Author Topic: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year  (Read 7954 times)

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Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2023, 06:09:10 AM »

Offline cman88

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hes not getting traded because GM's don't overreact to a bad playoff series to determine a players future and make dumb irrational emotional decisions that fans make.

this season is and playoffs is on mazzulla

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2023, 06:52:22 AM »

Offline greg683x

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It's unlikely, but there's absolutely precedent for trading a star player like this a year before they're a free agent. We had one just this year in Kyrie, even if slightly different situation given Kyrie's controversial character and decisions.

But it's actually not all that dissimilar given that I think there's going to be real questions about paying Brown the supermax after this postseason. His several major weaknesses have been on full display this postseason, and it's looking clearer and clearer that he's not a great second star fit behind JT given his strengths/weaknesses compared to Tatum, at least with our current no-true-PG dynamic. If you're not going to pay him the supermax, you absolutely have to trade him, as he almost certainly feels like he deserves it and will be slighted by not getting it.

If you can find a team that Brown would at least softly commit to for next year, you can absolutely find a trade partner with reasonable return.

The obvious choice here is Atlanta, and while I'm no Trae fan, there is some logic behind a trade package centered on a Trae for JB swap. Something like: Trae and Bey for Brown, White/Brogdon/Smart, and PP.

For Boston: our lack of a true point guard has been on full display this postseason yet again, as well as having a true alpha type star to help Tatum out in the closing moments. For all his flaws, Trae would actually fit this need perfectly. He'd provide us a true, proven point guard to take over the offense, as well as serve as a second, bonafide star to help Tatum out when things get tight down the stretch. Further, he's an excellent decision-maker and passer with a higher BBIQ. He'd also seemingly thrive with another star the caliber of Tatum.

For Atlanta: JB is from the Atlanta area and has regularly discussed loving playing back in his home area. He would seemingly relish the opportunity to go back home and play for his home team, especially given that he could be "the man" there and get all the attention. Trae has had some issues with Atlanta's coaching and management in the past, and there were already rumors about looking to move him this summer. JB would provide a similar level star who seemingly has less baggage and would be a better fit with Murray and the rest of their roster.

Not likely to happen, but I do think we have to make some sort of move for a truer point guard this summer. And moving one or more of Smart, White, and Brogdon and/or a star swap with Brown is the best way to do this.

I’d rather stand pat than trade for Trae
Greg

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2023, 11:40:35 AM »

Offline keevsnick

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It's unlikely, but there's absolutely precedent for trading a star player like this a year before they're a free agent. We had one just this year in Kyrie, even if slightly different situation given Kyrie's controversial character and decisions.

But it's actually not all that dissimilar given that I think there's going to be real questions about paying Brown the supermax after this postseason. His several major weaknesses have been on full display this postseason, and it's looking clearer and clearer that he's not a great second star fit behind JT given his strengths/weaknesses compared to Tatum, at least with our current no-true-PG dynamic. If you're not going to pay him the supermax, you absolutely have to trade him, as he almost certainly feels like he deserves it and will be slighted by not getting it.

If you can find a team that Brown would at least softly commit to for next year, you can absolutely find a trade partner with reasonable return.

The obvious choice here is Atlanta, and while I'm no Trae fan, there is some logic behind a trade package centered on a Trae for JB swap. Something like: Trae and Bey for Brown, White/Brogdon/Smart, and PP.

For Boston: our lack of a true point guard has been on full display this postseason yet again, as well as having a true alpha type star to help Tatum out in the closing moments. For all his flaws, Trae would actually fit this need perfectly. He'd provide us a true, proven point guard to take over the offense, as well as serve as a second, bonafide star to help Tatum out when things get tight down the stretch. Further, he's an excellent decision-maker and passer with a higher BBIQ. He'd also seemingly thrive with another star the caliber of Tatum.

For Atlanta: JB is from the Atlanta area and has regularly discussed loving playing back in his home area. He would seemingly relish the opportunity to go back home and play for his home team, especially given that he could be "the man" there and get all the attention. Trae has had some issues with Atlanta's coaching and management in the past, and there were already rumors about looking to move him this summer. JB would provide a similar level star who seemingly has less baggage and would be a better fit with Murray and the rest of their roster.

Not likely to happen, but I do think we have to make some sort of move for a truer point guard this summer. And moving one or more of Smart, White, and Brogdon and/or a star swap with Brown is the best way to do this.

I'm not saying you can't trade a star player, I'm saying in this situation its extremely unlikely. Ironically enough, the Irving situation is a good example of why.

