Cassell already complaining about minutes

[Kuberski33]

Sam vs. House -- here's the rub:

Sam's a much better ball handler.  They're pretty close as outside shooters. House is slightly better defensively -- which ain't saying much.

Sam's older, but has a history of playing really well the higher the stakes. 

I think the ball handling issue is the main reason Cassel's getting the minutes and that's also the main reason he was brought aboard. 

Safe to say however that at least one of them won't be back next year.

[fan33]

The turnover ratio on display last night IS the difference in playoff basketball, calling a T.O. is veteran PG play and I'll take that in exchange for other options available choosing SAM every time, IN PLAYOFF ball.

Great addition to this team in manifold ways IS SAM! 

[paintitgreen]

Sam vs. House -- here's the rub:

Sam's a much better ball handler.  They're pretty close as outside shooters. House is slightly better defensively -- which ain't saying much.

Sam's older, but has a history of playing really well the higher the stakes. 

I think the ball handling issue is the main reason Cassel's getting the minutes and that's also the main reason he was brought aboard. 

Safe to say however that at least one of them won't be back next year.

I'd be a little surprised if either is back next year.

Look, to me it comes down to this. Both are bad defenders and both are streak shooters (although I will say House is better), but Cassell can handle the ball and has experience playing in big games, so to me it's no contest. Even when House got that run in Game 4, which I am still convinced is a huge factor in why we lost that game, we had to have Ray handling the ball all the time. House can catch and shoot. That's all.

I like House, he had a lot of energy this year and helped us win some games. But don't forget, Cassell has now been a factor in at least two HUGE wins for us - in San Antonio and last night. Cassell can catch and shoot, he can handle the ball and he can find teammates - he doesn't do it often, but at least it's in his skill set. House is just a one trick pony who's too small to be concealed in other aspects of the game. Simply because Cassell has that one extra ability - ballhandling, an essential skill for a 6'0" player - he's infinitely more valuable. I closed the book on House's ability to play the point almost exclusively from the fact that he got worked by Lindsey Hunter repeatedly when he spelled Rondo in the first half of our first game against Detroit. Yeah, it was a regular season game and our first test, but House clearly cannot handle the ball, which will be exploited horribly in playoff games. That huge offensive difference is enough to compensate for the difference between a bad defender and a worse defender.

[winsomme]

As Who mentioned a while back (a month ago?), the job of which bench players get minutes is not so easy with this team since the addition of P.J. and Sam.....What I hope is that Doc approaches this complexity with fearlessness, that is, with zero regard for what any player says about minutes, trying to please the stronger personalities, etc....

I think Sam's style of play is not a perfect fit for these Celtics.....which means that he has to be HITTING his jumpers like he did in game 5.  Otherwise, I think he hurts us (mainly due to his age, defense, etc...).  Cousy was right when he said that Sam takes the Celts out of what they do best, what they've succeeded with all year long, which is ball movement....I think Couz said something to the effect of....well, he better his those jumpers... otherwise he's going to hurt us.....

I'm not saying he's worse than House, but House has had one whole year to know exactly what the Celtics expect of him.  He knows through experience that if his defense lags he'll be on the bench in a flash, so he busts his butt when he's on the floor, and he's younger than Cassell.  Sam is clearly a truer and more seasoned PG than House, and I'm very happy to have him, but he's going to need to play with all the urgency and headiness he can muster, and hit his shots.  

Sam is a cool player, while both House and Tony Allen are hot, which means they boost the energy of the team when they're on the floor.   I would say Pierce and Ray Allen are both cool players while Garnett is hot.  Balancing the effortlessness of the cool players and the urgency of the hot players is part of a coaches job.  So Doc, next time you feel a chill, stick House and/or Allen in the game and play attack defense and offense....

One combo I wouldn't play around with is Big Baby and Powe.  It's too late to tinker with that duo.  Give Powe minutes and let Baby help out when Perk or Leon is in foul trouble.  Also, I think Doc can tinker with Big baby over Perkins if he wants/needs to, but keep Leon on the floor.....

Very well said Wiley! I agree 100% with everything except the TA part. Every minute that TA gets should be Posey's. TA showed you last night what you get out of him once again. Dumb player making stupid mistakes and turnovers.

As fas as House vs. Cassell. Cassell did not play good D last night. He was playing "matador" defense. He could get beat off the dribble by Perk. That reach in foul may not have been a foul, but it was a lazy play out of position. That to go along with the other times he got blown past.

As far as people saying he "found the open man"?! He had one assist in 15 minutes. Come on! All Sam did last night was hit a couple shots more than he has been most games. He launched 8 shots in 15 minutes. If he had missed 3 more of them like usual the discussion is once again that he is a ball hog not trying to stay within the offense. I would much rather have Sam hitting his shots. Don't get me wrong. If you give House those same shots and PT, he will hit more of them, and he will also play better defense and get guys involved more. How can people not see that?!

but with House, you don't have a PG on the floor that can truely handle the ball under pressure.

there are trade off's.

House plays with more energy and plays better D, but Cassell is a PG that has a long track record of not getting rattled.

and both guys are shot-makers.

