Author Topic: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It  (Read 3946 times)

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Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2019, 03:22:27 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I'm just not convinced that a team in a position to draft high would've looked at Brown and found him as exciting (e.g. potential franchise talent) as the relative unknown of a college or overseas youngster. 

Brown looked good in the post-season but I don't think he's really hasn't ever looked like a guy who could become a lead playmaker or scoring option for a good or even decent team.  More of a high level two-way complimentary player.
Yeah I think it would have taken Brown plus the Sacto pick for any team in the top 3 to seriously consider moving that pick.
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Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2019, 03:23:33 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Fans don't hate trading high.  Fans just have differences of opinions on player values.  Do you think Doncic is the best player in the draft with a good chance of becoming a top level star?  Do you think Brown is likely to be a multi-year all-star?  How you answer those questions determines whether trading Brown for Doncic would be trading high.
bill Simmons going from reacting violently to the idea of trading brown for a top 5 pick in a good draft - to wanting to dump brown for the #17 pick in a bad draft... is still a great summary of how fans react to trading a player when their stock is high vs when their stock is low. 

If fans had it their way, they’d give up rozier for a late 2nd round pick right now.
Simmons isn't a normal fan.  He is an emotional nut bag that over hyperbolizes everything.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2019, 03:53:13 PM »

Offline Erik

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You should never trade while you're high
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Quote from: Moranis
Simmons isn't a normal fan.  He is an emotional nut bag that over hyperbolizes everything.

I'd like to refer you to some of our trade threads.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2019, 04:22:45 PM »

Online tazzmaniac

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Fans don't hate trading high.  Fans just have differences of opinions on player values.  Do you think Doncic is the best player in the draft with a good chance of becoming a top level star?  Do you think Brown is likely to be a multi-year all-star?  How you answer those questions determines whether trading Brown for Doncic would be trading high.
bill Simmons going from reacting violently to the idea of trading brown for a top 5 pick in a good draft - to wanting to dump brown for the #17 pick in a bad draft... is still a great summary of how fans react to trading a player when their stock is high vs when their stock is low. 

If fans had it their way, they’d give up rozier for a late 2nd round pick right now.
Simmons isn't a normal fan.  He is an emotional nut bag that over hyperbolizes everything.
Simmons is a grade A tool.  He hated the KG/Pierce Nets trade.  Until of course it became an obvious homerun.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2019, 04:29:56 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I'm just not convinced that a team in a position to draft high would've looked at Brown and found him as exciting (e.g. potential franchise talent) as the relative unknown of a college or overseas youngster. 

Brown looked good in the post-season but I don't think he's really hasn't ever looked like a guy who could become a lead playmaker or scoring option for a good or even decent team.  More of a high level two-way complimentary player.
Yeah I think it would have taken Brown plus the Sacto pick for any team in the top 3 to seriously consider moving that pick.

i would have to believe that sac would jump all over brown and their pick back.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2019, 04:54:34 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I'm just not convinced that a team in a position to draft high would've looked at Brown and found him as exciting (e.g. potential franchise talent) as the relative unknown of a college or overseas youngster. 

Brown looked good in the post-season but I don't think he's really hasn't ever looked like a guy who could become a lead playmaker or scoring option for a good or even decent team.  More of a high level two-way complimentary player.
Yeah I think it would have taken Brown plus the Sacto pick for any team in the top 3 to seriously consider moving that pick.

i would have to believe that sac would jump all over brown and their pick back.
Probably, though maybe they really fell in love with Bagley.  Sometimes teams get these often irrational love affairs with players. 

And remember it is still #1 protected
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2019, 05:04:37 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I'm just not convinced that a team in a position to draft high would've looked at Brown and found him as exciting (e.g. potential franchise talent) as the relative unknown of a college or overseas youngster. 

