Zion's Family Wants him Out of New Orleans

[RPGenerate]

They should sell that franchise and then move it.

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Is Silver's vision of the NBA a league where ~20 small market teams spend up to the 90% of the cap on middle of the road players and compete to win about half their games, while the other 8-10 teams in bigger markets horde all the stars and aim to win meaningful games in the post-season?

At this point, yeah. Wouldn't blame the Pelicans at all if they moved to Las Vegas or something, if Zion were to force himself out after only two years.

[slamtheking]

They should sell that franchise and then move it.

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Is Silver's vision of the NBA a league where ~20 small market teams spend up to the 90% of the cap on middle of the road players and compete to win about half their games, while the other 8-10 teams in bigger markets horde all the stars and aim to win meaningful games in the post-season?

just described a big part of what's wrong with baseball.

[Who]

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Easy to fix. Get rid of maximum contracts. Get rid of the draft. Get rid of rookie scale contracts. Keep the salary cap.

Players will follow the money. Talent will be better distributed throughout the league. Good for fans.

Good management will matter more so competence will be a bigger deciding factor in outcomes which is ideal.

And players have more freedom over choosing where they want to play which is ideal for them.

Fans no longer have to watch tanking teams because without the draft there is no upside to tanking. So teams are always competing and trying their best to win. Good for fans.

Okay for owners. More difficult in that you have to hire better front office personnel and hold them accountable to a better degree. But manageable. For all the benefits for players and fans? It is doable.

[Moranis]

If Zion was proactive, he would force his way out now. All the warning signs are there. He has a terrible GM who is running that team and harming Zion's career. Get out now. Don't wait 6-8 years before making the call. Do it now!

Unfortunately, few players are brave enough to withstand the negative fallout from such proactive decisions.

Is this supposed to be ironic? That sounds terrible for the NBA.

Good for the players. Good for the Fans. An added difficulty for owners.

Force owners to hire competent front office personnel and hold them accountable when they do not -- like every other business owner in the world is.

Players forcing their way to big markets is good for the fans? Nah, I don't think so. Also it's absurd to call their GM bad after less than two years.

Yes, absolutely = Good for fans.

There will be some pain but much better to have short lasting pain than long lasting chronic pain. Better to deal with the loss of a star than have bad management ruin your team for 6-8 years and then oftentimes lose the star anyway because of it.

Better to get the bad over and done with. Move on.

And of course, this is fixable for New Orleans. Just fire the GM and keep Zion. You don't have to lose the star. You only lose the star by supporting an incompetent front office / coaching staff over the welfare of the players.

What is in the article?  Griffin is a title winning executive.  He has worked for several different organizations and has almost universally been well received at those places. 

I mean even Lebron James spoke incredibly highly of him

It makes no sense why he shouldn't get an extension. He's pulled every move—he's tried to make every move happen—to better this team to be able to compete for a championship. So we wouldn't be in this position, obviously, without him and without the guys that are here—from the coaching staff to the players to Griff. He's been a big piece of it.

[Roy H.]

They should sell that franchise and then move it.

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Is Silver's vision of the NBA a league where ~20 small market teams spend up to the 90% of the cap on middle of the road players and compete to win about half their games, while the other 8-10 teams in bigger markets horde all the stars and aim to win meaningful games in the post-season?

just described a big part of what's wrong with baseball.

At least there, there’s robust revenue sharing and small market teams can win by building a great farm system.

[liam]

They should sell that franchise and then move it.

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Is Silver's vision of the NBA a league where ~20 small market teams spend up to the 90% of the cap on middle of the road players and compete to win about half their games, while the other 8-10 teams in bigger markets horde all the stars and aim to win meaningful games in the post-season?

Who are the 20 small market teams? Does that include Portland, Milwaukee, Boston, Denver, Washington, Atlanta?

[Who]

If Zion was proactive, he would force his way out now. All the warning signs are there. He has a terrible GM who is running that team and harming Zion's career. Get out now. Don't wait 6-8 years before making the call. Do it now!

Unfortunately, few players are brave enough to withstand the negative fallout from such proactive decisions.

Is this supposed to be ironic? That sounds terrible for the NBA.

Good for the players. Good for the Fans. An added difficulty for owners.

Force owners to hire competent front office personnel and hold them accountable when they do not -- like every other business owner in the world is.

Players forcing their way to big markets is good for the fans? Nah, I don't think so. Also it's absurd to call their GM bad after less than two years.

