
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Smokeeye123 on August 22, 2017, 09:19:48 PM
Moving crowder was needed to give the kids playing time.

Signing IT to a max in the offseason would have capped this team's potential at just not enough.

Losing the brooklyn pick sucks but think of it this way. We traded the corpses of KG and Paul Pierce for Kyrie Irving. Pretty [dang] good of a trade.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: JHTruth on August 22, 2017, 09:24:35 PM
Trades like this are why I just can't invest emotionally in the Celtics anymore. Just when you start to get excited for the future, you pay $1.50 on the dollar for a shoot first, no D PG.

Just awful. Never hated an Ainge trade more. Oh well, now I can ignore the Cs this year!!
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: footey on August 22, 2017, 09:33:04 PM
Moving crowder was needed to give the kids playing time.

Signing IT to a max in the offseason would have capped this team's potential at just not enough.

Losing the brooklyn pick sucks but think of it this way. We traded the corpses of KG and Paul Pierce for Kyrie Irving. Pretty [dang] good of a trade.

Also got a Brown and Tatum LOL.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: tenn_smoothie on August 22, 2017, 09:39:07 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

Exactly - like meat on the hoof ................... and we trade Isaiah, who loved being a Celtic, for one of the most self-centered players in the league.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: hodgy03038 on August 22, 2017, 09:42:28 PM
The Celts made IT a star. Everywhere else he was a bench player. He should be extremely happy at what the Celts have done for him and his career AND arguably to a team destined for the NBA finals. Nothing dirty about it.

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: dmopower on August 22, 2017, 09:47:37 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)

Love this post or the trade?  ???

 Love the trade.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 10:11:56 PM
Trades like this are why I just can't invest emotionally in the Celtics anymore. Just when you start to get excited for the future, you pay $1.50 on the dollar for a shoot first, no D PG.

Just awful. Never hated an Ainge trade more. Oh well, now I can ignore the Cs this year!!

Yeah and I got a Thomas jersey a year ago SMH.  :'(
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 10:13:16 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

Exactly - like meat on the hoof ................... and we trade Isaiah, who loved being a Celtic, for one of the most self-centered players in the league.

Yep, and now watch Irving not re-sign here in a few years and go somewhere else.  >:(
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 22, 2017, 10:18:11 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)

Love this post or the trade?  ???

 Love the trade.

Oh well.. That's unfortunate.  :P
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: dmopower on August 22, 2017, 11:01:27 PM
Love it. 


lets roll. :)

Love this post or the trade?  ???

 Love the trade.

Oh well.. That's unfortunate.  :P

 We dont need 4 lottery players all looking for max money within a couple years.  We still have a great pick next year. Irving has the potential to be a better defensive player and I think he is a better player On O as well. Plus younger. We get the young wings the PT they need to reach their potential.  I think we did well. I think Cleveland did well. We will be a better team more capable of competing with the upper level teams east and west.  My opinion.  Time will tell.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: TheSundanceKid on August 23, 2017, 04:20:17 AM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

Exactly - like meat on the hoof ................... and we trade Isaiah, who loved being a Celtic, for one of the most self-centered players in the league.

Yep, and now watch Irving not re-sign here in a few years and go somewhere else.  >:(
I advise you to take a day off, look at the trade again then when you are less emotional. Serious comment not trying to patronise, I'm feeling pretty bummed out right about now too.

To believe this trade then you should believe Ainge didn't want to give IT the full max and he [dang] sure wanted that. So you have to weigh this up against IT walking at the end of the year. Then it seems more palatable.

Then, being brutal to you and myself, we need to take off the green goggles and admit that as good as Isaiah was last year, Kyrie has the higher ceiling in his game and will very likely have the better career from this point forward. Crowder and Zizic were throw ins here, the Brooklyn pick is the only thing to mourn past Isaiah.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: kenmaine on August 23, 2017, 04:39:24 AM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.


Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: greenhead85 on August 23, 2017, 04:46:38 AM
Truly love this trade.

25 year-old All-Star!

