Author Topic: Why the blown leads???  (Read 6143 times)

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Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2010, 11:39:09 PM »

Offline dlpin

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As I've said before, I don't think it's the players choking as much as it is the opposing team making adjustments and the celtics not being able to respond. I think it's a coaching issue through and through.


Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2010, 11:40:22 PM »

Offline Ohio Celtics Fan

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Thank you to the OP for posting something like this, you beat me to it. This has had me scratching my head, I don't think I've ever seen this happen to a team this many times, could be exaggerated on my part as I'm a die hard fan but, this is ridiculous.
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Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2010, 11:41:30 PM »

Offline Spicoli

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We're playing "no one else gets injured" basketball. Once we have a lead in the first half, we stop playing physical, we play less strenuous defense, we walk up the ball, we stop driving inside and getting fouls, we stop moving off the ball... it's cruise control gone wrong.

Definitely could be right. Even though we were rebounding poorly, we still had a 14 point lead going into the 4th. These epic collapses are worse than if we just never led in the game.

Great point about the epic collapses.  It would be one thing if teams were blowing the Celtics out every night and ther weren't able to compete.  But to see them lose big leads night after night and utterly fail to execute down the stretch is much worse.  This team has no killer instinct, is too old and tired to play good basketball for 48 minutes and chokes down the stretch which is a recipe for disaster.

I don't think they're too old or too tired. I think they need to fix where they are mentally. Remember in the beginning of the season when Doc kept saying that they were at a great place mentally? I haven't heard him say that in quite some time now. Sad thing is that even our youth have bought into that. Rondo in his pregame TNT interview said something along the lines of "we're a little banged up right now." I think it's time for the players to stop feeling sorry for the team and just play.

Totally agree. The rebounding is a problem, but i think there's something mental at work here. The first and second halves are like night and day. It's like two completely different teams out there. I think for some reason when they get even a small lead, they just put it on cruise control. This is the kind of game where Ray should have had 30, if we kept feeding the hot hand. I know he missed a couple of good looks, but man, it seemed like in the second half they weren't going to him enough. It seems as though they play not to lose in the second halves of these games.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2010, 11:42:35 PM »

Offline Spicoli

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As I've said before, I don't think it's the players choking as much as it is the opposing team making adjustments and the celtics not being able to respond. I think it's a coaching issue through and through.



Yeah, as much as i think Doc is a good coach, i think a lot of this has to fall on him. You just cannot have your team unprepared to play during the second halves of each and every game.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2010, 11:43:46 PM »

Offline Spicoli

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Thank you to the OP for posting something like this, you beat me to it. This has had me scratching my head, I don't think I've ever seen this happen to a team this many times, could be exaggerated on my part as I'm a die hard fan but, this is ridiculous.

Yeah. I normally don't create topics (just read) but i've seen this too many times this season, and i just really feel like i need an answer to why this is happening. It's beyond frustrating.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2010, 12:10:05 AM »

Offline vinnie

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Thank you to the OP for posting something like this, you beat me to it. This has had me scratching my head, I don't think I've ever seen this happen to a team this many times, could be exaggerated on my part as I'm a die hard fan but, this is ridiculous.

I am with you. Other than KG's knee, this is the most troubling part of the season to me. This team has lost doouble digit leads more times this season than they did the last two. And, several of these games have been against bad teams.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2010, 12:48:45 AM »

Offline Rondo_is_better

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Well tonight it was 2 things:

1) Fouls.  We couldn't play defense without racking up tons and tons of fouls, whether they were legitimate or not.  The Magic shot 28 more free throws than us.  We're darned lucky they only made 26 of them.

2) Rebounding.  This team continuously gets killed on the glass.  We get very, very few offensive rebounds and we give up a ton of them.  Against a good rebounding team like the Magic or the Lakers, that's lights out.

It's very, very difficult to maintain a lead with those two problems, even if you are shooting over 50% from the field.  Eventually the law of averages catches up with you, and you start missing.  That happened tonight, and we lost.  No surprise.

Wait, REALLY?

REALLY??!?

That's absurd.
Grab a few boards, keep the TO's under 14, close out on shooters and we'll win.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2010, 12:57:12 AM »

Offline vinnie

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Well tonight it was 2 things:

1) Fouls.  We couldn't play defense without racking up tons and tons of fouls, whether they were legitimate or not.  The Magic shot 28 more free throws than us.  We're darned lucky they only made 26 of them.

2) Rebounding.  This team continuously gets killed on the glass.  We get very, very few offensive rebounds and we give up a ton of them.  Against a good rebounding team like the Magic or the Lakers, that's lights out.

