Tatum/Brown are A Walker8/Pierce

[todd_days_41]

Tatum > Pierce
Brown > Walker

Comparison ends.

Yeah, the former is still a bit of a stretch. I love Tatum, and he has that potential, but Pierce is one of the best to ever play the game.

I agree on Brown vs. Walker.

And….. The Truth was a major gamer. His duel with LeBron was one of the best games ever played. Tatum needs to win some more before he’s simply anointed superior. 

[Moranis]

Tatum > Pierce
Brown > Walker

Comparison ends.

Yeah, the former is still a bit of a stretch. I love Tatum, and he has that potential, but Pierce is one of the best to ever play the game.

I agree on Brown vs. Walker.

And….. The Truth was a major gamer. His duel with LeBron was one of the best games ever played. Tatum needs to win some more before he’s simply anointed superior.

Tatum has won more games than Pierce ever did with Walker.  Not even close.  I mean just this last playoffs alone he dropped a 50 point game in a game Boston won when Durant had 39 and Harden had 41.  He has been the leading scorer of two separate playoff runs that ended in the ECF.  He has 27 playoff victories.  Pierce had 16 until he shared the floor with Garnett.  This idea that Tatum isn't a winner just isn't borne in reality. 

Because Tatum is so young still, Pierce clearly had the better career to this point and more impactful because of the title he rode the back of Garnett to get (remember even with Allen the C's lost in the 2nd round without KG in 2009), but Tatum is quite simply a better player than Pierce ever was.

[BringToughnessBack]

Tatum > Pierce
Brown > Walker

Comparison ends.

Exactly- Agree 1000 percent.

[Roy H.]

because of the title he rode the back of Garnett to get

Eh.  KG rode Pierce too.  Without the other they both end up titleless.

[Jvalin]

Couldn't disagree more with the OP. Tatum and Brown can definitely play next to each other. Tatum is at his best when playing at PF. Traditional PFs aren't mobile enough to stay in front of him on the perimeter. This is a massive advantage in favour of Tatum, especially since he can put the ball on the floor and create his own shot. Brown is at his best when playing at SG. He's tall/long enough to shoot over most opposing SGs or take them to the basket. At the same time, he's mobile enough to stay in front of SGs on defense. Btw, the Celtics have made 2 trips to the ECF in the 4 years Tatum and Brown are playing together. I could even argue we are 2 out of 3, cause Brown missed the playoffs last season.

Today's NBA is all about defensive versatility (and shooting). If anything, we need one more starting-caliber swing. I mean, we never replaced Hayward. We also desperately need better ball movement/more passing. Long story short, we could have a use for a Point Forward. Easier said than done. Three names come to mind: Simmons > Siakam > Kyle Anderson. Obviously, they are different players compared to Hayward. Imo, Simmons is better suited at Point Center. Siakam ain't exaclty a Point Forward, but he's a willing passer. SloMo is the epitome of a Point Forward. I'd also be happy with Jerami Grant even though he's nothing special as a passer. If we trade for Jerami, I reckon we'd desperately need a pass-first PG.

[jambr380]

I definitely think the jury is still out on whether Brown is better than Walker was. Brown is in his 6th season and will have only made one All-Star team by the end of it. Walker had made three by the end of his 7th season. On top of that, Walker was a much better on the floor leader and the Pierce/Walker played with much worse players than Tatum/Brown have so far in their careers; yet, had moderate playoff success. Brown certainly has the potential to be better than Walker, but he isn't there yet.

In Ainge's first big move, he went out and traded Walker - an All-Star in his prime - for Raef freaking LaFrentz and his totally bloated contract. Let's hope that Brad does better than that if he decides to eventually break up the duo.

Jaylen has only played 5 full seasons. He hasn't finished his 6th so it's unfair to declare Brown won't be an All-Star this year. 

Also, in Antoine's first 5 full seasons he had 1 All-Star appearance, just like Jaylen. Here is a comparison of both for their first 5 seasons:

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1=walkean02&p1yrfrom=1997&p1yrto=2001&player_id2=brownja02&p2yrfrom=2017&p2yrto=2021

Antoine had better basic counting stats but Jaylen had better per 36 and advanced stats. Jaylen had also played in 61 playoff games and been his team's best performing player in a couple of those playoff runs. After 5 seasons Walker had yet to play in a playoff game. Jaylen was also a much more versatile and overall better defender.

I think by stats and the games I remember that watching, so the eye test, Jaylen was the much better player with much more room to grow as a player at the same amount of years in the league.

And I disagree. Isn’t it great to have differing opinions in the world?

And, no, Brown definitely won’t be making the All-Star game this season. And would he really have made the playoffs with a similar roster? We can also discuss things like durability and leadership.

Quite simply, Jaylen has been a nice player up to this point his career - admittedly with lots of room to grow - but he isn’t as good as Antoine was if you go year by year. And he certainly doesn’t have the impact of Antone.

[Roy H.]

And he certainly doesn’t have the impact of Antone.