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: playdream on August 23, 2017, 05:53:44 AM
Celtics gave IT his chance by building the system around him and IT convert, and Ainge won't make the trade without IT's permission
so no, Celtic does not do IT dirty
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: TheSundanceKid on August 23, 2017, 05:57:03 AM
Phantom, if you want to lighten your mood then have a look at the latter half of this..

https://www.si.com/nba/2017/08/22/kyrie-irving-isaiah-thomas-trade-twitter-reactions

The bits on JR and the general NBA stuff at the end made me giggle.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: GreenFaith1819 on August 23, 2017, 07:01:43 AM
It does feel as if we did IT4 wrong. He heavily recruited Durant, KLove, and was instrumental in us getting Big Al and The Haymaker.

The Boston Celtics - perhaps more than ANY other NBA team in history besides maybe the Lakers - thrives on CHEMISTRY and HEART.

He "LOVED" BOS and promoted us big time. He has a HUGE heart and at least RIGHT NOW more grit than Kyrie.

For ME, it's easier to stay attached to IT4 since he WAS BOS (and in my heart will ALWAYS be).

But I trust Danny (and Coach Stevens).

I don't know Kyrie personally but I've questioned his character in relation to him wanting out of CLE....his dancing with Steph, etc, etc. But his talent is UNDENIABLE - as well as his youth.

Unless things fall apart here in BOS over the next few years (they WON'T) I can see him resigning here again. He'll have The Haymaker, Big Al, Jayson Tatum, Smart, Jaylen, Morris, Baynes and whomever else Danny brings in here with that Laker pick.

Jayson is a fellow Blue Devil so there's a connection right there. Didn't these two JUST take a picture together or something?

We "COULD" have yet ANOTHER Blue Devil next season in Marvelous Marvin Bagley. That will be THREE.

We could very well be called the Duke Celtics (or the Boston Blue Devils) here in the next year or so.

There's already been some speculation as to WHY it happened (IT's health, paying him the max, his defense, etc, etc, etc) has already been discussed. Danny (and Brad) knows a LOT more than any of us.

The heartstrings will be tough to break, indeed. IT playing through his sister's passing..........those HUGE games of his....... :'( :'(

This is not to even mention Jae. He was one of our better defenders and added a LOT of grit to this team as well.

Kyrie will have HUGE shoes to fill for us ALL on the EMOTIONAL side. Character-wise he will need to get to BOS and WORK hard. No dancing with Steph Curry. BOS is BUSINESS.

I have no doubt he will do this.

Talent-wise there is no denying Kyrie. I believe we will be marginally better overall.

As long as Kyrie gives LeBron the business on October 17 I'll be happy.

Danny Ainge showed me with the Perk trade that he can make moves regardless of how it could affect the team chemistry-wise. The "ONLY" good side in regards to chemistry is that the season has NOT started yet and we're still a few weeks away from Training Camp.

The Perk trade was made mid-season.

What is the saying - "Fortune Favors the Bold"? Well, Danny HAS been bold the last 7-8 years or so.

We'll be fine as a team. Just have to let this all settle in.

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 11:07:46 AM
Yeah, I slept on it, had dreams, woke up, and guess what...

I STILL HATE THIS TRADE.

But in my dream I had BOS-CLE in the ECF with Game 3 @TD Garden and Celtics DOWN 2-0. Kyrie scored 45 to win us the game. But I figure we lose to Cavs in ECF THIS season anyways LOL.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Dannys Chipotle Guy on August 23, 2017, 11:16:08 AM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?
perhaps worth noting the Red Sox look reasonably likely to win the Pomeranz trade right now.

Hes pitched like a high end #2 this season and the kid we gave up got hurt.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 11:20:05 AM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?
perhaps worth noting the Red Sox look reasonably likely to win the Pomeranz trade right now.

Hes pitched like a high end #2 this season and the kid we gave up got hurt.

Yeah it definitely looks better now. And I don't wish injury upon anyone but Espinoza having TJS makes this deal look good now, although I hope he does have a speedy recovery.

