Celtics Off-Season News

[jambr380]

Celtics to sign Mfiondu Kabengele to two-way contract after solid Summer League showing

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2022/07/celtics-to-sign-mfiondu-kabengele-to-two-way-contract-after-solid-summer-league-showing.html?outputType=amp

Kabengele has all of the physical tools to be an NBA player. 6’10”/250lbs with a 7’3” wingspan. He’s athletic and a quick leaper. Can’t wait for Horford to start working with the kid.

Love it!! Alway like him & was hoping Celtics would draft him couple years ago..Davidson & Begarin look pretty good..Pritchard better have a good preseason coming up

Many of us really like Pritchard, but does he have a future with this team?  Short PG's don't fit with the C's current defensive plan as they get caught on switches against much taller players.  We already had Kemba and IT and everyone knows how that worked out.

Even with the injuries, Kemba and IT worked out extraordinarily well even though they were smaller. IT's teams always greatly outperformed expectations and Kemba's first year in Boston we were 48-24 (.667), as opposed to our 51-31 (.621) record last season. We were also a great defensive team under Stevens for most of his tenure as coach. We made it to the ECF without Hayward (twice, actually), but lost the first two games of the series before he returned. If he had been able to come back at the beginning of that series, we might be talking about the 2020 NBA Champion Boston Celtics.

I get it, we had a nice run at the end of last season and added a couple of nice pieces to a great team, but this team specifically has a history of performing well with small PGs. Frankly, our most disappointing seasons (2018-19 and 2020-21) were ones where we were expected to do well.

[Goldstar88]

Kabengele getting a two-way instead of one of the final standard contracts makes me wonder if we see a trade today or tomorrow for a veteran center. Not sure if the budget's there, but there's a handful of centers out there who should be available for Pritchard or less if you don't have to match salary.

Pickings are slim. One name I haven’t heard as a possible target is Cody Zeller. He is 29 with career averages of 8pts/6rebs while playing 22mpg. Cody was getting 13mins off the bench for Portland last season before suffering a knee fracture in January. The injury report said it would be 8-10 weeks for recovery and the trailblazers shut him down for the year after that.

Lemarcus Aldridge wouldn’t be a bad option as well for 10-15mpg.

So, you're not wrong about pickings being slim, but (again, and it's a significant if) if the budget is there any/all of Olynyk, Nerlens Noel, Derrick Favors, and maybe Zach Collins should be available for cheap and fit into the TPE. Maybe you could get one of Powell or Kleber out of Dallas for a bit more considering the summer they had.

Thing is, it wouldn’t be cheap. Since the team is over the luxury tax, I believe trading for one those players who make between $7M-$12M/year would ultimately cost the team 2-3 times their salary. Assuming Rob plays 30mpg and Al see’s 10mpg at center, that’s a ton of money to payout for a player that’s basically an insurance policy/3rd stringer. They would see 8mpg unless one of Rob or Al was missing a game(s).

[Goldstar88]

Celtics to sign Mfiondu Kabengele to two-way contract after solid Summer League showing

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2022/07/celtics-to-sign-mfiondu-kabengele-to-two-way-contract-after-solid-summer-league-showing.html?outputType=amp

Kabengele has all of the physical tools to be an NBA player. 6’10”/250lbs with a 7’3” wingspan. He’s athletic and a quick leaper. Can’t wait for Horford to start working with the kid.

Love it!! Alway like him & was hoping Celtics would draft him couple years ago..Davidson & Begarin look pretty good..Pritchard better have a good preseason coming up

Many of us really like Pritchard, but does he have a future with this team?  Short PG's don't fit with the C's current defensive plan as they get caught on switches against much taller players.  We already had Kemba and IT and everyone knows how that worked out.

Even with the injuries, Kemba and IT worked out extraordinarily well even though they were smaller. IT's teams always greatly outperformed expectations and Kemba's first year in Boston we were 48-24 (.667), as opposed to our 51-31 (.621) record last season. We were also a great defensive team under Stevens for most of his tenure as coach. We made it to the ECF without Hayward (twice, actually), but lost the first two games of the series before he returned. If he had been able to come back at the beginning of that series, we might be talking about the 2020 NBA Champion Boston Celtics.

I get it, we had a nice run at the end of last season and added a couple of nice pieces to a great team, but this team specifically has a history of performing well with small PGs. Frankly, our most disappointing seasons (2018-19 and 2020-21) were ones where we were expected to do well.

