Author Topic: Simone Biles  (Read 45373 times)

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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2021, 08:22:20 AM »

Offline Big333223

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She’s already got 4 Olympic gold medals and 19 World Championship golds. This is more like Michael Jordan stepping away after the first 3-peat to honour his father and play baseball than it is to Ben Simmons not improving his game IMO. Stepping away at the top of the world because something else is weighing you down is a bit different to choking from my perspective.
This is a pretty good analogy. She's already the GOAT in her sport. She holds a ton of individual records. She does things in competition no one has ever done. They've named moves after her. This will affect her legacy none.

As for what she actually did: None of us know what her body and mind feel like right now. Everyone seems to have a lot of takes on something they don't have a clue about.
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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #31 on: July 28, 2021, 08:38:14 AM »

Offline PAOBoston

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people just have not accepted the health part of ‘mental health’. All the time you see people either mocking or deriding the mentally ill or expecting more from them when their illness is actually acknowledged. That is a problem. The young lady has come out to say she was not mentally well enough to complete the competition yet the idiot press still peppered her with questions before the entire world, and made her speak about her health…weird. And here this thread questions her in ways that she would not have been questioned if she had a physical injury…double weird.

The lack of focus she had was potentially dangerous for her physical health too, since that is all anyone really cares about.

She’s not mentally ill, though.  She’s stressed and lacking focus, and is succumbing to pressure.  In evaluating a top athlete, that’s part of the package.

I guess if Jaylen misses a crucial FT in Game 7 of the Finals and then walks off the court before the second FT because he can’t take the pressure, you’ll be celebrating him for his courage?  Congratulating him for putting himself before the team?

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare the sports. In basketball you missed a FT, no harm physically happens to your body. If you unfocused in her sport you literally can become paralyzed.

I would say say if she was feeling like this for a while, she should have just not gone to Tokyo as a courtesy to her teammates. She bowed out of the individual event today as well so clearly she doesn’t care about competing right now.

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #32 on: July 28, 2021, 09:30:47 AM »

Offline tonydelk

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people just have not accepted the health part of ‘mental health’. All the time you see people either mocking or deriding the mentally ill or expecting more from them when their illness is actually acknowledged. That is a problem. The young lady has come out to say she was not mentally well enough to complete the competition yet the idiot press still peppered her with questions before the entire world, and made her speak about her health…weird. And here this thread questions her in ways that she would not have been questioned if she had a physical injury…double weird.

The lack of focus she had was potentially dangerous for her physical health too, since that is all anyone really cares about.

She’s not mentally ill, though.  She’s stressed and lacking focus, and is succumbing to pressure.  In evaluating a top athlete, that’s part of the package.

I guess if Jaylen misses a crucial FT in Game 7 of the Finals and then walks off the court before the second FT because he can’t take the pressure, you’ll be celebrating him for his courage?  Congratulating him for putting himself before the team?

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare the sports. In basketball you missed a FT, no harm physically happens to your body. If you unfocused in her sport you literally can become paralyzed.

I would say say if she was feeling like this for a while, she should have just not gone to Tokyo as a courtesy to her teammates. She bowed out of the individual event today as well so clearly she doesn’t care about competing right now.

Yeah definitely not the same.  I've never seen a basketball player break their neck from a FT.  If you watched her on that vault she did it was scary.  You could tell by her face she had no spatial awareness and could have landed anywhere.  Gymnastics is a dangerous sport where a fall could permanently injure an athlete.  She did the right thing if she could not get past what happened. 

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #33 on: July 28, 2021, 09:49:07 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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people just have not accepted the health part of ‘mental health’. All the time you see people either mocking or deriding the mentally ill or expecting more from them when their illness is actually acknowledged. That is a problem. The young lady has come out to say she was not mentally well enough to complete the competition yet the idiot press still peppered her with questions before the entire world, and made her speak about her health…weird. And here this thread questions her in ways that she would not have been questioned if she had a physical injury…double weird.

The lack of focus she had was potentially dangerous for her physical health too, since that is all anyone really cares about.

She’s not mentally ill, though.  She’s stressed and lacking focus, and is succumbing to pressure.  In evaluating a top athlete, that’s part of the package.

I guess if Jaylen misses a crucial FT in Game 7 of the Finals and then walks off the court before the second FT because he can’t take the pressure, you’ll be celebrating him for his courage?  Congratulating him for putting himself before the team?

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare the sports. In basketball you missed a FT, no harm physically happens to your body. If you unfocused in her sport you literally can become paralyzed.

I would say say if she was feeling like this for a while, she should have just not gone to Tokyo as a courtesy to her teammates. She bowed out of the individual event today as well so clearly she doesn’t care about competing right now.

Yeah definitely not the same.  I've never seen a basketball player break their neck from a FT.  If you watched her on that vault she did it was scary.  You could tell by her face she had no spatial awareness and could have landed anywhere.  Gymnastics is a dangerous sport where a fall could permanently injure an athlete.  She did the right thing if she could not get past what happened.

Say football then. If Aaron Rodgers quits in the first quarter of the Super Bowl because he is stressed by the pressure of having to be the best, how is he treated? 

Part of being an athlete is the ability to maintain focus and to handle stress. The inability to do that is a flaw as an athlete.


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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #34 on: July 28, 2021, 09:53:25 AM »

Offline MarcusSmartFanClub

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I think our society is in the middle of changing tides re: mental health.

My old man and his brothers would never go to a therapist. They consider this to be exhibiting mental weakness.

I think it's harder to come out and face the criticism by not competing. Some might see it as cowardice. I think it takes strength to face criticism, esp. on a big stage.

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #35 on: July 28, 2021, 09:53:56 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Following Simone Biles' shocking withdrawal from the team gymnastics competition at the Tokyo Olympics on Tuesday, many have applauded her for focusing on her mental health. But conservative talk radio hosts Clay Travis and Buck Sexton had little compassion for the star athlete, indicating on their Tuesday show that Biles' decision was selfish.

“We all have emotional and psychological struggles,” Sexton said. “That’s just a constant of being a human being. But what about your teammates?”

Travis wondered how fans would react if Tom Brady or LeBron James did something similar by pulling out of a major game because they couldn't handle the stress.

I’m sure we have all seen this by now. The most talented gymnast in the world, and perhaps the most talented of all time, quit during the Finals of the gymnastics team competition.

I’ve got to say, I think this massively diminishes her legacy. Part of being an athlete is being able to handle the mental crucible. Choking on the big stage, where in this case quitting, has to be evaluated when judging an athlete.  It’s like Ben Simmons. Nobody cares if he can drill 100 three pointers in practice, if he is going to choke in actual games.

It doesn’t make her a bad person. It doesn’t take away from her amazing skills. But I do think it takes her out of the conversation regarding best gymnast of all-time.



 Nope. She's still.the GOAT.

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #36 on: July 28, 2021, 10:00:07 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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Following Simone Biles' shocking withdrawal from the team gymnastics competition at the Tokyo Olympics on Tuesday, many have applauded her for focusing on her mental health. But conservative talk radio hosts Clay Travis and Buck Sexton had little compassion for the star athlete, indicating on their Tuesday show that Biles' decision was selfish.

“We all have emotional and psychological struggles,” Sexton said. “That’s just a constant of being a human being. But what about your teammates?”

Travis wondered how fans would react if Tom Brady or LeBron James did something similar by pulling out of a major game because they couldn't handle the stress.

I’m sure we have all seen this by now. The most talented gymnast in the world, and perhaps the most talented of all time, quit during the Finals of the gymnastics team competition.

I’ve got to say, I think this massively diminishes her legacy. Part of being an athlete is being able to handle the mental crucible. Choking on the big stage, where in this case quitting, has to be evaluated when judging an athlete.  It’s like Ben Simmons. Nobody cares if he can drill 100 three pointers in practice, if he is going to choke in actual games.

It doesn’t make her a bad person. It doesn’t take away from her amazing skills. But I do think it takes her out of the conversation regarding best gymnast of all-time.



 Nope. She's still.the GOAT.

At least relative to her peers she isn’t.

Quote
Larisa Semyonovna Latynina (Russian: Лари́са Семёновна Латы́нина; née Diriy; born 27 December 1934) is a former Soviet artistic gymnast. Between 1956 and 1964 she won 14 individual Olympic medals and four team medals. She holds the record for the most Olympic gold medals by a gymnast, male or female, with 9. Her total of 18 Olympic medals was a record for 48 years. She held the record for individual event medals with 14 for 52 years. She is credited with helping to establish the Soviet Union as a dominant force in gymnastics

Nine golds, five silvers, four bronzes.  Back-to-back Olympic all-around golds, followed by a silver.

Biles has 4 golds, 1 silver, and one bronze.



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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #37 on: July 28, 2021, 10:07:54 AM »

Offline seancally

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people just have not accepted the health part of ‘mental health’. All the time you see people either mocking or deriding the mentally ill or expecting more from them when their illness is actually acknowledged. That is a problem. The young lady has come out to say she was not mentally well enough to complete the competition yet the idiot press still peppered her with questions before the entire world, and made her speak about her health…weird. And here this thread questions her in ways that she would not have been questioned if she had a physical injury…double weird.

The lack of focus she had was potentially dangerous for her physical health too, since that is all anyone really cares about.

She’s not mentally ill, though.  She’s stressed and lacking focus, and is succumbing to pressure.  In evaluating a top athlete, that’s part of the package.

I guess if Jaylen misses a crucial FT in Game 7 of the Finals and then walks off the court before the second FT because he can’t take the pressure, you’ll be celebrating him for his courage?  Congratulating him for putting himself before the team?

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare the sports. In basketball you missed a FT, no harm physically happens to your body. If you unfocused in her sport you literally can become paralyzed.

I would say say if she was feeling like this for a while, she should have just not gone to Tokyo as a courtesy to her teammates. She bowed out of the individual event today as well so clearly she doesn’t care about competing right now.

Yeah definitely not the same.  I've never seen a basketball player break their neck from a FT.  If you watched her on that vault she did it was scary.  You could tell by her face she had no spatial awareness and could have landed anywhere.  Gymnastics is a dangerous sport where a fall could permanently injure an athlete.  She did the right thing if she could not get past what happened.

Say football then. If Aaron Rodgers quits in the first quarter of the Super Bowl because he is stressed by the pressure of having to be the best, how is he treated? 

Part of being an athlete is the ability to maintain focus and to handle stress. The inability to do that is a flaw as an athlete.

Yup, we all have flaws, athletes included. Simone Biles has fewer than any other gymnast, as proven by her 4 Olympic golds and 19 world championships. I wouldn’t say she has an “inability” to handle stress and maintain focus. I’d say she faltered only this one time.

Lastly, none of us nor anyone else actually know what’s going between the ears of another person. In gymnastics these are kids performing in possibly the most high-scrutiny event of the games. And the USA “only” won silver. Might’ve lost to ROC either way. So we could probably all tip our cap and applaud the team of young women for bringing home another medal.
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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #38 on: July 28, 2021, 10:20:47 AM »

Offline tonydelk

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people just have not accepted the health part of ‘mental health’. All the time you see people either mocking or deriding the mentally ill or expecting more from them when their illness is actually acknowledged. That is a problem. The young lady has come out to say she was not mentally well enough to complete the competition yet the idiot press still peppered her with questions before the entire world, and made her speak about her health…weird. And here this thread questions her in ways that she would not have been questioned if she had a physical injury…double weird.

The lack of focus she had was potentially dangerous for her physical health too, since that is all anyone really cares about.

She’s not mentally ill, though.  She’s stressed and lacking focus, and is succumbing to pressure.  In evaluating a top athlete, that’s part of the package.

I guess if Jaylen misses a crucial FT in Game 7 of the Finals and then walks off the court before the second FT because he can’t take the pressure, you’ll be celebrating him for his courage?  Congratulating him for putting himself before the team?

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare the sports. In basketball you missed a FT, no harm physically happens to your body. If you unfocused in her sport you literally can become paralyzed.

I would say say if she was feeling like this for a while, she should have just not gone to Tokyo as a courtesy to her teammates. She bowed out of the individual event today as well so clearly she doesn’t care about competing right now.

Yeah definitely not the same.  I've never seen a basketball player break their neck from a FT.  If you watched her on that vault she did it was scary.  You could tell by her face she had no spatial awareness and could have landed anywhere.  Gymnastics is a dangerous sport where a fall could permanently injure an athlete.  She did the right thing if she could not get past what happened.

Say football then. If Aaron Rodgers quits in the first quarter of the Super Bowl because he is stressed by the pressure of having to be the best, how is he treated? 

Part of being an athlete is the ability to maintain focus and to handle stress. The inability to do that is a flaw as an athlete.

Yup, we all have flaws, athletes included. Simone Biles has fewer than any other gymnast, as proven by her 4 Olympic golds and 19 world championships. I wouldn’t say she has an “inability” to handle stress and maintain focus. I’d say she faltered only this one time.

Lastly, none of us nor anyone else actually know what’s going between the ears of another person. In gymnastics these are kids performing in possibly the most high-scrutiny event of the games. And the USA “only” won silver. Might’ve lost to ROC either way. So we could probably all tip our cap and applaud the team of young women for bringing home another medal.

Absolutely agree.  I will also say that gymnastics can be more dangerous then football. Football players wear pads.  Rodgers can take a knee if he's scared of getting hit and can throw the ball out of bounds.  Gymnastic athletes are flipping through the air and one small miss can lead to something catastrophic.  I would compare it to a snowboarder or skier doing some of there events where they flip and turn and can really get hurt.  If they bowed out, yea I would have no issue with it. 

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #39 on: July 28, 2021, 10:59:36 AM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Following Simone Biles' shocking withdrawal from the team gymnastics competition at the Tokyo Olympics on Tuesday, many have applauded her for focusing on her mental health. But conservative talk radio hosts Clay Travis and Buck Sexton had little compassion for the star athlete, indicating on their Tuesday show that Biles' decision was selfish.

