Author Topic: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)  (Read 366707 times)

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Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1785 on: January 23, 2019, 09:16:52 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Per Justin Kubatko tweet:

Quote
Joel Embiid is just the fifth player since the ABA-NBA merger to record at least twenty 30-point, 10-rebound games before the All-Star Game. The others are Moses Malone, Karl Malone (2x), Russell Westbrook, and Anthony Davis.

With all the dominant big men of the past, I'm surprised there are so few on the list.  No Shaq, KG, Duncan, ...

Those three all have championship rings though. Embiid, Karl Malone, Westbrook, and AD don't.

It takes being on a team that relies too heavily on one guy to get those kind of stats 20 times before the all-star break.
I agree with this and was thinking along these lines before I got to your post.  Some of the guys that have done it are stat chasers also.  KG and Duncan didn’t care much about stats.  Duncan would save a lot of his monster games for the playoffs.  Shaq could have gotten 30 and 10 when he wanted to but he didn’t always want to and he would let Kobe take the lead in a lot of games.
The only guys who have done it are Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Anthony Davis, Westbrook and Embiid.  The only stat chaser is Westbrook.  Shaq let Kobe take the lead?  If that were the case, Shaq wouldn't have gotten traded.  The reason Shaq probably didn't do it is because of his poor free throw shooting.
Suboptimal conditioning too, to say the least.
He missed a lot of games.
Shaq certainly wasn't a type A personality.  He could have been far greater if he had been.  He could have played in more games and played at his best more often if he was.
Yes, I also always thought he would do much better if he didn't put those extra 50 lbs in LA.
Fewer injuries, better conditioning, better lateral speed.
Sure his overpowering dunks and beep, beep, beep post-ups were spectacular, but he was still the strongest man even at Orlando Shaq size.
He would just be faster and less injured.
He got injured the 1st time in Orlando.  I think you could reasonably argue it was the injuries that led to him putting on the weight.  I mean he played only 54 games his last year in Orlando
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Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1786 on: January 25, 2019, 12:46:07 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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According to Shams, Butler is going to see a specialist for his sprained wrist. It's just "cautionary" but probably not good if things really aren't okay with Butler's wrist/hand.
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Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1787 on: January 25, 2019, 01:17:03 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1788 on: January 25, 2019, 01:26:31 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1789 on: January 25, 2019, 01:31:11 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

I think he would go to Knicks

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1790 on: January 25, 2019, 01:33:54 PM »

Offline mef730

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According to Shams, Butler is going to see a specialist for his sprained wrist. It's just "cautionary" but probably not good if things really aren't okay with Butler's wrist/hand.

Sigh, no basketball, no love life...

Tough week coming up for him.

Mike

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1791 on: January 25, 2019, 01:36:00 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

I think he would go to Knicks

How awesome would it be if the Knicks ended up signing Butler and Cousins this summer?


Butler, Cousins, Porzingis.


I feel like the best way for the Knicks to be is for them to look much better on paper than in real life.  That's how I want the Knicks to be.
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Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1792 on: January 25, 2019, 01:40:33 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

I think he would go to Knicks

How awesome would it be if the Knicks ended up signing Butler and Cousins this summer?


Butler, Cousins, Porzingis.


I feel like the best way for the Knicks to be is for them to look much better on paper than in real life.  That's how I want the Knicks to be.


Yeah, following in the footsteps of former Knick legends like Marbury and Amare Stouadamire. And Melo too.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1793 on: January 25, 2019, 01:40:58 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

I think he would go to Knicks

How awesome would it be if the Knicks ended up signing Butler and Cousins this summer?


Butler, Cousins, Porzingis.


I feel like the best way for the Knicks to be is for them to look much better on paper than in real life.  That's how I want the Knicks to be.

add in wall! it has to be expensive too

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1794 on: January 25, 2019, 01:42:33 PM »

Online tazzmaniac

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.
I think it will come down to how they do in the playoff.  Of course, someone better might become available in free agency.  However they really can use Butler's defense and his ability to create shots.  Klay Thompson is talked about as being a perfect fit but he's not a shot creator.  Sixer's need another go to guy in crunch time besides Embiid and Simmons isn't it unless he improves his shooting.  There is a lot of negativity around Butler but he's got a great work ethic.  Working himself up from a 30th pick fringe NBA player is impressive. 

