Jaylen Brown interview in NY Times

[greg683x]

Rumor has it Jaylen dealt with racism in Boston because he experienced adversity trying to return an open box plunger at Home Depot

[Kernewek]

I think he was pretty fair about the racism in Boston stuff. The city has a history and still continues with the issue (like many other cities in the country).

The part of this interview that really bothered me was his freaking hypocrisy about his support for Kanye and Kyrie and the Black Islaelites. He claims racism against Blacks/African Americans but literally continues support for antisemites in the same article. He was asked about his support for Kanye and he just responded “Next question.” Just a super lame reply and just so hypocritical. It is so hard to take him seriously. You can’t claim to be an activist for civil rights/racism and in the same breath support the likes of Kanye and Kyrie. It was disappointing to read that.

Yeah, this isn't receiving enough attention. I obviously like Jaylen as a basketball player, but his views leave a lot to be desired. People should just stop giving him attention as if he is one of the league's great minds.

The fact that he won't just come out and denounce the words of Kanye and Kyrie speaks volumes and makes his platform about social equality a pretty empty one imo.

Yeah even on NBA reddit everyone is calling him out for it. Hard to really take Jaylen seriously on the off-the-court stuff when he can't even denounce Kayne and Kyrie.

And also, what Jaylen said about the fanbase, isn't that literally true of every fanbase? I mean maybe not the smaller ones like Charlotte, but almost all of them are like that with some "bad apples". It just is what it is.

This is nonsense - what part of what he's said in the above is invalidated by his stance on Kyrie and Kanye?

[greg683x]

I think he was pretty fair about the racism in Boston stuff. The city has a history and still continues with the issue (like many other cities in the country).

The part of this interview that really bothered me was his freaking hypocrisy about his support for Kanye and Kyrie and the Black Islaelites. He claims racism against Blacks/African Americans but literally continues support for antisemites in the same article. He was asked about his support for Kanye and he just responded “Next question.” Just a super lame reply and just so hypocritical. It is so hard to take him seriously. You can’t claim to be an activist for civil rights/racism and in the same breath support the likes of Kanye and Kyrie. It was disappointing to read that.

Yeah, this isn't receiving enough attention. I obviously like Jaylen as a basketball player, but his views leave a lot to be desired. People should just stop giving him attention as if he is one of the league's great minds.

The fact that he won't just come out and denounce the words of Kanye and Kyrie speaks volumes and makes his platform about social equality a pretty empty one imo.

Yeah even on NBA reddit everyone is calling him out for it. Hard to really take Jaylen seriously on the off-the-court stuff when he can't even denounce Kayne and Kyrie.

And also, what Jaylen said about the fanbase, isn't that literally true of every fanbase? I mean maybe not the smaller ones like Charlotte, but almost all of them are like that with some "bad apples". It just is what it is.

This is nonsense - what part of what he's said in the above is invalidated by his stance on Kyrie and Kanye?

It doesn’t invalidate it, but it starts to become more of a ‘maybe you should clean up your backyard before you start worrying about everyone else’s

[Roy H.]

I think he was pretty fair about the racism in Boston stuff. The city has a history and still continues with the issue (like many other cities in the country).

The part of this interview that really bothered me was his freaking hypocrisy about his support for Kanye and Kyrie and the Black Islaelites. He claims racism against Blacks/African Americans but literally continues support for antisemites in the same article. He was asked about his support for Kanye and he just responded “Next question.” Just a super lame reply and just so hypocritical. It is so hard to take him seriously. You can’t claim to be an activist for civil rights/racism and in the same breath support the likes of Kanye and Kyrie. It was disappointing to read that.

Yeah, this isn't receiving enough attention. I obviously like Jaylen as a basketball player, but his views leave a lot to be desired. People should just stop giving him attention as if he is one of the league's great minds.

The fact that he won't just come out and denounce the words of Kanye and Kyrie speaks volumes and makes his platform about social equality a pretty empty one imo.

Yeah even on NBA reddit everyone is calling him out for it. Hard to really take Jaylen seriously on the off-the-court stuff when he can't even denounce Kayne and Kyrie.

And also, what Jaylen said about the fanbase, isn't that literally true of every fanbase? I mean maybe not the smaller ones like Charlotte, but almost all of them are like that with some "bad apples". It just is what it is.

This is nonsense - what part of what he's said in the above is invalidated by his stance on Kyrie and Kanye?

I think what is being said is, when somebody is black supremacist adjacent, it’s hard to believe anything they say about equality is completely sincere.

[Dchuck]

Serious question…

if JB wasn’t second fiddle, the 1B to JT’s 1A, if he was the go-to-guy at the end of the game…if this was “his team”…does he come out and say this?

No place is perfect.  Are some places “better” than others? Sure.  But the same way “winning cures all”, being “THE man” on a team does as well. 

No one likes to play second fiddle, its human nature.  But especially world class athletes who are hyper competitive with over inflated egos, it never sits well.  He’s a great talent who believes he’s just as good as JT, I dont knock him for that. 