Pomeranz's performance this year has been huge and vital with Price being injured and Porcello having a down year (although he has looked really good the last 7-8 starts though).
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: dreamgreen on August 23, 2017, 11:21:13 AM
IT was great for us, but tell me how is his hip? I'm hearing could still need surgery. IMO we are building a team and IT became great here because he was the man, to win a championship you need more than a 5'9" shooing guard that dominates the ball. IT's continual talk about "backing up the brinks truck" didn't help him IMO. But he should be thankful the C's allowed him to get to that point. On a better team he may not have reached his potential.

Trades are always hard to evaluate immediately, lets see how things shake out going forward. Also this deal really helps to manage the salary cap going forward so lets not forget that.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: boscel33 on August 23, 2017, 11:21:17 AM
Well, also to quote Mazz (and Felger), never trade a horse for two ponies.  That's exactly what Cleveland did, traded a horse for some ponies.  I like the deal, although at first I didn't when I heard about the pick.  I'm of the belief, that pick is in the 7-11 range though and the Laker pick will be the better of the two.  I didn't see anyway they would "back the brinks truck up" for IT.  Danny cashed in one of his pony chips and got a horse.  Way to go....
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 12:13:20 PM
Well, also to quote Mazz (and Felger), never trade a horse for two ponies.  That's exactly what Cleveland did, traded a horse for some ponies.  I like the deal, although at first I didn't when I heard about the pick.  I'm of the belief, that pick is in the 7-11 range though and the Laker pick will be the better of the two.  I didn't see anyway they would "back the brinks truck up" for IT.  Danny cashed in one of his pony chips and got a horse.  Way to go....

Yea it looks clear that they were not going to give Isaiah the max.

Question is, will Cleveland? Lot depends on if Lebron stays too.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: CoachBo on August 23, 2017, 12:40:11 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 02:01:27 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.

What do you think of this trade @coachbo?

Hate it? Meh? Love it?
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: incoherent on August 23, 2017, 02:11:12 PM
So many emotions preventing people from seeing clearly.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on August 23, 2017, 02:23:54 PM
I understand that this was probably the best move for the long-term success of the organization.  But, the reality is that Ainge sucked the life out of IT, then dumped him.  I suppose that's what makes him a good GM, and I'm glad I don't have to make those decisions.  Maybe I value loyalty too high above other factors, but I have and continue to dislike Ainge for it.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: guava_wrench on August 23, 2017, 02:30:18 PM
I understand that this was probably the best move for the long-term success of the organization.  But, the reality is that Ainge sucked the life out of IT, then dumped him.  I suppose that's what makes him a good GM, and I'm glad I don't have to make those decisions.  Maybe I value loyalty too high above other factors, but I have and continue to dislike Ainge for it.
I assume you dislike Belichick for the same reasons.

Not to assume you are a Patriots fan. I surely am not.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: guava_wrench on August 23, 2017, 02:31:27 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.
I assume you are not a Patriots fan.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: tankcity! on August 23, 2017, 02:33:26 PM
Omg people are so emotional. Can't wait for people to quickly change their tune in the regular season. Irving is a top 10 player. Been saying it for a while. I think he's better than Harden.

It's going to be hilarious when people see how good we are as a team this season. But no one will remember that they were crushing this trade. Sad stuff. We've been starving for a star and this is how people react....Especially when you consider Brooklyn has no incentive to tank and will continue making moves throughout the season to improve their roster.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: colincb on August 23, 2017, 02:42:24 PM
I don't see this as much more than a sideways trade that helps the Cavs a lot more than it does us. I don't hate the trade. I don't like it though.

Cleveland was screwed if they don't do this trade. As such, we should do a deal with Cleveland only if we clearly win the deal. I don’t think this deal meets that hurdle.

IT was easily the better player this year by the numbers and better last year too. IT was a virtual lock to re-sign. We also gave up a draft pick most likely to be a top 5 for a big in a class that appears to be strong. I also have issues regarding KI’s maturity/attitude. He's never carried a team pretty much by himself either. IT did.

Vs

Getting a younger all-star in Irving who may not have topped out yet. Basically, you get three more years of prime time play IF he re-signs at the MAX over the length of his career.

If there's a clear win there, I don't see it and there are a couple of possibilities that make it a terrible deal.

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: ManUp on August 23, 2017, 03:00:19 PM
We lost the trade and I'm ok with it.