In the 2nd quote, who is they?  Philly fans?  People in the Philly organization?  His teammates seem to get along with him.   

Roco was a significant loss.  If they could have included Fultz instead of him, it would have been a much better trade.  Losing Saric wasn't that big of a loss.   

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1795 on: January 25, 2019, 01:43:33 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.

Sounds like he’s going the Cousins route with his reputation around the league. Maybe he’ll end up signing with GS this summer for the vet min

I think he would go to Knicks

How awesome would it be if the Knicks ended up signing Butler and Cousins this summer?


Butler, Cousins, Porzingis.


I feel like the best way for the Knicks to be is for them to look much better on paper than in real life.  That's how I want the Knicks to be.

add in wall! it has to be expensive too

Yeah , and Pitino as coach

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1796 on: January 25, 2019, 02:12:36 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.
I think it will come down to how they do in the playoff.  Of course, someone better might become available in free agency.  However they really can use Butler's defense and his ability to create shots.  Klay Thompson is talked about as being a perfect fit but he's not a shot creator.  Sixer's need another go to guy in crunch time besides Embiid and Simmons isn't it unless he improves his shooting.  There is a lot of negativity around Butler but he's got a great work ethic.  Working himself up from a 30th pick fringe NBA player is impressive. 

In the 2nd quote, who is they?  Philly fans?  People in the Philly organization?  His teammates seem to get along with him.   

Roco was a significant loss.  If they could have included Fultz instead of him, it would have been a much better trade.  Losing Saric wasn't that big of a loss.   

Tazz I didn't see any further comments from Jac on this https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2019/01/24/jimmy-butler-is-reportedly-on-thin-ice-with-76ers/

But there is a full podcast it is from with Lowe so maybe she says something else. I think for the second quote it is referring to either the front office or players (it wouldn't make any sense for Jac to try to suggest how the fans feel as an insider). If I had to guess I think that Embid is not thrilled with Butler. I will be the first to admit this is just my personal theory and could very well be completely false, but things I think about with Embid
1) He bristled in the past about the idea of adding a third star saying the 76ers had everything they need or something close to that (prior to adding butler)
2) He complained about touches/role twice since Butler arrived and I really don't remember him doing that at all last year (he has complained about how they have handled his injuries and playing time, but I don't believe role)
3) He is really close and love Brown, hard to imagine that he was not bothered by Butler yelling at Brown in front of him
4) he wants to be mvp, all defensive etc, i get the sense he is not in love with sharing the spotlight with a guy that gets as much attention/noise as Butler does right now

You add in that Embid has a much sillier and goofier side than butler (although very serious with his work ethic) and it would not surprise me if Embid doesn't like having Butler around.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1797 on: January 25, 2019, 03:09:08 PM »

Online tazzmaniac

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Jackie Mac says he is already on thin ice to boot, here are her comments:

“I think he’s on thin ice, Zach,” MacMullan said of Butler. “I think he’s on thin ice. And I think he’s a very talented player and no one has ever called him soft either, he’s a very tough player. On paper, he would be exactly what you’d want on a team. He’s not a selfish player, I would never say that about him. He defends, boy does he defend. He gets at it. He makes good decisions on the offensive end of the floor. I don’t know him well enough to know, is it real or is it bravado—this whole idea that I’m going to take everyone on.

“I can tell you, having spent a couple of days in Philadelphia, they don’t love it.”

