CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: vgulab on January 10, 2013, 12:00:06 PM
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We have 2 roster spaces and for a vet minimum he can't hurt. DA takes risks so if there is a chance he will go for Oden. What do you think ? Teams will risk giving more money to Oden than vet min? Where he can end up? LAL, MIA, BOS?
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Here's the link:
http://sulia.com/ricbucher/f/f8185fe1-a0d0-4cce-b2cc-f3be6f980699/
Knowing Danny, I'm sure he'll at least explore this option.
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
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I saw this on hoopshype, i would not mind him playing the collins role but I can't have faith on him playing more minutes than that
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Yes, sign him to a two year min deal.
Worth the injury risk.
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Saw this on RealGM as well.
I wonder if Oden might be best off with a team that is not in a playoff hunt and can afford the effort/patience to (re)develop him, instead of placing expectations on him.
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Yes, sign him to a two year min deal.
Worth the injury risk.
Agreed. Perfect opportunity here. Work him in slowly and see what he can do.
Problem is he still has enough potential that someone out there will probably offer him more than the minimum.
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Saw this on RealGM as well.
I wonder if Oden might be best off with a team that is not in a playoff hunt and can afford the effort/patience to (re)develop him, instead of placing expectations on him.
No real expectations here though...like someone said...the Collins role for this year with a pretty high ceiling if he ever stays healthy
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Saw this on RealGM as well.
I wonder if Oden might be best off with a team that is not in a playoff hunt and can afford the effort/patience to (re)develop him, instead of placing expectations on him.
I get the impression that he may not be looking to play this season, he just hopes to catch to a roster at the end of the season, with the hopes of getting ready for next year. At least that is how I took it.
In which case, the C's would be a very interesting option.
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Saw this on RealGM as well.
I wonder if Oden might be best off with a team that is not in a playoff hunt and can afford the effort/patience to (re)develop him, instead of placing expectations on him.
No real expectations here though...like someone said...the Collins role for this year with a pretty high ceiling if he ever stays healthy
Ah, but people here want to throw Collins out with the trash. If Oden were to put up Collins-like numbers in Boston, I'd suspect the same.
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Saw this on RealGM as well.
I wonder if Oden might be best off with a team that is not in a playoff hunt and can afford the effort/patience to (re)develop him, instead of placing expectations on him.
No real expectations here though...like someone said...the Collins role for this year with a pretty high ceiling if he ever stays healthy
Ah, but people here want to throw Collins out with the trash. If Oden were to put up Collins-like numbers in Boston, I'd suspect the same.
Lol not Collins number...just Collins minutes. He would have to be an grade over Collins but not play any more.
Also, I value Collins defense but cannot figure out why he can't rebound. Ogden could always board.
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Also, I value Collins defense but cannot figure out why he can't rebound. Ogden could always board.
Mobility and hands. Rebounding is about quickness to the ball, and the ability to grab it. Neither of those are Collins' strengths.
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I hope Oden is not rushing his comeback.
As for signing Oden, no. Boston do not have a roster spot to spare for another project center. They cannot afford to give him a spot right now. The team needs dependable contributors with it's vacant roster spots. Oden isn't that.
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I'd love it. Five years (and many injuries) later, the Celtics finally get their guy.
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I'd love it. Five years (and many injuries) later, the Celtics finally get their guy.
We would have both Oden and Jeff Green back, the guy we missed out on in Oden and the guy we drafted instead in Green. We'd be resetting from the initiation of the KG era!
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
Oden (or his agent) would be a moron to accept that deal.
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
Oden (or his agent) would be a moron to accept that deal.
If he is signing this season, it will likely be all he can get. It will more likely be a team option for next year though.
Teams will want to take a look at him this spring, and then basically give him next year to show he is an NBA player, before they really invest.
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Indiana (home roots) and Memphis (Conley connection) seem like two potential landing spots. Oden would only have to serve as the 2nd or 3rd string center behind established starters.