It's very, very difficult to maintain a lead with those two problems, even if you are shooting over 50% from the field.  Eventually the law of averages catches up with you, and you start missing.  That happened tonight, and we lost.  No surprise.

Wait, REALLY?

REALLY??!?

That's absurd.

Actually, they shot 40 and we shot 18. But, it was 35-11 entering the 4th quarter, so the C's shot two more free throws in the final period while blowing a 14-point lead.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2010, 03:24:02 AM »

Offline PosImpos

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Well tonight it was 2 things:

1) Fouls.  We couldn't play defense without racking up tons and tons of fouls, whether they were legitimate or not.  The Magic shot 28 more free throws than us.  We're darned lucky they only made 26 of them.

2) Rebounding.  This team continuously gets killed on the glass.  We get very, very few offensive rebounds and we give up a ton of them.  Against a good rebounding team like the Magic or the Lakers, that's lights out.

It's very, very difficult to maintain a lead with those two problems, even if you are shooting over 50% from the field.  Eventually the law of averages catches up with you, and you start missing.  That happened tonight, and we lost.  No surprise.

Wait, REALLY?

REALLY??!?

That's absurd.

Actually, they shot 40 and we shot 18. But, it was 35-11 entering the 4th quarter, so the C's shot two more free throws in the final period while blowing a 14-point lead.

My bad, they shot 22 more than us. :P
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Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2010, 06:47:26 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Giving up too many offensive rebounds. 
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Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2010, 07:23:31 AM »

Offline Fan from VT

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1. We are definitely showing our age. Ray and Paul can't play this many minutes per night without slowing down. Tony and Eddie were playing ok last night, they should have played more minutes each to keep Ray/PP fresher down the stretch

2. We change our offense in the second halves. In the first half, the offense was smooth, and we took what they gave us. In the second, we started trying to force it through Pierce, who has been terrible lately in his decision making; the ball should certainly go to him but it shouldn't start with him when you have a guy like Rondo on the floor

3. Our offensive bigs are soft or slow. Specific to tonight, this was a problem. KG and Sheed love using their length to shoot unblockable fadeaways; this is not a good thing. Sure, they can't be blocked, but they are also hard to make and almost never get a foul call. If they went toward the hoop on their move, we would have gotten more calls. Additionally, against a team like Orlando, we need guys who can really finish quickly at the hoop. A guy like Dwight makes it hard for Rondo to finish himself, but if he had the bigs that Dwight was covering fill into the space Dwight leaves, they'd have a dunk every time. Unfortunately, Perk needs to gather himself and pause before every move, and if Sheed or KG are open, the move away from the basket to their prefered 15-21 foot ranged rather than get in. And Baby is terrible around the basket.

And finally, I thought we would lose when Baby took and was stuffed on 3 shots in a row. He needs to be better. After that, our team stopped passing (why pass if they'll just mess it up) and got stagnant.

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #26 on: January 29, 2010, 07:31:52 AM »

Offline thebirdman

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Because all we do is shoot 3`s...ORL attacked the rim and we shot jumpers the whole night...you can`t win game if you don`t attack the basket...

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #27 on: January 29, 2010, 08:06:44 AM »

Offline 2short

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rebounding, free throws and the ball not in rondos hands late
I understand doc wanting the ball out of 60% ft shooting rondos hands at end of games but has any coach done the hackarondo yet?
PP slows the ball down over 1/2 court, pounds it to set offense and we  get 1 shot & done.  Run the offense, Rondo is arguably our best player now, we live and die with him.  Of course if I'm doc rondo is shooting 100 ft EVERYDAY
« Last Edit: January 29, 2010, 08:15:56 AM by 2short »

Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #28 on: January 29, 2010, 08:17:26 AM »

Offline connerhenry43

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maybe we attended the "2009 Patriots how to hold on to leads on the road" seminar!  >:( :( :-[ :-\ :'(

the presence of rasheed is the factor. he played well for much of last night, but doc pulled perk with 5 fouls and in typical doc fashion, never put him back in.

perk may have fouled him, but no way does he let lewis cruise baseline and lay in the winning basket with 1.5 seconds left.

nice signing, danny.
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Re: Why the blown leads???
« Reply #29 on: January 29, 2010, 08:39:10 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Celtics need to rebound as a team.  Right now, they are not putting energy in getting to the ball like they have in the past.


Celtics need to draw more fouls.  Especially those vet big men that should know all the tricks to get defenders out of position down low.  If they can get the other teams big men into more foul trouble, the easier it becomes to rebound.


Play Celtic level defense at the end of games.  If KG isn't capable of guarding a Lewis on the perimeter right now, put Wallace on him instead.




To me, the key is that the Celtics issues are fixable and they have time to fix them.  There is no need for a panic move. 



But someone needs to step up and lead this team in that direction.