Poll: If DA can't Land AD, Epic Failure

[droopdog7]

Well, not just Davis.  If we lose Kyrie for nothing, and thus don't get Davis, then that will be bad.

If the team can resign Kyrie then DA still has plenty of options to balance the roster.  I'd shop Tatum or Brown or both for a better fit.

Why is that bad? We have five first round picks this year and next and our team will be better without Kyrie.

It's certainly complicated but I don't completely disagree that the team could be better without Kyrie.  I would not say it's likely, but not impossible.

But the other thing I think I know is that a team without Kyrie or Davis is not a contender; not even close.  And, that team has really no way forward either.  The picks we have this year aren't worth very much to us or any other team mostly because the odds of getting a good starter with any of them are not that good.  We could get lucky but that's about it.

[Chris22]

Well, not just Davis.  If we lose Kyrie for nothing, and thus don't get Davis, then that will be bad.

If the team can resign Kyrie then DA still has plenty of options to balance the roster.  I'd shop Tatum or Brown or both for a better fit.

Why is that bad? We have five first round picks this year and next and our team will be better without Kyrie.

It's certainly complicated but I don't completely disagree that the team could be better without Kyrie.  I would not say it's likely, but not impossible.

But the other thing I think I know is that a team without Kyrie or Davis is not a contender; not even close.  And, that team has really no way forward either.  The picks we have this year aren't worth very much to us or any other team mostly because the odds of getting a good starter with any of them are not that good.  We could get lucky but that's about it.

I disagree.

Five first round draft picks and tons of cap space in 2021, plus our young guys. I actually like that option better than spending a hundred million on sad sack Kyrie who laid down like a dog in the playoffs.

[PhoSita]

The "worst case scenario" is AD traded to the Lakers, Kyrie signs with the Knicks, Horford opts out and signs with a contender, and the Celts go super young.

Even in that scenario, they still have Jaylen Brown, Jayson Tatum, three 1st round picks in this draft, the Memphis pick, Robert Williams, a good coach, Marcus Smart, and Gordon Hayward.

It could be muuuch worse.


Actually I think the "worst" case scenario is Kyrie re-signs but only for a year or two guaranteed, the Celts trade all their good stuff for AD, next year is rocky from the start, AD or Kyrie or both end up hurt by playoff time, and then AD leaves in free agency.  That's the complete disaster scenario.


Even if both Kyrie and Durant sign with the Knicks and the Lakers are able to trade for AD, I'd still rather be where the Celts are in terms of assets, roster, coach, and management than either of those moribund franchises.





How about the middle road?  What if Kyrie leaves and AD isn't coming, but Horford re-signs for 3-4 years at a reasonable figure, and then Danny trades Hayward plus one or two of the 1st rounders in this weak draft for Mike Conley?


Tell me you wouldn't be happy to watch Conley - Smart - Brown - Tatum - Horford next year.  Sure, they'll be an underdog to make the ECF, let alone the Finals, but I wouldn't put it past that group plus Stevens to find a way.



There are lots of good possibilities for this team that don't involve Anthony Davis.  There are also a few awful ones that do involve him.

I like Conley, but he's 31 with plenty of mileage and 56 playoff games under his belt... I wouldn't be surprised if Conley got injured before the playoffs, and we're left once again without a decent PG as our starter.

Could be.  Is he more likely to be injured than Kyrie?  AD?

I'm not saying the Celts should give up a bunch of assets for Conley.  I wouldn't mind if they decided not to even bother.  But trading Hayward and a pick or two for Conley seems like a decent middle of the road option, if they want to try to remain competitive while developing Brown / Tatum (hopefully) into stars.

The Conley - Horford two man game is something I'd love to see.

[droopdog7]

Well, not just Davis.  If we lose Kyrie for nothing, and thus don't get Davis, then that will be bad.

If the team can resign Kyrie then DA still has plenty of options to balance the roster.  I'd shop Tatum or Brown or both for a better fit.

Why is that bad? We have five first round picks this year and next and our team will be better without Kyrie.

It's certainly complicated but I don't completely disagree that the team could be better without Kyrie.  I would not say it's likely, but not impossible.

But the other thing I think I know is that a team without Kyrie or Davis is not a contender; not even close.  And, that team has really no way forward either.  The picks we have this year aren't worth very much to us or any other team mostly because the odds of getting a good starter with any of them are not that good.  We could get lucky but that's about it.

I disagree.

Five first round draft picks and tons of cap space in 2021, plus our young guys. I actually like that option better than spending a hundred million on sad sack Kyrie who laid down like a dog in the playoffs.

So you prefer to sit out for a couple of years and hope that these middling draft picks will turn into something and then wait for cap space (around the time Jaylen and Tatum) will need to be re-upped?  And then you need to hope that Jaylen (who I don't see as a star) and Tatum (who might be just like Kyrie in terms of his game) will blossom?

See, that is simply too much gambling and wishing for my taste.

[greg683x]

You traded a top 10 pick for Irving, if the plan to pair him with a star and contend falls through and both stars leave, them it’s an epic fail

Regardless of what you think of Colin Sexton, being able to pair him with Tatum and Jaylen Brown, all of which would be on rookie deals, would have been very exciting.

To be left with no Sexton, and on top of that, losing either or both of Tatum and Brown is devastating.

