Fire Joe! ... or critique Joe ... or defend Joe... or worry about Joe's coaching

[Celtics2021]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

The thing with these stats is there is a confounder — players generally don’t take threes if they aren’t open.  The substantial majority of attempted threes in virtually every game are open or wide open — I’d bet 70% or more.  Miami made a higher percentage on those than they normally do, and they started out hot so they kept taking them.  We made a lower percentage than we normally do, and we started out cold, so we took fewer and got away from our usual offense.

[jpotter33]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

Edit:
I found the stats (learned to fish).  Boston attempts:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 0-0
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-6
Open (4-6 feet): 10-17
Wide open (6+ feet): 2-9

Most of BOS 3PA were open or wide open too, although MIA had a lot more wide open shots per this tracking over just open.  We were only 2-9 on our wide open shots (22%).  MIA was 41.3% on wide open 3PA in the regular season.  65% in the game last night.

The 23 wide open threes are the major area of concern. Not being within 6 feet is alarming at this level and for this good of a perimeter defense.

And it’s not like most of these were transition threes either. The vast majority were in the half court set, which clearly indicates that this is more of a gameplan issue (e.g.the extreme drop defense).

For whatever reason, we clearly took a gamble and employed a strategy that dared them to beat us from three - which fell right into their hands and was exactly what they wanted. It’s just poor game planning and strategy.

[Vermont Green]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

The thing with these stats is there is a confounder — players generally don’t take threes if they aren’t open.  The substantial majority of attempted threes in virtually every game are open or wide open — I’d bet 70% or more.  Miami made a higher percentage on those than they normally do, and they started out hot so they kept taking them.  We made a lower percentage than we normally do, and we started out cold, so we took fewer and got away from our usual offense.

I added the BOS attempt summary (MIA defense) after the original post:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 0-0
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-6
Open (4-6 feet): 10-17
Wide open (6+ feet): 2-9

It is exactly as Celtics2012 says.  Most of BOS 3PA were open or wide open too.  79% for BOS, 86% for MIA.  MIA had more open/wide open attempt overall and a high percentage of the total, but to say that MIA shots were all open and BOS shots were defended is not accurate.  And MIA hit way above their norms for percent made.  BOS didn't

I expect that there will be some adjustment or more emphasis on defending the 3, but I don't expect or believe there needs to be any radical change in the defense.  My adjustment would be to pressure the ball earlier, make it harder for them to get into their set.  They are still going to get open and wide open 3PAs, every team does, but the harder you make them work to get to the shot, the less likely they are to make the shot.

[angryguy77]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

The thing with these stats is there is a confounder — players generally don’t take threes if they aren’t open.  The substantial majority of attempted threes in virtually every game are open or wide open — I’d bet 70% or more.  Miami made a higher percentage on those than they normally do, and they started out hot so they kept taking them.  We made a lower percentage than we normally do, and we started out cold, so we took fewer and got away from our usual offense.

Miami made it tougher for us to shoot threes.....Why are we acting like this is something new? Last year he was heard during a TO saying if we can't hit threes we're cooked or something to that effect.

Between last year and this, you have to stop chalking their 3% up to "shucks it's just bad luck"
It's happening because of that moron Brad gave the keys to. He cannot be gone soon enough.

[RMO]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

Edit:
I found the stats (learned to fish).  Boston attempts:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 0-0
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-6
Open (4-6 feet): 10-17
Wide open (6+ feet): 2-9

Most of BOS 3PA were open or wide open too, although MIA had a lot more wide open shots per this tracking over just open.  We were only 2-9 on our wide open shots (22%).  MIA was 41.3% on wide open 3PA in the regular season.  65% in the game last night.

The 23 wide open threes are the major area of concern. Not being within 6 feet is alarming at this level and for this good of a perimeter defense.

And it’s not like most of these were transition threes either. The vast majority were in the half court set, which clearly indicates that this is more of a gameplan issue (e.g.the extreme drop defense).

For whatever reason, we clearly took a gamble and employed a strategy that dared them to beat us from three - which fell right into their hands and was exactly what they wanted. It’s just poor game planning and strategy.

One play that stood out to me was when Al dropped on Duncan Robinson at the top of the key.  Yes, the game plan may have been to let them have those threes but context really matters.  What else is Duncan Robinson going to do if he's open above the three point line?  Al might not be the most mobile on the perimeter but I think he can handle Duncan Robinson off the dribble.

[Boston Garden Leprechaun]

So all the people saying Joe will be a liability in the playoffs were right?

