CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: Phantom255x on March 19, 2018, 10:25:39 PM
-
Our old friend and former "savior in the bigs department" had 13 points and 6 rebounds in 17 minutes against the Bucks tonight on 4-6 shooting.
Had 14 points, 6 rebounds on 7-9 shooting against the Bulls two nights ago.
For the month of March, he's averaging 8 points/4 rebounds/1 block a game in 13 MPG and he's doing it on 81% shooting :o
Kind of a shame that we had to trade him away just to make the salaries work in the Kyrie trade. An intriguing prospect who looks like he can be a very solid rotational big in the future (could have helped us out a bit as well it seems).
-
Considering how the Cavs front office/Lebron rewards this type of output from big men with minimal talent (see Tristan Thompson), he's likely to get a max contract soon if he keeps this up.
-
I think Zizic will turn into an above-average backup center.
-
Considering how the Cavs front office/Lebron rewards this type of output from big men with minimal talent (see Tristan Thompson), he's likely to get a max contract soon if he keeps this up.
LOL.
But it's also kind of sad, because despite that, Thompson ALWAYS kills us.
Seems like opposing bigs (even third stringers) always kill us. That's why I'm glad we have the likes of Monroe and Baynes on this team this year. I can understand Anthony Davis killing us last night, but it's annoying when "scrubs" on the other team suddenly have career rebounding nights or something against us, which seemed to be the case a lot last year. :P
And don't even get me started with us giving up a ton of offensive boards late in games last year...
-
Injury aside, I am perfectly happy with Theis over Zizic. I realize Zizic could evolve and we would have more years of control over him, but good teams (like us) can always pick up a back-up center for the minimum the quality of Zizic.
-
Our old friend and former "savior in the bigs department" had 13 points and 6 rebounds in 17 minutes against the Bucks tonight on 4-6 shooting.
Had 14 points, 6 rebounds on 7-9 shooting against the Bulls two nights ago.
For the month of March, he's averaging 8 points/4 rebounds/1 block a game in 13 MPG and he's doing it on 81% shooting :o
Kind of a shame that we had to trade him away just to make the salaries work in the Kyrie trade. An intriguing prospect who looks like he can be a very solid rotational big in the future (could have helped us out a bit as well it seems).
He's churning out meh production on completely unsustainable shooting. Might be a tad premature to crown him as "the one who got away."
-
I think Zizic will turn into an above-average backup center.
Same.
I truthfully don't see all-star in him, but he could be a solid player who can also get some starter minutes through the course of a season in case of injuries and such.
-
I’m other news Kyrie has been really good this season and has yet to shift his production and the team into a higher gear
-
But we have the real "Anti-Zizic" in Theis....rather have him.
Remember this:
https://youtu.be/32bal9DQWGg
-
I think Zizic will turn into an above-average backup center.
Same.
I truthfully don't see all-star in him, but he could be a solid player who can also get some starter minutes through the course of a season in case of injuries and such.
We could sign jeff withey if we really miss him. Lots of big stiffs out there
-
Considering how the Cavs front office/Lebron rewards this type of output from big men with minimal talent (see Tristan Thompson), he's likely to get a max contract soon if he keeps this up.
;D
-
Are we really judging Ante Zizic to be more than he really is based on two games of unsustainable shooting? I must be posting this on Celticsblog!
-
He played great in summer league so I wasn’t surprised.
-
Please take notice that I didn't start this thread ;D
TP to OP.
-
Injury aside, I am perfectly happy with Theis over Zizic. I realize Zizic could evolve and we would have more years of control over him, but good teams (like us) can always pick up a back-up center for the minimum the quality of Zizic.
Yep, we can sign guys like this with our exceptions like we did with Baynes.
If his potential is that of a starter on a quality team then maybe we did miss out. I’m not too concerned. We have Irving potentially on our team for a long time.
-
I think Zizic will turn into an above-average backup center.
Same.
I truthfully don't see all-star in him, but he could be a solid player who can also get some starter minutes through the course of a season in case of injuries and such.
I was a zizic booster even before the draft. Glad to see he is doing well.
I agree with posters above. As a ceiling he might start on a second division team, or a good back up on a good team.
I was sorry to see him go, but replacing him is possible. Case in point being Monroe and Baynes.
-
Considering how the Cavs front office/Lebron rewards this type of output from big men with minimal talent (see Tristan Thompson), he's likely to get a max contract soon if he keeps this up.
Thompson didn't get a max contract.
-
Uhhh no he doesnt. It took him 60 games to have a couple mediocre games in a row while playing with the best player in the world whos known for making everyone around him better.
-
I think Zizic will turn into an above-average backup center.
I would have much rather kept him than Yabusele, who I think will turn into an above average CBA player. But no, can haz three point shooting. >:( :( >:(
-
Speaking of... looks like Zizic replacement in his Turkish team is Jajuan Johnson!
And he had been playing well.
-
But we have the real "Anti-Zizic" in Theis....rather have him.
Remember this:
https://youtu.be/32bal9DQWGg
TP. I forgot about that. Why do we need Zizic when we have his father?
