Super max

[MBunge]

The problems with the super max are...

1.  Eventually teams will be forced to give guys like Mike Conley the super max.

2.  It restores the advantage to big market clubs that have more money to spend.

I also think people are overreacting a bit.  For example, if Durant signs a 1+1, they will be faced with resigning Iguadala, Livingston, Durant and Curry after next season.  They will likely be over the salary cap with just four players.  Or look at Miami where Wade is showing that giving up money to help the team could be money you never get back, even if you're a HOFer who brings titles to a team.

Mike

[jambr380]

I like the idea of dissuading the joining of multiple superstars through free agency, but I dislike the idea of penalizing teams for good drafting.

Yeah, perhaps you create a "homegrown exception" where you can add an additional "super max" if your team is the only team the player has ever played for. However, unlike a non-homegrown exception, that player (and any other "homegrown exceptions") would count towards your cap at whatever the max under the cap would be.

I totally get that with a Durant/Westbrook combo in OKC, but what about a situation like GSW where they would be able to sign Durant to a super-max, but know that next year their homegrown player in Curry would also get a super-max. Since he has not yet signed that contract, do they still get to sign him to that super-max or are they out of luck because they signed another team's super-max player first.

I would think this would come into play more often with teams who have future (or current) superstar players still on their rookie contracts with money to spend in free agency.

[Neurotic Guy]

I'm not sure I understand the benefit of the "super max" NOT being counted toward the salary cap.   In the scenario that the super max isn't counted, big market teams have a ridiculous advantage.  The Knicks, of example, could offer George Steinbrenner type contracts to attract the best player on the planet.  $100M a year may attract Lebron.  Small market teams will still be limited by their capacity for income -- thus, probably could only compete with current "max" offers.   

If Super-max counts toward the cap, big market teams would no longer have an advantage over small market teams for the top players, AND GMs would need to manage the cap -- keeping somewhat of a lid on what they'd offer for the Super Max. If a large number is taken up by the Super Max, the gathering of a super team will require 2nd tier players to take less $$ to play with the top tier guy (could happen, but chances decrease especially since all 30 teams can offer a super max slot). Good drafting, development of younger supporting players, and quality coaching will be big difference makers in the league.

[meangreenmachine]

I like the idea of dissuading the joining of multiple superstars through free agency, but I dislike the idea of penalizing teams for good drafting.

Yeah, perhaps you create a "homegrown exception" where you can add an additional "super max" if your team is the only team the player has ever played for. However, unlike a non-homegrown exception, that player (and any other "homegrown exceptions") would count towards your cap at whatever the max under the cap would be.

I totally get that with a Durant/Westbrook combo in OKC, but what about a situation like GSW where they would be able to sign Durant to a super-max, but know that next year their homegrown player in Curry would also get a super-max. Since he has not yet signed that contract, do they still get to sign him to that super-max or are they out of luck because they signed another team's super-max player first.

I would think this would come into play more often with teams who have future (or current) superstar players still on their rookie contracts with money to spend in free agency.

Yeah, by having "homegrown exceptions" I think you could allow the possibility of the formation of superteams.

Ultimately, how many teams draft two superstars within 1-2 years of each other? It is quite rare. Most recently with Durant, Westbrook and Harden in OKC and Curry, Thompson and Green in Oakland. When it does happen, perhaps you disperse the superstars. It sucks penalizing teams, but this would be the price to pay to avoid "superteams."

Perhaps you limit the "homegrown exception" to one per team, so the absolute most a team could have is two super max players, which does not make a super team. That way, for example, Durant would not have signed in Golden State because it would have meant breaking up the Splash Brothers (since GSW could only use their two supermaxs on Curry and Thompson).

[meangreenmachine]

I'm not sure I understand the benefit of the "super max" NOT being counted toward the salary cap.

In the end, it probably does not matter if you count it as a max, with anything paid above that max as a bonus excluded from the cap, or just exclude it from the cap.

In the scenario that the super max isn't counted, big market teams have a ridiculous advantage.  The Knicks, of example, could offer George Steinbrenner type contracts to attract the best player on the planet.  $100M a year may attract Lebron.

But they can only offer that major contract to ONE player. If they screw up, they may no longer be profitable no matter how large their market is. They may bury their team for years.

Besides, in the age of the Internet there is no guarantee small market teams cannot compete if their superstar was drafted to begin with (Durant brought in a lot of revenue for OKC; people all over the world wore his jerseys). How many superstars join a small market team that did not draft them? Alridge to San Antonio because his childhood hero was Duncan? I mean, it is exceedingly rare no matter how you structure things.

Good drafting, development of younger supporting players, and quality coaching will be big difference makers in the league.

Yeah, we need to maximize incentives for team ball, quality coaching and developing younger talent. It is just a much better product than watching two or three super teams compete (unless, admittedly, your team happens to be one of the super teams).