ROCKET SCIENCE No?? LOL

[Roy H.]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

The thing with these stats is there is a confounder — players generally don’t take threes if they aren’t open.  The substantial majority of attempted threes in virtually every game are open or wide open — I’d bet 70% or more.  Miami made a higher percentage on those than they normally do, and they started out hot so they kept taking them.  We made a lower percentage than we normally do, and we started out cold, so we took fewer and got away from our usual offense.

I added the BOS attempt summary (MIA defense) after the original post:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 0-0
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-6
Open (4-6 feet): 10-17
Wide open (6+ feet): 2-9

It is exactly as Celtics2012 says.  Most of BOS 3PA were open or wide open too.  79% for BOS, 86% for MIA.  MIA had more open/wide open attempt overall and a high percentage of the total, but to say that MIA shots were all open and BOS shots were defended is not accurate.  And MIA hit way above their norms for percent made.  BOS didn't

I expect that there will be some adjustment or more emphasis on defending the 3, but I don't expect or believe there needs to be any radical change in the defense.  My adjustment would be to pressure the ball earlier, make it harder for them to get into their set.  They are still going to get open and wide open 3PAs, every team does, but the harder you make them work to get to the shot, the less likely they are to make the shot.

26 open 3PTs for us, versus 37 for them.  Almost 50% more. 

Miami effectively limited our three point attempts, whereas according to the actual players on the court, we left Miami open by design.

[iadera]

We will beat Miami in this series, but this team ain't going to the NBA Finals. Not to mention C'ship.

[DocomoCelts]

So all the people saying Joe will be a liability in the playoffs were right?

Not yet, as it's only game 3 and 1 loss, but it's certainly leaning that way.

[SparzWizard]

So all the people saying Joe will be a liability in the playoffs were right?

Not yet, as it's only game 3 and 1 loss, but it's certainly leaning that way.

Yes since 2023 playoffs

[Celtics2021]

I’m coming to this thread after the Heat series to collect some receipts.  Oh heavens, they lost a game!

[angryguy77]

In 2022 we were driven mad by drop coverage against gs. Now it's claimed Joe was in charge of defense that year. I always doubted how much influence he had on that end of the floor during that run. Seeing us playing the same defense against the heat is making me think he was more involved than I give him credit for. It would make sense given he's shown he's not one to change approach since taking over.

[angryguy77]

I’m coming to this thread after the Heat series to collect some receipts.  Oh heavens, they lost a game!

Winning this series doesn't prove Joe is worthy of the job. You do you though.

[Roy H.]

I’m coming to this thread after the Heat series to collect some receipts.  Oh heavens, they lost a game!

Receipts for what?

Joe coached poorly and his decisions helped cost us a game.  The same thing happened last year.

None of that means we will lose to the eighth seed (again).  But, nobody in their right mind can say that Joe coached a good game last night. Those receipts have already been cashed.

[0003323344]

NBA tracking on Miami 3-point attempts in Game 2:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 1-1
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-5
Open (4-6 feet): 6-14
Wide open (6+ feet): 15-23


No Joe, they were not contested as you said.

So this tracking is saying that MIA had 37 3PAs that were either open or wide open (and made 21)?  That doesn't sound right.  The defense did not look that bad to me, but I wasn't measuring how close the defender was.

What was the tracking for BOS 3PA?

Edit:
I found the stats (learned to fish).  Boston attempts:

Very tight defense (0-2 feet): 0-0
Tight defense (2-4 feet): 1-6
Open (4-6 feet): 10-17
Wide open (6+ feet): 2-9

Most of BOS 3PA were open or wide open too, although MIA had a lot more wide open shots per this tracking over just open.  We were only 2-9 on our wide open shots (22%).  MIA was 41.3% on wide open 3PA in the regular season.  65% in the game last night.

The 23 wide open threes are the major area of concern. Not being within 6 feet is alarming at this level and for this good of a perimeter defense.

And it’s not like most of these were transition threes either. The vast majority were in the half court set, which clearly indicates that this is more of a gameplan issue (e.g.the extreme drop defense).

For whatever reason, we clearly took a gamble and employed a strategy that dared them to beat us from three - which fell right into their hands and was exactly what they wanted. It’s just poor game planning and strategy.

When the other team makes 8 three pointers in the first quarter a light bulb should have gone off in Joes feeble mind saying ok we need to change our strategy and defend the three much tighter but Joe being Joe just kept on letting Miami shoot their threes.