We were quickly becoming an older team and losing the cap flexibility Danny worked really hard to get. Missing out on Durant after signing Horford really screwed us more than I think people realize. Just imagine the moves Danny couldve made this offseason if we signed both Durant and Horford. We were becoming a win now team that wasn't good enough with a short contention window.The exact opposite of the team he was trying to build. Signing IT to the max would've handcuffed us to an aging pseudo-contender core ala Toronto and killed our cap flexibility.

Now we've extended our contention window by getting a guy whos 3 years younger, likely cheaper moving forward and is largely considered the better player. This trade only comes back to bite us if LeBron stays in Cleveland or the pick is a transcendent player.

With Kyrie we don't have to worry about his decline (barring injury) and each year Horfords contract becomes more of a tradeable asset. It makes sense If you believe Danny never wanted to pay IT the max and Horford was only signed to attract Durant. We've taken away the urgency from contending now and bought more time to make the superstar(top 5-10 player/Anthony Davis) deal Danny is looking for.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: CoachBo on August 23, 2017, 03:06:47 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.

What do you think of this trade @coachbo?

Hate it? Meh? Love it?

I'm fine with it. Stevens will expand Kyrie's game - first time he's played for a real coach. The Nets are going to be improved, so the pick should be somewhere around 7, I would expect. Crowder is an expendable piece and Zizic looked awful in summer league. I hope Rollie isn't on suicide watch because the Lithuanian Leadfoot has been moved.

The Celtics got better last night, short term and long term. Thomas did a lot for this franchise, but this franchise did a lot for him. I'm fine with the trade. One of Ainge's better moves.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: CoachBo on August 23, 2017, 03:13:34 PM
I understand that this was probably the best move for the long-term success of the organization.  But, the reality is that Ainge sucked the life out of IT, then dumped him.  I suppose that's what makes him a good GM, and I'm glad I don't have to make those decisions.  Maybe I value loyalty too high above other factors, but I have and continue to dislike Ainge for it.
I assume you dislike Belichick for the same reasons.

Not to assume you are a Patriots fan. I surely am not.

Sports history is replete with franchises that cratered because they were loyal to fading stars.

The kind of loyalty a fan feels will get a coach and GM fired. Every time.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Spilling Green Dye on August 23, 2017, 03:28:09 PM
I understand that this was probably the best move for the long-term success of the organization.  But, the reality is that Ainge sucked the life out of IT, then dumped him.  I suppose that's what makes him a good GM, and I'm glad I don't have to make those decisions.  Maybe I value loyalty too high above other factors, but I have and continue to dislike Ainge for it.
I assume you dislike Belichick for the same reasons.

Not to assume you are a Patriots fan. I surely am not.

Sports history is replete with franchises that cratered because they were loyal to fading stars.

The kind of loyalty a fan feels will get a coach and GM fired. Every time.

Agreed.  And Isiah couldn't have played in a better situation the past few years, nor could he have been traded to a better situation for the upcoming season.  Everything has been 100% optimal towards him earning a big next contract... which as he's indicated on social media is  his main goal.  While I'm thankful for what he did as a player on the team I love, he has a hell of a lot to be thankful for too.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Bobshot on August 23, 2017, 04:13:08 PM
Those media types are just well informed fans that get paid to spout their opinions. Your own judgments are just as valid. The coaches and GMs know a lot more. At least they are SUPPOSED TO know a lot more.  :laugh: Most of them do, and they see the game a bit differently than the fans do.

The media sees the game like the fans. That isn't what the coaches, GMs and the players see. It's a lot more quantitative for them. That's also true in football and horse racing. Trainers and jockeys look at a race differently from fans and the announcers. They are looking at the trip and the splits. Announcers don't get into that stuff.

Baseball, to me, is different. When Farrell screws up, you know it.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: byennie on August 23, 2017, 04:36:07 PM
The only question in this trade IMO is whether we overpaid. In terms of long-term plans, it makes a lot of sense.

I think IT had a better offensive season last year and is a great guy, but Irving is more valuable considering the 2 years under contract, younger, healthier, playoff mismatch problems, and better overall upside. So IT + something does make sense.