Those teams did well, but not well enough. The Celtics team philosophy since Brad has become GM has changed. Their identity is playing extremely high level defense and small guards don’t work in that equation. Brad has said many occasions that he values big, athletic, switchable defenders.

To Payton’s credit, his defense looked a lot better last year. He’s still a small guard at 6’1”/195lbs, but he’s still bigger and stronger than IT or Kemba. Those two would completely tank what the C’s try to do defensively even if they played 10-15mins per game. Payton is also a better shooter than either of them.

[nickagneta]

I have never liked associating the luxury tax increase to one player being added. Sure any player being added means the tax increases by X, but they are in the luxury tax because of the salaries of every player.

So the question shouldn't be is that player worth X, it should be is the entire team worth X.

A player that will get good run and make significant contributions in the playoffs, thereby making the team that much better and possibly putting them over the top is definitely worth X to the total value of the team. 

[jambr380]

Celtics to sign Mfiondu Kabengele to two-way contract after solid Summer League showing

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2022/07/celtics-to-sign-mfiondu-kabengele-to-two-way-contract-after-solid-summer-league-showing.html?outputType=amp

Kabengele has all of the physical tools to be an NBA player. 6’10”/250lbs with a 7’3” wingspan. He’s athletic and a quick leaper. Can’t wait for Horford to start working with the kid.

Love it!! Alway like him & was hoping Celtics would draft him couple years ago..Davidson & Begarin look pretty good..Pritchard better have a good preseason coming up

Many of us really like Pritchard, but does he have a future with this team?  Short PG's don't fit with the C's current defensive plan as they get caught on switches against much taller players.  We already had Kemba and IT and everyone knows how that worked out.

Even with the injuries, Kemba and IT worked out extraordinarily well even though they were smaller. IT's teams always greatly outperformed expectations and Kemba's first year in Boston we were 48-24 (.667), as opposed to our 51-31 (.621) record last season. We were also a great defensive team under Stevens for most of his tenure as coach. We made it to the ECF without Hayward (twice, actually), but lost the first two games of the series before he returned. If he had been able to come back at the beginning of that series, we might be talking about the 2020 NBA Champion Boston Celtics.

I get it, we had a nice run at the end of last season and added a couple of nice pieces to a great team, but this team specifically has a history of performing well with small PGs. Frankly, our most disappointing seasons (2018-19 and 2020-21) were ones where we were expected to do well.

Those teams did well, but not well enough. The Celtics team philosophy since Brad has become GM has changed. Their identity is playing extremely high level defense and small guards don’t work in that equation. Brad has said on so many occasions that he is looking for big, athletic, switchable defenders.

To Payton’s credit, his defense looked a lot better last year. He’s still a small guard at 6’1”/195lbs, but he’s bigger and stronger than IT or Kemba. Those two would completely tank what the C’s try to do defensively even if they played 10-15mins. Payton is also a better shooter than either of them.

My point was those teams were just fine and played as well - or better - healthy than this team that also didn't win a Title. It's extremely common for people to totally sh- on something they recently experienced because they now maybe doing slightly better (or just different). I hate this attitude. There's no reason you can't enjoy and appreciate what you once had, while also looking forward to the future that is in front of you. While different, they can both be positive experiences.

And to bring this back around to this topic, I fully believe that with Hayward returning two games earlier we win the 2020 NBA Championship - or are at least favorites heading into the Finals. As to Pritchard specifically, he is basically a 3rd string Guard on this roster. If we could play Title contending basketball with Kemba and IT, I am not too worried if our 3rd string Guard is a versatile defensive defender.

[Goldstar88]

I have never liked associating the luxury tax increase to one player being added. Sure any player being added means the tax increases by X, but they are in the luxury tax because of the salaries of every player.

So the question shouldn't be is that player worth X, it should be is the entire team worth X.

A player that will get good run and make significant contributions in the playoffs, thereby making the team that much better and possibly putting them over the top is definitely worth X to the total value of the team.

I agree, but at the end of the day it’s a business and the teams are going to do a cost-benefit analysis on each player. The only way I see a backup Center making significant contributions is if Rob and/or Al miss time. The team is essentially replacing Theis’s role, which really wasn’t much of a role, but more an insurance policy.