In the case of Irving BRK was able to trade him, the return they got back was two low end starters and a first round pick several years down the line. That package is fine value wise, but in terms of actual competing in the near future it was a downgrade that took BRK out of contention. BRK was fine with that because they saw the writing on the wall and knew they were going to rebuild anyway. But is that the direction people want Boston to go? Obviously not, Boston is too close right now to just start over.

The reason the Irving trade got done was Dallas was willing to bet with Irving's limited market they had a strong chance of bringing him back if they offered the max they could. No such assurance is possible with the team acquiring Jaylen Brown. And it only worked for BRK because they were fine with a package they are probably going to flip for draft picks as part of a rebuild. that doesn't really work for Boston.  As a general rule its hard to make a trade work when both teams want the same thing: A team acquiring Brown wants to win now, Boston wants to win now.

The Trade young trade is interesting, but I would not trade Jaylen for a small PG. Just flat no. We've tried that approach three different times (Thomas, Irving, Kemba) and the Celtics walked away from that deciding it wasn't the way to go.

And besides that I can pretty much guarantee that after a single season of watching Trae Young jack up 30 footers and play zero defense Celtics fans might literally burn down the TD garden in frustration. He is the living embodiment of everything C's fan love to complain about.

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2023, 11:46:22 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Would you trade Jaylen for Darius Garland?

CLE gets to move away from their undersized defensively challenged backcourt. Fills that SF spot. Can look for a defensive guard to play alongside Donovan Mitchell.

BOS gets a true PG who can create off the bounce at a high rate. Garland can create for himself and for others. He can push the pace and give BOS tempo. He doesn't impede on Tatum too much. I feel Trae Young would. A similar type of player as Garland but even more ball dominant and even weaker defensively. I believe Garland would take a back-seat to Tatum easier.
I would and I thought about including both them and Atlanta in my list, but figured I had enough on there to emphasize the point that there are trades out there.  Towns is also a possibility given how badly Minnesota's season ended.
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Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2023, 11:51:04 AM »

Offline Moranis

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hes not getting traded because GM's don't overreact to a bad playoff series to determine a players future and make dumb irrational emotional decisions that fans make.

this season is and playoffs is on mazzulla
Sure but there are 6 uears of Boston being better with Brown not playing..  his on/off differential per 100 possessions has always been terrible.  Brown quite simply doesn't impact wins and losses for Boston and he never has.  I've gone through why countless times on this board but in short he isn't a good fit with Tatum because while he doe kost things well, he has no elite skills and he is worse than Tatum at basically everything.  The team does better with an elite shooter or much better play maker playing in Brown's role. Those player compliment and enhance Tatum, while Brown does not.
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Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
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Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2023, 11:51:52 AM »

Offline Larry for 3

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I don’t see this ownership paying brown 60 mil a year. That and brown wants out as I said in the other thread. I wouldn’t be shocked if there’s public trade demand very soon
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Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2023, 11:53:04 AM »

Offline keevsnick

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Or he is traded for a player or players similarly situated.  Or a team takes the chance on re-signing him.  Or he indicates he happily go somewhere.  Or a team is looking to move on from a guy.  Players get traded all of the time with 1 year left. 

A couple of trades that in theory make sense and the value is reasonable

Brown, Smart for Siakam, Anunoby

Brown, Smart for Klay, Kuminga, Moody

Brown, Smart for Lillard

Brown for JJJ

Brown for Sabonis, Huerter

Brown, Rob, Gallinari for Ingram, Valanciunas, Murphy

If Houston signs Harden then something like Brown for Green makes a fair amount of sense

All of those make some level of sense for both teams.  I don't think Brown gets traded, but it also isn't out of the realm of possibility.
I would cry with joy at Brown & Smart for Siakam & OG, or for Dame. Would also probably do the Pels deal too

Okay, this is another good example. Why would TOR do this deal? I think brown is a little better than Siakam for sure, although OG is probably a little better than Smart. Lets say this deal makes Toronto slightly better. But whats that get them? They were a play in team this year, maybe this gets them back in the play in as a 7th or 8th seed? Great. That's not a situation Toronto is going to feel great about getting Jaylen to re-sign into.

And for the C's the big issue is the defacto-hard cap moving forward. So the solution to that is.... get even more expensive? You save a little money giving Siakam a 30% max vs the Jaylen 35% max, but then you have to pay OG who is likely going to make a good deal more than Smart. I find it hard to believe the C's would trade Brown for two guys on 1 year deals (super risky) rather than just offer him the super max. The financial stuff becomes an even bigger issue!

Again, if a team is going to trade for Jaylen with 1 year left on his deal it needs to be a team that is winning next year (so they can convince him to stay), ideally in a market he'd want to be in. They'd need to be comfortable enough with the deal that they'd be okay risking him leaving, which likely means the c's aren't getting enough back. That's the issue. 