I still think a rebuilding team like Cleveland would also be a good spot for Oden to break back into the league.
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
Oden (or his agent) would be a moron to accept that deal.
I'm not sure he'll get offers for more than that.
Why would a team sign him without another year on the deal? Maybe he gets more than the minimum, but he'll be forced to take a two year deal.
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I can think of worse actions to take than taking a flyer on Oden on the cheap.
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Yeah I wouldn't hesitate to do this at all. There is really no harm in it. 2 yr vet min deal. Let him play a few minutes off the bench. If he gets hurt oh well. If not it could be a huge addition for us.
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Indiana (home roots) and Memphis (Conley connection) seem like two potential landing spots. Oden would only have to serve as the 2nd or 3rd string center behind established starters.
I still think a rebuilding team like Cleveland would also be a good spot for Oden to break back into the league.
Memphis would be a great destination for him. They need a back up center like whoa. They are thin in the front court and having the moral support of his boy Conley might be huge for him. I dont know if the cash strapped Grizz go for it though.
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Yeah I wouldn't hesitate to do this at all. There is really no harm in it. 2 yr vet min deal. Let him play a few minutes off the bench. If he gets hurt oh well. If not it could be a huge addition for us.
Yeah, exactly. Also, in terms of fit, I'm not sure there's a team out there that could offer Oden a better opportunity to (1) play, (2) win, and (3) have a great environment around him. Miami and possibly OKC would be pretty good options, too.
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Yeah I wouldn't hesitate to do this at all. There is really no harm in it. 2 yr vet min deal. Let him play a few minutes off the bench. If he gets hurt oh well. If not it could be a huge addition for us.
Yeah, exactly. Also, in terms of fit, I'm not sure there's a team out there that could offer Oden a better opportunity to (1) play, (2) win, and (3) have a great environment around him. Miami and possibly OKC would be pretty good options, too.
Wouldn't that be something? Oden & Durant on the same team.
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Just on potentail yes, yes, yes, yes. He was always a Celtic deep down anyways....at least in my eyes. That draft lottery night was turrrrible...at the time. :)
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I said this before and I will say it again.
Of course the medical staff needs to check him first. Even if his knees are injury prone, if the meds clear him, the Celtics should offer him a 3 year 15-16 million dollars off of his potential alone, with the 3rd year being a team option.
There will be a ton of deals out there, but this deal will be too good to pass. Although it's a very high risk thing to do, the reward would be oh so sweet if he turns out to be even just 85% of what he should.
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Yeah I wouldn't hesitate to do this at all. There is really no harm in it. 2 yr vet min deal. Let him play a few minutes off the bench. If he gets hurt oh well. If not it could be a huge addition for us.
Yeah, exactly. Also, in terms of fit, I'm not sure there's a team out there that could offer Oden a better opportunity to (1) play, (2) win, and (3) have a great environment around him. Miami and possibly OKC would be pretty good options, too.
Wouldn't that be something? Oden & Durant on the same team.
Didn't Jordan try to talk Bowie into joining the Bulls at the end of his career as well? Ironic.
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I said this before and I will say it again.
Of course the medical staff needs to check him first. Even if his knees are injury prone, if the meds clear him, the Celtics should offer him a 3 year 15-16 million dollars off of his potential alone, with the 3rd year being a team option.
There will be a ton of deals out there, but this deal will be too good to pass. Although it's a very high risk thing to do, the reward would be oh so sweet if he turns out to be even just 85% of what he should.
and where is that $ coming from ::)
C's basically only have the minimum really available. as mentioned elsewhere -- make it a 2-year deal only. If he can play this year, it might require a little raise next year if he can stay on the court. make the second year a team option as well
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My question is: how is Oden ever going to pass a physical? Does he have to do that to sign a contract? Look at what happened to Brandon Roy this year. Sometimes, no matter what a guy wants, your body just fails you.