[Goldstar88]

Celtics to sign Mfiondu Kabengele to two-way contract after solid Summer League showing

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2022/07/celtics-to-sign-mfiondu-kabengele-to-two-way-contract-after-solid-summer-league-showing.html?outputType=amp

Kabengele has all of the physical tools to be an NBA player. 6’10”/250lbs with a 7’3” wingspan. He’s athletic and a quick leaper. Can’t wait for Horford to start working with the kid.

Love it!! Alway like him & was hoping Celtics would draft him couple years ago..Davidson & Begarin look pretty good..Pritchard better have a good preseason coming up

Many of us really like Pritchard, but does he have a future with this team?  Short PG's don't fit with the C's current defensive plan as they get caught on switches against much taller players.  We already had Kemba and IT and everyone knows how that worked out.

Even with the injuries, Kemba and IT worked out extraordinarily well even though they were smaller. IT's teams always greatly outperformed expectations and Kemba's first year in Boston we were 48-24 (.667), as opposed to our 51-31 (.621) record last season. We were also a great defensive team under Stevens for most of his tenure as coach. We made it to the ECF without Hayward (twice, actually), but lost the first two games of the series before he returned. If he had been able to come back at the beginning of that series, we might be talking about the 2020 NBA Champion Boston Celtics.

I get it, we had a nice run at the end of last season and added a couple of nice pieces to a great team, but this team specifically has a history of performing well with small PGs. Frankly, our most disappointing seasons (2018-19 and 2020-21) were ones where we were expected to do well.

Those teams did well, but not well enough. The Celtics team philosophy since Brad has become GM has changed. Their identity is playing extremely high level defense and small guards don’t work in that equation. Brad has said on so many occasions that he is looking for big, athletic, switchable defenders.

To Payton’s credit, his defense looked a lot better last year. He’s still a small guard at 6’1”/195lbs, but he’s bigger and stronger than IT or Kemba. Those two would completely tank what the C’s try to do defensively even if they played 10-15mins. Payton is also a better shooter than either of them.

My point was those teams were just fine and played as well - or better - healthy than this team that also didn't win a Title. It's extremely common for people to totally sh- on something they recently experienced because they now maybe doing slightly better (or just different). I hate this attitude. There's no reason you can't enjoy and appreciate what you once had, while also looking forward to the future that is in front of you. While different, they can both be positive experiences.

And to bring this back around to this topic, I fully believe that with Hayward returning two games earlier we win the 2020 NBA Championship - or are at least favorites heading into the Finals. As to Pritchard specifically, he is basically a 3rd string Guard on this roster. If we could play Title contending basketball with Kemba and IT, I am not too worried if our 3rd string Guard is a versatile defensive defender.

I enjoyed watching those teams, but ultimately they always fell short of making it to the next step, which is the Finals. This years team with their new philosophy made it. When the C’s faced the Heat in the conference finals the year before last, Spolestra completely dismantled our defense when Kemba was in the game. You can’t have a guy like that on the court if your teams Identity is being elite defensively. This is the same reason Walker didn’t work out in NY. He became unplayable.

[tenn_smoothie]

Kabengele getting a two-way instead of one of the final standard contracts makes me wonder if we see a trade today or tomorrow for a veteran center. Not sure if the budget's there, but there's a handful of centers out there who should be available for Pritchard or less if you don't have to match salary.

I hope so. Karalis is speculating that the roster spot is going to Matt Ryan.

We desperately need a rebounding center with some muscle and a mean streak.
Our team is too soft and gets outrebounded by smaller rosters.

[Surferdad]

Celtics to sign Mfiondu Kabengele to two-way contract after solid Summer League showing

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2022/07/celtics-to-sign-mfiondu-kabengele-to-two-way-contract-after-solid-summer-league-showing.html?outputType=amp

Kabengele has all of the physical tools to be an NBA player. 6’10”/250lbs with a 7’3” wingspan. He’s athletic and a quick leaper. Can’t wait for Horford to start working with the kid.

Love it!! Alway like him & was hoping Celtics would draft him couple years ago..Davidson & Begarin look pretty good..Pritchard better have a good preseason coming up

Many of us really like Pritchard, but does he have a future with this team?  Short PG's don't fit with the C's current defensive plan as they get caught on switches against much taller players.  We already had Kemba and IT and everyone knows how that worked out.

