Okafor - The Ringer (article)

[chambers]

I mean the biggest issue here is the inconsistency. Yes it is factually true something doesn't have the actual value of anything until a trade or sale is completed for it. However that is not how this board works ever (and not how larbrd posts either). He has shared plenty of rumors about player trades or Okafor trades even when he liked the proposed terms more. Now that lots of writers have come out and suggested that the 76ers would trade Okafor any top 6 pick etc, he is pretending it is all nonsense.

I mean I was just reading this article from Simmons new site on proposed trades for Okafor and is it things like Okafor for McDermott and Valentine, Okafor for rozier and our lowest level prospects, Okafor for buddy hield, Okafor for oquinn and a mid first from the Knicks. You know, trades for role players. https://theringer.com/who-wants-jahlil-okafor-303e9d13169#.n1hgn0hcm

You don't see people writing articles suggesting that Chris Paul gets traded for Livingston. These rumors by NBA writers on independent site are not usually completely off. So why would they be in the case of Okafor. It is some conspiracy?

TP. Interesting article.

I am not a fan of Okafor's game but if this writer is correct and the Celtics could land Okafor for some combo of:

Rozier
Mickey
Hunter
Young
Jackson
Bentil
Yabusele
Zizic

and a draft pick like the Celtics 2018 pick, I would be all for it. Its a perfect consolidation trade that doesn't give up any core players or either of the two Brooklyn picks. If Philly would want some second rounders as well, give them to them.

My guess is a trade like this will happen somewhere close to the end of September when Philly really starts feeling the unbalanced roster crunch

I don't see it happening, because the people who get paid to make NBA personnel decisions aren't as nuts as the posters of this board are when it comes to Okafor's value.

But if you could get him for a bag of Ainge's trash, by all means get him.

We won't really know what his value is until he is traded, but I think we can all agree it is no longer that of a top 3 pick.

Just look at this snippet about James Young at the end of the 2015 season -

"Look, Boston still doesn't know what they have in James Young," a general manager told Bulpett. "But what we do know is that if Young went back to school for another year, we'd be talking about him as a top-10 pick in this draft."

You have to think Ainge is probably kicking himself if Young was worth a top 10 pick in last year's draft. I realize that particular GM probably meant if Young had more seasoning and was just entering the draft rather than toiling in the D-League all year, but that can show you how fast a player's value can plummet.

Philly would be wise go get something decent for him now if they truly don't believe in his future.

I'm just curious... do people think Mario Hezonja could be acquired for the likes of Jordan Mickey?  Presumably his trade value is low too.  He didn't show half of what Okafor did as a rookie.   Does that mean Orlando is going to give up on him and trade him away for a 2nd round talent?

First off let me say that I dont believe for a second that Okafor is available for a bag of balls.

However, the Huzonja situation is different. Mario is from Europe and was a known project. A bit in the Dante Exum mold .Furthermore, Hezonja is still a mystery because he was playing in a 123 rotatin that was pretty deep. Oladipo Peyton Fournier Harris even Gordon.

Okafor also had roster complications but he got on the floor. He played a ton. He also wasnt seen as much of a project. He was supposed to translate immediately. Furthermore, he added injury and character concerns to his list of negatives while Hezonja remained an unkown. I think both guys saw their values drop a bit, but Okafors, Id imagine, dropped a lot further.

Where do you get the idea that Okafor wasn't seen as much of a prospect.  Yes, he was rightfully praised for his outstanding post skills, but who said he was a finished product?

I guess a better comparison would be our very own Marcus Smart.  Smart was seen as one of the two most NBA-ready players in his draft class.  He was supposed to come in and make an immediate impact.   Instead, he struggled mightily.   For two straight seasons he's been complete incompetent on the offensive end.  His shooting has been historically bad.  While he shows signs defensively, the advanced stats don't seem to back up the idea that he's dominant on that end.  He lost his starting role and plays on a team with a major log jam at his position.  Not only does he have to contend for minutes with starters Thomas and Bradley, but he has to hold off Rozier, and possibly even Young, Hunter, Gerald Green and Jaylen Brown for guard minutes.    All things considered, his trade value has tanked.  I'm sure other teams around the league think he's "worth" for a couple of their d-leaguers.  Maybe he's worth a late 1st rounder at this point. 

You could argue that Boston would be best off trading Marcus Smart for a role player.  Maybe someone who can help with their rebounding woes.  Maybe a backup 3-point specialist.   But would Boston trade him for that?  Nah.  No point.  There's still a chance Smart develops into a much better player.  We have hope.  If all he's worth is a backup rebounder, d-leaguer, or late 1st, we might as well just hang onto him, keep feeding him his 24-32 minutes per night, and hope his trade value skews upwards.   