-
But we have the real "Anti-Zizic" in Theis....rather have him.
Remember this:
https://youtu.be/32bal9DQWGg
TP. I forgot about that. Why do we need Zizic when we have his father?
But we don't, right now.
-
I know Danny can find a big of his quality with our own pick this year. KI is proven playoff finisher and there is maybe 10 of those in the league.
-
Whatever all of you say about Ante (good, so-so, bad), he is the best nugget Cavs have from the Kyrie deal ATM.
Crowdy = injured Hood, waiting to see
IT = Clarkson (15 mil, not my cup of tea)
Bkn pick = still waiting
2nd rounder = still waiting
-
Let's get all of this talk straight.
Zizic is from Croatia and doesn't speak German.
Theis is German and speaks German....this is a way better situation already.
Zizic played some Euroball and...whatever.
Theis crushed it for a German team last year at 17.5 ppg.
Zizic was traded to another team because the salary worked.
Theis lead his league in personal fouls for two years straight....the guy is a monstah.
Zizic's new team, the one from Cleveland, has essentially been below .500 since he arrived there and their football team is horrible.
Theis played on an NBA club that won 16 in a row and is home to the greatest NFL team in history.
Theis is better than Zizic.
-
Let's get all of this talk straight.
Zizic is from Croatia and doesn't speak German.
Theis is German and speaks German....this is a way better situation already.
Zizic played some Euroball and...whatever.
Theis crushed it for a German team last year at 17.5 ppg.
Zizic was traded to another team because the salary worked.
Theis lead his league in personal fouls for two years straight....the guy is a monstah.
Zizic's new team, the one from Cleveland, has essentially been below .500 since he arrived there and their football team is horrible.
Theis played on an NBA club that won 16 in a row and is home to the greatest NFL team in history.
Theis is better than Zizic.
True,
Keep on mind that there is a concept where players get better with age.
5 years of NBA training regime can do that to a basketball player.
Theis is 26 in a week,
Ante just turned 21.
-
Sounds like Lebron has one more reason to stay in Cleveland..... ;)
-
Sounds like Lebron has one more reason to stay in Cleveland..... ;)
Or Lebron has another asset to dangle in that everlasting quest for adding yet another star to the super-team :laugh:
-
But we have the real "Anti-Zizic" in Theis....rather have him.
Remember this:
https://youtu.be/32bal9DQWGg
TP. I forgot about that. Why do we need Zizic when we have his father?
TP back atcha.
Theis certainly looked like Zizic's daddy, there, huh?
-
Considering how the Cavs front office/Lebron rewards this type of output from big men with minimal talent (see Tristan Thompson), he's likely to get a max contract soon if he keeps this up.
Thompson didn't get a max contract.
True, but definitely was overpaid. Kinda how everything works around the Lebron circus.
-
Yawn
-
He's getting torched literally every time he switches on the PnR.
Not a good sign in the modern NBA if you're that slow and have no impressive offensive game to offset it
-
He's getting torched literally every time he switches on the PnR.
Not a good sign in the modern NBA if you're that slow and have no impressive offensive game to offset it
Yeah he doesn't look like an NBA player this game. Overall it seems like this thread will age badly.
-
He's getting torched literally every time he switches on the PnR.
Not a good sign in the modern NBA if you're that slow and have no impressive offensive game to offset it
Yeah he doesn't look like an NBA player this game. Overall it seems like this thread will age badly.
I just said "he looks good" not "he's going to become a superstar soon" :P
-
He fits in perfectly in Cleveland because his defense is just awful. His footwork is terrible and can easily be taken off a PnR. He almost just lets it happen.
I think he's very raw ala Yabu but when has someone "raw" ever turned it into anything other than being a high energy guy off the bench? Tyler Zeller if he gets a mid range jumper at some point.
Why do we as CBers get so hyped on fringe NBA players?
-
He fits in perfectly in Cleveland because his defense is just awful. His footwork is terrible and can easily be taken off a PnR. He almost just lets it happen.
I think he's very raw ala Yabu but when has someone "raw" ever turned it into anything other than being a high energy guy off the bench? Tyler Zeller if he gets a mid range jumper at some point.
Why do we as CBers get so hyped on fringe NBA players?
Depends on the level of athleticism for a “raw” guy. For a guy like DeAndre Jordan, they can grow into all stars. For a guy with Zizic’s athleticism, I’d say you pretty much hit the nail on the head.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
All of the guys listed with the exception of Zaza have quickness and/or athletic advantages over Zizic though.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
While your point remains, Valanciunas is actually shooting 44% from deep on about a shot per game. He has that shot in his game and should probably shoot it more than he does.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
What does shooting the 3 have to do with this? Zizic can't shoot OR play defense. He is absolutely horrible at defending the pick and roll. He was getting exposed every play against the Lakers by IT and Randle pick and rolls. Add in the fact that he can't do much on offense and that makes him worse than all these centers. Just because they can't shoot either doesn't mean that makes Zizic as good as them.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
All these center's besides Pachulia have at least one good skill.