Brown looked good in the post-season but I don't think he's really hasn't ever looked like a guy who could become a lead playmaker or scoring option for a good or even decent team.  More of a high level two-way complimentary player.
Yeah I think it would have taken Brown plus the Sacto pick for any team in the top 3 to seriously consider moving that pick.

i would have to believe that sac would jump all over brown and their pick back.

I'm not so sure -- I'm with Moranis on this one (amazing!) ... I think Sac probably fell in love with Bagley there at #2. 

As I say, I think most teams would see Brown as a good prospect that likely won't turn into a franchise guy, and at #2 I think teams tend to talk themselves into the guy they're taking being a potential franchise player.
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Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2019, 06:21:56 PM »

Offline mctyson

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If they trade Smart I quit the NBA.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2019, 08:19:07 PM »

Offline GRADYCOLNON

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The roles and futures of players play a factor in trading a player.  After watching the Kendrick Perkins trade backfire in our face in 2012, I think it is best to leave that team alone when a team is competing for a title.  The dividing factor has to be whether the team is competing or truly competing. Right now, I don't know where the Celtics stand.  If things continue to progress inconsistently, I see no reason why not to sell Morris high, assuming there is a team willing to pay the right price.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2019, 09:38:08 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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If they trade Smart I quit the NBA.



 Me Too. Unless it's for Davis LOL

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #40 on: January 17, 2019, 09:15:43 AM »

Offline safecracker

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Fans don't hate trading high.  Fans just have differences of opinions on player values.  Do you think Doncic is the best player in the draft with a good chance of becoming a top level star?  Do you think Brown is likely to be a multi-year all-star?  How you answer those questions determines whether trading Brown for Doncic would be trading high.
bill Simmons going from reacting violently to the idea of trading brown for a top 5 pick in a good draft - to wanting to dump brown for the #17 pick in a bad draft... is still a great summary of how fans react to trading a player when their stock is high vs when their stock is low. 

If fans had it their way, they’d give up rozier for a late 2nd round pick right now.
Simmons isn't a normal fan.  He is an emotional nut bag that over hyperbolizes everything.
Sounds like a perfectly normal fan to me....

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #41 on: January 17, 2019, 09:20:57 AM »

Offline petbrick

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Original post seems like a lot of words to say "stop being a fan in a way I don't like."

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #42 on: January 17, 2019, 11:42:06 AM »

Offline trickybilly

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Trade Kyrie now. I'm serious. I'm not triboying here but we could probably get a psychopath gamer for him.
"Gimme the ball, gimme the ball". Freddy Quimby, 1994.

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #43 on: January 17, 2019, 11:51:53 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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You’ll have to excuse my lengthiness—the reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain

Re: The Concept of Trading High and Why Fans Obviously Hate It
« Reply #44 on: January 17, 2019, 01:07:03 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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The idea is sound - trade an overvalued stock while it's overvalued - and it's an interesting thought experiment.

Even factoring that in, I have a hard time finding a trade involving Smart that works for the team. Smart brings a lot to the Celtics that would be difficult to replace. Jaylen could step into Marcus's spot, but he's a long way from being able to do what Smart does on defense, and I'm not sure he ever gets there. It's also an important plus for Marcus that he does not need a lot of shots to be fully engaged, which Jaylen may need. That Marcus is also (for the moment) efficient on a few shots a game and functions as a secondary playmaker is a cherry on that sundae. Does plugging Jaylen into the starting 5 really help him develop? Maybe; I don't know, given the limits on his usage. Does it help the team *this year*? Almost certainly not. And that is where I lose interest in trading Smart.  I still believe this team has a shot to come out of the East this year, and once you get to the Finals you never know what can happen. (See, e.g., GSW in 2016, when Draymond gets himself suspended while his team was up 3-1...). I do not give that opportunity up lightly.

Jay King has a great thread on what Marcus brought at the end of the game last night. While Kyrie closed on one end of the court, Marcus closed on the other. https://twitter.com/ByJayKing/status/1085951733384261633?s=20
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 01:21:53 PM by Sophomore »