Where would Madar and Begarin go in this year's draft?

[Roy H.]

I've read a few statements lately suggesting that Madar and Begarin are roughly equal to first round draft picks that will eventually be coming over. 

Here's how they're each performing:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/yam-madar-1.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/juhann-begarin-1.html

It's impossible to determine a draft prospect by just stats in international competition, but that's what we have so far. 

Are these guys viewed as good prospects?  Would they be given a first-round grade?

[Vermont Green]

I've read a few statements lately suggesting that Madar and Begarin are roughly equal to first round draft picks that will eventually be coming over. 

Here's how they're each performing:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/yam-madar-1.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/juhann-begarin-1.html

It's impossible to determine a draft prospect by just stats in international competition, but that's what we have so far. 

Are these guys viewed as good prospects?  Would they be given a first-round grade?

I am just going by what I saw in summer league.  I felt that both were probably back end of the first round caliber.  That is totally unscientific though, just my impression.  It is very hard to base it on stats in Europe or other international leagues.  Team are more comfortable drafting college players in general.  There is more of a baseline for comparison.  It is understandable.

Begarin in particular looked very athletic if raw.  Lot of potential there I felt.  More so than Madar at that point in time.

[Celtics2021]

Prior to the draft last year, Begarin was someone who Givony of DraftExpress/ESPN thought would be a first rounder (he said top 20) if he waited until 2022, so that’s where that line of reasoning comes from.  Because he’s no longer a potential draftee, scouting reports on him have dried up so I have no idea if he’s still on that development track.  My guess is he isn’t that far off, as he’s jumped a level in competition with similar levels of productivity.

Madar had a huge leap last year, but has generally struggled moving up to new competition this year.  His shooting has carried over, however, so that’s good. I don’t think he’d be a first, but he’s probably still draftable.

I would be shocked if the C’s don’t bring over Begarin next season unless they trade him.  I think Madar will depend on his buyout and what the C’s do with their other second.  I think the Celtics will have two second-round rookies because it helps avoid the tax/reduce tax bill relative to other minimum salary players.

[Celtics4ever]

Madar undrafted, his summer league did not help, this season has not helped

Begarin 2nd round.

[CFAN38]

If you forget about summer league and just look compare them to other Euro prospects I would rank them both as mid seconds.

Begarin fits the profile of the perfect 2nd round gamble. As a wing with a great athletic profile and length he plays a role that is very coveted in the NBA and that really helps his value. However he needs to shoot the 3 better and its very disappointing to see him statistically digress as a shooter.

Madar I would projected as a backup pg, his shooting this season gives me hope that he can be a solid 3&D PG who can play strong point of attack D and hit open 3s.

[CFAN38]

Prior to the draft last year, Begarin was someone who Givony of DraftExpress/ESPN thought would be a first rounder (he said top 20) if he waited until 2022, so that’s where that line of reasoning comes from.  Because he’s no longer a potential draftee, scouting reports on him have dried up so I have no idea if he’s still on that development track.  My guess is he isn’t that far off, as he’s jumped a level in competition with similar levels of productivity.

Madar had a huge leap last year, but has generally struggled moving up to new competition this year.  His shooting has carried over, however, so that’s good. I don’t think he’d be a first, but he’s probably still draftable.

I would be shocked if the C’s don’t bring over Begarin next season unless they trade him.  I think Madar will depend on his buyout and what the C’s do with their other second.  I think the Celtics will have two second-round rookies because it helps avoid the tax/reduce tax bill relative to other minimum salary players.

Begarin is so young I suspect the Cs leave him in europe another season and hope he shot starts turning around.

I do agree picking up another 2nd round pick makes sense for its low cost and future cost control. I pointed this out in another thread the 2021 draft has already produced a handful of productive players and the 2022 (using Tankathons mock) has some nice later 2nd options that I like ( Champagnie, T Williams, Hall, Tshiebwe) 

[Birdman]

Probably end of 2nd round

[Celtics2021]

Prior to the draft last year, Begarin was someone who Givony of DraftExpress/ESPN thought would be a first rounder (he said top 20) if he waited until 2022, so that’s where that line of reasoning comes from.  Because he’s no longer a potential draftee, scouting reports on him have dried up so I have no idea if he’s still on that development track.  My guess is he isn’t that far off, as he’s jumped a level in competition with similar levels of productivity.

