Edwards & Dunn Traded for Juancho Hernangomez

[GreenShooter]

This guy is terrible. I can see why the trade was made but at least Dunn was good at a couple of things. This guy is pretty much useless. Say all you want about him being active and shooting 3's but he's good for one minute per game.

And yet he has been a rotation level player every year of his career.  Even a spot starter for a Denver team that made game 7 of the WCS.  And earned himself a contract well above the minimum in the process. 

Just not a take borne in reality.

Yeah, a Denver team with Jokic and Plumlee as their only bigs? Maybe Milsap. Did he really spot start? That's tragic.
And I don't know what reality you're talking about. I see it, the bad contracts given to mediocre players, every day.
As long as this trade means that Grant will be dealt or relegated to player #12 off the bench I'm ok with it.

He started 25 games for Denver playing 19.4 mpg.  He played 17.3 mpg last year starting 6 games.  No one is saying he isn't mediocre or a bench player, but he isn't worthless and can give you a lot more than one minute a game.  That is what I was responding to, your take that he has no value and shouldn't play at all.  He is a nice solid bench player that can start in a pinch if needed.  That isn't worthless.

worthless and terrible are two different words

[Moranis]

This guy is terrible. I can see why the trade was made but at least Dunn was good at a couple of things. This guy is pretty much useless. Say all you want about him being active and shooting 3's but he's good for one minute per game.

And yet he has been a rotation level player every year of his career.  Even a spot starter for a Denver team that made game 7 of the WCS.  And earned himself a contract well above the minimum in the process. 

Just not a take borne in reality.

Yeah, a Denver team with Jokic and Plumlee as their only bigs? Maybe Milsap. Did he really spot start? That's tragic.
And I don't know what reality you're talking about. I see it, the bad contracts given to mediocre players, every day.
As long as this trade means that Grant will be dealt or relegated to player #12 off the bench I'm ok with it.

He started 25 games for Denver playing 19.4 mpg.  He played 17.3 mpg last year starting 6 games.  No one is saying he isn't mediocre or a bench player, but he isn't worthless and can give you a lot more than one minute a game.  That is what I was responding to, your take that he has no value and shouldn't play at all.  He is a nice solid bench player that can start in a pinch if needed.  That isn't worthless.

worthless and terrible are two different words

You said he was useless, not terrible (though he isn't terrible).  Worthless and Useless do in fact mean basically the same thing.  Here are there definitions from dictionary.com

useless

adjective
of no use; not serving the purpose or any purpose; unavailing or futile:
It is useless to reason with him.

without useful qualities; of no practical good:
a useless person; a useless gadget.

worthless

adjective
without worth; of no use, importance, or value; good-for-nothing:
a worthless person; a worthless contract.

And hey, what do you know, thesarus.com lists worthless and useless as synonyms.  https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/useless

[Goldstar88]

I view Juancho as a useful 3rd string PF. Arguably the same as Grant Williams (3rd stringer or non-NBA?). And better than Jabari who I view as a non-NBA level player.

Basically, we just have three 3rd string PFs. None of whom are good enough to be playing regular minutes. Each offers a different skill set as an end of the roster player.

How is Jabari a “Non-NBA” level player?  His defense is below average, but everything else looked decent enough for a backup, Plus he has good size and looks strong. His per 36 in 10 games for the C’s was 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk. He may end up being the best back up PF on the team this year.

His defense is terrible. Not just below average but terrible. And his offense is useful but not good enough to make up for his terrible defense.

His offense is limited by his lack of outside shooting & middling scoring efficiency which makes him both a (1) bad fit as a supporting player due to lack of outside shooting (2) a bad fit as a leading shot creator due to middling efficiency.

He is just an empty stats guy for bad teams. He doesn't impact winning positively. A loser player for loser teams.

Parker’s defense wasn’t as bad as you make it seem. He’s not IT... Grant may be a better team defender, but one on one he gets destroyed by taller players. Just like Kemba did.

Jabari’s player efficiency rating was 14.75 last season, Grants was 7.54.

Jabari’s per 36: 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk, eFG%563. Grants was 9pts, 5rebs, 2ast, 1stl, eFG%.534

I’d take Parker over Grant every day of the week.

[Silas]

I view Juancho as a useful 3rd string PF. Arguably the same as Grant Williams (3rd stringer or non-NBA?). And better than Jabari who I view as a non-NBA level player.

Basically, we just have three 3rd string PFs. None of whom are good enough to be playing regular minutes. Each offers a different skill set as an end of the roster player.

How is Jabari a “Non-NBA” level player?  His defense is below average, but everything else looked decent enough for a backup, Plus he has good size and looks strong. His per 36 in 10 games for the C’s was 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk. He may end up being the best back up PF on the team this year.

His defense is terrible. Not just below average but terrible. And his offense is useful but not good enough to make up for his terrible defense.