Yes, absolutely = Good for fans.

There will be some pain but much better to have short lasting pain than long lasting chronic pain. Better to deal with the loss of a star than have bad management ruin your team for 6-8 years and then oftentimes lose the star anyway because of it.

Better to get the bad over and done with. Move on.

And of course, this is fixable for New Orleans. Just fire the GM and keep Zion. You don't have to lose the star. You only lose the star by supporting an incompetent front office / coaching staff over the welfare of the players.

How are they bad management? You never actually explained that part. Also I see you crossed out "big markets". Do you think that somehow counters the point? Your vision of the NBA is frankly trash to me, and would probably make me stop watching. Tatum should just force his way out of Boston and call it a day at this point.

I never mentioned anything about big markets in my initial post. Nor did you in your first reply. Then that appeared suddenly out of nowhere.

I did not wish to respond to the big markets point. That is why I crossed it out. To show that I was not speaking to that specific point in the rest of your reply.

[Rondo9]

If Zion was proactive, he would force his way out now. All the warning signs are there. He has a terrible GM who is running that team and harming Zion's career. Get out now. Don't wait 6-8 years before making the call. Do it now!

Unfortunately, few players are brave enough to withstand the negative fallout from such proactive decisions.

I have to agree assuming this is true.

For too long many franchise players have been wasting their primes under terrible management. Do you want to continue to stay in that situation? Or do you want to put massive amounts of pressure on the team to actually be competent. Glad to see players trying to use their power instead of just riding their contracts, they can get money through endorsements but right they want to play winning basketball.

Besides this means that the Celtics can trade Kemba for Zion!

[RPGenerate]

If Zion was proactive, he would force his way out now. All the warning signs are there. He has a terrible GM who is running that team and harming Zion's career. Get out now. Don't wait 6-8 years before making the call. Do it now!

Unfortunately, few players are brave enough to withstand the negative fallout from such proactive decisions.

Is this supposed to be ironic? That sounds terrible for the NBA.

Good for the players. Good for the Fans. An added difficulty for owners.

Force owners to hire competent front office personnel and hold them accountable when they do not -- like every other business owner in the world is.

Players forcing their way to big markets is good for the fans? Nah, I don't think so. Also it's absurd to call their GM bad after less than two years.

Yes, absolutely = Good for fans.

There will be some pain but much better to have short lasting pain than long lasting chronic pain. Better to deal with the loss of a star than have bad management ruin your team for 6-8 years and then oftentimes lose the star anyway because of it.

Better to get the bad over and done with. Move on.

And of course, this is fixable for New Orleans. Just fire the GM and keep Zion. You don't have to lose the star. You only lose the star by supporting an incompetent front office / coaching staff over the welfare of the players.

How are they bad management? You never actually explained that part. Also I see you crossed out "big markets". Do you think that somehow counters the point? Your vision of the NBA is frankly trash to me, and would probably make me stop watching. Tatum should just force his way out of Boston and call it a day at this point.

I never mentioned anything about big markets in my initial post. Nor did you in your first reply. Then that appeared suddenly out of nowhere.

I did not wish to respond to the big markets point. That is why I crossed it out. To show that I was not speaking to that specific point in the rest of your reply.

Than you are purposely ignoring a huge aspect of what we are talking about. It's like discussing going to the moon and when someone brings up the lack of oxygen, you wave it off as unimportant.

[Who]

I could care less that David Griffin has a title. He did not build that team. He was given that team. He walked into a team where the best player in the league was returning, he had one of the finest up and coming stars in the league in Kyrie Irving and multiple high draft picks including that year's #1  overall pick to trade and get a 3rd star. That was a cakewalk.

David Griffin has never - I repeat, NEVER - built a team. This is a whole new task for him.  And he is doing a terrible job. I have no issue with any player (Zion) feeling that he isn't up to that job given Griffin's decisions.

In fact, I would cheer Zion on for being so proactive.

[Ogaju]

That said, if young star players are going to start forcing their way out before their rookie deals are even up, the NBA is in a very precarious spot.

Why should small market teams feel that they will ever be able to obtain and hold onto young star players?

Does the NBA care? 

Easy to fix. Get rid of maximum contracts. Get rid of the draft. Get rid of rookie scale contracts. Keep the salary cap.

Players will follow the money. Talent will be better distributed throughout the league. Good for fans.

