WBC

[Finkelskyhook]

WBC ranks up there with the olympics and summer league basketball in the relevence department

[crownsy]

WBC ranks up there with the olympics and summer league basketball in the relevence department

mabey to you, but im actualy really enjoying it.

The players are into it, and since they'd be playing exibition games right now anyway, i don't understand peoples attutide that is bad because players might get hurt.

How'd that go for cole hamels? ducked the "glorified exibtion games" and got hurt in one for the phillies. wouldn't he have rather been hurt playing for the USA than the philles team B against the isotopes?

I would understand the "to much of an injury risk" if it wasen't during times guys would be playing anyway.

[yall hate]

I think it is a cool idea, but I hate the fact that it is at this time of the year.  Sorry, but it should be after the season. 

the damage/potential damage to the players is simply to great for multimillion dollar investments.  DiceK has pitched what, 15 or 16 innings in 3 starts?  that is more then the team would have him do.  they are higher stress innings so he is exerting himself more, etc...

I dont like that.  additionally, instead of these players easing into it, they are thrown right into the fire.

[crownsy]

I think it is a cool idea, but I hate the fact that it is at this time of the year.  Sorry, but it should be after the season. 

the damage/potential damage to the players is simply to great for multimillion dollar investments.  DiceK has pitched what, 15 or 16 innings in 3 starts?  that is more then the team would have him do.  they are higher stress innings so he is exerting himself more, etc...

I dont like that.  additionally, instead of these players easing into it, they are thrown right into the fire.

i've heard this argument, but i just think its so wishy washy. for one, dicek would have thrown about 10 innings by now, mabey more. your telling me those six innings are the make or break innings?

and i've heard the "these are higher stress games" argument, but then the same people want to argue the games aren't even serious because the players don't care/ they don't mean anything. Well which is it?

i also reject that it becomes "more of a strain" to throw/hit/field if the game means more. Pitching is pitching, and hitting is hitting.

just my 2C, but i dont think som exibition games when teams are playing them anyway once every three years is the national epidemic some have made it out to be. not speaking of anyone here, but look at SOSH after youk and dustin got boo boo's. dustin was out 3 days, and it was a national disaster. youk goes down with what he has admited was a rolled ankle, nothing more, and bud is the worst commisionar of all time for thinking of this idea in thier eyes.

[yall hate]

I think it is a cool idea, but I hate the fact that it is at this time of the year.  Sorry, but it should be after the season. 

the damage/potential damage to the players is simply to great for multimillion dollar investments.  DiceK has pitched what, 15 or 16 innings in 3 starts?  that is more then the team would have him do.  they are higher stress innings so he is exerting himself more, etc...

I dont like that.  additionally, instead of these players easing into it, they are thrown right into the fire.

i've heard this argument, but i just think its so wishy washy. for one, dicek would have thrown about 10 innings by now, mabey more. your telling me those six innings are the make or break innings?

and i've heard the "these are higher stress games" argument, but then the same people want to argue the games aren't even serious because the players don't care/ they don't mean anything. Well which is it?

i also reject that it becomes "more of a strain" to throw/hit/field if the game means more. Pitching is pitching, and hitting is hitting.

just my 2C, but i dont think som exibition games when teams are playing them anyway once every three years is the national epidemic some have made it out to be. not speaking of anyone here, but look at SOSH after youk and dustin got boo boo's. dustin was out 3 days, and it was a national disaster. youk goes down with what he has admited was a rolled ankle, nothing more, and bud is the worst commisionar of all time for thinking of this idea in thier eyes.

The six innings do likely make a difference.  The ML teams clearly ease pitchers in very slowly. everything is calculated and diagrammed out.  that isnt the case with the wbc, because the teams have no control.

I think the players clearly care.  thats why David Wright played when injured (without telling the team), thats why Youk played with his hurt ankle without telling anyway, thats why Pedroia tried to play through the oblique injury.  and thats the problem.  these guys want to play because it matters (to a degree) and they want to perform.  if they were playing in meaningless tune up games in Florida, then at the first sign of injury they would come out.

As for higher stress, DiceK, feeling like an entire country is watching his every move in the WBC is certainly going to be trying his hardest to get guys out.  whereas with the sox, he may be working on one specific pitch, or one specific aspect of his delivery etc...so there is a clear difference in mindset and course of conduct.

I agree that pitching is pitching, and hitting is hitting, but as I mention above, the players may not be looking to hit home runs in spring training, just liek a pitcher may be working on one specific aspect.  maybe the hitter is simply trying to track pitches, get a feel for what is what.  he cant do that in the wbc.

I agree the guys at SOSH get too worked up, but if and when a player has a serious injury in the tournament it is going to be a big deal. As it is, I am in the camp of believing that it messes with the players.  I strongly believe this is why some teams refuse to allow their players to play on the various teams. 

I like the tournament, it is exciting.  I would just be much more apt to throw my support behind it if it were after the season.

[Finkelskyhook]

This is the same as the olympics. The owners who employ and pay these players assume all of the risk for this meaningless exhibition.  There's  nothing wishy washy about the checks the owners write.  There's nothing patriotic about these events.  If these guys want to be patriotic they ought to serve their country or communities.  They're playing a game.

If you took time off to do something that risked the ability to do what he pays you to do would you expect your employer to endorse it?  Not to mention pay you for doing it?  It's a ludicrous concept.  And far from wishy washy.

One watches Goddell put forth ridiculous new rules to build halos around the NFL's and their franchise's marquee players (investments) to shield the Bradys and Mannings from injury risk.  It's called protecting your investment.

If the players want to engage in this, they should not only forego their paychecks during the "classic"  , but should forgo them if (and while) they are injured and be required to pay for their own recovery from said injury.  It'd be real interesting to see how "patriotic" these guys would be then......