Same situation for Philly and Okafor, except that Okafor has shown signs of being a star offensively instead of defensively... and we've only seen a single season of him in a really bizarre situation as opposed to two full seasons of disappointment.  Also, at the moment Okafor still seems to be penciled in as the starter and prime offensive weapon for that team... trading him for a role player makes very little sense.

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Wanna give an example of a role player we could trade for Smart that would make sense?
I'm not being facetious, I would actually like to hear who you think would make sense in a trade like that.

[Celtics4ever]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

[chambers]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

No doubt. I think he's already a better player than Tony Allen and is a candidate for the all defensive team. The team does far better with him on the court.

I'm just curious to know what role players Brd thinks could potentially be traded for Smart, because Smart right now is an elite role player, with potential still in the bag for being much greater.

[Csfan1984]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

Tony wasn't traded he left as a FA.

[celticsclay]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

No doubt. I think he's already a better player than Tony Allen and is a candidate for the all defensive team. The team does far better with him on the court.

I'm just curious to know what role players Brd thinks could potentially be traded for Smart, because Smart right now is an elite role player, with potential still in the bag for being much greater.

He obviously was just trying to get a reaction by saying Marcus Smart's trade value was a few d-leaguers or a late first. That is why we said he had lost it. It is not worth responding to like that is a serious idea.

[timpiker]

Smart may never get much better or he could become the next DWade.  Too early to tell.

[Ilikesports17]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

No doubt. I think he's already a better player than Tony Allen and is a candidate for the all defensive team. The team does far better with him on the court.

I'm just curious to know what role players Brd thinks could potentially be traded for Smart, because Smart right now is an elite role player, with potential still in the bag for being much greater.

He obviously was just trying to get a reaction by saying Marcus Smart's trade value was a few d-leaguers or a late first. That is why we said he had lost it. It is not worth responding to like that is a serious idea.

No. I think hes got a good point.

Trading Marcus Smart now would be selling low on him. Similarly, trading Jahlil now would be selling low on him. Difference is twofold. 1st Smart can better exist in his current form than Jahlil and 2nd Philly is under more pressure to trade a big than Boston is to trade a guard.

[celticsclay]

his defensive impact outweighs any of those things you mention. He is already an elite role player under rookie contract. We are now hoping he takes the leap from role player to star- which he has plenty of time to do.

Smart is a good defender but his shooting needs to improve.  There are two ends of the court, you should not stink at one of them and he does right now.  I honestly, think if he does not Ainge could trade him.  I would remind you that Tony Allen had many of the same strengths and weaknesses that Smart has and Ainge traded him.  Allen could drive too.   That alone should tell you he is not untouchable.

Hopefully, his shot improves and this will not be an issue.  That would be the best case scenario.

No doubt. I think he's already a better player than Tony Allen and is a candidate for the all defensive team. The team does far better with him on the court.

I'm just curious to know what role players Brd thinks could potentially be traded for Smart, because Smart right now is an elite role player, with potential still in the bag for being much greater.

He obviously was just trying to get a reaction by saying Marcus Smart's trade value was a few d-leaguers or a late first. That is why we said he had lost it. It is not worth responding to like that is a serious idea.

No. I think hes got a good point.

Trading Marcus Smart now would be selling low on him. Similarly, trading Jahlil now would be selling low on him. Difference is twofold. 1st Smart can better exist in his current form than Jahlil and 2nd Philly is under more pressure to trade a big than Boston is to trade a guard.

lol nobody is trading either smart or Okafor for d-leaguers. Suggesting it for either is just trying to incite a reaction.

[footey]

Smart may never get much better or he could become the next DWade.  Too early to tell.

Like Smart. But he will never be the next Wade. Get real.

[Eddie20]

Smart may never get much better or he could become the next DWade.  Too early to tell.

Like Smart. But he will never be the next Wade. Get real.

I'll agree with that. Smart's ceiling is probably Lowry with all-NBA defense, which is pretty [dang] good.

[chambers]

Smart may never get much better or he could become the next DWade.  Too early to tell.

Like Smart. But he will never be the next Wade. Get real.

I'll agree with that. Smart's ceiling is probably Lowry with all-NBA defense, which is pretty [dang] good.

If he somehow becomes a 35% 3 point shooter I could see him as Chauncey Billups reincarnated, with even better defense.