It’s an epic fail, but it’s not like there’s no going back on an epic fail.  Philly had an epic fail with trading for Fultz and they’ve recovered.

[Walker Wiggle]

Even if you don't trade for AD and you lose Kyrie for nothing, think about what this team is: A playoff team with two of the best young prospects in the league, a former Western conference all-star still regaining his form from a broken ankle, a do-it-all big man, three draft picks coming in this year, and a lottery pick coming up in the next two seasons.

Edit: Forgot to include an all-NBA defense combo guard whose offense is finally coming around.

[PhoSita]

Even if you don't trade for AD and you lose Kyrie for nothing, think about what this team is: A playoff team with two of the best young prospects in the league, a former Western conference all-star still regaining his form from a broken ankle, a do-it-all big man, three draft picks coming in this year, and a lottery pick coming up in the next two seasons.

Edit: Forgot to include an all-NBA defense combo guard whose offense is finally coming around.

I can guarantee there are a lot of fans out there who would love to be where the Celts are.

Especially fans of teams with awful owners (e.g. Bulls, Suns, Knicks, etc.)

[Roy H.]

Epic disappointment, for sure.  But, it's hard to find a ton of fault in a GM who has given us a core of Tatum and Brown to build around without ever having entered a full-blown rebound.  If Horford, Kyrie and Hayward all remain on board, all the better.

[mobilija]

Failure, but maybe not epic.

If Stars win championships, and the goal is championships then...
Danny hanging on to his "treasure trove" of picks and prospects and not trading for Cousins, Butler, George, Leonard and now not getting Davis would be a failure to get the necessary stars. However, being left with a nice young core and high quality vets is a nice consolation prize with the potential of maybe eventually becoming the requisite stars.

[PhoSita]

Failure, but maybe not epic.

If Stars win championships, and the goal is championships then...
Danny hanging on to his "treasure trove" of picks and prospects and not trading for Cousins, Butler, George, Leonard and now not getting Davis would be a failure to get the necessary stars. However, being left with a nice young core and high quality vets is a nice consolation prize with the potential of maybe eventually becoming the requisite stars.

I think of the names mentioned, Leonard is the only one who is definitely good enough to lead a team to a title.  Davis has the talent but not sure if he's there yet in terms of how he impacts a game.

Not going harder for Leonard looks bad in retrospect, but there were big question marks about his health and willingness to play.  There's also a very good chance he would have left after a single year, which is what he may do re: Toronto despite the nice run they're on.


I think Ainge is trying to do what he couldn't do with the KG era Celts -- put together a contender that can be in contention for a while.  The Garnett team thankfully was able to win in year one.  Most of the time, though, if you put together a great collection of talent, the team will need time to come together.  You can't expect to immediately win a title or even necessarily have a great year one.

That's why it's so tough trading for these superstars with just a year left on their deal and no long term commitment.  If year one doesn't go great, there's a decent chance they leave for a more exciting location.

[CF033]

I really don't care either way. I def wouldn't call it an epic fail. If AD doesn't come here though I am hoping that Kyrie leaves and hands the team over to the younger guys though. I don't want to see the same team as last year again, that was painful. NOT saying it was all Kyrie's fault but man the chemistry was just flat out bad and I doubt it will be any better going forward.

If we do get AD then yea let's see what he and Kyrie can do together (that is if Kyrie has any desire to remain in Boston which is questionable). IMO even if we sign AD and keep Kyrie the Celts still aren't title contenders though.

[Kuberski33]

 Everything hinges on Davis. I'm turning on Danny if this doesn't happen.

Because Boston is such a special place that Davis has to come?  Gimme a break. 

[bdm860]

the poll question might be better stated as epic disappointment, and not epic failure.

Yeah, it can only really be an epic failure in hindsight right?

Ha, I think a lot of people thought the Brooklyn trade was an epic failure for the C's when it happened.  The heart and soul of the C's for 3 late first round picks?  That's the best Danny could do?

And for our rivals, a lot of Lakers fans (and Kobe) wanted to trade Andrew Bynum for Jason Kidd back in '07.  Unfortunately for us, the Lakers brass was competent at the time.  Also for the Lakers, it would have probably been seen as an epic failure had they not landed Nash and Howard in '12.

It's really hard to judge these things in the present, though I will echo the others that say "epic disappoint" would be a better way to put it.

[mobilija]

@ Pho

Agree, it's tough trading for the 1 year rental. It takes some major courage and faith but I think the league is skewing in this mercenary free agent direction. It's just as risky and takes more years to go the home grown star route.

As for the list of stars, 1) I think you are underrating George, tho health was a concern with him as well and 2) It takes a collection (usually, Dirk, Wade, maybe others being the exception). Lebron didn't win a championship without his star sidekicks. Shaq needed Kobe. KG, Pierce and Allen never came close until they teamed up.

Ainge is a notorious trader and not a guy that sits around and waits for things to fall in his lap. Sure, he probably wants to build a long term contender but that's possible with the ages of AD and Kyrie and Hayward. I think he's a home run hitter and he has watched a lot of close pitches come across the plate. The count is full, If he doesn't take a swing at the Anthony Davis pitch to try and get that home run then.... at best he's gonna get a walk.

[GreenCoffeeBean]

How good is AD anyway.