As far as I am concerned, Oden cannot survive the rigors of an NBA game, let alone 82 of them plus the playoffs. If he comes back, he WILL get hurt again, that is a 100% certainty.
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I'd love to give him a shot, but at no more than the vet min.
It's quite possible that there's some team out there that would give him more, but I think that would be foolish, because I'm pretty much expecting him to suffer another serious injury sooner or later.
If Boston could sign him at the vet min, and he could provide 15 minutes a game as KG's backup—with the smaller amount of playing time reducing his injury risk—then he could be the final piece of the puzzle, providing more rebounding, length, defense, and KG insurance.
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
Can vet min deals be for any number of years?
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I'd love it. Five years (and many injuries) later, the Celtics finally get their guy.
We would have both Oden and Jeff Green back, the guy we missed out on in Oden and the guy we drafted instead in Green. We'd be resetting from the initiation of the KG era!
Throw in a trade for Al Jefferson, and bring back Delonte while we're at it!
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Supposedly, the Heat are "at the top of the list to get him". At least according to ESPN.
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I'd love it. Five years (and many injuries) later, the Celtics finally get their guy.
We would have both Oden and Jeff Green back, the guy we missed out on in Oden and the guy we drafted instead in Green. We'd be resetting from the initiation of the KG era!
I thought Ainge was always thinking of going with Durant with the first pick.
http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/this-just-in/21114751/wyc-ainge-wanted-durant-over-oden
My question is: how is Oden ever going to pass a physical?
It's the team that set the requirements for the physical. The only players that fail physicals are those assumed to be healthy when signed through trade or free agency, but then they find out all is not well.
For somebody whom everybody knows has injury problems, that wouldn't be an issue. Which is why Brandon Roy "passed" his physical to sign for the TWolves. The team knew his knee was busted up, but they were gambling that it could stay okay enough to play him for limited mins once every couple of games or whatever; gamble didn't work out, obviously.
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Supposedly, the Heat are "at the top of the list to get him". At least according to ESPN.
Would this allow us to get in on a birdman signing? I wouldnt expect the Heat to look into both.
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Supposedly, the Heat are "at the top of the list to get him". At least according to ESPN.
Would this allow us to get in on a birdman signing? I wouldnt expect the Heat to look into both.
I could see the Heat signing Birdman for this year, and Oden for the future.
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Supposedly, the Heat are "at the top of the list to get him". At least according to ESPN.
Would this allow us to get in on a birdman signing? I wouldnt expect the Heat to look into both.
I could see the Heat signing Birdman for this year, and Oden for the future.
Yep!!
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In a heartbeat, as long as its a 2 yr vet min.
Oden (or his agent) would be a moron to accept that deal.
I'm not sure he'll get offers for more than that.
Why would a team sign him without another year on the deal? Maybe he gets more than the minimum, but he'll be forced to take a two year deal.
A team would sign him without another year on the deal for the same reason it might make a trade for a player on an expiring contract who won't be re-signed as a free agent.
From Oden's perspective, if he can get his body to where he wants it to be, he wants to demonstrate that he can be useful over a small sample of games so that someone will give him more than the minimum next season. Otherwise, he'll just wait until the off-season when more teams have exceptions they can toss at him.
If he can pass a physical and do a workout with the team, but says he is not signing through next season unless he gets something close to what his agent tells him that he could get in the summer if he waited until then, would you sign him through the end of the season for the minimum or would you stick with Wilcox and Collins backing up KG at center?
EDIT: At best, you might be able to get a player option for next season.
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I said this before and I will say it again.
Of course the medical staff needs to check him first. Even if his knees are injury prone, if the meds clear him, the Celtics should offer him a 3 year 15-16 million dollars off of his potential alone, with the 3rd year being a team option.
There will be a ton of deals out there, but this deal will be too good to pass. Although it's a very high risk thing to do, the reward would be oh so sweet if he turns out to be even just 85% of what he should.
and where is that $ coming from ::)
C's basically only have the minimum really available. as mentioned elsewhere -- make it a 2-year deal only. If he can play this year, it might require a little raise next year if he can stay on the court. make the second year a team option as well
I was thinking of next off season. Like an MLE or if we have cap space, an FA signing.
