« Reply #30 on: May 22, 2021, 09:57:44 PM »
You aren’t going to win an NBA championship with a 6’1” guard as your best player and only all star.
OK this doesn't remotely describe the Jazz though
Also I picked the Bucks
The Jazz best player is a 6’1” guard in Mitchell. I doubt they get past either of the LA teams to make it to the finals. Quite a few are picking the Jazz to win it all. For the record, I would love for them to win, just don’t see it happening. Need star wing players to go far in the postseason.
Mitchell's height aside, the Jazz had 3 all stars this year and have 2 of the 3 finalists for 6th man of the year. They don't fit the traditional champion as they lack a top 5ish player, but they are fairly similar to the 3 teams that won a title without a top 5 player i.e. 3 or 4 all star caliber players, a lot of quality legit NBA depth, and a defensive anchor (14 Spurs, 05 Pistons, 79 Sonics).
And their best player is a 7'1 Gobert ('78 Bullets were also in that mould of 3-4 stars and a lot of quality role players FWIW).
I've always felt Hayes was a top 5 player that year. Dr. J, Kareem, Moses, and arguably Walton (Walton missed a bunch of games which is why I say arguably) were the only guys I think you could clearly say were better than Hayes though I wouldn't nitpick if someone wanted to argue about the scoring guards i.e. Gervin or Thompson. I just think Hayes was a better defender and more impactful player than those guys.
I felt that '78 and '79 was Gervin's peak and while I was never the highest on him in All-Time drafts, I do think that his massive scoring in a hybrid on/off-ball package holds pretty good value on strong and weak teams, kind of like a homeless man's Kevin Durant before the three point line so I'd take him over Hayes (Gervin led some elite offences during his prime with good but not great support around him). But to me the 4-5 guys who were next level superstars were the 4 you listed and Gervin - all of the others just don't seem THAT good to me with the limited data and film we have.
I think Hayes was an excellent defender, but I'm pretty low on his offence: low efficiency black holes who make a few boneheaded decisions every game when the offence is running through them aren't valuable at all. To me his overall impact is similar to a guy like late-70s Unseld (obviously very different players, but I think they were on a similar level), which takes him out of that inner circle for me.
The Bullets made 3 Finals winning the 1 with Hayes. He joined the Bullets in 73 and they didn't even lose in the 1st round until 1980 when Hayes was 34. I just don't think Hayes gets the credit historically he deserves. Absolutely an elite defender. He is still 8th all time in defensive win shares (he is 48th overall for win shares). Elite Rebounder. 6th all time in total rebounds and he is 14th all time in rpg, but only 2 players after him average more (Drummond and Rodman). He is 11th all time in points scored. 23rd all time with 2 bpg (and they didn't start tracking that until his 6th season - he had more earlier on before he lost some athleticism).
One of the most underrated players in league history. Elvin Hayes absolutely was a top 5 player over a several season string including the year the Bullets won the title.
Logged
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick
Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip