Author Topic: Ray Allen = John Starks  (Read 6148 times)

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Ray Allen = John Starks
« on: May 07, 2008, 08:17:33 AM »

Offline jchamorro

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I can only fault Allen for his play to a point. You know what you have with him. He's said in interviews that if he has the ball and he's open he's going to shoot it.  That's what streak shooters do, they shoot when they're hot & they shoot when they're not. hat's fine for the regular season,  but playoffs are different.  Each possession counts.  Allen has consistently been bad so far.

I can fault Doc a good amount for sticking with Allen for so long. Ray may still think he's the man out there but just watching him,  it's obvious that he's lost a step & hasn't come to grips with it yet.  The onus is on Doc as coach to make subsitutions based on matchups and how players are playing. Allen doesn't decide when he plays. House is ready,  TA is ready.  Give the Cavs and any other opponents a different look if things aren't going well. It's the playoffs.

Ask Riley and Van Gundy how Starks worked out for them.

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2008, 08:25:46 AM »

Offline CT34

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I think this is way off base. Ray Allen is not John Starks.  Ray Allen is just not being put in the right position to have great success.  I blame Doc for that and Ray teammates for not getting him the ball off the screens.  Ray Allen only had 4 shoots the whole night.  4 shoots for a guy who is consider one of the games top shooters.  Sorry but I think your wrong.

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2008, 08:29:34 AM »

Offline CT34

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One more thing I'm getting sick of hearing Doc say after game how he has to get Ray more involved in the offense.  Doc has been saying this all season long.  Ok Doc it's now game 90 and you still haven't found out a way to get Ray Allen into the game plan.  Is this the type of coach that can lead the Cs to a Championship? 

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2008, 08:42:11 AM »

Offline tb727

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I'll respectfully, whole-heartedly disagree.  John Starks was a vagabond journeyman who fell into Pat Riley's lap at a time where grabbing and holding was prevalent.  Without looking at his stats I wanna say the guy had one solid year- 92-93- the same year as his "dunk" on Horace Grant.  He was incredibly erratic and overly-arrogant.  I believe he made 1 All Star Game in his career.

If you're trying to make the comparison because of last night, remember Ray took 4 shots.  In that Houston series Game 7 Starks shot 2-17. 

Ray Allen is a classy guy and is the antithesis of John Starks.
Jay Wingspan Bilas

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2008, 08:43:22 AM »

Offline celticsguy

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Give me a break- Allen has plenty of shots, it would be great if he could start making them. How long did we sign him for?

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2008, 08:48:21 AM »

Offline Petro

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I think comparing Allen to Starks is Ridiculous so i wont bother commenting on that. I think we need to cut Allen a little slack I still don't feel he has adjusted in his new role and he has been inconsistent. The major difference between Allen and Pierce is that if Pierce is having a off-nite he can do other things to contribute(rebound,passing,defense)Allen is a shooter either he makes a shot or not that's it that's what he is nothing else.He will win a game or two for us with his shooting eventually.

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2008, 08:54:24 AM »

Offline celticsguy

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"I still don't feel he has adjusted in his new role and he has been inconsistent."

He's a pro, he should have adjusted midway through the season, it's just another excuse.

 

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2008, 08:56:22 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Wow, when you can't score against Wally you look REALLY bad.  I was shocked that Cleveland won the Wally/Ray matchup.  Ray HAS to do better, as PP will likely continue to struggle offensively because of his defensive assignment on Lebron.  Ray must get it going in this series.  We need him to win that matchup against Wally. 
"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2008, 09:03:18 AM »

Offline reggie35

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Give me a break- Allen has plenty of shots, it would be great if he could start making them. How long did we sign him for?

He took four shots last night. I wouldn't call that plenty. Pierce took 14.

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2008, 09:03:53 AM »

Offline jchamorro

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Just to clarify,  the comparison I am making is Allen in the Playoffs shooting bricks night in and night out to Game 7 Starks - the original bricklayer, his defining moment. 

Doc is enabling Allen by doing nothing. Try something different, TA or House.  TA plays better D & can't do any worse shooting.  House is the same defensively.

Players deserve PT based on how they play, not who they are.


Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2008, 09:04:18 AM »

Offline CT34

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Give me a break- Allen has plenty of shots, it would be great if he could start making them. How long did we sign him for?

Did you watch the game?  Ray Allen only took 4 shots last night.  I blame that on coaching and to a degree the point guards. You have to find your shooter and give him the ball in a position when he can has success. 0-4 from the field and 3 of the attempts was from the 3 point arch.

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2008, 09:04:32 AM »

Offline BASSTHUMPER

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One more thing I'm getting sick of hearing Doc say after game how he has to get Ray more involved in the offense.  Doc has been saying this all season long.  Ok Doc it's now game 90 and you still haven't found out a way to get Ray Allen into the game plan.  Is this the type of coach that can lead the Cs to a Championship? 

encouraging ray will get us to a chamionship...everyone knows what ray is capable of...when rays 3 aint fallin he needs to take it to the hole..that is becoming a better part of his game...but i hope soon his 3's start fallin again cause he does have good looks..

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2008, 09:05:10 AM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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How has Allen been "consistently bad"? 

He's coming off the fourth best shooting year of his entire career.  Ray is widely considered one of the best shooters of all-time, and he just had his fourth best shooting year, ever.  Think about that.  Is that a guy who has "lost a step"?

In the playoffs, he's struggled in his last three games, plus in Game 3 in Atlanta.  In the other four games, he was very good, shooting at least 50% from 3PT in each game.  Overall, he's shooting 40.4% from the field, and 37.5% from three, in the playoffs.  Those numbers aren't great, but they're not terrible, either, especially considering the slump Ray has been in over the past three games.  They're almost identical to Paul's numbers (40.9%, 38.5%), with Paul having twice as many turnovers  Has he lost a step, as well?

Slumps happen.  Ray will work through it, as he has all year.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

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Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2008, 09:08:29 AM »

Offline MrsNumba17

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I like Ray. He is hella smooth with that ball.

In his defense...Everyone has an off night.

Can't wait till Thursday!!!
Go Celtics!!
"A winner is someone who recognizes his God-given talents, works his tail off to develop them into skills, and uses these skills to accomplish his goals"
~Larry Bird

Re: Ray Allen = John Starks
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2008, 09:08:47 AM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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How has Allen been "consistently bad"? 

He's coming off the fourth best shooting year of his entire career.  Ray is widely considered one of the best shooters of all-time, and he just had his fourth best shooting year, ever.  Think about that.  Is that a guy who has "lost a step"?

In the playoffs, he's struggled in his last three games, plus in Game 3 in Atlanta.  In the other four games, he was very good, shooting at least 50% from 3PT in each game.  Overall, he's shooting 40.4% from the field, and 37.5% from three, in the playoffs.  Those numbers aren't great, but they're not terrible, either, consider the slump Ray has been in over the past three games.  They're almost identical to Paul's numbers (40.9%, 38.5%), with Paul having twice as many turnovers  Has he lost a step, as well?

Slumps happen.  Ray will work through it, as he has all year.

And in game 6 he was playing extremely well, until the 4th quarter hit and he started forcing shots.  But he was being the best player until the 4th, making big shots after big shots. So it's really 2 bad games and one bad quarter as of late.