Even with the injuries, Kemba and IT worked out extraordinarily well even though they were smaller. IT's teams always greatly outperformed expectations and Kemba's first year in Boston we were 48-24 (.667), as opposed to our 51-31 (.621) record last season. We were also a great defensive team under Stevens for most of his tenure as coach. We made it to the ECF without Hayward (twice, actually), but lost the first two games of the series before he returned. If he had been able to come back at the beginning of that series, we might be talking about the 2020 NBA Champion Boston Celtics.

I get it, we had a nice run at the end of last season and added a couple of nice pieces to a great team, but this team specifically has a history of performing well with small PGs. Frankly, our most disappointing seasons (2018-19 and 2020-21) were ones where we were expected to do well.

Those teams did well, but not well enough. The Celtics team philosophy since Brad has become GM has changed. Their identity is playing extremely high level defense and small guards don’t work in that equation. Brad has said on so many occasions that he is looking for big, athletic, switchable defenders.

To Payton’s credit, his defense looked a lot better last year. He’s still a small guard at 6’1”/195lbs, but he’s bigger and stronger than IT or Kemba. Those two would completely tank what the C’s try to do defensively even if they played 10-15mins. Payton is also a better shooter than either of them.

My point was those teams were just fine and played as well - or better - healthy than this team that also didn't win a Title. It's extremely common for people to totally sh- on something they recently experienced because they now maybe doing slightly better (or just different). I hate this attitude. There's no reason you can't enjoy and appreciate what you once had, while also looking forward to the future that is in front of you. While different, they can both be positive experiences.

And to bring this back around to this topic, I fully believe that with Hayward returning two games earlier we win the 2020 NBA Championship - or are at least favorites heading into the Finals. As to Pritchard specifically, he is basically a 3rd string Guard on this roster. If we could play Title contending basketball with Kemba and IT, I am not too worried if our 3rd string Guard is a versatile defensive defender.

I enjoyed watching those teams, but ultimately they always fell short of making it to the next step, which is the Finals. This years team with their new philosophy made it. When the C’s faced the Heat in the conference finals the year before last, Spolestra completely dismantled our defense when Kemba was in the game. You can’t have a guy like that on the court if your teams Identity is being elite defensively. This is the same reason Walker didn’t work out in NY. He became unplayable.

Yes that's my point, jambr380.  I liked those teams too and making the ECF is playing "well", but obviously not well enough.  Pritchard's perimeter man-defense is very good and he switches quickly too, but if he's on the box with a bigger man, they just shoot over him.

[Surferdad]

Kabengele getting a two-way instead of one of the final standard contracts makes me wonder if we see a trade today or tomorrow for a veteran center. Not sure if the budget's there, but there's a handful of centers out there who should be available for Pritchard or less if you don't have to match salary.

I don't see the C's using the $17M TPE but perhaps one of the smaller ones later.  There's simply no rush to get that ring-chasing vet center.

[Goldstar88]

Hope he’s right…

Tony Parker believes Celtics can learn valuable lessons from 2014 Spurs

Tony Parker believes his team reached basketball nirvana because of an NBA Finals loss the previous season. As great as San Antonio teams were regularly during that time, Parker said motivation from a crushing loss to the Heat in 2013 drove the Spurs to what likely was the best hoops of their golden era.

“For the Celtics,” Parker said recently, “that’s what they have to do.”

Ime Udoka, an assistant coach for that Spurs team, wasted no time delivering a similar message to the Celtics. Immediately after the final loss to the Warriors, Udoka told his players they would need to use the experience to propel them forward. He wanted the Celtics to learn from Golden State’s consistency and IQ.

“He was with us in those years,” Parker said. “So he can definitely take some stuff from what we had to go through. I played with him as teammates and had him as a coach. He’s been through everything with us, so he knows better than anybody how to bounce back from a tough NBA Finals loss.”

“For me, the way we lost in 2013, it created what happened in 2014,” Parker said. “Maybe one of the best finals in NBA history. Maybe the best Spurs basketball that we played. In 2014, the way we played, the passing game, everything, we were maybe at the highest level of my whole career. It started with a tough loss in 2013.”

[KeepBigAl]

I like Kabengele, but he seems smallish for a center.  I know they list him at 250, but bigger summer league centers seemed to noticeably outsize him.  Happy to have him available, just doesn't fill the need for true size off the bench (and Kornet doesn't either bc he gets pushed around so easily even at his height).