His offense is limited by his lack of outside shooting & middling scoring efficiency which makes him both a (1) bad fit as a supporting player due to lack of outside shooting (2) a bad fit as a leading shot creator due to middling efficiency.

He is just an empty stats guy for bad teams. He doesn't impact winning positively. A loser player for loser teams.

Parker’s defense wasn’t as bad as you make it seem. He’s not IT... Grant may be a better team defender, but one on one he gets destroyed by taller players. Just like Kemba did.

Jabari’s player efficiency rating was 14.75 last season, Grants was 7.54.

Jabari’s per 36: 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk, eFG%563. Grants was 9pts, 5rebs, 2ast, 1stl, eFG%.534

I’d take Parker over Grant every day of the week.

And twice on Sunday!

[gouki88]

I view Juancho as a useful 3rd string PF. Arguably the same as Grant Williams (3rd stringer or non-NBA?). And better than Jabari who I view as a non-NBA level player.

Basically, we just have three 3rd string PFs. None of whom are good enough to be playing regular minutes. Each offers a different skill set as an end of the roster player.

How is Jabari a “Non-NBA” level player?  His defense is below average, but everything else looked decent enough for a backup, Plus he has good size and looks strong. His per 36 in 10 games for the C’s was 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk. He may end up being the best back up PF on the team this year.

His defense is terrible. Not just below average but terrible. And his offense is useful but not good enough to make up for his terrible defense.

His offense is limited by his lack of outside shooting & middling scoring efficiency which makes him both a (1) bad fit as a supporting player due to lack of outside shooting (2) a bad fit as a leading shot creator due to middling efficiency.

He is just an empty stats guy for bad teams. He doesn't impact winning positively. A loser player for loser teams.

Parker’s defense wasn’t as bad as you make it seem. He’s not IT... Grant may be a better team defender, but one on one he gets destroyed by taller players. Just like Kemba did.

Jabari’s player efficiency rating was 14.75 last season, Grants was 7.54.

Jabari’s per 36: 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk, eFG%563. Grants was 9pts, 5rebs, 2ast, 1stl, eFG%.534

I’d take Parker over Grant every day of the week.

Parker's defence is definitely as bad as Who made it out to be

[Celtics4ever]

His defense is bad, but so is Grant's folks.   He routinely gets beat and can't rim protect or even rebound.   Both of them logged 114 DRtg last year.

Parker has one elite skill he can put the ball in the hole.  What is Grant's elite skill?   He can shoot the three some but is  not elite.   He is a good team mate that we know.  Hernangomez is not elite at things either but the sum of his game is greater than Grant's.   I will warn folks he had a 117 DRtg last year but it looked like an anomaly because he has done better in previous years.

We all know the thing keeping Grant on the team is his contract.

Grant is not that good folks, if he was we WOULD NOT be bringing in Jabari or Juancho as they are clearly potential replacements for him.

[Vermont Green]

Jabari’s per 36: 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk, eFG%563. Grants was 9pts, 5rebs, 2ast, 1stl, eFG%.534

In 2019/20, in combined ATL and SAC (38 games) Parker Per36 was 21 pts / 8.5 rebs, much of that as a starter for ATL (playing 26min).  Grant and Hernangomez have never and will never match that kind of production.  And we may not see that kind of production from Parker either but his potential far exceeds that of our other options.

And I don't know how bad Parker's defense will be.  In his time with Boston last season, I didn't see it as being so bad that it would keep him off the court over Grant Williams but we shall see.  I think the bottom line is that if Parker is no better than Grant Williams in the preseason, he will probably be cut or released and Bruno Fernando will see more action.

I suspect that the Celtics are hoping that Parker is better, or at least different.  We are going to be PF by committee so the hope that we can utilize the 3, utilizing their strengths against certain match ups or situations.  Parker will be more of a scoring swing type PF.

[GreenShooter]

This guy is terrible. I can see why the trade was made but at least Dunn was good at a couple of things. This guy is pretty much useless. Say all you want about him being active and shooting 3's but he's good for one minute per game.

And yet he has been a rotation level player every year of his career.  Even a spot starter for a Denver team that made game 7 of the WCS.  And earned himself a contract well above the minimum in the process. 

Just not a take borne in reality.

Yeah, a Denver team with Jokic and Plumlee as their only bigs? Maybe Milsap. Did he really spot start? That's tragic.
And I don't know what reality you're talking about. I see it, the bad contracts given to mediocre players, every day.
As long as this trade means that Grant will be dealt or relegated to player #12 off the bench I'm ok with it.