Yeah. Just like last night when he dribbled it up the sideline into a trap and had to use a time out. Great PG skills there Sam! He was getting pressured when he was in there and his answer was to pass the ball 3-4 times immediately to Ray. Kind of sounds like what House does out there! Every single skill set other than possibly ball handling he is better at than Sam. If Sam has the ball over half court he doesn't pass it, so why not let the better shooter shoot the ball?!

I'm tired of hearing of what Sam USED to do. He takes us out of what we do well as a team. That's enough for me.

he also can create his own shot.

your USED TO argument simply does not mesh with how Sam currently plays. there has been very little change in the how Sam plays the game aside from slowing down a little.

plus your position that the team doesn't play well with Sam out there is not supported by his +11 plus/minus last night.

House will get his shot. there are so many twists and turns in the playoffs, he is going to be needed at some point.

[wiley]

Yes, we need ball handling.  That's why I'm glad Sam's here.  But we also need ball movement, player movement, and the kind of attack offense that come through those things...

If Sam misses his shots again next game, I guarantee people will complain about stagnation in the offense.  That's why I said Sam has to hit his shots.

As good as his ball handling still is, it not so much better than House that it can overcome poor shooting, a stagnant offense and less defense (even a little less defense is dangerous).   So again, he HAS TO hit his shots.

Doc has to be very tuned in, and if he thinks Sam's headed for an off night, make the switch immediately, don't wait until the 4th.  If Eddie's game is off or is defense is lacking, there'll be time to go back to Sam in the 4th when ball handling is an even bigger issue.  This gets back to Who's observation that the Celtics rotation possiblities are complex.  Yes, they can simplify them by taking Eddie out completely out of the rotation, but, despite clearing up the rotation picture, this is a mistake imo.  There are going to be games in these playoffs that the Celtics can't win without relying on energy and defense.  Doc's tricky job is to figure out immediately when the Celtics find themselves in such games....

[CT34]

Before the game I was watching warm-ups very closely.  I notice KG and House was working on a two man game where House would toss the ball into the KG who was in the post and Eddie would run to the baseline for a three point shot.  Those two had to work on that drill for a good 3 minutes.  Seeing that I though Eddie House was going to see a lot of time on the court last night.  Or more time the he has been getting. However Eddie didn't see much playing time.  My Point?  Eddie House spaces the floor better then Sam Cassell does yet I don't understand why Doc has turn his back on a player who has been with the team all season. I wanted Sam Cassell here and I think as this team moves along in the play-offs Sam will prove his worth.  However, I like to see Eddie House play his way out of the line-up instead of being taking out of the line-up.

[tanner]

I must say, even though i am a big fam of Cassell, I don't see anything that he said as being a problem. He's right, it hard to play well when you only get 5 minutes. Can't argue with that. He said he's not getting minutes because Rondo was playing so well. Don't have a problem with that.
Than he says he was dissapointed not to be used more, but that he needed to show Doc that he can be more aggressive. First, he should be disappointed at not playing more. So should House, Scal, Tony Allen, pretty much any professional should want to play more. If they didn't they would never have made it to the pros. Now you assume that by aggressive Sam ment shoot more. I think perhaps he was refering to playing harder in general. Both on the offensive and defensive end, which is what he did last night.
Show me a guy who doesn't want to play and I'll show you a guy whos not playing.

Sam could have said a lot of things after a huge win in which the team (including himself) played well and he got 14 minutes (though it's still probably less than what he's asking for).  His remarks could have went to a hundred different directions but what's the first thing that comes out of his mouth?  MINUTES.  I don't know about you guys but that tells me a  lot. 

Add to that you hear his broadcaster buddy Kenny mention Sam's disappointment and desire for more minutes.  The disappointement was not at himself for not playing well in game 4.  Sam was disappointed at Doc for not playing him down the stretch.     

[Bahku]

Sadly, Sam's interview made it quite clear what his priorities are. There was nothing of "I just want to help the team" or "I want to help Rage develop" or "I just want to do my part to win a championship" ... it was all about complaining that he doesn't get enough minutes, a bit of resentment that Rondo is playing so well, and that he's not going to get a lot of minutes if that keeps happening, and that he's a "playoff" guy and wants more minutes.

Very little, if anything, about the team or anyone else, and his self-centered perspective and agenda was as clear as it could be. Nothing wrong with wanting to be on the floor, you'd want that from anyone, but it's the motivation behind that sentiment that was clearly not the team, or anyone else, and that's a bit troubling ... especially if his shots stop falling. It was a bit obvious that he's playing just in "Sammy's World", and that there's really not much room for anyone else.

[EJPLAYA]

Sadly, Sam's interview made it quite clear what his priorities are. There was nothing of "I just want to help the team" or "I want to help Rage develop" or "I just want to do my part to win a championship" ... it was all about complaining that he doesn't get enough minutes, a bit of resentment that Rondo is playing so well, and that he's not going to get a lot of minutes if that keeps happening, and that he's a "playoff" guy and wants more minutes.