Crowder, Zizic, BKN is a hell of a "something", but: Crowder had become our 4th or 5th most valuable wing. Zizic is likely a role player. BKN pick is hard to rate, but you could definitely argue it's worth less than Brown or Tatum (known quantities who we rated #3 and #1 in their draft classes).

Ainge wanted to get two young All-Stars locked up and he did it, while keeping his 3 favorite young players (Smart, Brown, Tatum) and conjuring up the LAL pick along the way.

Eyes on the big picture. We're even in great shape cap-wise, compared to any other team with multiple stars under contract.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 05:23:32 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.

What do you think of this trade @coachbo?

Hate it? Meh? Love it?

I'm fine with it. Stevens will expand Kyrie's game - first time he's played for a real coach. The Nets are going to be improved, so the pick should be somewhere around 7, I would expect. Crowder is an expendable piece and Zizic looked awful in summer league. I hope Rollie isn't on suicide watch because the Lithuanian Leadfoot has been moved.

The Celtics got better last night, short term and long term. Thomas did a lot for this franchise, but this franchise did a lot for him. I'm fine with the trade. One of Ainge's better moves.

I actually never thought about the coach thing, but you're right.

Stevens is WAY better than anyone Cleveland has had. TP for that.

I hope you're right about Nets Pick but idk, the fact that Lakers can only convey 2-5 scares me. Wish it was something like 2-7. Even if it's on the lower end, I WANT a Top-10 pick out of this draft. Not having it convey would be brutal...
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: JHTruth on August 23, 2017, 05:33:52 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.

What do you think of this trade @coachbo?

Hate it? Meh? Love it?

I'm fine with it. Stevens will expand Kyrie's game - first time he's played for a real coach. The Nets are going to be improved, so the pick should be somewhere around 7, I would expect. Crowder is an expendable piece and Zizic looked awful in summer league. I hope Rollie isn't on suicide watch because the Lithuanian Leadfoot has been moved.

The Celtics got better last night, short term and long term. Thomas did a lot for this franchise, but this franchise did a lot for him. I'm fine with the trade. One of Ainge's better moves.

I think the jury is out on the trade for the long term. This draft class looks pretty amazing at the top and we just traded one of those guys away to really just draw even with the Cavs in the East. We're running out of assets to make big moves and we're still not in the same ballpark as GS.

Great, I'm glad we're one of the three top teams on the league but in my opinion trading away Ante and the Brooklyn pick especially for an upgrade at a position that was already one of our assumed strengths coming into the season reeks of shooting the moon and coming up short.

Our big rotation aside from Horford is as atrocious as ever and our rebounding will again be an abomination, possibly worse..
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 23, 2017, 05:52:44 PM
I'm done.
First it was the K. Perkins trade that cost the C's a potential championship.
Then it was Tony Allen, James Posey, Rondo, Avery Bradley, etc., and now IT.
Snake Danny "loves" all these guys- yeah right!. The minute he gets a player he's on the phone trying to trade him.
No loyalty, no pride, no tradition, no stability- just constant shuffling of the deck.
And this latest trade sucks.
I've been a fan for almost 50 years but this is really the last straw.
The best part of watching the C's this year wil be Scal and Draper, plus Tommy. But I have no interest anymore.

Bingo.

I've been looking for the post-Garnett trade Brickowski post, and this one is it.

What do you think of this trade @coachbo?

Hate it? Meh? Love it?

I'm fine with it. Stevens will expand Kyrie's game - first time he's played for a real coach. The Nets are going to be improved, so the pick should be somewhere around 7, I would expect. Crowder is an expendable piece and Zizic looked awful in summer league. I hope Rollie isn't on suicide watch because the Lithuanian Leadfoot has been moved.

The Celtics got better last night, short term and long term. Thomas did a lot for this franchise, but this franchise did a lot for him. I'm fine with the trade. One of Ainge's better moves.

I think the jury is out on the trade for the long term. This draft class looks pretty amazing at the top and we just traded one of those guys away to really just draw even with the Cavs in the East. We're running out of assets to make big moves and we're still not in the same ballpark as GS.

