NFL 2023-24 Off-Season

[Birdman]

All depends what team & coach you play for

[Roy H.]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

These guys can pretend that they know what is going on in until they are blue in the face. Many thought that Andrew Luck was going to carry his team to multiple championship victories. Some said that Tua or Herbert were worthy of tanking NFL seasons. I've read that Trevor Lawrence is a generational talent (a term that is thrown around frequently, not once a generation).

If I was a Bears fan, I'd get excited about Caleb Williams as well. The Bears (like the Pats) need a lot of work before Caleb can shine. You saw what happened last year at USC. Caleb is a good first step, but he's going to need a lot of help to reach his potential. I'd argue that the rest of the draft is just as important as the Caleb pick.

I think Luck would have had a wildly successful NFL career if he had been healthy.  I don't think the scouts missed on him at all, unless there were medical red flags at the time that were ignored. 

I think Luck was the Bill Walton of the NFL, at least in terms of individual talent.  I don't think you can criticize his selection at #1, or doubt the scouting.

[Donoghus]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

These guys can pretend that they know what is going on in until they are blue in the face. Many thought that Andrew Luck was going to carry his team to multiple championship victories. Some said that Tua or Herbert were worthy of tanking NFL seasons. I've read that Trevor Lawrence is a generational talent (a term that is thrown around frequently, not once a generation).

If I was a Bears fan, I'd get excited about Caleb Williams as well. The Bears (like the Pats) need a lot of work before Caleb can shine. You saw what happened last year at USC. Caleb is a good first step, but he's going to need a lot of help to reach his potential. I'd argue that the rest of the draft is just as important as the Caleb pick.

I think Luck would have had a wildly successful NFL career if he had been healthy.  I don't think the scouts missed on him at all, unless there were medical red flags at the time that were ignored. 

I think Luck was the Bill Walton of the NFL, at least in terms of individual talent.  I don't think you can criticize his selection at #1, or doubt the scouting.

Yeah, Luck was fine and had a great career up until his retirement. 

Outside of the injuries, he also had the misfortune of playing in the AFC when it was being dominated by Brady & Manning and just didn't have the team around him to beat either the Pats or Broncos.

[SparzWizard]

If this is the end of him, he managed to do alright for himself.  10 year career & over $140M in career earnings. 

Not too shabby.  I don't think anyone expected that a decade ago.

Also won 2 Super Bowls. Before Mahomes won his 3rd, Jimmy G was up there as one of the only QBs with multiple SB wins besides Brady but then Brady retired too.

Blaine Gabbert the other active QB who has multiple Superbowl wins.

[Phantom255x]

If this is the end of him, he managed to do alright for himself.  10 year career & over $140M in career earnings. 

Not too shabby.  I don't think anyone expected that a decade ago.

Also won 2 Super Bowls. Before Mahomes won his 3rd, Jimmy G was up there as one of the only QBs with multiple SB wins besides Brady but then Brady retired too.

Blaine Gabbert the other active QB who has multiple Superbowl wins.

Yeah but that was after the most recent Chiefs one.

[Goldstar88]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

[Moranis]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

He also had major injury concerns,  was older, and was on a team loaded with high level NFL draft picks.

[SparzWizard]

The Chiefs' schedule next year does not look too bright-- shouldn't be able to 3peat.

They have the AFC gauntlet to go through at Arrowhead: vs Ravens, Texans, Bengals, and Browns
They also got the Bills on the road.

Oh, and a lovely Superbowl rematch with the 49ers but this time in Santa Clara instead of Vegas.
And another Superbowl rematch at home against the Bucs who did pretty well last year.

[footey]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

He also had major injury concerns,  was older, and was on a team loaded with high level NFL draft picks.

If Caleb Williams measures closer to 6' or 5'11" at combine, he will drop out of top slot, probably to no better than 3rd.  Bryce Young was listed as 6' on Bama roster, but measured 5'10"at combine.  He looks small to me on the tape.

[Roy H.]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

He also had major injury concerns,  was older, and was on a team loaded with high level NFL draft picks.

If Caleb Williams measures closer to 6' or 5'11" at combine, he will drop out of top slot, probably to no better than 3rd.  Bryce Young was listed as 6' on Bama roster, but measured 5'10"at combine.  He looks small to me on the tape.

And Young still went #1.  So did Kyler Murray and Baker Mayfield.  Williams will as well.

[footey]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

He also had major injury concerns,  was older, and was on a team loaded with high level NFL draft picks.