That’s the rub.  Antoine was a primary playmaker who always had the ball, particularly when PP was finding himself.  Jaylen has never had that role.  Would things be different if JB was thrust into the “face of a franchise” role?

[Moranis]

because of the title he rode the back of Garnett to get

Eh.  KG rode Pierce too.  Without the other they both end up titleless.

Absolutely.  I wasn't trying to imply they didn't need each other (they needed Allen also).  KG always was best served as a #2 or 3 scoring option and was at his best with a lead scorer (Spreewell, Pierce), but KG was clearly the best player during their run together which was the point I was making.

Pierce had a long very good borderline great career, but Tatum is better than Pierce was at his peak.  Much longer peak so far than Tatum, just not as high.  Since Bird, only KG has been a better player than Tatum for the C's and Tatum is still getting better.  If he doesn't get into the KG range as a player though, then Boston has no shot at winning a title with the basic team framework that exists right now.

[Roy H.]

It’s interesting how similar the best statistical season for each of JT and PP is:

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1=piercpa01&p1yrfrom=2006&player_id2=tatumja01&p2yrfrom=2021

Big differences:

1.  Pierce got to the hoop much more;
2.  Tatum shoots double the 3PAs;
3.  Pierce was more durable;
4.  JT was on a playoff team, Pierce was in the lottery
5.  “Advanced” metrics like Pierce’s season a lot more

[nickagneta]

And he certainly doesn’t have the impact of Antone.

That’s the rub.  Antoine was a primary playmaker who always had the ball, particularly when PP was finding himself.  Jaylen has never had that role.  Would things be different if JB was thrust into the “face of a franchise” role?

Also, Antoine's impact was a double edged sword. He did impact his team in good ways, but it can be argued that his overall impact was a net negative because of his turnovers, horrible shot selection, terrible shooting efficiency, the shear amount of bad shots taken and an unwillingness to play down low and grab rebounds, which was actually his best skill.

And lest we forget, Brown went to and showed up huge in the playoffs, as I said, being arguably his team's best player during two playoff runs. That impact just can't be ignored when comparing the two.

[Roy H.]

Never will I ever agree that Antoine was a net negative.  I have an irrational love for that guy, mostly because he loved being a Celtic.

[Somebody]

It’s interesting how similar the best statistical season for each of JT and PP is:

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1=piercpa01&p1yrfrom=2006&player_id2=tatumja01&p2yrfrom=2021

Big differences:

1.  Pierce got to the hoop much more;
2.  Tatum shoots double the 3PAs;
3.  Pierce was more durable;
4.  JT was on a playoff team, Pierce was in the lottery
5.  “Advanced” metrics like Pierce’s season a lot more

To be fair Pierce would be swapping out a lot of his long twos for threes today, he increased his rate of three point attempts as the league got more modern and would likely be even more extreme today. Just a fantastic shot profile - he truly maximised every drop of potential he had (I'm not saying that the midrange has no value, it's just that there's a difference between using it as a counter and stepping inside for a long two when you have a three).

[nickagneta]

Never will I ever agree that Antoine was a net negative.  I have an irrational love for that guy, mostly because he loved being a Celtic.

I understand this but I think Antoine was very much a net negative during some years(not all, just some), but I don't think it was his fault. Pitino allowed Toine to shoot awful shots without consequences. Pitino allowed Walker to put up 20+ shots a game even though he was terribly inefficient. Pitino allowed Toine to play on the perimeter when his strengths were playing closer to the basket. Pitino traded away Billups who would have made Antoine a better player. I think if not for Pitino, Antoine would have been a much, much better player.

[spikelovetheCelts]

Having Isaiah, Gordon and Kyrie helped our playoff runs with Brown and Tatum. I would take Pierce over both Brown in a Death Match Game. He has hit more big shots than most. Brown is not over walker yet but he will be. Tatum is Willling to get dirty more than Walker ever did. We will see this playoff Season Waht they can do. If we don't keep Dennis we have no chance.

[droopdog7]

Tatum > Pierce
Brown > Walker

Comparison ends.

Yeah, the former is still a bit of a stretch. I love Tatum, and he has that potential, but Pierce is one of the best to ever play the game.

I agree on Brown vs. Walker.

And….. The Truth was a major gamer. His duel with LeBron was one of the best games ever played. Tatum needs to win some more before he’s simply anointed superior.

Tatum has won more games than Pierce ever did with Walker.  Not even close.  I mean just this last playoffs alone he dropped a 50 point game in a game Boston won when Durant had 39 and Harden had 41.  He has been the leading scorer of two separate playoff runs that ended in the ECF.  He has 27 playoff victories.  Pierce had 16 until he shared the floor with Garnett.  This idea that Tatum isn't a winner just isn't borne in reality. 

Because Tatum is so young still, Pierce clearly had the better career to this point and more impactful because of the title he rode the back of Garnett to get (remember even with Allen the C's lost in the 2nd round without KG in 2009), but Tatum is quite simply a better player than Pierce ever was.

I was going with your first thought but not this one.  PP did at least crack the top 10 in MVP voting once.  Tatum hasn't done anything close to that yet and there is no guarantee that he ever will.