It doesnt seem like he's going to come back this season, so we should go for a really enticing offer, something that's too good for Oden to refuse.
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I'd love it. Five years (and many injuries) later, the Celtics finally get their guy.
We would have both Oden and Jeff Green back, the guy we missed out on in Oden and the guy we drafted instead in Green. We'd be resetting from the initiation of the KG era!
Throw in a trade for Al Jefferson, and bring back Delonte while we're at it!
It's amazing how circular these things are. We sent the pick we used on Rondo to Atlanta for Antoine, they sent it to Phoenix for JJ and we got it back from Phoenix. To get the Rondo pick, we sent the Suns the pick we got for Jiri Welsh, who we got when we traded Antoine away.
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Greg Oden? For Vet Min or something similar?
Do it!
I'm still holding out hope that he can come back with SOME semblance of an NBA career...
Why not with BOS?
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I hear he's Pat Riley's pet project ::)
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Offer a 2-year deal or something. He is worth the gamble.
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He should go to Phx if their medical staff is everything people say.
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(http://admin2.collegepublisher.com/polopoly/polopoly_fs/1.1880889.1295411798!/image/3146037678.jpg)
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(http://admin2.collegepublisher.com/polopoly/polopoly_fs/1.1880889.1295411798!/image/3146037678.jpg)
It's like they are the same guy *x files music*
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Cavs or Pacers make the most sense for him.
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(http://admin2.collegepublisher.com/polopoly/polopoly_fs/1.1880889.1295411798!/image/3146037678.jpg)
great find
P.s. after a second grad emath i think the per 48 still keeps oden at 9.7 rebs in sullys mins ... lol
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I agree that the Suns should be his preferred destination, they have the greatest history in keeping injury-prone players healthy (G.Hill, Nash, Stat and now JO).
But I don't see how and why would any other team be a better fit for him, at least not from the basketball perspective. Especially those teams dying for some inside presence, because I believe that he should target a defensive specialist, back-up role. Here he could come and if ready provide the C's bench some inside presence, Bill Watlon style! :)
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Oh, and I'd give him BAE for two years in a heartbeat, though we probably would have to shed some salary in order to be able to use it. It's a bit more than vet min and after two years we'd have early bird rights, so if he works out well, we'd be able to re-sign him to some reasonable contract. Danny, please, get it done!
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Cavs or Pacers make the most sense for him.
Why the cavs and pacers? Both have guys established at the 5.
Heat, blazers, Mavs make the most sense to me. And blazers are obv out
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Cavs or Pacers make the most sense for him.
Why the cavs and pacers? Both have guys established at the 5.
Heat, blazers, Mavs make the most sense to me. And blazers are obv out
Cleveland = Ohio State university = where Oden went to college.
Indiana = home state = where Oden grew up
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I think Oden should go anywhere that offers him a regular rotation role close to 20 minutes a night. Preferably as a backup rather than a starter.
I wouldn't go to a team like Miami because he might not be able to crack + stay in the rotation. I would avoid most playoff teams. I think Indiana would be tough too with Mahinmi playing well for them.
G.Oden strikes me as the type who regularly makes bad career decisions (putting on all that extra weight before first season, difficulties sticking to his rehab) so I am expecting him to go to Miami and have lots of problems getting on the floor. Similar to what happened with Dampier when the lack of quickness and offensive talent wrecked havoc with Miami's lineups.
Cleveland looks a very good option to me. That is where I would like to see Oden go.
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Boston is probably not a good place for Oden to go (if Oden makes his decision out of self-interest) because Doc will probably make him earn a role in the rotation instead of automatically handing him a 15-20 mpg role off the bench.
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If Oden goes to a team that has 20minutes a night open for him, that team will probably end up one big man short after Oden gets hurt.