Has he experienced racism in the Boston area, I’m sure he has.  It exists everywhere.  I’ve faced it.  But I also know there is no utopian place where it doesnt.  Lets face it, he aint dealing with the situation Bill Russell dealt with.

I think this is a proactive attempt to lay the ground work for him to save face when he bounces.

In hindsight, we shoulda traded him for KD.

[RJ87]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

[Dchuck]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

True.  But is that racism?  He’s part of an entertainment product (sports, NBA).  That doesnt dehumanize him.  Some people might just want to watch the product and have no interest in what else they’re doing.  Doesnt make it racist.  Same goes for other celebrities (actors, musicians, athletes, etc).  Do we have to care about what they do outside of what has given them fame?  And if we dont, does that make us bad?

[Roy H.]

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

I’d be curious to hear him elaborate on this.

Me too. I would love to hear about the difficulty a multi-millionaire has in buying a house.

I thought this, like Jaylen's other statements about his experience with racism and treatment as an athlete, was pretty straightforward, and (mostly) not something exclusive to Boston. I think the racism comments can be taken either way, but it's certainly one of the more diplomatic answers an athlete has given, including Boston's own players. It bothers me that the media only asks this about Boston, but I don't think anything Jaylen said is false. The business/housing comments I chalk up to youth.

For example, buying/leasing retail property in Seaport and starting a clothing brand and foundation (7uice) is really hard, and frankly, as someone who has worked with professional athletes before, it is harder and a different kind of business than most high draft picks are used to. It's less name/image/likeness and more money/power/connections, and most athletes as business-inclined as Jaylen are are hesitant to overspend in business endeavors. They're used to low-risk endeavors like endorsement deals. And, as young men who have about 15 years to make enough money to last them and their families, they are understandably hesitant to engage in capital-intensive business deals. This is compounded by the fact that people have probably been trying to take advantage of them for years.

Additionally, like most business verticals, Boston commercial real estate is cut-throat and gate-kept in its own unique ways. For example, a friend of mine was talking to a bubble tea shop in Newton that was bidding on the rights to lease a small commercial property in Harvard Square, and their max of $18,000/month was swiftly rejected in favor of a higher, foreign bidder. I've heard rumors that the CVS on JFK Street pays over $100,000 per month. Money talks, but only if you have the most and are willing to spend it. Imagine the shock a rookie celebrity must have had to realize his small-footprint clothing store would cost 5-figures a month to have a retail location.

Additionally, Wellesley is a really weird place to live and does not like outsiders. It's predominantly white (77.1% of pop, according to the census), and Asian (13.2%, which is likely heavily skewed by Wellesley College and Babson). Only 2.9% Black/African, which I'd also imagine is mostly college students.

I've had Asian friends who have absolutely experienced covert and overt racism in Wellesley, most having to do with White residents who assume they are students and will brazenly and profanely tell them to move out as soon as possible and that they are not welcome. And, not that it matters, but these are very quiet and 2nd+ generation Americans whose primary language is English. They are certainly not instigating any of these happenings.

Boston is my favorite city in the US and certainly, in my opinion, one of the better places to live. But, like all places, it has its warts, which are definitely compounded for pro athletes by an intensely passionate fan base.

Sources: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/wellesleycdpmassachusetts#

This is a very interesting post, but I’m still interested in what JB thought.  I’m just sick of interviews that are basically quips.  I’d like follow up and depth.

For instance, cost of investing in a business:  what were his expectations?  What was the reality?  Why should doors open easier for an athlete as opposed to somebody with a successful track record?  What adversity was related to race in his opinion?  What’s that opinion based upon?

[NextCeltic34]

I feel like Jaylen tries too hard sometimes and isn't as smart as he thinks he is, especially when you're still making the dumbest mistakes on the court

[jpotter33]

I’ve never been a subscriber to the “shut up, and dribble” philosophy. It makes no sense to me. We all regularly discuss these matters and participate in political or social organizations and events we find worthwhile, yet we’re not professional politicians or activists. Who says that famous athletes and celebrities can’t do the same thing?

That being said, given the platform and influence these famous individuals have, they have a stronger moral obligation to be responsible, fair, and accurate in their messaging, activities, and platform, as what they do is much more impactful than what the average person does due to their reach. For example, in 2021 when Lebron James doxxed the one white officer involved in a shooting of a 16 year old girl before all the evidence was revealed, that was an absolute travesty, as it turned out to be a clearly justifiable shooting that likely saved another young African-American girl’s life. He likely influenced how millions of people - particularly African-Americans - perceived this situation due to his influence and platform.

I view JB’s situation similarly. While he’s done a lot  of good in the world, he’s clearly flubbed up this Kanye/Kyrie/Black Supremacism issue, and continues to do so by not taking a strong stand against this. Given his platform, who knows how much he’s contributed to allowing this racist philosophy to grow and fester, especially given his reputation as being one of the more astute and insightful athletes in the NBA.