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2023, 11:54:51 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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Would you trade Jaylen for Darius Garland?

CLE gets to move away from their undersized defensively challenged backcourt. Fills that SF spot. Can look for a defensive guard to play alongside Donovan Mitchell.

BOS gets a true PG who can create off the bounce at a high rate. Garland can create for himself and for others. He can push the pace and give BOS tempo. He doesn't impede on Tatum too much. I feel Trae Young would. A similar type of player as Garland but even more ball dominant and even weaker defensively. I believe Garland would take a back-seat to Tatum easier.
I would and I thought about including both them and Atlanta in my list, but figured I had enough on there to emphasize the point that there are trades out there.  Towns is also a possibility given how badly Minnesota's season ended.
Why would Minny trade Towns for JB?   Edwards/JB doesn't seem like that good of a combo.  JB only has one year on his contract whereas Towns has 4 years left. 

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #23 on: May 22, 2023, 11:56:59 AM »

Offline cman88

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I don’t see this ownership paying brown 60 mil a year. That and brown wants out as I said in the other thread. I wouldn’t be shocked if there’s public trade demand very soon

can you show where he wants out?

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #24 on: May 22, 2023, 12:02:18 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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hes not getting traded because GM's don't overreact to a bad playoff series to determine a players future and make dumb irrational emotional decisions that fans make.

this season is and playoffs is on mazzulla
Sure but there are 6 uears of Boston being better with Brown not playing..  his on/off differential per 100 possessions has always been terrible.  Brown quite simply doesn't impact wins and losses for Boston and he never has.  I've gone through why countless times on this board but in short he isn't a good fit with Tatum because while he doe kost things well, he has no elite skills and he is worse than Tatum at basically everything.  The team does better with an elite shooter or much better play maker playing in Brown's role. Those player compliment and enhance Tatum, while Brown does not.

They were literally better with him on the court than off the court just last year! And actually the year before that too! (According to cleaning the glass net rating). Admittedly he's been up and down in that regard, there were years like his third year (where he got benched) where he was bad, and the number was bad this year as well. I think he impacts winning. not as much as Tatum to be sure, but he has skills good teams need. You trade Brown, immediately you are looking for a guy with similar skills to replace him.

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2023, 12:04:53 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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Would you trade Jaylen for Darius Garland?

CLE gets to move away from their undersized defensively challenged backcourt. Fills that SF spot. Can look for a defensive guard to play alongside Donovan Mitchell.

BOS gets a true PG who can create off the bounce at a high rate. Garland can create for himself and for others. He can push the pace and give BOS tempo. He doesn't impede on Tatum too much. I feel Trae Young would. A similar type of player as Garland but even more ball dominant and even weaker defensively. I believe Garland would take a back-seat to Tatum easier.
I would and I thought about including both them and Atlanta in my list, but figured I had enough on there to emphasize the point that there are trades out there.  Towns is also a possibility given how badly Minnesota's season ended.
Why would Minny trade Towns for JB?   Edwards/JB doesn't seem like that good of a combo.  JB only has one year on his contract whereas Towns has 4 years left.

My question is.... why would Boston do that deal? Did people just watch the playoffs Towns had, getting completely steam rolled in that Denver series? I mean I would rather pay Jaylen the super max then pay KAT what he's going to make. Especially because a center who plays no defense is just devastating to your teams chances in the post seaosn.

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2023, 12:10:08 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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Would you trade Jaylen for Darius Garland?

CLE gets to move away from their undersized defensively challenged backcourt. Fills that SF spot. Can look for a defensive guard to play alongside Donovan Mitchell.

BOS gets a true PG who can create off the bounce at a high rate. Garland can create for himself and for others. He can push the pace and give BOS tempo. He doesn't impede on Tatum too much. I feel Trae Young would. A similar type of player as Garland but even more ball dominant and even weaker defensively. I believe Garland would take a back-seat to Tatum easier.
I would and I thought about including both them and Atlanta in my list, but figured I had enough on there to emphasize the point that there are trades out there.  Towns is also a possibility given how badly Minnesota's season ended.
Why would Minny trade Towns for JB?   Edwards/JB doesn't seem like that good of a combo.  JB only has one year on his contract whereas Towns has 4 years left.

My question is.... why would Boston do that deal? Did people just watch the playoffs Towns had, getting completely steam rolled in that Denver series? I mean I would rather pay Jaylen the super max then pay KAT what he's going to make. Especially because a center who plays no defense is just devastating to your teams chances in the post seaosn.
I'm not a fan of KAT but I was assuming that he'd be PF and Timelord would be center. 

