Author Topic: Wes Unseld Dead at 74  (Read 2659 times)

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Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« on: June 02, 2020, 10:32:21 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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Baltimore/Washington Bullets legend Wes Unseld has died, his family says.


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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2020, 11:39:06 AM »

Offline bdm860

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You look at the stats, and wonder how he was MVP that rookie year.

13.8ppg and 18.2rpg while not shabby, don't look like MVP numbers.  And his 18.2 rpg was only good for 5th in the league!

Wilt and Nate Thurmond both had 20/20 seasons.  Elvin Hayes (also a rookie) had 28/17 (but they all played 45+ mpg, while Unseld was at only 36.2).

Voting wasn't even close.  Unseld got 53 first place votes for MVP, next closes (Willis Reed 21ppg, 15rpg) got 18.  Coincidentally, Unseld also got 53 votes for ROY, while Hayes got 25 there.

All about the winning and turnaround narrative though (some things never change).  Bullets went from 36-46, last in the East, 4th worst in league (of 12 teams), to 1st in the league at 57-25 when they added Unseld.  (Probably helps that they teamed him with the previous year's ROY winner Earl the Pearl, but Unseld/Monroe were still able to keep winning despite missing Hall of Famer Gus Johnson for 33 games).

Also wonder if (not unlike present times) there was resentment towards the super team that had formed in LA (Wilt was just added to West/Baylor combo), and if voters thought they under-performed and/or noticed the dysfunction (Baylor and Wilt supposedly hated each other, heard a story that Wilt would post up on Baylor's side just to p--- him off). A whole article from SI at the time on Lakers "struggles" (and if you read the whole thing, shows the enigma that was Wilt, seems Kyrie-ish):

Quote
When the Los Angeles Lakers got Wilt Chamberlain (see cover) in a trade last summer, the immediate popular supposition was that they had dealt themselves a wonder team. With Elgin Baylor and Jerry West playing, too, every game would be a thrilling All-Star show and every box office would do boffo, turnaway business. The only problem, it was suggested, was-that the big three superstars would be struggling with each other to see who could get the ball and shoot it the most.

Now, as the NBA season moves into its last two months, it has become apparent that the results are exactly the reverse of the assumptions. The Lakers are, first of all, only a pretty good team with about the same chance to win the championship as last year's Lakers—who did not. Moreover, far from providing raging effervescence, the Lakers are dull almost to the point of tedium, and the slow realization of that fact may soon be reflected in attendance at the Inglewood Forum.

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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2020, 11:45:14 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Sad day for the NBA, especially in the Baltimore/DC area, as they lose another legend. Unseld did it all for that Bullets/Wizards franchise. ROY, MVP, Finals MVP, NBA champion, multi-time All Star, multi-time All-NBA, J. Walter Kennedy Citizenship Award, head coach, GM, executive VP.

Rest in peace, Mr. Unseld.

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2020, 11:48:23 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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RIP.  One of the greats who seems largely forgotten.


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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2020, 07:21:49 PM »

Offline footey

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Maybe the greatest outlet passer in NBA history. I remember him from the start of his career, built like a brick wall, classy guy.  Only 6'7" as I recall, from Louisville? 

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2020, 07:47:55 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Great player who played the right way aways .  Always admired his game .  And a really good fellow .  Sad news .

RIP big guy . 

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2020, 03:49:01 AM »

Offline Androslav

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One of the greats.
I didn't get to watch him play, but I remember him for his leadership, reliability, and toughness.
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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2020, 04:57:59 AM »

Offline Somebody

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You look at the stats, and wonder how he was MVP that rookie year.

13.8ppg and 18.2rpg while not shabby, don't look like MVP numbers.  And his 18.2 rpg was only good for 5th in the league!

Wilt and Nate Thurmond both had 20/20 seasons.  Elvin Hayes (also a rookie) had 28/17 (but they all played 45+ mpg, while Unseld was at only 36.2).

Voting wasn't even close.  Unseld got 53 first place votes for MVP, next closes (Willis Reed 21ppg, 15rpg) got 18.  Coincidentally, Unseld also got 53 votes for ROY, while Hayes got 25 there.

