Smart vs. Brogdon

[nickagneta]

It's an absurd statement. It was absurd when you and others said the same about Kyrie and Brown and Hayward. Having success when a great player sits does not mean the team is better without them. It simply means there are enough other players here to pick up the slack.

Smart is better than Rozier. It can be argued that you can simply put Smart into the rotation and get rid of Rozier's minutes. Stevens tightens rotations in the playoffs. Rozier and/or Baynes will be seeing a lot less minutes when Smart returns.

[Roy H.]

Brogdon is massive for the Bucks.  Boston is arguably better without Smart.  No comparison.

1000%, I'd rather Brogdon stay out of this series.   This team's problem all season has been "too many guys" and it's not a coincidence we've been playing better with one less guy out there needing minutes.

I absolutely knew and even wrote earlier someone would make this absurd comment.

Sorry, LB, I know you love playing the contrarianism, but this team is not better without Smart.

They may be playing better without him, though.  The ideal solution would probably be to have a healthy Smart take Rozier’s minutes.  I do think that our best team has Jaylen starting.

[LarBrd33]

It's an absurd statement. It was absurd when you and others said the same about Kyrie and Brown and Hayward.

I always thought the idea we were better without Kyrie was idiotic.  I was never on that train.

But it's a fact that when Kyrie sat out, other players were able to step up.

And it's pretty clear the issue is that we are trying to incorporate too many guys.  It's not possible.  Players play best when they can get in a rhythm.  Having Jaylen Brown play 22 minutes off the bench and taking 5 shots isn't going to get him in a rhythm.

Right now the minute distribution is nice.   

- Kyrie - 36
- Tatum  34
- Horford - 34
- Hayward - 31
- Brown - 30
- Morris - 27
-  Rozier - 19
- Baynes - 17. 

This makes sense. Who do you want to lose minutes for Smart's 27?   I sure as heck don't want to see Tatum or Hayward lose minutes to that guy.  I'd actually like to see Tatum and Hayward get an increase in minutes.

It's not a knock on Smart... though he's obscenely overrated by Celtic fans... he's a darn fine player.  Under different circumstances, having Smart back would be a no brainer.  The problem is the makeup of this roster - which is a real issue.  It can't work with all of the guys together.  Ainge is going to need to make big changes this SUmmer one way or the other, because this just doesn't work with everyone.   With Smart out, it makes a little more sense.  I'm fine with him taking his sweet time returning.  It's ungodly frustrating to see a talent like Gordon Hayward get 4 shots off the bench in 20 minutes because we have 10 other guys who need minutes and touches.   I'm cool with avoiding that.

[hodgy03038]

Team is NOT better without Smart. That is ridiculous. Today he could have taken some of Tatum's minutes but generally I think it would be Rozier and whoever else is not playing well during a particular game. Minutes and how many you get shouldn't be the issue.

[LarBrd33]

Team is NOT better without Smart. That is ridiculous. Today he could have taken some of Tatum's minutes but generally I think it would be Rozier and whoever else is not playing well during a particular game. Minutes and how many you get shouldn't be the issue.

I don't want him taking a single minute from Jayson Tatum.  Having a role player take minutes from your 2nd best scorer isn't a recipe for success.

I want Tatum getting more minutes.  Let's get him up to 37.  He can take some from Morris.   

I'd also like to see Hayward get an increase in minutes.  Ideally up to around 35.   

This a problematic roster.  Assuming we get knocked off this round or the next, I expect Ainge to consolidate this Summer.  Having 9 starters doesn't work.

[gouki88]

With Sterling Brown suffering back spasms I would prefer if Brogdon and Smart both missed the round.

Substituting Smart in for Rozier in the rotation would be a nasty surprise for Toronto

[LarBrd33]

With Sterling Brown suffering back spasms I would prefer if Brogdon and Smart both missed the round.

Substituting Smart in for Rozier in the rotation would be a nasty surprise for Toronto

I mean.. I'd support that, probably.  If Smart is cool with getting 17 minutes off the bench and Rozier is cool with geting DNPs, then maybe it can work.

But having Brown and Hayward lose minutes for Smart isn't a net positive in my opinion.

[rondofan1255]

Neither. More Connaughton, Shannon's brother, and Snell please

And I see Lar's point about one too many wrt role players.

[gouki88]

With Sterling Brown suffering back spasms I would prefer if Brogdon and Smart both missed the round.