If I were Oden I would go somewhere with no expectations. If he can stay healthy, of course minutes will open up. If he can't stay healthy, it won't be noticed so much. I think the last thing Oden wants is to have a team count on him again and then let them down.
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As long as we can amnesty him when the injury happens I think it is worth giving him a vet minimum.
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I think Boston would be a great spot for him. He'd have an opportunity to earn minutes and to learn from some great veteran pros under a great coach while competing for something as a team. Plus, he's used to living in a place with crappy weather.
I don't necessarily think these developmental teams that are simply about giving big minutes to potential stars while competing for lottery balls are all that great for player development. Young players have to learn to play on an NBA level, but it's also helpful when they are learning to play to actually win games.
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Go to the Kings. Get some good minutes and makes Cousins expendable for us to reep the benefits.
I still think the Grizzlies make the most sense for him. (If he's healthy). They need a back up big man for their rotation because they are thin up front. He could also get more comfortable being alongside Conley.
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He's the most injured and fragile player in league history, but I never thought Grant Hill would play either. Definitely try to get him. I can't deal with the idea of him doing well for the Lakers or Heat
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He should go to Phoenix.
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I think Oden should go anywhere that offers him a regular rotation role close to 20 minutes a night. Preferably as a backup rather than a starter.
I wouldn't go to a team like Miami because he might not be able to crack + stay in the rotation. I would avoid most playoff teams. I think Indiana would be tough too with Mahinmi playing well for them.
G.Oden strikes me as the type who regularly makes bad career decisions (putting on all that extra weight before first season, difficulties sticking to his rehab) so I am expecting him to go to Miami and have lots of problems getting on the floor. Similar to what happened with Dampier when the lack of quickness and offensive talent wrecked havoc with Miami's lineups.
Cleveland looks a very good option to me. That is where I would like to see Oden go.
From what I'm seeing, the idea is not to play this year, not play Summer League, or anything until next season. Looks like the lesson was learned about rushing to the court.
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Cavs or Pacers make the most sense for him.
Why the cavs and pacers? Both have guys established at the 5.
Heat, blazers, Mavs make the most sense to me. And blazers are obv out
Cleveland = Ohio State university = where Oden went to college.
Indiana = home state = where Oden grew up
well it is more than that. Oden is actually taking classes at OSU right now and lives in the area year round. I actually think he would be better off on those teams from a basketball standpoint as they both have some solid young centers/power forwards ahead of him so he won't have near the pressure to perform.
Aside from them a team like the Heat, Bulls, Thunder, or Grizzlies (back with Conley also there) would make the most sense (for similar reasons).
He just needs a place that isn't going to be relying on him to be a savior and where said team would be fine if he only played 10-15 minutes a game.
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I said this before and I will say it again.
Of course the medical staff needs to check him first. Even if his knees are injury prone, if the meds clear him, the Celtics should offer him a 3 year 15-16 million dollars off of his potential alone, with the 3rd year being a team option.
There will be a ton of deals out there, but this deal will be too good to pass. Although it's a very high risk thing to do, the reward would be oh so sweet if he turns out to be even just 85% of what he should.
and where is that $ coming from ::)
C's basically only have the minimum really available. as mentioned elsewhere -- make it a 2-year deal only. If he can play this year, it might require a little raise next year if he can stay on the court. make the second year a team option as well
I was thinking of next off season. Like an MLE or if we have cap space, an FA signing.
It doesnt seem like he's going to come back this season, so we should go for a really enticing offer, something that's too good for Oden to refuse.
didn't get the impression that you were planning on waiting until next year to make that offer. In any case, there's no way Oden is worth the MLE, much less worth that much for 3 years-->this guy hasn't been healthy for an entire season yet. Should the C's have the full MLe availalbe next year (not a guarantee based on the current roster's salaries) I would expect Ainge to go after a very healthy center with that much money. That's just way too many eggs to throw into a basket as fragile as Oden.