All about the winning and turnaround narrative though (some things never change).  Bullets went from 36-46, last in the East, 4th worst in league (of 12 teams), to 1st in the league at 57-25 when they added Unseld.  (Probably helps that they teamed him with the previous year's ROY winner Earl the Pearl, but Unseld/Monroe were still able to keep winning despite missing Hall of Famer Gus Johnson for 33 games).

Also wonder if (not unlike present times) there was resentment towards the super team that had formed in LA (Wilt was just added to West/Baylor combo), and if voters thought they under-performed and/or noticed the dysfunction (Baylor and Wilt supposedly hated each other, heard a story that Wilt would post up on Baylor's side just to p--- him off). A whole article from SI at the time on Lakers "struggles" (and if you read the whole thing, shows the enigma that was Wilt, seems Kyrie-ish):

Quote
When the Los Angeles Lakers got Wilt Chamberlain (see cover) in a trade last summer, the immediate popular supposition was that they had dealt themselves a wonder team. With Elgin Baylor and Jerry West playing, too, every game would be a thrilling All-Star show and every box office would do boffo, turnaway business. The only problem, it was suggested, was-that the big three superstars would be struggling with each other to see who could get the ball and shoot it the most.

Now, as the NBA season moves into its last two months, it has become apparent that the results are exactly the reverse of the assumptions. The Lakers are, first of all, only a pretty good team with about the same chance to win the championship as last year's Lakers—who did not. Moreover, far from providing raging effervescence, the Lakers are dull almost to the point of tedium, and the slow realization of that fact may soon be reflected in attendance at the Inglewood Forum.
Hm it looks pretty strange to me as well if we're looking at the stats. He seems to be a typical All-Star/fringe All-NBA defensive anchor (strangely enough in the mold of Draymond Green with elite defence and good passing, maybe a rung below Draymond but still great) just by looking at the impact metrics - his WOWY/GPM is pretty strong but not elite, he lifted an average defence to the upper echelon but not quite transcendence and point differential isn't head over heels for him (the Wizards were actually roughly average in point differential adjusted for schedule strength before his arrival). Surely behind the likes of Oscar/Russell/Wilt without even mentioning West imo, although Wilt and West likely received flack for underperforming due to portability issues with Baylor and Wilt on that Lakers squad as you mentioned.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2020, 05:15:15 AM by Somebody »
Jaylen Brown for All-NBA

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2020, 08:29:56 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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Maybe the greatest outlet passer in NBA history. I remember him from the start of his career, built like a brick wall, classy guy.  Only 6'7" as I recall, from Louisville?
Yup, and this was in an era where tall big men dominated --  Wilt, Nate Thurmond, Artis Gilmore (also Willis Reed but he was only around 6'9").

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2020, 09:04:34 AM »

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You look at the stats, and wonder how he was MVP that rookie year.

13.8ppg and 18.2rpg while not shabby, don't look like MVP numbers.  And his 18.2 rpg was only good for 5th in the league!

Wilt and Nate Thurmond both had 20/20 seasons.  Elvin Hayes (also a rookie) had 28/17 (but they all played 45+ mpg, while Unseld was at only 36.2).

Voting wasn't even close.  Unseld got 53 first place votes for MVP, next closes (Willis Reed 21ppg, 15rpg) got 18.  Coincidentally, Unseld also got 53 votes for ROY, while Hayes got 25 there.

All about the winning and turnaround narrative though (some things never change).  Bullets went from 36-46, last in the East, 4th worst in league (of 12 teams), to 1st in the league at 57-25 when they added Unseld.  (Probably helps that they teamed him with the previous year's ROY winner Earl the Pearl, but Unseld/Monroe were still able to keep winning despite missing Hall of Famer Gus Johnson for 33 games).

Also wonder if (not unlike present times) there was resentment towards the super team that had formed in LA (Wilt was just added to West/Baylor combo), and if voters thought they under-performed and/or noticed the dysfunction (Baylor and Wilt supposedly hated each other, heard a story that Wilt would post up on Baylor's side just to p--- him off). A whole article from SI at the time on Lakers "struggles" (and if you read the whole thing, shows the enigma that was Wilt, seems Kyrie-ish):

Quote
When the Los Angeles Lakers got Wilt Chamberlain (see cover) in a trade last summer, the immediate popular supposition was that they had dealt themselves a wonder team. With Elgin Baylor and Jerry West playing, too, every game would be a thrilling All-Star show and every box office would do boffo, turnaway business. The only problem, it was suggested, was-that the big three superstars would be struggling with each other to see who could get the ball and shoot it the most.