Great, I'm glad we're one of the three top teams on the league but in my opinion trading away Ante and the Brooklyn pick especially for an upgrade at a position that was already one of our assumed strengths coming into the season reeks of shooting the moon and coming up short.

Our big rotation aside from Horford is as atrocious as ever and our rebounding will again be an abomination, possibly worse..

Not saying it will be a huge upgrade at all, but I think they REALLY need to go after a big man using the remaining exception they have. They NEED depth behind Horford and Baynes.

And I agree with most of what you say.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 24, 2017, 04:51:21 PM
Lol and even Mazz is surprised Ainge made this move. We all are..
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on August 27, 2017, 12:10:34 PM
I feel conflicted now.

As much as I hate the trade, now that there's a chance to have it voided, I'm having second thoughts about it LOL.

Strange but funny times these are.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: iadera on August 28, 2017, 03:47:30 AM
The only thing that Ainge could do, if in some scenario the trade is canceled, is to try to go with same players + another picks and players after Davis.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on October 02, 2017, 10:59:28 PM
Kyrie Irving with 9 points, 3 assists, 4 rebounds, 1 turnover and a -4 rating.

Isaiah Thomas meanwhile with 0 turnovers and a 0 rating to start the season.

This Irving trade = BUST!  :laugh:

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: OldSchoolDude on October 03, 2017, 12:04:19 AM
IT is hurt.  He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.  At one point in the summer IT said he would be ready to start the season, now he is mid to late December at best.  His game is based on his speed.  It is more likely then not that he will lose a step with this injury.  He'll still be able to spot up for 3's and blow by slow mediocre defenders but he is done vs quicker defenders.  I think he is done as an all star.  I do not think he will get a max deal from Cleveland and will go to a below average team for a chance to stay the man rather than come off the bench on a contender for 6th man money.  Cleveland asked for extra because the realized IT was hurt worse than he was letting on during all his talk about how he would be back better than ever. People have be screaming for Danny to trade one of the Brooklyn picks and now that he did and netted a legit all star who has that cold blooded knock out end game and people want to complain. We bought low on IT and sold high.  Add IT to one of one season wonder videos or documentaries because he is not going to be the player he was last year again. 
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Roy H. on October 03, 2017, 06:37:29 AM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on October 03, 2017, 07:05:31 PM
IT is hurt.  He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.  At one point in the summer IT said he would be ready to start the season, now he is mid to late December at best.  His game is based on his speed.  It is more likely then not that he will lose a step with this injury.  He'll still be able to spot up for 3's and blow by slow mediocre defenders but he is done vs quicker defenders.  I think he is done as an all star.  I do not think he will get a max deal from Cleveland and will go to a below average team for a chance to stay the man rather than come off the bench on a contender for 6th man money.  Cleveland asked for extra because the realized IT was hurt worse than he was letting on during all his talk about how he would be back better than ever. People have be screaming for Danny to trade one of the Brooklyn picks and now that he did and netted a legit all star who has that cold blooded knock out end game and people want to complain. We bought low on IT and sold high.  Add IT to one of one season wonder videos or documentaries because he is not going to be the player he was last year again.

I highly doubt that's true.

And maybe he doesn't replicate his 29/6 MVP-worthy season, but it seems like a stretch to say he's essentially "done".

If he comes back 2nd half pretty much healthy and still getting 23-25 PPG, that's an all-star caliber player still.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: mctyson on October 03, 2017, 07:10:58 PM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.

Do not compare plodding bigs to a 5'9" PG who needs every ounce of bounce and burst to succeed.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: crimson_stallion on October 03, 2017, 07:39:27 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?

1.  Irving is better then Thomas - watching yesterday, he showed some legit flashes of passing ability and defensive effort that I've never seen before from him (or from Thomas, for that matter).  If he keeps up that defensive effort then he's going to be so much better then Thomas that it's not even funny.  If he doesn't keep it up and remains a major defensive liability, then he'll still be better then Thomas.

2. I take it you didn't watch Baynes and Theis play yesterday?
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: incoherent on October 03, 2017, 07:40:13 PM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.

Do not compare plodding bigs to a 5'9" PG who needs every ounce of bounce and burst to succeed.