Between that and his injury it becomes harder to imagine him signing there. Giving up Roco and Saric for 6 months of Butler would be pretty tough to swallow for philly.
I think it will come down to how they do in the playoff.  Of course, someone better might become available in free agency.  However they really can use Butler's defense and his ability to create shots.  Klay Thompson is talked about as being a perfect fit but he's not a shot creator.  Sixer's need another go to guy in crunch time besides Embiid and Simmons isn't it unless he improves his shooting.  There is a lot of negativity around Butler but he's got a great work ethic.  Working himself up from a 30th pick fringe NBA player is impressive. 

In the 2nd quote, who is they?  Philly fans?  People in the Philly organization?  His teammates seem to get along with him.   

Roco was a significant loss.  If they could have included Fultz instead of him, it would have been a much better trade.  Losing Saric wasn't that big of a loss.   

Tazz I didn't see any further comments from Jac on this https://lebronwire.usatoday.com/2019/01/24/jimmy-butler-is-reportedly-on-thin-ice-with-76ers/

But there is a full podcast it is from with Lowe so maybe she says something else. I think for the second quote it is referring to either the front office or players (it wouldn't make any sense for Jac to try to suggest how the fans feel as an insider). If I had to guess I think that Embid is not thrilled with Butler. I will be the first to admit this is just my personal theory and could very well be completely false, but things I think about with Embid
1) He bristled in the past about the idea of adding a third star saying the 76ers had everything they need or something close to that (prior to adding butler)
2) He complained about touches/role twice since Butler arrived and I really don't remember him doing that at all last year (he has complained about how they have handled his injuries and playing time, but I don't believe role)
3) He is really close and love Brown, hard to imagine that he was not bothered by Butler yelling at Brown in front of him
4) he wants to be mvp, all defensive etc, i get the sense he is not in love with sharing the spotlight with a guy that gets as much attention/noise as Butler does right now

You add in that Embid has a much sillier and goofier side than butler (although very serious with his work ethic) and it would not surprise me if Embid doesn't like having Butler around.
I saw that podcast yesterday and plan to listen to it plus the one he did with Jeannie Buss. 
I don't think Jackie Mac has any particular insight into the Sixers.  There are plenty of others like Bodner, Pompei that are better tied into the Sixers organization. 

I really don't see Embiid that way.  He's got a good work ethic and a strong drive for personal and team success and I think he sees those as being intertwined.  He hates losing.  He's emotional and speaks off the cuff.  I don't think you can take what he says at face value.  He's said he hates shooting 3s but he clearly doesn't hate shooting 3s.  He hates missing 3s and he probably prefers to establish his presence inside early in games rather than starting out on the perimeter. 

As usual, I think the media really made the Butler film session incident much bigger than what it was.  Coach Brown clearly wasn't disturbed or concerned about it.  It was an open film session where players were free to speak up.  It sounds like the other players rarely did so but that's not Jimmy Butler's style.  I even heard it suggested on a podcast that Butler was speaking up for other player's views too.  Personally, I think players constructively questioning a coach's offensive and defensive schemes is a good thing. 

I really don't think Embiid minds sharing the spotlight but if he does Simmons gets much more attention/noise than Butler.  I think Embiid would more likely have an issue with Simmons questionable work ethic and unwillingness to shoot jumpers.  Bodner did say recently that Embiid is the most import person in the Sixers organization.  I assume he was excluding the owners.   :)  Bill Simmons made a comment during the playoffs last season about being in the stands and being surprised by how much Sixers fans love Embiid.  I suspect that if there is an issue in the future it will be Simmons chaffing under Embiid's shadow but he still has his own large spotlight. 

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1798 on: January 25, 2019, 03:37:02 PM »

Offline Big333223

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Butler strikes me as being very similar to Kobe in personality but he doesn't have Kobe's talent or resume to be that kind of a jerk.
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Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1799 on: January 25, 2019, 03:57:37 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Butler strikes me as being very similar to Kobe in personality but he doesn't have Kobe's talent or resume to be that kind of a jerk.

So kind of like Kobe his last 5 years?

I agree btw.  Kobe's teammates didn't tend to like him much either but he was good enough to get away with it, until he wasn't.  Butler's never been good enough and seems to be wearing out his welcome faster and faster.