If Caleb Williams measures closer to 6' or 5'11" at combine, he will drop out of top slot, probably to no better than 3rd.  Bryce Young was listed as 6' on Bama roster, but measured 5'10"at combine.  He looks small to me on the tape.

And Young still went #1.  So did Kyler Murray and Baker Mayfield.  Williams will as well.

After what happened in last season's draft, I doubt it.

[tazzmaniac]

Fox Sports draft analyst:

Joel Klatt
@joelklatt
If I were to rank, as prospects, the QBs since 2012 (Andrew Luck, RGIII) here is how they would stack up
1) Caleb Williams
2) Trevor Lawrence
3) Joe Burrow
4) Drake Maye
5) Bryce Young
*note: evaluation of Mahomes was difficult & no QB had suceeded from that offense prior)

I find it interesting that this guy has Maye that high, or that he has Williams over where Lawrence and Burrow were coming out of school.  Recency bias?  It's hard to remember going back a decade, but I remember that guys like Mayfield, Darnold, Winston, etc. were all highly rated.

But, this isn't the first guy I've seen who rates Williams in the same class of prospect as Burrow (stud) and Lawrence (good to very good).

Definitely interesting.  Lawrence & Burrow were certainly in another stratosphere.   I remember people being all over the board in the Mayfield draft.  Goff/Wentz was an interesting debate as was Winston/Mariota but there weren't on the same tier as Lawrence or Burrow.  People were real high on Murray which seems to have been forgotten since.

I do wonder how much of the Williams hype is chalked up to analysts being afraid to miss on the potential "next Mahomes".

They certainly were. Burrow threw 60TD’s his senior year and won a national championship. Putting Williams ahead of him is laughable.

He also had major injury concerns,  was older, and was on a team loaded with high level NFL draft picks.

If Caleb Williams measures closer to 6' or 5'11" at combine, he will drop out of top slot, probably to no better than 3rd.  Bryce Young was listed as 6' on Bama roster, but measured 5'10"at combine.  He looks small to me on the tape.

And Young still went #1.  So did Kyler Murray and Baker Mayfield.  Williams will as well.

After what happened in last season's draft, I doubt it.

The concern with Bryce was more about his overall size than his height.  How the other shorter QBs, like Murray, had a lot stockier frames than Young.  Could a QB with such a small frame survive a full NFL season?  Bryce did a lot of eating to get to 204lbs at the combine which was at least 10 pounds more than his playing weight at Bama.  Bryce ended up playing 16 NFL games taking 62 sacks so he showed his ability to take a hit. 

[Phantom255x]

McCarthy seems to be rising on these mock drafts if people pay attention to them. I've seen about 3 of them today that have him in the Top-15 (two in the Top-10). I personally don't see it and it's probably teams being desperate for a QB that's not in the Top-4 for Williams/Daniels/Maye, but I'm obviously no scout or anything.

[johnnygreen]

McCarthy seems to be rising on these mock drafts if people pay attention to them. I've seen about 3 of them today that have him in the Top-15 (two in the Top-10). I personally don't see it and it's probably teams being desperate for a QB that's not in the Top-4 for Williams/Daniels/Maye, but I'm obviously no scout or anything.

I have no issue with McCarthy rising. However, I'm still baffled with Daniels. He is 23, played 5 years in college, and in his senior year, had two of the best receivers in the country.

All I hear about Penix and Nix is their age and number of years in college being a negative. Remember the negative talk about Mac Jones coming out? He only got those numbers because he played with elite receivers. All the signs are there to not take Daniels, yet no one wants to admit it.

[Celtics2021]

McCarthy seems to be rising on these mock drafts if people pay attention to them. I've seen about 3 of them today that have him in the Top-15 (two in the Top-10). I personally don't see it and it's probably teams being desperate for a QB that's not in the Top-4 for Williams/Daniels/Maye, but I'm obviously no scout or anything.

I watched every snap of McCarthy’s career and he has it.  I think scouts are finally catching up with him.  He can make every throw and he can run.  His build is a little slight, but that’s partly because he’s young.  He turned 21 barely a month ago.  His make-up is legit.  The only reason I wouldn’t pick him top 10 is I think he’d be better developed if he didn’t play right away, and you can’t do that with a top 10 pick any more, but I think that’s also true of Drake Maye.

Seattle really hates that he’s shooting up the boards — he’d have totally been their pick at 16.  I expect they’ll trade up for him if they can — that coaching staff knows him well.