He's not comparing them. He is simply pointing out how incorrect the statement he quoted is.

Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Eddie20 on October 03, 2017, 08:23:02 PM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.

Do not compare plodding bigs to a 5'9" PG who needs every ounce of bounce and burst to succeed.

Yeah, plus it seems that unlike Thomas, who continued playing on a bad hip, Aldridge had surgery immediately. As the Thomas ESPN article points out, "If you have a patient who has an acute injury and has cartilage damage, I find it's better to intervene earlier than later," Philippon says, "because the longer you wait with these injuries, that tends to lead to more problems."

Compare that to Aldridge's case:

Portland Trail Blazers forward/center LaMarcus Aldridge will undergo arthroscopic surgery on his right hip to repair a labral tear and will miss the remainder of the season, it was announced today by the team.

"In his most recent MRI, and following further evaluation, it's been determined that LaMarcus has a slight labral tear and will require arthroscopic surgery," said Acting General Manager Chad Buchanan. "LaMarcus' priority is that he's 100-percent healthy going into training camp this fall and we all feel this is the best course. He's had an All-Star year and his long-term health is the most important thing to consider."

Aldridge told reporters in Portland on Thursday that he had suffered a "very slight" tear and that he expected his recovery period would take 2-4 months. Aldridge said that he could possibly make a return in time to compete for USA Basketball during the 2012 Olympics but also noted that he wouldn't "push it."

"Talking to the doctor over and over again, this is very precautionary and very smart to do right now because it's a very small tear right now," Aldridge said. "If you play on it and wait, it could become something major."
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on October 03, 2017, 11:14:19 PM
https://twitter.com/tonymassarotti/status/753715692294242308

Mazz said that^ (link) in response to the Drew Pomeranz trade the Red Sox did last summer, and frankly, I thought the same thing about that one lol (a Top-15 prospect in ALL of MLB for a dang #3-4 starter???).

But this trade, is AWFUL. Cleveland won it.

Kyrie Irving is NOT that much better than Isaiah Thomas, and the fact that they needed to include the Brooklyn Pick in this deal (with NO protections)... YIKES. I'm not super upset about losing Zizic and Crowder (although I will miss Crowder a ton), but this deal overall.... YUCK.

Say what you want about Isaiah Thomas, but he's the ONLY reason this team made the playoffs in 2015 and made the ECF last season. He also got Hayward and Horford here and did get us a meeting with Durant that summer we got Horford too. And even after all that he's done... just seeing him traded away like this makes it look like the Celtics did him dirty.

I'm sorry, but I'm NOT a fan of this trade one bit. It will look A LOT worse if Brooklyn's pick lands 1-3 and the Cavs get any of Porter or Bagley (YUCK again...).

And what exactly is our big man depth behind Horford now? Baynes... then who?

1.  Irving is better then Thomas - watching yesterday, he showed some legit flashes of passing ability and defensive effort that I've never seen before from him (or from Thomas, for that matter).  If he keeps up that defensive effort then he's going to be so much better then Thomas that it's not even funny.  If he doesn't keep it up and remains a major defensive liability, then he'll still be better then Thomas.

2. I take it you didn't watch Baynes and Theis play yesterday?

Well in all fairness this post was made a month ago so yeah I'll admit I underestimated them (Theis and Baynes).  :P
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: Phantom255x on October 03, 2017, 11:18:52 PM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.

Do not compare plodding bigs to a 5'9" PG who needs every ounce of bounce and burst to succeed.

Yeah, plus it seems that unlike Thomas, who continued playing on a bad hip, Aldridge had surgery immediately. As the Thomas ESPN article points out, "If you have a patient who has an acute injury and has cartilage damage, I find it's better to intervene earlier than later," Philippon says, "because the longer you wait with these injuries, that tends to lead to more problems."

Compare that to Aldridge's case:

Portland Trail Blazers forward/center LaMarcus Aldridge will undergo arthroscopic surgery on his right hip to repair a labral tear and will miss the remainder of the season, it was announced today by the team.

