If needed, should Ainge actually put Tatum in package for AD? Nope, walk away.

[nickagneta]

Tatum, Brown, picks for AD and I wouldn’t think twice. Matching salary will be an issue but Ainge will figure it out.

I'd trade both Brown and Tatum to get AD assuming he gives indications that he'd re-sign with us.  The trade can't be actually made until Kyrie re-signs in free agency.  So the players chosen with those "NOP picks" can be signed and used to help salary match.

Tatum and Brown and the Memphis and Sacto picks seems like way better than anyone else could offer.  I'd hope to keep Brown or the Memphis pick out of it.

I’m predicting Tatum + Smart + Williams + three #1s

Right there with you Roy. That meets the salary and doesn't completely ruin the Boston bench.

Kyrie
Brown
Hayward
Davis
Horford

Yabusele
Ojeleye
Baynes
Morris or Rozier(re-signed after Horford opts out and comes back next year much cheaper to afford Morris or Rozier)
Wanamaker
Taxpayer MLE wing
Vet min contracts to fill out the rest

I think that's a team that can win it all.

I think a Danny will fight to keep Smart like he did Rondo. Smart won’t be a deal breaker. Tatum would be and Danny will have to include him in the offer.

Except without Smart's $12.5 million being included, the Celtics have little chance to match money.

Horford will not be going anywhere unless he wants to. Horford has the ability to opt out so if Danny tries to include Horford, Al can simply opt out and screw things up. Danny knows this so he would have to get Al's permission to be included and I doubt Al gives it.

Obviously Horford wouldn't like being traded, but if he doesn't pick up his option, he has to go elsewhere as well. Via a trade there are probably good destinations available (not necessarily New Orleans, 3-team-trade possible, maybe to Minnesota or Portland), so why leave millions on the table out of spite? No team is going to give a 33-year old player a 30-million-a-year-contract. Probably more in the neighbourhood of 15-20 million.

Al wants to be in Boston. If suddenly the C's are going to want to move on from Al, Al most likely would opt out to get one last very good contract to be where he and his family want to be.

I think we just need to accept that Horford is going nowhere in a Davis deal, especially since Horford would be the perfect player to pair with Davis in the C's frontcourt. There will be no centers. Just a point guard, two wings, and two PFs where either can switch to a center and defend him at any time.

[Roy H.]

Thought it was a good idea to bump this since there's been a lot of AD talk going around. I'm still against it, but when you hear Tatum himself say "I'd trade myself for AD" and other rumors and reports popping up, you kind of get the feeling that's Ainge's master plan this summer: Bidding war for AD and be willing to flip Tatum if needed.

It reminds me of the KG rumors.  The vast majority of Celtics fans -- both here and in the Boston Globe's poll -- were against a trade for KG.  They didn't want to trade Big Al, they thought we'd have too little depth, etc.  One of the posters I was closest to on here quit the blog and allegedly gave up watching the Celtics after the Celts traded Jefferson, because he truly thought the young kids would lead us to the promised land, and he couldn't forgive Danny.

[CelticsQuestFor18]

Thought it was a good idea to bump this since there's been a lot of AD talk going around. I'm still against it, but when you hear Tatum himself say "I'd trade myself for AD" and other rumors and reports popping up, you kind of get the feeling that's Ainge's master plan this summer: Bidding war for AD and be willing to flip Tatum if needed.

It reminds me of the KG rumors.  The vast majority of Celtics fans -- both here and in the Boston Globe's poll -- were against a trade for KG.  They didn't want to trade Big Al, they thought we'd have too little depth, etc.  One of the posters I was closest to on here quit the blog and allegedly gave up watching the Celtics after the Celts traded Jefferson, because he truly thought the young kids would lead us to the promised land, and he couldn't forgive Danny.

Wait seriously? And that poster actually never returned here even when they won it all??

[Phantom255x]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

[Roy H.]

Thought it was a good idea to bump this since there's been a lot of AD talk going around. I'm still against it, but when you hear Tatum himself say "I'd trade myself for AD" and other rumors and reports popping up, you kind of get the feeling that's Ainge's master plan this summer: Bidding war for AD and be willing to flip Tatum if needed.

It reminds me of the KG rumors.  The vast majority of Celtics fans -- both here and in the Boston Globe's poll -- were against a trade for KG.  They didn't want to trade Big Al, they thought we'd have too little depth, etc.  One of the posters I was closest to on here quit the blog and allegedly gave up watching the Celtics after the Celts traded Jefferson, because he truly thought the young kids would lead us to the promised land, and he couldn't forgive Danny.

Wait seriously? And that poster actually never returned here even when they won it all??

Yeah, it’s kind of sad, but it was a betrayal thing with him.  There are a lot of stubborn folks out there.

[RodyTur10]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

[Phantom255x]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

[nickagneta]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

[Phantom255x]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

Ugh why do trades have to be so complicated 

TP and thanks though! Yeah I recall you did say this earlier too lol. The 3rd team proposition is interesting too.