There’s a difference between saying “shut up, and dribble” and holding athletes accountable for their highly influential words and actions when they do participate in speech or activities beyond basketball. Feels like these two distinct things regularly get conflated inappropriately - by both fans and athletes themselves - as the latter is clearly an appropriate standard to hold athletes to where the former is not.

Feels like there’s some of this going on in JB’s messaging here, i.e. that he doesn’t appreciate the difference between the “shut up, and dribble crowd” from the legitimate criticism of his approach to the Kanye/Kyrie/Black Supremacism issue. And he’s just making it worse by continuing to skirt the issue by not fully explaining himself in a perfect opportunity like this.

[RJ87]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

True.  But is that racism?  He’s part of an entertainment product (sports, NBA).  That doesnt dehumanize him.  Some people might just want to watch the product and have no interest in what else they’re doing.  Doesnt make it racist.  Same goes for other celebrities (actors, musicians, athletes, etc).  Do we have to care about what they do outside of what has given them fame?  And if we dont, does that make us bad?

I think you're conflating two different things.

If you don't care, you don't care. But there is a contingent that actively and aggressively attack him and other players. And yes, those attacks sometimes take on racist and political tones.

[Roy H.]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

True.  But is that racism?  He’s part of an entertainment product (sports, NBA).  That doesnt dehumanize him.  Some people might just want to watch the product and have no interest in what else they’re doing.  Doesnt make it racist.  Same goes for other celebrities (actors, musicians, athletes, etc).  Do we have to care about what they do outside of what has given them fame?  And if we dont, does that make us bad?

I think you're conflating two different things.

If you don't care, you don't care. But there is a contingent that actively and aggressively attack him and other players. And yes, those attacks sometimes take on racist and political tones.

Political and racist aren’t necessarily the same thing.

I see this the same as people who don’t want movie stars making award shows political.  Hell, Richard Gere got suspended from the Academy Awards for like 20 years for criticizing China.

[gouki88]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

Pretty much any social media post where an athlete makes a social stance elicits this response. Don't have to dig deep

[tonydelk]

This interview does not inspire confidence that Jaylen would want to resign here.  Money talks but if Jaylen things he can make a difference elsewhere with all of his off the court things he likes to do and support then I can definitely see this being his last season in Boston.

[Big333223]

It's behind a pay wall, but below is the relevant part discussing Boston and the Celtics:

"Brown made his second All-Star team this season, and his career-best 26.8 points a game places him among the top guards in scoring. He could be a free agent after next season, but he said he isn’t thinking about that yet. “I’ve been able to make a lot of connections in the city, meet a lot of amazing families who have dedicated their lives to issues about change,” he said.

Brown, who is Black, has spoken publicly about racism in Boston, where about half the population is white and about a quarter is Black. In 2015, a jolting study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston estimated that the Black households in the Boston area had a median wealth of close to zero, while the figure for white households was $247,500. “The wealth disparity in Boston is ridiculous,” Brown said.

What has your experience been like as a Black professional athlete in Boston?

There’s multiple experiences: as an athlete, as a basketball player, as a regular civilian, as somebody who’s trying to start a business, as someone who’s trying to do things in the community.

There’s not a lot of room for people of color, Black entrepreneurs, to come in and start a business.

I think that my experience there has been not as fluid as I thought it would be.

What do you mean by that?

Even being an athlete, you would think that you’ve got a certain amount of influence to be able to have experiences, to be able to have some things that doors open a little bit easier. But even with me being who I am, trying to start a business, trying to buy a house, trying to do certain things, you run into some adversity.

Other athletes have spoken about the negative way that fans have treated Black athletes while playing in Boston. Have you experienced any of that?

I have, but I pretty much block it all out. It’s not the whole Celtic fan base, but it is a part of the fan base that exists within the Celtic nation that is problematic. If you have a bad game, they tie it to your personal character.

I definitely think there’s a group or an amount within the Celtic nation that is extremely toxic and does not want to see athletes use their platform, or they just want you to play basketball and entertain and go home. And that’s a problem to me."

Surprised to hear this and would like to know more details.

You don't really have to look too hard to see examples of what he's talking about. The shut up and dribble crowd is pretty vocal on social media. And there's more than a few posters on this forum that fall into that category too.

True.  But is that racism?  He’s part of an entertainment product (sports, NBA).  That doesnt dehumanize him.  Some people might just want to watch the product and have no interest in what else they’re doing.  Doesnt make it racist.  Same goes for other celebrities (actors, musicians, athletes, etc).  Do we have to care about what they do outside of what has given them fame?  And if we dont, does that make us bad?

Wanting to watch the product while ignoring the person is dehumanizing.

It doesn't make you bad if you don't care about what a celebrity does outside of their art/sport but if you're criticizing him for his views (or for just expressing them) then apparently you do care.