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #27 on: May 22, 2023, 12:18:33 PM »

Offline boscel33

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Or he is traded for a player or players similarly situated.  Or a team takes the chance on re-signing him.  Or he indicates he happily go somewhere.  Or a team is looking to move on from a guy.  Players get traded all of the time with 1 year left. 

A couple of trades that in theory make sense and the value is reasonable

Brown, Smart for Siakam, Anunoby

Brown, Smart for Klay, Kuminga, Moody

Brown, Smart for Lillard

Brown for JJJ

Brown for Sabonis, Huerter

Brown, Rob, Gallinari for Ingram, Valanciunas, Murphy

If Houston signs Harden then something like Brown for Green makes a fair amount of sense

All of those make some level of sense for both teams.  I don't think Brown gets traded, but it also isn't out of the realm of possibility.

If Houston signs Harden, Brown for Green and the #4 makes a ton of sense (suspect more $ need to be traded, not sure).  Remember, I keep talking about how close Brown and Ime were.

Where there's smoke......
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Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #28 on: May 22, 2023, 12:20:22 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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Would you trade Jaylen for Darius Garland?

CLE gets to move away from their undersized defensively challenged backcourt. Fills that SF spot. Can look for a defensive guard to play alongside Donovan Mitchell.

BOS gets a true PG who can create off the bounce at a high rate. Garland can create for himself and for others. He can push the pace and give BOS tempo. He doesn't impede on Tatum too much. I feel Trae Young would. A similar type of player as Garland but even more ball dominant and even weaker defensively. I believe Garland would take a back-seat to Tatum easier.
I would and I thought about including both them and Atlanta in my list, but figured I had enough on there to emphasize the point that there are trades out there.  Towns is also a possibility given how badly Minnesota's season ended.
Why would Minny trade Towns for JB?   Edwards/JB doesn't seem like that good of a combo.  JB only has one year on his contract whereas Towns has 4 years left.

My question is.... why would Boston do that deal? Did people just watch the playoffs Towns had, getting completely steam rolled in that Denver series? I mean I would rather pay Jaylen the super max then pay KAT what he's going to make. Especially because a center who plays no defense is just devastating to your teams chances in the post seaosn.
I'm not a fan of KAT but I was assuming that he'd be PF and Timelord would be center.

As a general rule if your center is soooooo bad defensively that he can't play center and need to play power forward, but ALSO can't defend that position at all, then you are in trouble.

A significant portion of KAT"s value is being an insane shooter from the center position. That advantage is somewhat diminished if you have to play him at Forward. And we just saw a KAT/Center situation look awful in Minnesota.

I guess my question is this: People get annoyed mostly at Jaylens turnovers and defensive lapses. So the solution is.....bring in a guy EVEN WORSE at those things? Kat just had a first round where he was a -10 net rating, had almost twice as many Turnovers as assists, couldn't stop anybody and got stone walled by Aaron Gordon in the post. Shot 45%/25%.

Again, he's a "grass is greener" player.

Re: Why Jaylen Brown is not getting traded this coming year
« Reply #29 on: May 22, 2023, 12:26:38 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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Or he is traded for a player or players similarly situated.  Or a team takes the chance on re-signing him.  Or he indicates he happily go somewhere.  Or a team is looking to move on from a guy.  Players get traded all of the time with 1 year left. 

A couple of trades that in theory make sense and the value is reasonable

Brown, Smart for Siakam, Anunoby

Brown, Smart for Klay, Kuminga, Moody

Brown, Smart for Lillard

Brown for JJJ

Brown for Sabonis, Huerter

Brown, Rob, Gallinari for Ingram, Valanciunas, Murphy

If Houston signs Harden then something like Brown for Green makes a fair amount of sense

All of those make some level of sense for both teams.  I don't think Brown gets traded, but it also isn't out of the realm of possibility.

If Houston signs Harden, Brown for Green and the #4 makes a ton of sense (suspect more $ need to be traded, not sure).  Remember, I keep talking about how close Brown and Ime were.

Where there's smoke......

It makes almost zero sense! Brown goes to a team that absolutely sucked last year, a team he has no reason to re-sign with. You think Brown is going to be jumping at a chance to re-up long term with a 34 year old fat James Harden, who mostly just misses Houston's strip clubs?

So, that being the case, you really think Houston is going all in on a guy they have a high chance of losing in a year?

And I will say it again: If questionable shot selection and defensiveness lapses bother you, you will tear your hair out watching Jalen Green. He's all the worst parts of Brown, without the good stuff. I like his upside a lot, I think he might be VERY good one day, but thats a tough bet to make.