Good management will matter more so competence will be a bigger deciding factor in outcomes which is ideal.

And players have more freedom over choosing where they want to play which is ideal for them.

Fans no longer have to watch tanking teams because without the draft there is no upside to tanking. So teams are always competing and trying their best to win. Good for fans.

Okay for owners. More difficult in that you have to hire better front office personnel and hold them accountable to a better degree. But manageable. For all the benefits for players and fans? It is doable.

I second get rid of the draft....it is not serving its purpose. It has just turned bad teams to development teams for young stars. Keep the cap get rid of the draft, the market will sort itself out. Oh and get rid of the age restriction...no minimum age restriction beyond the prohibitions against child labor.

[Phantom255x]

And let me guess. His preference is to either 1 LA team, Miami or New York? 

[Who]

How are they bad management? You never actually explained that part. Also I see you crossed out "big markets". Do you think that somehow counters the point? Your vision of the NBA is frankly trash to me, and would probably make me stop watching. Tatum should just force his way out of Boston and call it a day at this point.

I never mentioned anything about big markets in my initial post. Nor did you in your first reply. Then that appeared suddenly out of nowhere.

I did not wish to respond to the big markets point. That is why I crossed it out. To show that I was not speaking to that specific point in the rest of your reply.

Than you are purposely ignoring a huge aspect of what we are talking about. It's like discussing going to the moon and when someone brings up the lack of oxygen, you wave it off as unimportant.

I disagree.

I hate this part of the conversation because far too many people -- both fans and sportswriters -- completely overlook the incompetence and mismanagement that causes star players to leave their teams and put everything down to big market vs small market.

Most players are loyal to teams that are well run.
Most players are disloyal to teams that are badly run.

The whole big market vs small market complaint is just a distraction to hide owner's from the blame of what really has happened -- they hired someone who failed, the owner did not hold them accountable in a timely manner and their star player got fed up and decided to look elsewhere.

Fair enough. That star player should look elsewhere.

[RPGenerate]

How are they bad management? You never actually explained that part. Also I see you crossed out "big markets". Do you think that somehow counters the point? Your vision of the NBA is frankly trash to me, and would probably make me stop watching. Tatum should just force his way out of Boston and call it a day at this point.

I never mentioned anything about big markets in my initial post. Nor did you in your first reply. Then that appeared suddenly out of nowhere.

I did not wish to respond to the big markets point. That is why I crossed it out. To show that I was not speaking to that specific point in the rest of your reply.

Than you are purposely ignoring a huge aspect of what we are talking about. It's like discussing going to the moon and when someone brings up the lack of oxygen, you wave it off as unimportant.

I disagree.

I hate this part of the conversation because far too many people -- both fans and sportswriters -- completely overlook the incompetence and mismanagement that causes star players to leave their teams and put everything down to big market vs small market.

Most players are loyal to teams that are well run.
Most players are disloyal to teams that are badly run.

The whole big market vs small market complaint is just a distraction to hide owner's from the blame of what really has happened -- they hired someone who failed, the owner did not hold them accountable in a timely manner and their star player got fed up and decided to look elsewhere.

Fair enough. That star player should look elsewhere.

So it's just a huge coincident that nearly every example we have is a player forcing themselves out of small market teams onto big market teams?

[Who]

What’s incompetent about David Griffin?

(1) Steven Adams -- putting a paint only big man next to your superstar interior PF who needs a clear paint to maximize his skill-set.

(2) Trading Jrue = Having the makings of a 45-50 win team that could easily become a 50+ team either through minor changes or internal development (Zion, Ingram, Ball) ... and deciding that is better to destroy that team and lose intentionally for longer team (possible) gains. Selling out Zion's short term ambitions.

(3) Putting Bledsoe a dodgy shooting PG next to your paint only center, interior based PF and dodgy shooting Lonzo Ball. Destroying your team's capacity to have any semblance of an offense due to not just inferior but outright pathetic spacing.


(4) I really cannot get over the sheer lack of ambition David Griffin has & the sheer lack of faith / confidence David Griffin has in his young stars (Zion, Ingram). He has two of the finest young players in the league - already on his team! They are already All-Stars (or at least clearly on the path to it last summer).

This isn't a team that is starting over from scratch and entering a 3-5 year rebuilding stage. This is a team that needs to start moving forwards. Build something. Win. His decision making and willingness to sacrifice the present for the future was unnecessary and insulting (to the players and to the fans).