[keevsnick]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

Ugh why do trades have to be so complicated 

TP and thanks though! Yeah I recall you did say this earlier too lol. The 3rd team proposition is interesting too.

Yep, and at this point paying Rozier 14 million is an significant overpay anyway. Because of the BYC rules on a Rozier sign and trade you basically have to include Marcus Smart in any Anthony Davis trade. Even if you are sending both Brown and Tatum you can't get to the propper salary unless you are doing like a 7-1 trade. Al Horford has a player option so its hard too see him being used as salary balast, and Hayward has no value.

[Fierce1]

The question is do the Pels want Rozier?

[nickagneta]

The question is do the Pels want Rozier?

No it really isn't given the sign and trade problems he creates in any trade for Davis.

[Phantom255x]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

Ugh why do trades have to be so complicated 

TP and thanks though! Yeah I recall you did say this earlier too lol. The 3rd team proposition is interesting too.

Yep, and at this point paying Rozier 14 million is an significant overpay anyway. Because of the BYC rules on a Rozier sign and trade you basically have to include Marcus Smart in any Anthony Davis trade. Even if you are sending both Brown and Tatum you can't get to the propper salary unless you are doing like a 7-1 trade. Al Horford has a player option so its hard too see him being used as salary balast, and Hayward has no value.

Well trading Tatum and Smart both will be tough pills to swallow 

[nickagneta]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

Ugh why do trades have to be so complicated 

TP and thanks though! Yeah I recall you did say this earlier too lol. The 3rd team proposition is interesting too.

Yep, and at this point paying Rozier 14 million is an significant overpay anyway. Because of the BYC rules on a Rozier sign and trade you basically have to include Marcus Smart in any Anthony Davis trade. Even if you are sending both Brown and Tatum you can't get to the propper salary unless you are doing like a 7-1 trade. Al Horford has a player option so its hard too see him being used as salary balast, and Hayward has no value.

Well trading Tatum and Smart both will be tough pills to swallow 

Once upon a time trading Al Jefferson and Gerald Greene was a hard pill to swallow too.

[keevsnick]

Question, does this trade work salary-wise?

Rozier (S&T - 14M/Year), Tatum (~7.8M), Williams (2M), Yabusele (~3M) + Kings Pick (say, #13) + Grizzlies Pick + Clippers Pick (say, #17)? Something like that. Is it close or still not enough? I think @Nick mentioned we have to trade out about 21.6M to acquire him and that in Rozier's instance, only half his $$$ counts as going out in a S&T scenario.

Where is Saltlover?

But I think it can actually work.

Yeah I was wondering the same. Where is @salt. I miss those days I'd post a trade idea and salt would completely debunk it due to CBA/Salary Cap issues that I'd never known

I did this math for you about a month or 6 weeks ago. It doesn't work.

Pelicans trade Davis at $27.1 million so that is the Pelicans outgoing salary. That means they have to receive in salary from the Celtics a minimum salary of $21.6 million or a Max of $34 million.

So you want to include Rozier as a sign n trade but he is Base Year Compensation eligible so his salary counts as 50% outgoing but 100% incoming.

So your trade is

Tatum at $7.8 million
Rozier at $14 million incoming $7million outgoing.
Williams at $2 million
Yabusele at $3 million.

So as incoming salary the C's are at $26.8 million. They need incoming salary to be within  25%+/-$100k of that number meaning Davis' $27.1 million fits. Trade okay there.

But Rozier's outgoing only counts as $7 million so Boston's total outgoing is $19.8 million. Needing to take on salary that is at most 25% +/- $100k means Boston can take on a max salary of $24.8 million making Davis' $27.1 million way to much so trade not okay here. Trade fails.

If a third team gets involved it might get easier.

Ugh why do trades have to be so complicated 

TP and thanks though! Yeah I recall you did say this earlier too lol. The 3rd team proposition is interesting too.

Yep, and at this point paying Rozier 14 million is an significant overpay anyway. Because of the BYC rules on a Rozier sign and trade you basically have to include Marcus Smart in any Anthony Davis trade. Even if you are sending both Brown and Tatum you can't get to the propper salary unless you are doing like a 7-1 trade. Al Horford has a player option so its hard too see him being used as salary balast, and Hayward has no value.

Well trading Tatum and Smart both will be tough pills to swallow 

Which is probably the best sign there is that its fair value. Don't get me wrong, I would rather find a way to keep Smart but salary wise  its difficult to figure our how. And if NOP is gonna trade a top 5 player I don't see how Tatum isn't in the deal. Even if you assume you don't need to include him to have the bets deal (and I'm not sure that's true), I don't see how NOP goes back to its 7 fans with an AD to Boston  trade without netting Tatum. Might as well send the team to Seattle at that point.


On a side note, I would be eager to see what Tatum or Brown could do with more freedom on a team like the Pels.