Author Topic: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete (Merged)  (Read 25363 times)

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Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2018, 01:34:04 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2018, 01:38:42 PM »

Offline RodyTur10

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

If Thomas would get traded for Bradley, that would be very ironic. Even if they thought it would be a good move, they wouldn't do it since it makes the Irving trade look worse.

But I agree with you. Cleveland doesn't need more star power or primary scoring options. They need a supporting cast that consists of reliable shooters and players who can hold their own defensively against Curry, Thompson and Durant.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2018, 01:38:44 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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I'm not sure how fair it is to single out Isaiah for being a poor defender. Their age as a whole, is contributing to their lack of defensive effort. If each man can't seem to defend their own guy, then what made anyone think they could provide help defense for Isaiah's man?

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2018, 01:41:42 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

If Thomas would get traded for Bradley, that would be very ironic. Even if they thought it would be a good move, they wouldn't do it since it makes the Irving trade look worse.

But I agree with you. Cleveland doesn't need more star power or primary scoring options. They need a supporting cast that consists of reliable shooters and players who can hold their own defensively against Curry, Thompson and Durant.

Bradley for IT would instantly make them a lot better.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2018, 01:45:45 PM »

Offline blink

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

If Thomas would get traded for Bradley, that would be very ironic. Even if they thought it would be a good move, they wouldn't do it since it makes the Irving trade look worse.

But I agree with you. Cleveland doesn't need more star power or primary scoring options. They need a supporting cast that consists of reliable shooters and players who can hold their own defensively against Curry, Thompson and Durant.

Bradley for IT would instantly make them a lot better.

Yes it would.  I don't want that to happen anytime soon.  There is a chance that Bradley would spark other players to giving better effort, but I am not sure.

Plus I would have to root against my fav ex-celtic (currently playing) when we beat the cavs in the playoffs.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2018, 01:47:13 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Lebron needs defensive help , not scoring .   

Two younger intense defensive players like Bradley would help right the ship.

To get players like this ,  teams may demand picks as well as players.

Cavs second string played good .....cause IT is not on it .   

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2018, 01:47:25 PM »

Offline blink

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They are just noticing that Thomas is worse than Irving?  Really?  The Cavs have some terrible scouts.  If they didn't know that Thomas was a terrible defensive player last year when healthy, than they were in for a rude awakening.   Smart covered for many of his shortcomings.  However, the Cavs do not have a "Smart" on their team.  Good luck Cavs.  HaHa
Except he's not worse than Irving. He's just not nearly as healthy, and there is a good chance we will never see the same IT ever again.

The Cavaliers' defense isn't bad because of Isaiah Thomas. He has barely even played this year. Their defense is bad because they don't have a single elite defensive player on their roster. Having Thomas in the starting lineup certainly doesn't help, but there is no other point guard in the league who could turn Cleveland into even a mediocre defensive ballclub, let alone one that can seriously challenge Golden State in the finals.

Replace IT with Kyrie on that team, and its defense is still 29th in the league.

I don't agree with the bolded part at all.  Lebron is still a great defender.  I am not sure how often he brings his A-game defensively during the regular season, but he is still a great defender.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2018, 01:48:36 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

If Thomas would get traded for Bradley, that would be very ironic. Even if they thought it would be a good move, they wouldn't do it since it makes the Irving trade look worse.

But I agree with you. Cleveland doesn't need more star power or primary scoring options. They need a supporting cast that consists of reliable shooters and players who can hold their own defensively against Curry, Thompson and Durant.

Bradley for IT would instantly make them a lot better.

Yes it would.  I don't want that to happen anytime soon.  There is a chance that Bradley would spark other players to giving better effort, but I am not sure.

Plus I would have to root against my fav ex-celtic (currently playing) when we beat the cavs in the playoffs.
probably worth noting that AB is currently underwelming in Detroit. Once again, the Pistons are better defensively when he is off the floor and they have a better w/l record in games he misses.

This is consistent with his last few years here. Defensive and impact stats are noisy and crappy, but I think AB is hugely overrated as a defensive player. He cant switch, he's bad off ball and he hurts your team size badly because he cant play the 1 or guard most 2s.
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Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2018, 01:49:10 PM »

Offline spikelovetheCelts

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I read a post on Kings Chat room that George Hill is a done deal to the Cavs. I think it would be a good move by the Cavs. The Kings also have other vets. I know the Cavs will make a move and i don't see why the Kings would not at least listen. The major problem is the Cavs don't have a good GM to make one happen. IMO.
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Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2018, 01:52:41 PM »

Offline celticinorlando

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It is amazing how little the Cavs get out of 2 major pieces of that trade. Jae Crowder is a token starter but never plays during the big boy minutes


Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2018, 01:53:16 PM »

Offline blink

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Lebron needs defensive help , not scoring .   

Two younger intense defensive players like Bradley would help right the ship.

To get players like this ,  teams may demand picks as well as players.

Cavs second string played good .....cause IT is not on it .