Very little, if anything, about the team or anyone else, and his self-centered perspective and agenda was as clear as it could be. Nothing wrong with wanting to be on the floor, you'd want that from anyone, but it's the motivation behind that sentiment that was clearly not the team, or anyone else, and that's a bit troubling ... especially if his shots stop falling. It was a bit obvious that he's playing just in "Sammy's World", and that there's really not much room for anyone else.

Very well said Bahku! I would bet that almost everyone who isn't a huge Sam fan feels that way because of this sentiment. TP for you Bahku!

[Redz]

Does anyone have the accompanying questions that were being asked to Cassell?  I kind of doubt he just sat down and started a diatribe about his minutes unless the topic was raised in the form of a question directed at him first. 

Some context would go a long way here.

Lighten up on Sam.  I'm not hearing him begging for minutes here. 

I see him on the bench getting pretty pumped for his teammates. If the team's not bothered by Sam, why are we?

[winsomme]

Does anyone have the accompanying questions that were being asked to Cassell?  I kind of doubt he just sat down and started a diatribe about his minutes unless the topic was raised in the form of a question directed at him first. 

Some context would go a long way here.

Lighten up on Sam.  I'm not hearing him begging for minutes here. 

I see him on the bench getting pretty pumped for his teammates. If the team's not bothered by Sam, why are we?

TP. well said.

this heat being given to Cassell after being a big part of a win that many fans were starting to waiver on is being way over-blown.

the guy had a +11 plus/minus in the game.  so he clearly was a positive influence on the team in the game.

House will get his shot too....

[Bahku]

Hey, I'm just going on what he said, and the emotion behind it, and it had nothing to do with the team or anyone else but Sam. He was definitely irritated that Rondo is playing so well, because it means HE isn't getting as many minutes ... he said so. Sorry, but that's a bit removed from the whole "We Not Me" thing ... to say the least. I would think that kind of statement would bother anyone on the Celtic side of things who heard it. Wrong priorities if you ask me. Not saying it's his ONLY motivation, cuz I honestly don't know. But from what he said, it was clear he wasn't thinking much about the team.

[Redz]

Hey, I'm just going on what he said, and the emotion behind it, and it had nothing to do with the team or anyone else but Sam. He was definitely irritated that Rondo is playing so well, because it means HE isn't getting as many minutes ... he said so. Sorry, but that's a bit removed from the whole "We Not Me" thing ... to say the least. I would think that kind of statement would bother anyone on the Celtic side of things who heard it. Wrong priorities if you ask me. Not saying it's his ONLY motivation, cuz I honestly don't know. But from what he said, it was clear he wasn't thinking much about the team.

See, I didn't get that.  I got that that was the reason why he wasn't playing and he understands that's the case because Rondo's playing well.

So

1) He's saying he'd be playing better if he had more minutes (which is likely true)
2) He's saying that the reason he's not playing more is because Rondo is playing well (which is true)

I didn't hear any resentment about it, just an understanding.  He's not asking for more minutes anywhere. 

[winsomme]

Hey, I'm just going on what he said, and the emotion behind it, and it had nothing to do with the team or anyone else but Sam. He was definitely irritated that Rondo is playing so well, because it means HE isn't getting as many minutes ... he said so. Sorry, but that's a bit removed from the whole "We Not Me" thing ... to say the least. I would think that kind of statement would bother anyone on the Celtic side of things who heard it. Wrong priorities if you ask me. Not saying it's his ONLY motivation, cuz I honestly don't know. But from what he said, it was clear he wasn't thinking much about the team.

See, I didn't get that.  I got that that was the reason why he wasn't playing and he understands that's the case because Rondo's playing well.

So

1) He's saying he'd playing better if he had more minutes (which is likely true)
2) He's saying that the reason he's not playing more is because Rondo is playing well (which is true)

I didn't hear any resentment about it, just an understanding.  He's not asking for more minutes anywhere. 

that's definitely how it seems to me too.....

[nickagneta]

Hey, I'm just going on what he said, and the emotion behind it, and it had nothing to do with the team or anyone else but Sam. He was definitely irritated that Rondo is playing so well, because it means HE isn't getting as many minutes ... he said so. Sorry, but that's a bit removed from the whole "We Not Me" thing ... to say the least. I would think that kind of statement would bother anyone on the Celtic side of things who heard it. Wrong priorities if you ask me. Not saying it's his ONLY motivation, cuz I honestly don't know. But from what he said, it was clear he wasn't thinking much about the team.

See, I didn't get that.  I got that that was the reason why he wasn't playing and he understands that's the case because Rondo's playing well.

So

1) He's saying he'd playing better if he had more minutes (which is likely true)
2) He's saying that the reason he's not playing more is because Rondo is playing well (which is true)

I didn't hear any resentment about it, just an understanding.  He's not asking for more minutes anywhere. 

that's definitely how it seems to me too.....

Me too. And if I remember properly, and that's not always a given(what did I have for dinner anyway?), the first question posed to Sam was about his good production in the minutes given. That's why he expounded on his minutes and Rondo's excellent play dictating those minutes.

But as I said, I may have "misremembered".