“We all have emotional and psychological struggles,” Sexton said. “That’s just a constant of being a human being. But what about your teammates?”

Travis wondered how fans would react if Tom Brady or LeBron James did something similar by pulling out of a major game because they couldn't handle the stress.

I’m sure we have all seen this by now. The most talented gymnast in the world, and perhaps the most talented of all time, quit during the Finals of the gymnastics team competition.

I’ve got to say, I think this massively diminishes her legacy. Part of being an athlete is being able to handle the mental crucible. Choking on the big stage, where in this case quitting, has to be evaluated when judging an athlete.  It’s like Ben Simmons. Nobody cares if he can drill 100 three pointers in practice, if he is going to choke in actual games.

It doesn’t make her a bad person. It doesn’t take away from her amazing skills. But I do think it takes her out of the conversation regarding best gymnast of all-time.



 Nope. She's still.the GOAT.

At least relative to her peers she isn’t.

Quote
Larisa Semyonovna Latynina (Russian: Лари́са Семёновна Латы́нина; née Diriy; born 27 December 1934) is a former Soviet artistic gymnast. Between 1956 and 1964 she won 14 individual Olympic medals and four team medals. She holds the record for the most Olympic gold medals by a gymnast, male or female, with 9. Her total of 18 Olympic medals was a record for 48 years. She held the record for individual event medals with 14 for 52 years. She is credited with helping to establish the Soviet Union as a dominant force in gymnastics

Nine golds, five silvers, four bronzes.  Back-to-back Olympic all-around golds, followed by a silver.

Biles has 4 golds, 1 silver, and one bronze.



 She's the American Goat. Changed the sport. Nothing she does now will change that.

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2021, 11:40:40 AM »

Offline jambr380

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Honest question - and I am trying to take in everybody's opinion - if Biles lands her first vault, do you think she quits?

On a side note, Larisa Latynina is obviously the goat. As a Cs fan, if you believe Russell is the best ever, then it would be hypocritical to say that Latynina isn't.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 11:58:42 AM by jambr380 »

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #41 on: July 28, 2021, 11:47:30 AM »

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Honest question - and I am trying not to take in everybody's opinion - if Biles lands her first vault, do you think she quits?

On a side note, Larisa Latynina is obviously the goat. As a Cs fan, if you believe Russell is the best ever, then it would be hypocritical to say that Latynina isn't.

Biles quit because she was mid-air and couldn’t control her body, and thus she didn’t land the vault.  If she didn’t have that problem, she presumably would’ve landed, but missing the landing was the symptom of why she quit, not the cause.

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #42 on: July 28, 2021, 12:00:39 PM »

Offline jambr380

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Honest question - and I am trying not to take in everybody's opinion - if Biles lands her first vault, do you think she quits?

On a side note, Larisa Latynina is obviously the goat. As a Cs fan, if you believe Russell is the best ever, then it would be hypocritical to say that Latynina isn't.

Biles quit because she was mid-air and couldn’t control her body, and thus she didn’t land the vault.  If she didn’t have that problem, she presumably would’ve landed, but missing the landing was the symptom of why she quit, not the cause.

Okay, that's what we are hearing, so I can't dispute it. How about if the Americans started with, say, uneven bars rather than possibly the most dangerous [looking] event in sports?

Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2021, 12:03:13 PM »

Offline chicagoceltic

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Honest question - and I am trying not to take in everybody's opinion - if Biles lands her first vault, do you think she quits?

On a side note, Larisa Latynina is obviously the goat. As a Cs fan, if you believe Russell is the best ever, then it would be hypocritical to say that Latynina isn't.

Biles quit because she was mid-air and couldn’t control her body, and thus she didn’t land the vault.  If she didn’t have that problem, she presumably would’ve landed, but missing the landing was the symptom of why she quit, not the cause.
Agreed that not landing the vault was a symptom and not the cause. I also do not think that that vault was the first symptom...she clearly was not herself during the prelims. I think she tried to fight through her issues and they just got worse and that vault was the the final straw that made her realize that it was not safe to continue to try to push through it.
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Re: Simon Biles
« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2021, 12:11:20 PM »

Offline Wretch

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She is a victim of sexual assault, who has been very candid about the difficulties of the recovery/treatment process. She's been operating in an intensely stressful environment since she was a child.  She gets some grace from me regardless of the timing.

Would anyone be questioning her is she had said she sprained her ankle instead of being honest with her need to manage her mental health?  Frankly I think her legacy should be enhanced by her honesty and candor under such intense scrutiny.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2021, 03:12:57 PM by Wretch »