He started 25 games for Denver playing 19.4 mpg.  He played 17.3 mpg last year starting 6 games.  No one is saying he isn't mediocre or a bench player, but he isn't worthless and can give you a lot more than one minute a game.  That is what I was responding to, your take that he has no value and shouldn't play at all.  He is a nice solid bench player that can start in a pinch if needed.  That isn't worthless.

worthless and terrible are two different words

You said he was useless, not terrible (though he isn't terrible).  Worthless and Useless do in fact mean basically the same thing.  Here are there definitions from dictionary.com

useless

adjective
of no use; not serving the purpose or any purpose; unavailing or futile:
It is useless to reason with him.

without useful qualities; of no practical good:
a useless person; a useless gadget.

worthless

adjective
without worth; of no use, importance, or value; good-for-nothing:
a worthless person; a worthless contract.

And hey, what do you know, thesarus.com lists worthless and useless as synonyms.  https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/useless

You need to get a life if you're trying to teach people thesaurus on here. If you want to argue about what I said (go see original post on page it was " this guy is terrible" and later "he's pretty much useless" (pretty much and completely have different meanings to some), which is to say "don't expect much from him" as he doesn't do enough to garner more than a couple/few/several (depending on matchups) minutes per game. And if the bench was any deeper with bigs he wouldn't even be here. So there's that and also that more deals could be in the works. You all need to hold your water thinking this guy is anything more than a replacement for Semi and Grant.

[JBcat]

Jabari’s per 36: 17pts, 9reb, 3ast, 1blk, eFG%563. Grants was 9pts, 5rebs, 2ast, 1stl, eFG%.534

In 2019/20, in combined ATL and SAC (38 games) Parker Per36 was 21 pts / 8.5 rebs, much of that as a starter for ATL (playing 26min).  Grant and Hernangomez have never and will never match that kind of production.  And we may not see that kind of production from Parker either but his potential far exceeds that of our other options.

And I don't know how bad Parker's defense will be.  In his time with Boston last season, I didn't see it as being so bad that it would keep him off the court over Grant Williams but we shall see.  I think the bottom line is that if Parker is no better than Grant Williams in the preseason, he will probably be cut or released and Bruno Fernando will see more action.

I suspect that the Celtics are hoping that Parker is better, or at least different.  We are going to be PF by committee so the hope that we can utilize the 3, utilizing their strengths against certain match ups or situations.  Parker will be more of a scoring swing type PF.

I’m also willing to give Parker a second life when it comes to defense.  Plenty of players have improved their defense over time, and Parker is still only 25.  Maybe a more mature Parker fighting for his NBA life with a full offseason moving further away from 2 horrific acl injuries, and shoulder injuries his defense will at least become passable.

[Roy H.]

I didn’t think that Jabari‘s defense was terrible in Boston. I think the effort was there, and he made a few plays. I don’t think he was being targeted repeatedly as the weak point of our defense. I expect that that would happen in a playoff series, but not so much in the regular season.

That said, historically his defense has been pretty awful. I don’t think that he was unplayable, however, just due to the other sub-NBA players behind him.

[liam]

Juancho Hernangomez is the poor man's version of the power forward everyone has been wanting. He can ( not saying he will...) shoot, pass, drive, run the floor, rebound, get a block of a steal. He has to be accounted for when he's on the floor. If he's on with Smart, Brown, Tatum, and TIMELORD he has to be accounted for. If he's on the floor with Schroder, Nesmith, Richardson, and Horford he has to be accounted for. That's a deep team full of vets. It's the kind of team where a role player who has an all-round, though not tops at anything, type of game can thrive in the cracks. Between Hernangomez and Parker you might get a full year of healthy production as both are injury prone.

[Goldstar88]

I didn’t think that Jabari‘s defense was terrible in Boston. I think the effort was there, and he made a few plays. I don’t think he was being targeted repeatedly as the weak point of our defense. I expect that that would happen in a playoff series, but not so much in the regular season.

That said, historically his defense has been pretty awful. I don’t think that he was unplayable, however, just due to the other sub-NBA players behind him.

100% correct. I expect him to be better this season.

[theswitch]

Well, at the very least Juancho will be our best power forward in front of a camera:

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2021/09/04/nba-boston-celtics-hernangomez-sandler/

[liam]

Well, at the very least Juancho will be our best power forward in front of a camera:

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2021/09/04/nba-boston-celtics-hernangomez-sandler/

Maybe he'll get a better whistle if he's more famous!

[BudweiserCeltic]

I didn’t think that Jabari‘s defense was terrible in Boston. I think the effort was there, and he made a few plays. I don’t think he was being targeted repeatedly as the weak point of our defense. I expect that that would happen in a playoff series, but not so much in the regular season.

That said, historically his defense has been pretty awful. I don’t think that he was unplayable, however, just due to the other sub-NBA players behind him.

Honestly don't recall much on the defensive side of things in the playoffs, but I thought Jabari was our best offensive player outside of Tatum in the playoffs.

Of course, can't expect that type of efficiency in the season... but it was nice to see.

I do think we may see quite a bit of Juancho at a SF with Jabari at PF during the season, assuming he's not cut.