[Goldstar88]

I like Kabengele, but he seems smallish for a center.  I know they list him at 250, but bigger summer league centers seemed to noticeably outsize him.  Happy to have him available, just doesn't fill the need for true size off the bench (and Kornet doesn't either bc he gets pushed around so easily even at his height).

Kabengele was officially measured at 6’10.5”/256lbs at the draft combine with a 7’3” reach. Also had a 35.5” vertical. He’s bigger than Rob, Al, Gallo and Grant in both height/weight. So unless you are worried about everyone’s size at C, you shouldn’t have to worry about Kabengele.

[Vermont Green]

I like Kabengele, but he seems smallish for a center.  I know they list him at 250, but bigger summer league centers seemed to noticeably outsize him.  Happy to have him available, just doesn't fill the need for true size off the bench (and Kornet doesn't either bc he gets pushed around so easily even at his height).

Kabengele was officially measured at 6’10.5”/256lbs at the draft combine with a 7’3” reach. Also had a 35.5” vertical. He’s bigger than Rob, Al, Gallo and Grant in both height/weight. So unless you are worried about everyone’s size at C, you shouldn’t have to worry about Kabengele.

This draft measurement was in shoes.  The official measurements of NBA players is now done without shoes.  I think they have him at 6'-9", so yes, much bigger than Grant, the same as RWill or Horford (both listed at 6'-9"), but not as big as Gallinari (listed at 6'-10").  Definitely an impressive wingspan which of course is important.  I don't think size or length is the issue for him.

As to his position, it seems he is rightfully modeling himself after Al Horford.  Horford is not really either a natural PF or C but can play either.  "Tweener" is not usually considered a compliment but for Horford it is representative of his versatility.  I think if Kabengele develops the athletic ability and skill to play in the NBA, he will be fine at either position.  As I said, size won't be the issue, ability will be.  He may be more of a PF than a C but I think he he will either develop the skills and be fine in either role or he won't and he will struggle in either role.

After a much improved sophomore season, Mfiondu Kabengele showed up at the combine and measured out at a really impressive size for an NBA power forward. At 6’10.5” in shoes,

[Celtics2021]

I like Kabengele, but he seems smallish for a center.  I know they list him at 250, but bigger summer league centers seemed to noticeably outsize him.  Happy to have him available, just doesn't fill the need for true size off the bench (and Kornet doesn't either bc he gets pushed around so easily even at his height).

Kabengele was officially measured at 6’10.5”/256lbs at the draft combine with a 7’3” reach. Also had a 35.5” vertical. He’s bigger than Rob, Al, Gallo and Grant in both height/weight. So unless you are worried about everyone’s size at C, you shouldn’t have to worry about Kabengele.

This draft measurement was in shoes.  The official measurements of NBA players is now done without shoes.  I think they have him at 6'-9", so yes, much bigger than Grant, the same as RWill or Horford (both listed at 6'-9"), but not as big as Gallinari (listed at 6'-10").  Definitely an impressive wingspan which of course is important.  I don't think size or length is the issue for him.

As to his position, it seems he is rightfully modeling himself after Al Horford.  Horford is not really either a natural PF or C but can play either.  "Tweener" is not usually considered a compliment but for Horford it is representative of his versatility.  I think if Kabengele develops the athletic ability and skill to play in the NBA, he will be fine at either position.  As I said, size won't be the issue, ability will be.  He may be more of a PF than a C but I think he he will either develop the skills and be fine in either role or he won't and he will struggle in either role.

After a much improved sophomore season, Mfiondu Kabengele showed up at the combine and measured out at a really impressive size for an NBA power forward. At 6’10.5” in shoes,

For what it’s worth, Horford was measured at 6’8” without shoes at the combine, while Kabengele was measured at 6’8.75, so Kabengele is indeed taller.  He’s got three inches on Grant’s shoeless height.  Williams didn’t attend his combine, so we don’t have a verified height, but the Celtics have him at 6’8” officially, which is supposedly without shoes.  They must round up, because Grant is listed as 6’6”, so Kabengele would be 6’9” officially, making him taller than Rob.

We also don’t have an official height for Gallinari from the combine, so I guess we’ll have to wait for training camp heights on him.