Capela is an elite rebounder and rim protector
Valanciunas is a very strong rebounder and good scorer
Baynes is a good defender and rebounder
Nurkic is a good rebounder, passer and scorer
Adams is one of the best offensive rebounders in the league and is a solid scorer.
Zizic has worse physical profiles than all these guys besides Zaza, and is less skilled than all of them too. Even with Zaza, it's just a tad dishonest when he starts next to two MVP's, one DPOY and a 3&D All-Star.
-
Ante Žižić - dividing Celtic fans since 2018.
-
The hype machine, for Zizic was ridiculous here, at least he was part of the package that got us Kyrie. Funny how a guy with no hope like Daniel Theis is a way better player than all the hyped guys.
-
The hype machine, for Zizic was ridiculous here, at least he was part of the package that got us Kyrie. Funny how a guy with no hope like Daniel Theis is a way better player than all the hyped guys.
CB, sometime last year:
"I want a true rebounding 5!
I responded - Žižić does rebound, he always did.
"I want a true rebounding 5, that finishes around the rim!
- Žižić does finishes well there. His true shooting is .725 in the NBA!
"I want a true rebounding 5, that can finish around the rim and hit threes"
- ...That's a different pair of trousers.
Some guys are like my girlfriend.
I love you, but you can be difficult.
He is a rookie big that was the 23rd pick - put things in perspective, please.
At that spot, and at this stage of his career, you shouldn't expect a surefire starting quality dude.
He was never supposed to be a top-shelf talent.
As for Theis, the most of the louder forum members were down on him before they even saw him play...
Classic Euro diss
-
I actually liked Theis a lot because I saw evidence of a motor and defensive instincts on the film. Zizic like Nader lacks the foot speed on D for the NBA.
My post was not a dig at you, thought it might have seen that day. I can completely understand rooting for your countryman. Sorry if it came across that way. But there are others here that routinely hype the next unknown year after year with little to show for it.
-
I actually liked Theis a lot because I saw evidence of a motor and defensive instincts on the film. Zizic like Nader lacks the foot speed on D for the NBA.
My post was not a dig at you, though it might have seen that day. I can completely understand rooting for your countryman. Sorry if it came across that way. But there are others here that routinely hype the next unknown year after year with little to show for it.
Thank you for your consideration.
I guess we all hope for the best and we get carried away.
-
Zizic has looked good recently but it's only a few games. Let's not get carried away but I'm happy for the guy that he's getting some play time and has looked decent. I still don't think he's a difference-maker for the Cavs though but good for him. I'm totally fine with having Theis instead long-term though.
-
Someday he may actually be a useful NBA rotation player.
Slow big men that can't stretch the floor do 2 things in the NBA right now. They plug up your offense and get your team destroyed on the perimeter on defense against the good teams.
Yeah, you just can't win with guys like that starting at center anymore ... oh wait.
Clint Capela
Zaza Pachulia
Jonas Valanciunas
Aron Baynes
Jusuf Nurkic
Steven Adams
Those are the starting centers on the 6 teams with the best records in the NBA right now.
I don't believe the whole lot of them have combined to shoot even one single 3PT shot all year.
All these center's besides Pachulia have at least one good skill.
Capela is an elite rebounder and rim protector
Valanciunas is a very strong rebounder and good scorer
Baynes is a good defender and rebounder
Nurkic is a good rebounder, passer and scorer
Adams is one of the best offensive rebounders in the league and is a solid scorer.
Zizic has worse physical profiles than all these guys besides Zaza, and is less skilled than all of them too. Even with Zaza, it's just a tad dishonest when he starts next to two MVP's, one DPOY and a 3&D All-Star.
My point is simply that the death of the conventional big man is vastly overstated. I'm responding specifically to the comment I replied to. You can win in the NBA with a conventional big man who is not a "stretch big". And most of those guys are indeed slow.
In addition to the above guys, the Clippers have been a very good team the last few seasons with DAJ at the 5.
On Zizic, specifically, the point isn't to compare him. I find it silly for him, at (barely) age 21, with a grand total of just 174 minutes played in the NBA, to be compared to any of those guys.
-
The hype machine, for Zizic was ridiculous here, at least he was part of the package that got us Kyrie. Funny how a guy with no hope like Daniel Theis is a way better player than all the hyped guys.
CB, sometime last year:
"I want a true rebounding 5!
I responded - Žižić does rebound, he always did.
"I want a true rebounding 5, that finishes around the rim!
- Žižić does finishes well there. His true shooting is .725 in the NBA!
"I want a true rebounding 5, that can finish around the rim and hit threes"
- ...That's a different pair of trousers.
Some guys are like my girlfriend.
I love you, but you can be difficult.
He is a rookie big that was the 23rd pick - put things in perspective, please.
At that spot, and at this stage of his career, you shouldn't expect a surefire starting quality dude.
He was never supposed to be a top-shelf talent.
As for Theis, the most of the louder forum members were down on him before they even saw him play...
Classic Euro diss
One poster said that if were expecting good minutes from a 25 yr old undersized rookie we're in trouble.
-
Summer league grounded our expectations on Zizic. Not missed.