Now, as the NBA season moves into its last two months, it has become apparent that the results are exactly the reverse of the assumptions. The Lakers are, first of all, only a pretty good team with about the same chance to win the championship as last year's Lakers—who did not. Moreover, far from providing raging effervescence, the Lakers are dull almost to the point of tedium, and the slow realization of that fact may soon be reflected in attendance at the Inglewood Forum.
Hm it looks pretty strange to me as well if we're looking at the stats. He seems to be a typical All-Star/fringe All-NBA defensive anchor (strangely enough in the mold of Draymond Green with elite defence and good passing, maybe a rung below Draymond but still great) just by looking at the impact metrics - his WOWY/GPM is pretty strong but not elite, he lifted an average defence to the upper echelon but not quite transcendence and point differential isn't head over heels for him (the Wizards were actually roughly average in point differential adjusted for schedule strength before his arrival). Surely behind the likes of Oscar/Russell/Wilt without even mentioning West imo, although Wilt and West likely received flack for underperforming due to portability issues with Baylor and Wilt on that Lakers squad as you mentioned.

I always believed Unseld's MVP had a lot to do with Bill Russell. That people saw what Unseld was doing and thought it was the same as what Bill Russell was doing. With Russell coming to the end of his career and with both Russell's and Celtics' dominance over the NBA ... that Unseld was next.

That that rookie performance reminded them so much of Bill Russell. Unseld was the next Russell. And in many ways Unseld was that type of player - just not as dynamic a defender as Russell was which is what separated Russell from being a high level player to GOAT level player.

And Unseld was probably more skilled than Russell on offense. Unseld had a nice midrange jump-shot which he didn't use enough.

Unseld was a terrific player. The type of player who by himself creates a sense of team. Of unity. Togetherness. Like KG did in 2008 when he came here. Unseld did that for his team throughout his career. Why Washington made 4 NBA Finals throughout the 70s (more than anyone else) and did so with different supporting casts.

In many ways Unseld was like Bill Russell.

Unseld was such a phenomenal team player. Always put the team first. Did everything possible to help his teammates. Always concentrated on helping his teammates. Whether it was his passing as a high post facilitator, setting monster screens to free up shooters or ball-handlers in the PnR, grabbing big contested boards, being the defensive anchor -- all team based actions that made people around him better. That took individuals and brought them together in way that made them a team.

And especially in those first few years before the knee injury. Unseld was an incredible rebounder before he got hurt. His mobility and quickness of leaping were not as good after that. Played stiffer. Still managed to be a very good player and lead his team to 3 more Finals appearances though.


Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2020, 10:48:30 AM »

Offline mmmmm

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Much respect out to the great Wes Unseld from this once-young Sonics fan who fondly remembers those two epic wars between Unseld's Bullets and Seattle SuperSonics.

Great player.  So strong.  So smart.  His impact on the game was way beyond the numbers.  When he was on the floor, the floor revolved around him.
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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2020, 11:47:43 AM »

Offline Vermont Green

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I was a big fan of Wes Unseld.  Never thought of him as a league MVP type but he was good.  11 pts and 14 rebs for a career doesn't sound like much and doesn't really represent his impact.  Interesting to me that his career average was 3.0 FTA per game.  I think they "let them play" a lot more back then.

Also 50% career 3-pt % (OK, based on 3 for 6) but I wonder how much difference there would be if he had the 3-pt line his whole career (introduced in 1979, Unseld had it for his last two seasons).

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2020, 01:18:20 PM »

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RIP Wes.
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Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2020, 01:57:19 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Unseld was definitely one of those guys who's statistics didn't come close to showing the effect he had on winning and the game in general. Dave Cowens comes to mind as another guy from that era that was the same way.

Re: Wes Unseld Dead at 74
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2020, 10:49:58 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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