The first game IT came back he was playing on the 2nd team, and their 2nd unit was playing really well.  I honestly think it would be better for the Cavs to have IT be a spark plug bench player than starting.  He isn't healthy yet.  Moving him in as a starter seems to have upset their team chemistry for whatever reason.

Watching them yesterday, Wade has really done well coming off the bench this year, he doesn't have to log the minutes as a starter and he still is pretty effective.  I don't know why a 2nd team IT / Wade back court couldn't work.  I think IT on the 2nd team lowers his def liability and playing with a larger guard Wade could help.

Either way, until clev starts actually trying hard on def they are going to continue to lose more games.  Good for us, lets hope they don't ever decide to actually put effort in on d. haha

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2018, 01:55:15 PM »

Offline Eric_Suede

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Haven't the Cavs gone through these "slumps" for the last 3 years in a row where people fall for it and actually question "are the cavs falling apart" for it all to come together in the playoffs? Until the Cavs get knocked out of the Playoffs , it think it's silly to even entertain convos like this.

This is like those reports talking about talking about the turmoil in the locker room with the Patriots. I take all this with a grain of salt.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 02:01:02 PM by Eric_Suede »

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2018, 01:58:31 PM »

Offline blink

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AB could really really make an impact on defense.  and the team i. terms of embrassing the rest of the Cavs ...when they see how hard he works .....it sets a tone for everybody else.

AB would change the dynamics of Caves defense .   Crowder might play harder if AB was on the team ...IT is just a liability for the Cavs main weaknes defense .  Cavs don't need scoring ....ITs role ..they need lock down defense stoppers.

If Thomas would get traded for Bradley, that would be very ironic. Even if they thought it would be a good move, they wouldn't do it since it makes the Irving trade look worse.

But I agree with you. Cleveland doesn't need more star power or primary scoring options. They need a supporting cast that consists of reliable shooters and players who can hold their own defensively against Curry, Thompson and Durant.

Bradley for IT would instantly make them a lot better.

Yes it would.  I don't want that to happen anytime soon.  There is a chance that Bradley would spark other players to giving better effort, but I am not sure.

Plus I would have to root against my fav ex-celtic (currently playing) when we beat the cavs in the playoffs.
probably worth noting that AB is currently underwelming in Detroit. Once again, the Pistons are better defensively when he is off the floor and they have a better w/l record in games he misses.

This is consistent with his last few years here. Defensive and impact stats are noisy and crappy, but I think AB is hugely overrated as a defensive player. He cant switch, he's bad off ball and he hurts your team size badly because he cant play the 1 or guard most 2s.

Well I did say "I don't know" if Bradley would make them better on D.  I wasn't really speaking about advanced def stats honestly, more just the eye test.  I don't think AB is HUGELY overrated as a defender.  He gives great effort, and still is a great on ball defender.  He is better than anyone the Cavs can currently throw at Curry.

The other players for Clev other than Lebron need to just raise their level of intensity and effort on D.  Maybe they can't? Maybe they are all too old, and this is the only gear they have.  I hope so.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2018, 01:59:30 PM »

Offline celticinorlando

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Haven't the Cavs gone through these "slumps" for the last 3 years in a row where people fall for it and actually question "are the cavs falling apart" for it all to come together in the playoffs? Until the Cavs get knocked out of the Playoffs , it think it's silly to even entertain convos like this.

You must not remember the Cavs pre James to Miami. And this time they do not have Kyrie...who is showing to have done a lot more for that team. This time the entire team is old.

Re: McMenanim: Cavs players don't think current roster can compete
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2018, 01:59:30 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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A whole bunch of stuff came out this morning. Here's another from Joe Vardon of Cleveland.com:

Quote
"Rotations are awful. IT (Isaiah Thomas) is so much worse than Kyrie (Irving) defensively it's insane," said a league source. "There is not a great feeling anywhere. They need to limp into the All-Star break and get away from each other."

Some nuggets on Thomas from this article: "In the meantime, Thomas continues to struggle to shoot as he works his way back from seven months off due to hip injuries.

Thomas was 8-of-21 shooting against the Warriors and finished with 19 points. Thomas again mentioned the Cavs "don't practice" -- an apparent shot at the organization considering the number of times he's mentioned it over the past several days. He's continually cited a lack of practice as the reason he's playing his way into shape.

Thomas put up the most shots of any Cavs player on Monday, and his teammates said it is his role to shoot. But at the same time, their patience is being tested as the losses mount and the rhythm they had at both ends of the court when they won 18 of 19 games is gone."


Lol that organization is such a ****show. It makes you appreciate how good we have it here with Boston.

Also, it's looking more and more like those "agenda" comments were in fact aimed at IT and his shot selection and decision-making, which has been a constant source of discussion around the league since then.

EDIT: And I should clarify that I don't really blame IT for this either. He's out there for his offensive prowess, not anything else, so I don't understand why this would come as a surprise to anyone. On a team like Cleveland especially, I think IT would be best served as a scoring sparkplug off the bench and at the end of games where he wouldn't have to worry about sharing the ball as much as he'll need to with Lebron and Love.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 02:05:31 PM by jpotter33 »