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From what I'm seeing, the idea is not to play this year, not play Summer League, or anything until next season. Looks like the lesson was learned about rushing to the court.
I don't think his recent injuries have anything to do with rushing back on the court, guy just doesn't seem to be able to stay healthy.
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Yep, his picture is next to brittle in the dictionary!
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Boston is probably not a good place for Oden to go (if Oden makes his decision out of self-interest) because Doc will probably make him earn a role in the rotation instead of automatically handing him a 15-20 mpg role off the bench.
KG is one of the best PF/C of the last 20 years and best teacher for a young player still looking for a place in the league.
Doc one of the better coaches for NBA players
Playing with a PG like Rondo and start building a future championship team with Bradley, Green and Sully...
Probably the only 7 footer with Collins to fight for some minutes...
Play off team, NBA champs? why not?
Sure in Sacramento or Charlotte he can get more $..
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Yep, his picture is next to brittle in the dictionary!
Mean thing to say about brittle
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Indiana (home roots) and Memphis (Conley connection) seem like two potential landing spots. Oden would only have to serve as the 2nd or 3rd string center behind established starters.
I still think a rebuilding team like Cleveland would also be a good spot for Oden to break back into the league.
Memphis would be a great destination for him. They need a back up center like whoa. They are thin in the front court and having the moral support of his boy Conley might be huge for him. I dont know if the cash strapped Grizz go for it though.
They have Arthur and Speights, they're not what I would call thin.
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i pass on Oden
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make him a Lafayette/Gaffney type offer: prorated vet min this year + partially guaranteed 2nd year.
It might seem little money for Oden, but it's not very clear he'll be able to play this season (if ever, look at Brandon Roy). He can rehab as a Celtic, get a fresh start in Boston, and earn his payday in the 2014 summer while having a chance to win now and backup KG (and eventually replace him in the starting C spot someday).
The Celtics could end up losing some money, but little compared to the humongous reward a healthy Oden back in the NBA could be.
Probably he goes to South Beach to meet the Three Stooges and that guy from UConn. Sad.
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Can anyone say I'm wrong and be serious...
Greg should sign with PHX or they should take the flier on him.
I'd love him here, we should take the shot but let me end this post with a few names...
Nash
Shaq
Hill
JO
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Boston is probably not a good place for Oden to go (if Oden makes his decision out of self-interest) because Doc will probably make him earn a role in the rotation instead of automatically handing him a 15-20 mpg role off the bench.
KG is one of the best PF/C of the last 20 years and best teacher for a young player still looking for a place in the league.
Doc one of the better coaches for NBA players
Playing with a PG like Rondo and start building a future championship team with Bradley, Green and Sully...
Probably the only 7 footer with Collins to fight for some minutes...
Play off team, NBA champs? why not?
Sure in Sacramento or Charlotte he can get more $..
Oden doesn't need a teacher. He can already play at a top level. He just needs to be healthy.
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Oden's desire to return to the NBA is admirable, but as a heavy 7-footer with multiple significant surgeries on both knees his playing days are over.
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He should go to Phoenix.
Yep. Those voodoo shamans on the Suns medical/training staff know what they are doing.
Gortat seems to be halfway out the door, and JO is merely auditioning for a playoff team to either trade for him or pick him up if/when he is bought out. Oden could slide into a no-pressure 20+ minutes a night in Phoenix once the trade deadline passes.
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He should go to Phoenix.
Yep. Those voodoo shamans on the Suns medical/training staff know what they are doing.
Gortat seems to be halfway out the door, and JO is merely auditioning for a playoff team to either trade for him or pick him up if/when he is bought out. Oden could slide into a no-pressure 20+ minutes a night in Phoenix once the trade deadline passes.
Yeah great point. I never thought about Phoenix as a destination. They could turn Oden back into a rotation player, probably even a starting center for them. They've got nothing to loose and look to be on the verge of rebuilding, plus probably going to get rid of gortat.