Madar had a huge leap last year, but has generally struggled moving up to new competition this year.  His shooting has carried over, however, so that’s good. I don’t think he’d be a first, but he’s probably still draftable.

I would be shocked if the C’s don’t bring over Begarin next season unless they trade him.  I think Madar will depend on his buyout and what the C’s do with their other second.  I think the Celtics will have two second-round rookies because it helps avoid the tax/reduce tax bill relative to other minimum salary players.

Begarin is so young I suspect the Cs leave him in europe another season and hope he shot starts turning around.

I do agree picking up another 2nd round pick makes sense for its low cost and future cost control. I pointed this out in another thread the 2021 draft has already produced a handful of productive players and the 2022 (using Tankathons mock) has some nice later 2nd options that I like ( Champagnie, T Williams, Hall, Tshiebwe)

I don't think it too likely the C's add a 2nd on draft night.  Maybe they can convince someone that Nesmith is worth a second, but they've used up most of the cash they're allowed to send out in deals.  Looking at the C's depth chart for next year, they don't need a 2nd rounder who can come in immediately, so having Begarin develop in Maine for a season would be fine while he gets acclimated to the US.  The Celtics still have their first and a probable high second in 2023 as well, and Stevens isn't likely to want to give Udoka more than two rookies at a time based on his own experiences, so it makes sense for Begarin to come over this year for long-term roster management as well.

[slamtheking]

Madar undrafted, his summer league did not help, this season has not helped

Begarin 2nd round.

agreed.  Begarin would likely be a late second taken as a flyer on him, much like we did.

Madar was overwhelmed in summer league for the most part and his current season abroad isn't quelling concerns about his game/development

[knuckleballer]

I was really impressed with Begarin while watching the summer league.  He was raw, but only 18 years old.  He was listed at 185, but during the broadcast, they said he was actually 215.  He had an impressive physique for his age.  He’s 6’5 with about a 7” wingspan and was very athletic.  He was aggressive, a willing passer, and seemed to have a decent IQ for the game.  He could be a meaningful player for us in a couple of years.

Here’s his highlights from last summer. https://youtu.be/bWHJAXCO_w8

[wiley]

I currently have hopes for Begarin to be on the team next year. Liked him in Summer league a lot for this advanced poise considering his age), along with physical profile mentioned by Knuckleballer.

I have hopes that Madar could become our starting PG maybe 3 or 4 years from now, Smart will either be gone or perhaps ready to come off the bench...

to Summarize:

Begarin: almost now
Madar:  much later

Not sure where they'd go in this draft

[Surferdad]

Madar undrafted, his summer league did not help, this season has not helped

Begarin 2nd round.

agreed.  Begarin would likely be a late second taken as a flyer on him, much like we did.

Madar was overwhelmed in summer league for the most part and his current season abroad isn't quelling concerns about his game/development

I liked his IQ and defense, got his hands in the passing lanes etc. However, he needs to add some muscle to play in the NBA.

[Csfan1984]

Late 2nd if they agree to be stashed.

[Hoopvortex]

I've read a few statements lately suggesting that Madar and Begarin are roughly equal to first round draft picks that will eventually be coming over. 

Here's how they're each performing:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/yam-madar-1.html

https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/juhann-begarin-1.html

It's impossible to determine a draft prospect by just stats in international competition, but that's what we have so far. 

Are these guys viewed as good prospects?  Would they be given a first-round grade?

Begarin maybe. I doubt that Madar makes it to the Big Show because of the body.

Begarin has a good body, good movement, good hands.

He's got some attractive skills; shoots with range off the dribble and showed a rather pretty fall-away 18-footer in summer league. Good touch but I thought I saw inconsistent shooting posture, which should be correctable.

Showed a bit of left-hand dribbling and finishing, probably very much a work in progress.

Size and athleticism should translate into an NBA defender.

[RPGenerate]

Man, it would be great if even one of these guys end up being an NBA player. We don't really have many picks coming in the next couple of years, so these guys may be some of the only youth we get.