Substituting Smart in for Rozier in the rotation would be a nasty surprise for Toronto

I mean.. I'd support that, probably.  If Smart is cool with getting 17 minutes off the bench and Rozier is cool with geting DNPs, then maybe it can work.

But having Brown and Hayward lose minutes for Smart isn't a net positive in my opinion.

In my little dream world of an absolutely benched Rozier I'd also have Theis sitting for the most part, and Morris getting closer to 20-25 minutes than 30. Give the ~10 minutes from that to Gordy, Tatum or Smart, depending on matchup and form

[nickagneta]

The Celtics as a team are not better without Smart...or Kyrie...or Brown...or Hayward. They simply aren't. The notion is ridiculous.

Now if you want to argue the team is better when Stevens is forced into a tighter rotation with proof being the team's record with one of its first ten players out...okay I can get behind that. But the team is not better without those individual players.

[Vermont Green]

You can work the playing time any number of ways but I can say that at the end of a close playoff game where the refs have their whistles in their pockets, I would rather have Smart on the floor over Brown, Hayward, and Rozier.  You can say all you want about his bad shooting or whatever but if that is all you are looking at, sure, you come to the conclusion that you don't need Smart, and maybe due to our depth, we don't.

But if you have been truly paying attention to the games over the last few seasons, I don't see how you can not want Smart on the court at crunch time.  I know it is a cliche but he is just one of those players that you can't quantify with stats.

As to the comparison to Brogdon, I don't get to see Milwaukee often enough to truly judge that.  It is actually kind of a silly, hypothetical but that is what we are all here for I guess.

[LarBrd33]

The Celtics as a team are not better without Smart...or Kyrie...or Brown...or Hayward. They simply aren't. The notion is ridiculous.

Now if you want to argue the team is better when Stevens is forced into a tighter rotation with proof being the team's record with one of its first ten players out...okay I can get behind that. But the team is not better without those individual players.

The best version of the team leans heavily on Kyrie, Hayward, Tatum, Horford and Brown.   They all need major minutes. 

Look, there are plenty of players in this league I think are good.  Go ahead and pick 10 random players who are "good". 

Cool... add them all to the mix with Kyrie, Hayward, Tatum, Horford and Brown.  Have them all play 5-10 minutes per game.

You think that is going to work?

It's not going to work.

Players need rhythm.  Hayward and Brown both play significantly better when they have more minutes and more touches to get comfortable.  Same can be said about Rozier, actually.  Check out Rozier's stats as a starter this season vs coming off the bench.  Guys play far better with defined roles and more time.  It's not a coincidence that this team has played it's best when less guys are in the mix.  That was the case in the playoffs last year.  That was the case when any individual sat out.  It's the case right now with Smart out.   Having 10 starters doesn't work.  If adding Smart back in the mix means Hayward going back to 22-25 minutes - it's a net negative.  There's little logic to your "all-star" getting 20 minutes because you have 9 other guys who need 20 minutes.

Glad this rotation is working right now.  I was one of the few who thought the Smart injury would be a blessing in disguise.  We have an 8 man rotation that makes sense.  That's not an attack on Smart.  Morris is good too, but I think there's a valid case to be made that you'd get more from Brown and Hayward without Morris in the mix.

Too many guys.  It was a problem all season.  Our poor chemistry was a direct result of that. 

[ozgod]

Bucks need Brogdon much more than the Celtics need Smart. Jaylen has flourished filling in for Smart, whereas the Bucks have a major weak spot at the starting 2, and the Celtics are exploiting it.

Agree. We have plenty of depth to cover. The Bucks had to put in Sterling Brown to replace Brodgon who was a 50-40-90 player for them.

[ederson]

Numbers may support Brogdon being better than Smart but I disagree. If I need a steal or a block or someone diving on the floor for a loose ball or one of these two players playing defense on a big I will take Smart 100 times out of 100.

Id rather have smart too but the argument is weak to say the least.

when you need to make the next bucket you take Brogdon... Using your logic Brogdon is better

[RazzelnoDazzel]

Tbh I only watched Brogdon when he has ever went up against no the Celtics so I’m only going to speak from THAT point of view. With that being said he does not help the bucks out At all. We have destroyed Brogdon so many times to the point I thought he was just a trash dude until I heard the announcers say he was the Rookie of the year. He couldn’t even slow anyone down last year, he [dang] sure wasn’t going to slow Kyrie down. He does not get buckets on the Celtics, so he serves no purpose. I get it he’s a “50,40,90” guy or whatever.. show me what he is against the Celtics.i doubt they are impressive.