I'm guessing these guys would be a little wishy washy on the patriotism angle then.

[crownsy]

This is the same as the olympics. The owners who employ and pay these players assume all of the risk for this meaningless exhibition.  There's  nothing wishy washy about the checks the owners write.  There's nothing patriotic about these events.  If these guys want to be patriotic they ought to serve their country or communities.  They're playing a game.

If you took time off to do something that risked the ability to do what he pays you to do would you expect your employer to endorse it?  Not to mention pay you for doing it?  It's a ludicrous concept.  And far from wishy washy.

One watches Goddell put forth ridiculous new rules to build halos around the NFL's and their franchise's marquee players (investments) to shield the Bradys and Mannings from injury risk.  It's called protecting your investment.

If the players want to engage in this, they should not only forego their paychecks during the "classic"  , but should forgo them if (and while) they are injured and be required to pay for their own recovery from said injury.  It'd be real interesting to see how "patriotic" these guys would be then......

I'm guessing these guys would be a little wishy washy on the patriotism angle then.

tell this to teams with players on the internationl squads for the world cup and the euro's. they often have a ton more involved salary wise, and players leave during the season and miss real games, but somehow they make it through the day.

and yes, the World cup is much, much more prestigeous, but it didn't start out that way. The WBC is fine. injuries happen, case in point cole hamels.

kid skipped the WBC and was lauded for it because it protected the phillies investment, and he hurt himself worse than anyone in the WBC in an exibition game.


EDIT:

gettign back to the actual event, anyone watch it last night? what a game, awesome atmopshere and play. I do find it funny the asian teams that promote small ball consistanly do better than big boppign teams loaded with stars

Japan is estatic right now, they own the WBC. also, who is this kid that batted 4th for them and they say (on tv, so take it with a grain of salt) is now a better hitter than ichiro? does he play/ is he going to play in the MLB?

[Finkelskyhook]

getting back to the actual event, anyone watch it last night? what a game, awesome atmopshere and play. I do find it funny the asian teams that promote small ball consistanly do better than big boppign teams loaded with stars

I agree.  I watched part of the game last night.  Amazingly well played and fun to watch in a great atmosphere. 

I object to the wishy washy comment.  If the players want to participate, they should assume part of the risk.  Right now they assume none of it.  That is wrong.

[Amonkey]

So, what does that say about the state of world baseball? Japan completely dominated the tournament. Korea went 6-3 during the tournament, all 3 losses to Japan. Granted, not every top MLB player was in the tournament, but there were definitely some big name MLB players in there, not only on the USA squad but also on the Latin countries (DR, Puerto Rico) and they still lost to a mostly Japanese and Korean league players. I think with that assessment, we can say that the Japanese league is not that far behind in the MLB, which would actually make a Japanese champion versus MLB champion game very interesting.

In the end, I don't know what to make of this. Like I said, not all top players were in the league, and they were coming an off season, but the same can be said about the Japanese players in that regard. The reality is that the Asian countries completely dominated the WBC and until 2013 USA can't say they are the best country in baseball.

[crownsy]

So, what does that say about the state of world baseball? Japan completely dominated the tournament. Korea went 6-3 during the tournament, all 3 losses to Japan. Granted, not every top MLB player was in the tournament, but there were definitely some big name MLB players in there, not only on the USA squad but also on the Latin countries (DR, Puerto Rico) and they still lost to a mostly Japanese and Korean league players. I think with that assessment, we can say that the Japanese league is not that far behind in the MLB, which would actually make a Japanese champion versus MLB champion game very interesting.

In the end, I don't know what to make of this. Like I said, not all top players were in the league, and they were coming an off season, but the same can be said about the Japanese players in that regard. The reality is that the Asian countries completely dominated the WBC and until 2013 USA can't say they are the best country in baseball.

i think what it says most to me is that in a tournoment, its better to play a style like the asian teams do based around hitting for contact and small ball with good defense over huge power, which can flucuate from game to game.

Japan and korea almost always scored 2-3 runs by manufactring them. even when they wern't hitting for power, they were still in it.

[yall hate]

dont forget these teams that are filled with players that arent mlb players have been playing for a while now.  mlb players are just getting started.  there is so much involved in timing and getting little kinks worked out, that it shouldnt be a stretch to show that guys who are not playing for the first time in months are not going to be as 'on the ball' as those who are have been.

[crownsy]

dont forget these teams that are filled with players that arent mlb players have been playing for a while now.  mlb players are just getting started.  there is so much involved in timing and getting little kinks worked out, that it shouldnt be a stretch to show that guys who are not playing for the first time in months are not going to be as 'on the ball' as those who are have been.

japan's season isn't starting for another month either, it starts in mid april, just like ours.

not sure about korea's league, but japans professinal teams have actually been on hiatus longer than MLB players, as they only play 140 games, and wont go back to the grind of thier season till we do.

I think japan just has a more fundemntaly sound group fo players. they don't hit for power, but they all can move a guy over and know how to hit. no one on that team bats .250 and hits 40 HR's. they would rather teach there players how to hit .290 with 25 HR's.

[Amonkey]

Maybe that's something that MLB should look into it.  It seems like an effective method of winning big time with "superior talent" (even though I am not sure of that anymore).  Leave the big paychecks, power hitters out and play the quicker guys.

Question:  Who would win a game in July, when both seasons are done (about 1-2 weeks after the season)- a game between the MLB champion versus the Japanese champion?

Japan's best players are from MLB, but the majority of players are from the Japanese league.  I think this would be very interesting.

[TheReaLPuba]

Gee...instead of taking steroids why not try perfecting fundamentals.

Who woulda thought that would work?