"In his most recent MRI, and following further evaluation, it's been determined that LaMarcus has a slight labral tear and will require arthroscopic surgery," said Acting General Manager Chad Buchanan. "LaMarcus' priority is that he's 100-percent healthy going into training camp this fall and we all feel this is the best course. He's had an All-Star year and his long-term health is the most important thing to consider."

Aldridge told reporters in Portland on Thursday that he had suffered a "very slight" tear and that he expected his recovery period would take 2-4 months. Aldridge said that he could possibly make a return in time to compete for USA Basketball during the 2012 Olympics but also noted that he wouldn't "push it."

"Talking to the doctor over and over again, this is very precautionary and very smart to do right now because it's a very small tear right now," Aldridge said. "If you play on it and wait, it could become something major."


Right, except as Roy H. said, very few have had hip surgery and Aldridge is someone who had hip surgery and returned and played like an all-star still.

So to say, "a guy who has hip surgery can never come back and be an all-star again" is a bit premature and not entirely correct.
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: OldSchoolDude on October 03, 2017, 11:48:35 PM
Quote
He didn't want surgery because no one has ever returned to from from that particular surgery to play at a high level.

Very few players have had hip surgery. The one star player who did, Lamarcus Aldridge, played at an all-star level after his return.

Do not compare plodding bigs to a 5'9" PG who needs every ounce of bounce and burst to succeed.

Yeah, plus it seems that unlike Thomas, who continued playing on a bad hip, Aldridge had surgery immediately. As the Thomas ESPN article points out, "If you have a patient who has an acute injury and has cartilage damage, I find it's better to intervene earlier than later," Philippon says, "because the longer you wait with these injuries, that tends to lead to more problems."

Compare that to Aldridge's case:

Portland Trail Blazers forward/center LaMarcus Aldridge will undergo arthroscopic surgery on his right hip to repair a labral tear and will miss the remainder of the season, it was announced today by the team.

"In his most recent MRI, and following further evaluation, it's been determined that LaMarcus has a slight labral tear and will require arthroscopic surgery," said Acting General Manager Chad Buchanan. "LaMarcus' priority is that he's 100-percent healthy going into training camp this fall and we all feel this is the best course. He's had an All-Star year and his long-term health is the most important thing to consider."

Aldridge told reporters in Portland on Thursday that he had suffered a "very slight" tear and that he expected his recovery period would take 2-4 months. Aldridge said that he could possibly make a return in time to compete for USA Basketball during the 2012 Olympics but also noted that he wouldn't "push it."

"Talking to the doctor over and over again, this is very precautionary and very smart to do right now because it's a very small tear right now," Aldridge said. "If you play on it and wait, it could become something major."


Right, except as Roy H. said, very few have had hip surgery and Aldridge is someone who had hip surgery and returned and played like an all-star still.

So to say, "a guy who has hip surgery can never come back and be an all-star again" is a bit premature and not entirely correct.

When there was a lot of discussion about Cleveland possibly rejecting the trade one of the sports networks talked about athletic players who had hsd the surgery IT would have had.  They explained how none of them ever played the same again.  They were trying to explain why a guy like IT would pass on the surgery.  The painted that hip surgery in the same light that ACL surgery used to be.  I forget what network that was on, but they seemed to defend Cleveland asking for more while at the same time defending IT passing on the surgery.  It is turning 30 and coming of a serious leg injury.  His game is based off his speed.  He is done. Danny saw that and dumped him for value. 
Title: Re: To Quote What Tony Massarotti Once Said: I. HATE. THIS. TRADE.
Post by: TheSlipperyWhistle on October 27, 2017, 02:01:53 PM
What is a GM's job?
To assemble a team to win championships.
Were the 2016-2017 Celtics ready to win a championship?
No.
Did things have to change?
Yes.
Did everyone love IT and his heart?
Yes.
Is Kyrie Irving better (both now and future looking) than IT?
Yes.
Did we take a step back in the "stretch" position?
Jaylen and Tatum are handling it just fine, the loss of Crowder is not felt.
Did we need another TOP 3 pick?
Always nice to have, but we have a stable of great prospects (Tatum, Brown, Rozier)
Stop Crying. This was a good trade. So was the Philly pick trade. Have you seen the shooting form on Fultz? has MCW written all over him.